EPTAnd game journalism =/= Game reviewer. Gamasutra is just as capable of making or breaking careers for devs.
Will edit my post if i find somethin specific on them, gettin ready to leave work now though.
Gamergate and video game journalism - Page 12
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Please don't go calling people racist, misogynists, or any combination therein. Don't start throwing around words like "white Knight" or SJW, these words are at this point used in a derogatory manner regarding this debate. You can discuss that these terms exist, but do not attribute them to any individual user or group of users on this website. Try to have a serious discussion about the topic at hand without resorting to personal attacks and we will all be the better for it. Breaking this rule will result in an automatic temp ban the length of which will depend on the comment you make. This thread started not so bad. It is getting worse. If you want to have this discussion on TL be respectful of your fellow users, we all live in the same house. Effective now: Page 21 October 18th 08:31 KST | ||
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Dunnobro
United States67 Posts
And game journalism =/= Game reviewer. Gamasutra is just as capable of making or breaking careers for devs. Will edit my post if i find somethin specific on them, gettin ready to leave work now though. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On October 17 2014 06:29 Dunnobro wrote: IIRC i think the big hits to Gamasutra were for Leigh's dumb tweets and racist to go with supporting the recent stuff too. And game journalism =/= Game reviewer. Gamasutra is just as capable of making or breaking careers for devs. Will edit my post when i find somethin, gettin ready to leave work now though. So then it comes back to Leigh saying some stuff not cared for being a worthy catalyst for the wholesale bombardment of a website? Is what Leigh said offensive enough that no one should be able to make up their own mind about whether or not they want to continue reading Gamasutra? If people do deserve that choice why engage advertisers rather than the readership? I bring up game reviewer because the vast majority of your mass linking had to do with problems with game reviews and nothing that seemed to relate to Gamasutra directly. Gamasutra only has the power to make or break devs insofar as the readership has entrusted it with that power (and even then far less than other websites since it appeals directly to developers rather than consumers). If the readership continues to agree with Gamasutra having that power even with all of the facts laid bare than who are you to try and circumvent that choice? | ||
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Millitron
United States2611 Posts
As proof, you can still discuss GG on 4chan. But only on /v/, and you have to keep it to one thread. Honestly, the more extreme GG crowd are just as bad as the SJW's they decry. They both love playing the victim. | ||
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Dunnobro
United States67 Posts
Here's intel's official reasoning: http://i.imgur.com/h5WqpM1.png Essentially, seems like they give the same reason they all do. Don't want to be affiliated with the politics of those sites, and #Gamergate's main issue is politicizing games. The gaming media is supposed to be the middleman between player and developer, and they're screwing up our signals with their personal agenda. | ||
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
On October 17 2014 06:41 Dunnobro wrote: Note I said "to go with", not because of entirely. Tweets just made it much harder to defend her unlike other sites. I don't really care about what she said though when you claim to be fighting for minorities and are racist to blacks it kind of delivers a message of insincerity. Here's intel's official reasoning: http://i.imgur.com/h5WqpM1.png Essentially, seems like they give the same reason they all do. Don't want to be affiliated with the politics of those sites, and #Gamergate's main issue is politicizing games. The gaming media is supposed to be the middleman between player and developer, and they're screwing up our signals with their personal agenda. If an advertiser pulls their advertisement because an article is considered controversial that would be an example of a negative aspect of gaming journalism, not one to claim as a victory. That is the primary worry at the center of any journalism operation: how do you keep advertising influence from affecting your ability to create content free from influence. Also of note is a lack of any sort of critique of Gamasutra's content other than calling it controversial making the whole action appear to be little more than Intel worrying about losing business. If a website takes a stance and you pull out of advertising because you disagree with that stance that's taking a stance for the opposite, something Intel is very clear that they don't want to do (they say so in their official apology they issue later). | ||
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Dunnobro
United States67 Posts
On October 17 2014 06:37 Millitron wrote: Moot didn't try to censor GG stuff. It was taking over 4chan. It was spammed on every board, and /v/, the videogame board was almost nothing but GG shit. He had mods clean the place up and try to keep it to one thread in /v/. Idiots freaked out and took any deleted threads as fascist oppression. As proof, you can still discuss GG on 4chan. But only on /v/, and you have to keep it to one thread. Honestly, the more extreme GG crowd are just as bad as the SJW's they decry. They both love playing the victim. Except he did. We've had that issue before, you make a sticky and punish people who don't post in it. He disallowed it entirely. (After allowing it after another mod banned it) OF course he'd backtrack after everyone fucking left. Because what's different? It's only even more widespread and talked about. What's different now than then? 4chan's traffic is down. And I was fucking there, it didn't overrun shit. Especially not when it was on /pol/ and /vg/ "It was everywhere" is pure grade horse shit. You couldn't even say gamergate. Or 8chan. I can guarantee the energy used silencing all discussion about it wouldn't come anywhere near just dedicating a /v/ sticky to it and pruning straggler threads. | ||
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
On October 17 2014 06:37 Millitron wrote: Moot didn't try to censor GG stuff. It was taking over 4chan. It was spammed on every board, and /v/, the videogame board was almost nothing but GG shit. He had mods clean the place up and try to keep it to one thread in /v/. Idiots freaked out and took any deleted threads as fascist oppression. As proof, you can still discuss GG on 4chan. But only on /v/, and you have to keep it to one thread You make it sound like 4chan is a nice place for discussion. With clearly structured rules thoroughly up-held by moderators. It is not. Expect when content threatens the sites continuation, or #GamerGate. | ||
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Dunnobro
United States67 Posts
On October 17 2014 06:50 Logo wrote: If an advertiser pulls their advertisement because an article is considered controversial that would be an example of a negative aspect of gaming journalism, not one to claim as a victory. That is the primary worry at the center of any journalism operation: how do you keep advertising influence from affecting your ability to create content free from influence. Also of note is a lack of any sort of critique of Gamasutra's content other than calling it controversial making the whole action appear to be little more than Intel worrying about losing business. If a website takes a stance and you pull out of advertising because you disagree with that stance that's taking a stance for the opposite, something Intel is very clear that they don't want to do (they say so in their official apology they issue later). "Controversial" and "Inflammatory" are a little different. The fact is, you collude to get all these writers to smear gamers after they find all this evidence to their corruption, things are a little more than "Controversial" and if you want to fault intel for not wanting to be associated with that kind of shady behavior, I don't know what to tell you. You keep acting like it was the disagreement with the article that sparked this. It wasn't, it was the reasoning and meaning for it. Overall, #Gamergate wants gaming media it can trust. When they all get together to call us racist misogynists, call us crazy but I don't think they have our best interest at heart. Really, it seems they're more concerned with clicks than objective review. | ||
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Millitron
United States2611 Posts
On October 17 2014 06:51 Dunnobro wrote: Except he did. We've had that issue before, you make a sticky and punish people who don't post in it. He disallowed it entirely. (After allowing it after another mod banned it) OF course he'd backtrack after everyone fucking left. Because what's different? It's only even more widespread and talked about. What's different now than then? 4chan's traffic is down. And I was fucking there, it didn't overrun shit. Especially not when it was on /pol/ and /vg/ "It was everywhere" is pure grade horse shit. You couldn't even say gamergate. Or 8chan. I can guarantee the energy used silencing all discussion about it wouldn't come anywhere near just dedicating a /v/ sticky to it and pruning straggler threads. I was there too. A mod banned it, Moot overruled him, and just demanded it be kept to one thread. It WAS everywhere. I saw posts that were nothing more than ads for 8chan spammed on /a/, /k/, /co/, even fucking /sci/. I don't know where you get the idea that everyone left. 4chan seems as fast as ever. And if statistics show that 4chan IS receiving lower traffic, this whole thing started right as school started. Every year there's a dip in traffic when school starts in the US. On October 17 2014 06:51 WakaDoDo wrote: You make it sound like 4chan is a nice place for discussion. With clearly structured rules thoroughly up-held by moderators. It is not. Expect when content threatens the sites continuation, or #GamerGate. I don't know about "nice place for discussion"; its a pretty abrasive place thats definitely not for everyone. But there are rules that are upheld that have to do with the quality of the content. Remember when getting "dubs" (a post number ending in repeating digits) took over /v/? And then they instituted the no-dubs spam rule and banned for it? Remember when off-topic My Little Pony crap was spammed everywhere? They got a containment board and posting MLP stuff anywhere but /mlp/ will get your post deleted. | ||
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JacobShock
Denmark2485 Posts
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Dunnobro
United States67 Posts
On October 17 2014 06:57 Millitron wrote: I was there too. A mod banned it, Moot overruled him, and just demanded it be kept to one thread. It WAS everywhere. I saw posts that were nothing more than ads for 8chan spammed on /a/, /k/, /co/, even fucking /sci/. I don't know where you get the idea that everyone left. 4chan seems as fast as ever. And if statistics show that 4chan IS receiving lower traffic, this whole thing started right as school started. Every year there's a dip in traffic when school starts in the US. Uh, I think you got the timeline mixed up. >Gamergate starts > Discussion is banned by mod > People bitch > Moot undoes it > Stuff goes on as normal > Then he bans it himself http://i.imgur.com/snmdgRT.png He doesn't justify it as "it's everywhere!" he justifies it as "it's a raid! holy shit it's a raid!" like he hasn't been apart of 4chan all this time to know the difference. | ||
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BallinWitStalin
1177 Posts
Seems a bit weird/confusing to me. | ||
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Dunnobro
United States67 Posts
On October 17 2014 07:01 JacobShock wrote: I found this interview refreshing. GamerGate supporters actually having a voice in the media. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtzrUsi6Y1s All the #Gamergaters hype the hell out of Jenny but honestly she stammered a lot, i swear there was like a minute where she said "ideology" 10 times and acted kind of immature. Georgina's testimony was most valuable to me, but that might be because I came from neutrality/anti. | ||
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deadmau
960 Posts
/r/kotakuinaction (pro-gamergate) /r/gamerghazi (anti-gamergate) Just get your information there if you're lazy, a lot better than the sources i've seen liquid users post in this tread, atrocious. Don't use sources that are obviously complicit in this entire mess, it's fine to be uniformed, but when you're informed hopefully you do something with the truth you've uncovered. I really expected better from Liquid users in terms of sourcing. Sad part is while liquid is great for discussions, the rate of information travel is a lot slower than reddit which is all it's good for except memes, funny images/gifs, and more memes. Please drown out all the mouths trying to sway you, and find out for yourself. I think every person is capable of making their own opinion, it's either or not it has a chance to surface before you're swayed by outside forces. | ||
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Millitron
United States2611 Posts
This idea that he's some SJW pawn or something is patently ridiculous. Have you ever been on /pol/? He allows /pol/ to exist. How about /r9k/? On October 17 2014 07:07 deadmau wrote: Damn I don't wanna hop into this to inform the uninformed, it's kinda silly to do this over a topic that is so misconstrued in the media, and TeamLiquid users linking to sources complicit in the entire ordeal is asinine...(arstechnica, cracked....). Man this place sources information worse than reddit at times. So much misinformation in here i'm just gonna leave you some places to go for information. /r/kotakuinaction (pro-gamergate) /r/gamerghazi (anti-gamergate) Just get your information there, but don't use sources that are obviously complicit in this entire mess. I really expected better from Liquid users in terms of sourcing. Posting this article again because its a pretty awesome, unbiased summation of the whole issue. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2014/10/09/the_gender_games_sex_lies_and_videogames_124244.html | ||
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SigmaoctanusIV
United States3313 Posts
On October 17 2014 07:04 BallinWitStalin wrote: I still do not legitimately understand what this is all about. Seems a bit weird/confusing to me. Same I was going to ask the same thing, I didn't even think that Video game Journalism was a big thing? | ||
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HeatEXTEND
Netherlands836 Posts
On October 17 2014 07:04 BallinWitStalin wrote: I still do not legitimately understand what this is all about. Seems a bit weird/confusing to me. Probably because the whole thing has been ripped outta context all over the place. | ||
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JacobShock
Denmark2485 Posts
On October 17 2014 07:05 Dunnobro wrote: All the #Gamergaters hype the hell out of Jenny but honestly she stammered a lot, i swear there was like a minute where she said "ideology" 10 times and acted kind of immature. Georgina's testimony was most valuable to me, but that might be because I came from neutrality/anti. I agree, but interviews like that can be nerve wrecking I am sure. Especially considering the scrutiny you subjugate yourself to when you represent GG. | ||
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Polarexia
United States383 Posts
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amazingxkcd
GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
On October 17 2014 07:07 Millitron wrote: There WERE posts doxxing Zoe Quinn and others. I wonder how many large pizzas got delivered to ZQ's house, and how many times she got asked if she had battletoads. This idea that he's some SJW pawn or something is patently ridiculous. Have you ever been on /pol/? He allows /pol/ to exist. How about /r9k/? Posting this article again because its a pretty awesome, unbiased summation of the whole issue. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2014/10/09/the_gender_games_sex_lies_and_videogames_124244.html Zoe Quinn doxxed herself, giving out fake addresses and fake phone numbers to play the victim card when she was found out. And there's nothing wrong with /pol/ nor /r9k/. Denying those 2 places are denying freedom of speech (and most non-SJW people left half chan anyways due to the overflood of SJW mods) | ||
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