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@nunez
If you're going to complain about his sources you should check your sources as well. I noticed that in one of your posts earlier on the last page all but one link (from itar-tass) were from Timer, a website founded and owned by Igor Markov, the founder of the pro-Russian Rodina political party (who advocates for federalization, removal of the office of president, etc). Markov was even arrested a few years back for allegedly attacking protesters of a statue of Catherine in Odessa. I doubt you could argue he is unbiased in all of this.
But I agree with Mc, websites shouldn't be banned, but people should be honest about what they are.
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@saryph
yes, timer has bias as well (odessian newspaper started in 2008, for the record), and maybe oligrach / tychoon backing is the norm in ukraine (your post is news to me, appreciate that). however i haven't been arguing that it isn't biased (allthough i've been reading it for updates on odessa), and i don't see how it's equatable to advocating a wholesale dismissal of itar-tass based on a 3 month old anti-propaganda blog.
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russian media is reporting dpr claims that the truck was hit by a rrpg, was carrying wounded from fights at the airport om donetsk, and was marked as an ambulance. korrespondent however is reporting that the truck was travelling from the airport, but that the militia in it were firing from it, and that it's the same kind of trucks used for troop movements, no mention of any ambulance marking. not seeing any reports of chechens being involved either.
seems like the 'ato' is back, more committed than before, like poro indicated... reuters is reporting that the airforce is being deployed in donetsk.
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Things are getting weird, Luhansk 'people's governor' (or whatnot) has declared war on the 'Donetsk People's Republic' for being unable to resist the Ukrainian military and retreating from their positions.
Source in Russian.
The source is dubious, but the same claims are repeated by several sources. Korrespondent We can conclude that there is strife or confusion between different separatist groups.
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Sources don't need to be banned, I've posted RT and MFA_Russia myself several times. But when the source has a dubious background, tt's crucial to a) search for better sources first, b) qualify the post appropriately. Without it, the burden to debunk false claims lies on other people in the thread. It doesn't add to the discussion, it literally diminishes the ability of other posters to contribute.
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Regarding Chechens, there are multiple reports, including a CNN video:
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The land of freedom23126 Posts
On May 27 2014 05:43 Mc wrote:
I'm fine with itar-tass/RT/etc being posted. I'm sometimes curious as to what Russian propaganda is up to, and they post some information that is brushed over by Western media. Just read it with a healthy dose of scepticism as nunez said :p
Every news are propaganda in one way or another :D
As i was told once by old and respected journalist: "You can't expect that your news will be neutral, it never happens in journalism"
Anyway, it's getting ridiculously weird. I guess, rebels are going to end soon with neutralising of it but i'm more interested in what will happen next.
There were rumours here and it seems legit because my lovely Ukranians are telling me that Euromaidan might occure once more because of people disliking Poroshenko in general.
This ridiculous moment when you don't know who to vote for because you dislike everyone. Good old CIS votings.
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the truck looks similar to the one posted on korrespondent, but hard to tell from the actual wreckage.
wouldn't put any money on it being the same one. militias joining rebels from russia has been known for a while though (f.ex criminal hobbit).
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Looks like the situation in Ukraine is improving. Mass protests occuring again in Ukrain appears to be unlikely since poroshenko was chosen with a clear margin. You don't protest simply because you disliking someone. Both revolutions and protests occured due to blantant and mass corruption, it simply makes no sense to predict that the Ukrainians will erupt into the streets because they "dislike" a newly elected leader in possible the most free and uncontested election yet.
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Russian Federation1953 Posts
On May 27 2014 07:53 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Looks like the situation in Ukraine is improving. Mass protests occuring again in Ukrain appears to be unlikely since poroshenko was chosen with a clear margin. You don't protest simply because you disliking someone. Both revolutions and protests occured due to blantant and mass corruption, it simply makes no sense to predict that the Ukrainians will erupt into the streets because they "dislike" a newly elected leader in possible the most free and uncontested election yet.
I'm expecting new maidan within 2 months
some ppl already loathe Poroshenko for his words that Ukraine should "work" with Russia, he is oligarch etc.
if he will not stop war at eastern Ukraine in 1 month (which I doubt) - shit will hit the fan again
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I guess this answers the question why separatists have manpads, they are being shipped in from Russia. Alongside other weapons and men. And Russian border guards are nowhere to be seen.
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Follow up on the men coming in from Russia:
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On May 26 2014 03:44 Greem wrote:
This is too easy, i don't know what to think when there are no competition to even choose from, obviously he said things that Kiev goverment wanted to hear. But what everyone suppose to think when he tells something like "Crimea annexation wont be recognized by Ukraine", I mean what can he do if people in Crimea is happy enought with current situation. Also visit to Donbas under current condition seem like a wasted promise, i bet first visit there is months away, he may get killed even if he goes there right now.
I guess time will tell what's in his agenda, but the parlament is still formed by the same people, so what really is there to expect , just some random promises again ? Its hard to believe anyone under this circumstances, at the moment situation , economically is pretty much at lowest point possible, divided nation, Its summer, but when autumn will come , the gas debts will come again.
Crimea is going to be poor relatively soon, its a tourist region and only works 4 months (may to august) a year. No one from Ukraine will go, and from Russia they cant go through Ukraine, they will have to pay 50$ usd to cross, the infrastructure is beyond bad. Also dont forget about Crimean tatars who are really pissed because how Russian terrorists treat their leader.
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Russian Federation1953 Posts
As I thought Ukraine doesn't want to pay for gas which is already shipped (not 1st time thoug)
KIEV, May 27. /ITAR-TASS/. Ukraine “will not pay anything” for gas to Russia, if the countries do not reach an agreement to bring back the previous gas price at $268.5 for 1,000 cubic meters, parliament-appointed acting Ukrainian Finance Minister Oleksandr Shlapak told reporters before a country’s government meeting on Tuesday.
“We are prepared to pay after they [Russia] confirm the gas price to us for the future. However, the proposal made today — “you pay and then we will start talking to you” — does not suit us,” the interim minister said.
He noted the need to hold gas talks with Russia at which negotiating parties should agree on returning the gas price at $268.5 for 1,000 cubic meters.
“If no agreement is attained, we will not pay anything,” Shlapak noted.
Source
Since Ghan thinks he is thread captain or something I will post ONLY Itar-Tass sources even if there is others for same news,
Itar-tass was founded in 1902 while biased, west-worshipping Kyev-Post (which Ghan likes so much) in 1995 by american citizen Jed Sunden. Now it is owned by british citizen Mohammad Zahoor. Nuff said.
User was warned for this post
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On May 27 2014 17:11 Ghanburighan wrote:
Follow up on the men coming in from Russia:
Chechens fighting for Russian interests...what an ironic twist of events.
It was only twenty, hell, even ten years ago that they were going at each other's throats.
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On May 27 2014 17:48 sgtnoobkilla wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2014 17:11 Ghanburighan wrote:
Follow up on the men coming in from Russia:
Chechens fighting for Russian interests...what an ironic twist of events. It was only twenty, hell, even ten years ago that they were going at each other's throats.
It's basically all Kadyrov. His strongman tactics backed by Putin allowed him to tajke control of Chechnya, and now he's lending his thugs for other causes.
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Russian Federation1953 Posts
On May 27 2014 17:22 Corsica wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2014 03:44 Greem wrote:
This is too easy, i don't know what to think when there are no competition to even choose from, obviously he said things that Kiev goverment wanted to hear. But what everyone suppose to think when he tells something like "Crimea annexation wont be recognized by Ukraine", I mean what can he do if people in Crimea is happy enought with current situation. Also visit to Donbas under current condition seem like a wasted promise, i bet first visit there is months away, he may get killed even if he goes there right now.
I guess time will tell what's in his agenda, but the parlament is still formed by the same people, so what really is there to expect , just some random promises again ? Its hard to believe anyone under this circumstances, at the moment situation , economically is pretty much at lowest point possible, divided nation, Its summer, but when autumn will come , the gas debts will come again.
Crimea is going to be poor relatively soon, its a tourist region and only works 4 months (may to august) a year. No one from Ukraine will go, and from Russia they cant go through Ukraine, they will have to pay 50$ usd to cross, the infrastructure is beyond bad. Also dont forget about Crimean tatars who are really pissed because how Russian terrorists treat their leader.
Why would russian citizens come to Crimea through Ukraine and pay $50? Could you please elaborate.
the infrastructure is beyond bad
of course its bad, Crimea was under Ukraine for more than 20 years, you screwed it up as all you do
Crimea is booming with russian tourists atm. A lot of ppl here decided not to go for Turkey this summer but to go to Crimea.
Just small example: http://top.rbc.ru/economics/27/05/2014/926487.shtml
User was warned for this post
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DPR separatists burned down the local hockey club. Local news does not take kindly to it "this is how the separatists `love' our home Donetsk'. The longer article isn't out yet.
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Follow-up: Here's the article, but all it adds is that it started at 4 am, firefighters left at 14.00 and that the building might collapse.
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On Monday evening at around 18:00 OSCE Special Monitoring Mission lost contact with one of its Donetsk-based teams. The team was on a routine patrol east of Donetsk when contact was lost. We have been unable to re-establish communication until now. The team consists of four international SMM members. We are continuing with our efforts and utilizing our contacts on the ground. The Ukrainian Government as well as regional authorities have been informed of the situation. Source: OSCE
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On May 27 2014 16:51 PaleMan wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2014 07:53 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Looks like the situation in Ukraine is improving. Mass protests occuring again in Ukrain appears to be unlikely since poroshenko was chosen with a clear margin. You don't protest simply because you disliking someone. Both revolutions and protests occured due to blantant and mass corruption, it simply makes no sense to predict that the Ukrainians will erupt into the streets because they "dislike" a newly elected leader in possible the most free and uncontested election yet. I'm expecting new maidan within 2 months some ppl already loathe Poroshenko for his words that Ukraine should "work" with Russia, he is oligarch etc. if he will not stop war at eastern Ukraine in 1 month (which I doubt) - shit will hit the fan again
All the medias are broadly covering the elections as being fair and with a wide an firm mandate. I am not sure what is with the insistence of russian apologists insisting that Ukraine will yet again descend into mass protests in such a short order of time, unless they know something that nobody else does. Examples of such media, being the exact on nunez uses: http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/26/us-ukraine-crisis-idUSBREA4M05420140526
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reuters sitrep from last days fighting in donetsk, this puts us on at least 5 civillian casualties (3 reported in slavyansk).
Fighting rages in eastern Ukraine city, dozens dead
May 27 (Reuters) - Ukrainian forces fought with separatists in the city of Donetsk for a second day on Tuesday after inflicting heavy losses on the rebels and the government vowed to press on with a military offensive "until not a single terrorist" was left.
Pro-Russian rebels said more than 50 of their fighters had been killed. The mayor of Donetsk, an industrial hub of one million in eastern Ukraine, said the death toll in the clashes which erupted on Monday stood at 48, including two civilians.
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Ukraine launched its fresh offensive against the rebels, who have occupied strategic points in Donetsk and other towns in the east, shortly after Sunday's presidential election. The election victor, Petro Poroshenko, rejected any talks with "terrorists".
Kiev accused Moscow on Tuesday of sending "terrorists" across the border after border guards clashed with armed men overnight in eastern Ukraine. Russia repeated its call on Ukraine to halt its military operations.
Ukraine used air strikes and a paratroop assault on Monday to clear rebels from Donetsk's international terminal and had pushed the separatists out of the complex by the end of the day.
... reuters
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The German finance minister gave a worrying interview (in English) regarding German foreign policy and security spending.
I'd especially like to point out that he somehow has managed to convince himself that Baltic politicians are not anxious about the situation in Ukraine.
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On May 28 2014 00:40 Ghanburighan wrote:The German finance minister gave a worrying interview (in English) regarding German foreign policy and security spending. I'd especially like to point out that he somehow has managed to convince himself that Baltic politicians are not anxious about the situation in Ukraine.
Well our politicians basically have no other choice, because the public opinion here is very negative when it comes to increasing the military budget, or increasing our military presence in foreign countries.
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So i decided to see what does TL think about the topic and pretty much all i see is some estonian dude spreading "the truth" about kremlin-backed chechens terrorist-separatists killing themselves under the protection of Kiev's glorious army. Much like russian citizens burned themselves in Odessa, although they all ended up being ukranians when the dust settled. Claims that russian sources are biased, immediately posts news citing anonymous twitters. Much democracy!
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EPT
