|
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On June 10 2016 02:41 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:19 Nyxisto wrote:
racism in any meaningful sense of the word comes from a place of power and is perpetuated by institutions, the police, the education system and so on. In this case you cannot really be racist against white people because what ever you're going to do is always going to stay at the individual level without any wider social repercussions. Yeah, because power is only reserved for white people of course, where have I heard that before? Can you be racist against Asians or are Asians superprivileged so that kind of prejudice doesn't count either?
Of course you can be prejudice towards Asians. The US has a long history of doing just that.
|
On June 10 2016 02:40 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:32 GGTeMpLaR wrote:On June 10 2016 02:30 Mohdoo wrote:On June 10 2016 02:29 GGTeMpLaR wrote:On June 10 2016 02:25 Plansix wrote:On June 10 2016 02:22 NukeD wrote:
So then is it okay for me to be a racist (hold racist beliefs) if I never act upon it? If you never act on them, then only you know you hold them. Why would you need anyone's approval? And isn't asking for approval acting on those beliefs in some small way? So by your own definition how is Trump a racist? What has he done and acted on that is 'racist'. The double-standards of you people just blows my mind. I would say that using racist sentiments to rally people and get people fired up is causing racial tensions. How is that racist and my example of the BLM advocate's tweets advocating 'white genocide' not racist? IM SO CONFUSED BY THIS PHENOMENON BLM is trash. I consider BLM to be equally toxic as Trump because of how much BLM has discredited black empowerment movements across the country. There is a certain amount of condescending taboo regarding black rights after BLM. It's similar to how Trump's wall has hurt the effort to crack down on illegal immigration. Someone can't bring up tougher borders without being asked if they support the wall. Same kinda deal with black rights as a result of BLM.
I mean we both agree the organization that shuts down major highways and protests in libraries during finals week is trash.
That says nothing about my point that you can be racist against white people. Advocating for genocide of white people is textbook definition of racism.
The act of 'being a racist' or 'having racist views' has nothing to do with systematic power.
|
On June 10 2016 02:37 GGTeMpLaR wrote:It's so hilarious the left is calling Trump hitler when this new regressive-left movement is more like the rise of Nazi-era racism than anything from the right. ![[image loading]](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRt5f1xLwEvpDBRxCfpbTPixU6zryl2sxyUwcrl8C7KdP4i52LO)
I mean yeah if you ignore anything either party says and use only you as a source...
Nationalist who threatens free speech and wants to control the media vs a version of Social Democracy which demands that voters be able to exert greater influence over their government. Which is more fascist? This is a question so hard a fifth grader would need three or four seconds to answer it.
|
On June 10 2016 02:43 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
I mean we both agree the organization that shuts down major highways and protests in libraries during finals week is trash.
Incidentally, "trash" is one of the most important words uttered by Jim in the Adventures of Huckleberry Finn!
Also, how dare they protest DURING FINALS WEEK!? It's almost as if protests were designed to disrupt because else everybody would ignore them! That's craaaayzy
|
On June 10 2016 02:41 Surth wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:39 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Let's avoid these types of useless inflammatory generalizations in the future. Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:37 GGTeMpLaR wrote:It's so hilarious the left is calling Trump hitler when this new regressive-left movement is more like the rise of Nazi-era racism than anything from the right.
You're my favorite poster in this thread, by the way.
I'm not perfect. I'm guilty of the mudslinging too. I try to avoid it but it's hard when mud is getting thrown in all directions not to get dragged in.
|
On June 10 2016 02:45 Surth wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:43 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
I mean we both agree the organization that shuts down major highways and protests in libraries during finals week is trash.
Incidentally, "trash" is one of the most important words uttered by Jim in the Adventures of Huckleberry Finn! Also, how dare they protest DURING FINALS WEEK!? It's almost as if protests were designed to disrupt because else everybody would ignore them! That's craaaayzy
All those times MLK marched and he never shut down a highway or road. Never happened. They protested in a manner that made sure they didn't slow down traffic or caught any problems for other people.
|
On June 10 2016 02:45 Surth wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:43 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
I mean we both agree the organization that shuts down major highways and protests in libraries during finals week is trash.
Incidentally, "trash" is one of the most important words uttered by Jim in the Adventures of Huckleberry Finn! Also, how dare they protest DURING FINALS WEEK!? It's almost as if protests were designed to disrupt because else everybody would ignore them! That's craaaayzy
I was just using the word he used himself to describe the movement.
And it just goes to show you the absurdity of the movement. There's a youtube video of them marching through a library during finals week shouting at people and bullying people who are actually studying for their education.
So you've got one group of college students that just wants to blame everyone else for their problems and protest and riot in the library during finals week, then blame society when they fail their classes.
And the other group who is quietly working hard and being impeded from doing so by the incompetence of others.
Shutting down major highways is actually a crime by the way and can actually lead to deaths. Fucking help us all if a firetruck or ambulance needs to get somewhere and people die because these spoiled entitled imbeciles want to spread hatred.
|
On June 10 2016 02:42 farvacola wrote:
The 9th Circuit has just ruled that the 2nd Amendment doesn't guarantee a right to concealed carry.
Makes sense, I never understood the need for concealed carry. What is the argument for it? (compared to open carry)
|
On June 10 2016 02:44 Jormundr wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:37 GGTeMpLaR wrote:It's so hilarious the left is calling Trump hitler when this new regressive-left movement is more like the rise of Nazi-era racism than anything from the right. I mean yeah if you ignore anything either party says and use only you as a source... Nationalist who threatens free speech and wants to control the media vs a version of Social Democracy which demands that voters be able to exert greater influence over their government. Which is more fascist? This is a question so hard a fifth grader would need three or four seconds to answer it.
Who threatens free speech? The authoritarian PC movement is the only movement here threatening free speech.
You're seriously defending the media's ability to say whatever they want without criticism, and accusing anyone who accuses this 'immune media' of being anti-free speech. I can't make this shit up.
You've effectively straw-manned the opposition and mary-sue'd your side very well. I applaud you.
|
On June 10 2016 02:46 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:45 Surth wrote:On June 10 2016 02:43 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
I mean we both agree the organization that shuts down major highways and protests in libraries during finals week is trash.
Incidentally, "trash" is one of the most important words uttered by Jim in the Adventures of Huckleberry Finn! Also, how dare they protest DURING FINALS WEEK!? It's almost as if protests were designed to disrupt because else everybody would ignore them! That's craaaayzy All those times MLK marched and he never shut down a highway or road. Never happened. They protested in a manner that made sure they didn't slow down traffic or caught any problems for other people.
There are a lot of indian intellectuals who think that Gandhi's peaceful bullshit held back the movement for independence far more than it helped it. Sometimes peaceful protest works, sometimes it doesnt, and saying a priori "peaceful is better" is dumb. You better be making rigorous arguments as to which kind of protest is best suited to which problem. Perhaps (and of course i am not being rigorous here) the visibility of racism meant that peacful protests were good enough? perhaps the insidiousness of racism today calls for more drastic action?
|
Well clearly no one here has any clue what BLM actually is based on how you talk about it. Innocent people are being murdered by the people paid to protect them and you guys get bent about traffic. Just sad.
On June 10 2016 02:34 GGTeMpLaR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:31 GreenHorizons wrote:On June 10 2016 02:18 Plansix wrote:
Systematic Racism against white people is possible in China. Or another area where non-whites control the system of power. A black person can be bigoted against a white person in the US.
But systemic racism against whites as a whole does not exist in the US at any significantly measurable scale. We hold the majority of power in the country and that benefits us over other demographics.
Just going to have to come up with a new word. Then they can't try to force the old white guy definition down the throat of the people who actually study/deal with it . Being called racist, or being told that black people can't be racist toward white people is the closest many white people come to feeling what racism is like, it's not even a fraction as bad as racism, but look how disturbing it is for them. I wish just for like a year they could wake up in a world where they actually experienced racism so they could understand the difference thoroughly.
This is so incredibly racist and hypocritical I don't even know how you can seriously be saying these things. It's almost as bad as when Bernie literally said in a debate that white people don't know what it's like to be poor and live in poverty.
What? White people don't know what it's like to be black (or experience real raycism [spelled different so you don't confuse it with your word]) like getting a bad flu doesn't mean you understand what it's like to have cancer and chemo.
Believe me, I'd rather they just stop being jerks, but we've been waiting for that ship for a loooooong time now.
|
Anyone can be racist, get that nonsense out of here. The word racism refers to a belief system, not about the implications on society. "Systemic" racism is also a poisonous thought process, as it undermines personal responsibility.
|
People protest systematic oppression which has been impeding them their entire life by disrupting some students studies for a few minutes. I, for one, am outraged at this terrible injustice. Also outraged at the guy who farted three chairs down when I was studying for an exam. How dare he eat gassy food before coming to the library? The smell was unbearable, I couldn’t’ get anything done.
I sort of love how the same 3-4 posters come in every day to tell everyone their opinions on racism and how it isn’t a problem, demanding everyone prove them wrong as they regurgitate the same points over and over. Its leads to a lot of nice, productive discussions.
|
On June 10 2016 02:53 biology]major wrote:
Anyone can be racist, get that nonsense out of here. The word racism refers to a belief system, not about the implications on society. "Systemic" racism is also a poisonous thought process, as it undermines personal responsibility.
Sure, if we have to abide by the white definition, anyone can be racist, but only white people can be raycist.
|
On June 10 2016 02:42 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:41 oBlade wrote:On June 10 2016 02:19 Nyxisto wrote:
racism in any meaningful sense of the word comes from a place of power and is perpetuated by institutions, the police, the education system and so on. In this case you cannot really be racist against white people because what ever you're going to do is always going to stay at the individual level without any wider social repercussions. Yeah, because power is only reserved for white people of course, where have I heard that before? Can you be racist against Asians or are Asians superprivileged so that kind of prejudice doesn't count either? Of course you can be prejudice towards Asians. The US has a long history of doing just that.
That's not what I asked, I asked if it counted as "racism" in newspeak, and I'm talking about the present day USA like Nyxisto, because apparently this is a word whose definition changes depending on what time and country you're talking about, Asians didn't use to be so privileged, so perhaps there was an instant in history when it stopped being racism, right?
|
On June 10 2016 02:53 GreenHorizons wrote:Well clearly no one here has any clue what BLM actually is based on how you talk about it. Innocent people are being murdered by the people paid to protect them and you guys get bent about traffic. Just sad. Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:34 GGTeMpLaR wrote:On June 10 2016 02:31 GreenHorizons wrote:On June 10 2016 02:18 Plansix wrote:
Systematic Racism against white people is possible in China. Or another area where non-whites control the system of power. A black person can be bigoted against a white person in the US.
But systemic racism against whites as a whole does not exist in the US at any significantly measurable scale. We hold the majority of power in the country and that benefits us over other demographics.
Just going to have to come up with a new word. Then they can't try to force the old white guy definition down the throat of the people who actually study/deal with it . Being called racist, or being told that black people can't be racist toward white people is the closest many white people come to feeling what racism is like, it's not even a fraction as bad as racism, but look how disturbing it is for them. I wish just for like a year they could wake up in a world where they actually experienced racism so they could understand the difference thoroughly.
This is so incredibly racist and hypocritical I don't even know how you can seriously be saying these things. It's almost as bad as when Bernie literally said in a debate that white people don't know what it's like to be poor and live in poverty. What? White people don't know what it's like to be black (or experience real raycism [spelled different so you don't confuse it with your word]) like getting a bad flu doesn't mean you understand what it's like to have cancer and chemo. Believe me, I'd rather they just stop being jerks, but we've been waiting for that ship for a loooooong time now.
I'd agree with you that the majority of white people are not subject to the same racism as blacks, nor even close to it.
However there are white minorities within black communities that most definitely feel a very great racist threat towards them. The simple fact that living in a black community means you are likely to experience violence within 1-2 years is a testament to this. I linked the Howard Stern story earlier, was his getting beat the shit out of not a testament to this?
In South Africa the laws are actually racist against whites now. If an intruder breaks into their home (which is almost always black) they are not allowed to shoot the intruder. They are not allowed to shoot the intruder even if said intruder is in the act of raping their daughter. They can only shoot the intruder IF any only if the intruder is in the process of attacking them, or already has a gun pointed at them. You cannot point your gun first. The intruder must.
Granted, this is probably difficult to prove but that's an example of .. actually may not be a racist law (though it may have been designed with a sort of revenge mindset). But a law that's so poorly designed that it gives so much power to the perpetrator and so little to the victim.
But no, racism isn't equal because the population sizes are quite different.
Who said racism wasn't a problem? It is but there's a disingenuous argument going on about it. The minute people attempted to change it to privilege+power people wanted to make sure to call bullshit on it. Again I'll link this where this is clearly bullshit. Black people shouting at an Asian girl, "go back to your own country!" etc and other racial epithets is still racism.
+ Show Spoiler +
Also the people arguing against racism believe there's more of a personal responsibility factor at play I'd imagine. They have the line of thinking: "Nobody makes you choose guns, drugs, and violence over going to a public library and studying". Even if a school sucks, libraries are public and amazing sources of information. But if the kids see, "how the fuck are some books going to help me get $ anyway, fuck you" well, someone needs to guide them. Sadly, then you get to the lack of a father issue all over again.
|
On June 10 2016 02:53 GreenHorizons wrote:Well clearly no one here has any clue what BLM actually is based on how you talk about it. Innocent people are being murdered by the people paid to protect them and you guys get bent about traffic. Just sad. Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:34 GGTeMpLaR wrote:On June 10 2016 02:31 GreenHorizons wrote:On June 10 2016 02:18 Plansix wrote:
Systematic Racism against white people is possible in China. Or another area where non-whites control the system of power. A black person can be bigoted against a white person in the US.
But systemic racism against whites as a whole does not exist in the US at any significantly measurable scale. We hold the majority of power in the country and that benefits us over other demographics.
Just going to have to come up with a new word. Then they can't try to force the old white guy definition down the throat of the people who actually study/deal with it . Being called racist, or being told that black people can't be racist toward white people is the closest many white people come to feeling what racism is like, it's not even a fraction as bad as racism, but look how disturbing it is for them. I wish just for like a year they could wake up in a world where they actually experienced racism so they could understand the difference thoroughly.
This is so incredibly racist and hypocritical I don't even know how you can seriously be saying these things. It's almost as bad as when Bernie literally said in a debate that white people don't know what it's like to be poor and live in poverty. What? White people don't know what it's like to be black (or experience real raycism [spelled different so you don't confuse it with your word]) like getting a bad flu doesn't mean you understand what it's like to have cancer and chemo. Believe me, I'd rather they just stop being jerks, but we've been waiting for that ship for a loooooong time now.
I agree White people don't know what it's like to be black.
Most black people today haven't experienced 'real raycism' either. That has long since been eradicated and named taboo in our mainstream culture, and rightly so.
You show me a KKK 'raycist' you're showing me a terrible person. I agree with you.
I do not think that type of person exists anymore. I grew up knowing people who I would say are 'racist' because they make 'black jokes' when no black people were around, but would never disrespect a black person or treat them like they weren't a human. I do not think that type of mindset exists in America anymore, it's considered a taboo of our culture to even think like that let alone share it with others.
You're literally being the racist you hate. "I'd rather white people (like all white people are the same) stop being jerks, but we've (all black people) been waiting for that ship for a loooong time now.
You are the racist in this thread. Stop thinking in collectives based on race.
I don't think racism will ever 100% die off until we discover alien life and only then will we start thinking of everyone as the 'human race' instead of 'black race white race asian race' because people will have some actual fucking racism against some protoss and zerg to throw around.
|
On June 10 2016 03:00 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2016 02:53 GreenHorizons wrote:Well clearly no one here has any clue what BLM actually is based on how you talk about it. Innocent people are being murdered by the people paid to protect them and you guys get bent about traffic. Just sad. On June 10 2016 02:34 GGTeMpLaR wrote:On June 10 2016 02:31 GreenHorizons wrote:On June 10 2016 02:18 Plansix wrote:
Systematic Racism against white people is possible in China. Or another area where non-whites control the system of power. A black person can be bigoted against a white person in the US.
But systemic racism against whites as a whole does not exist in the US at any significantly measurable scale. We hold the majority of power in the country and that benefits us over other demographics.
Just going to have to come up with a new word. Then they can't try to force the old white guy definition down the throat of the people who actually study/deal with it . Being called racist, or being told that black people can't be racist toward white people is the closest many white people come to feeling what racism is like, it's not even a fraction as bad as racism, but look how disturbing it is for them. I wish just for like a year they could wake up in a world where they actually experienced racism so they could understand the difference thoroughly.
This is so incredibly racist and hypocritical I don't even know how you can seriously be saying these things. It's almost as bad as when Bernie literally said in a debate that white people don't know what it's like to be poor and live in poverty. What? White people don't know what it's like to be black (or experience real raycism [spelled different so you don't confuse it with your word]) like getting a bad flu doesn't mean you understand what it's like to have cancer and chemo. Believe me, I'd rather they just stop being jerks, but we've been waiting for that ship for a loooooong time now. I'd agree with you that the majority of white people are not subject to the same racism as blacks, nor even close to it. However there are white minorities within black communities that most definitely feel a very great racist threat towards them. The simple fact that living in a black community means you are likely to experience violence within 1-2 years is a testament to this. I linked the Howard Stern story earlier, was his getting beat the shit out of not a testament to this? In South Africa the laws are actually racist against whites now. If an intruder breaks into their home (which is almost always black) they are not allowed to shoot the intruder. They are not allowed to shoot the intruder even if said intruder is in the act of raping their daughter. They can only shoot the intruder IF any only if the intruder is in the process of attacking them, or already has a gun pointed at them. You cannot point your gun first. The intruder must. Granted, this is probably difficult to prove but that's an example of .. actually may not be a racist law (though it may have been designed with a sort of revenge mindset). But a law that's so poorly designed that it gives so much power to the perpetrator and so little to the victim. But no, racism isn't equal because the population sizes are quite different. Who said racism wasn't a problem? It is but there's a disingenuous argument going on about it.
Hate to break it to you but over here in the Netherlands I cant shoot an intruder raping my daughter without getting charged for murder either.
Not being allowed to kill a person unless under direct threat of death is the norm in the world outside the US.
Or do you think the world is racist against whites?
Geez.
|
On June 10 2016 02:53 biology]major wrote:
Anyone can be racist, get that nonsense out of here. The word racism refers to a belief system, not about the implications on society. "Systemic" racism is also a poisonous thought process, as it undermines personal responsibility.
The bold part is the most important point in eliminating racism as a whole.
Stop attributing responsibility to collectives and be responsible for yourself. If everyone did this racism wouldn't exist. Problem is people in general, from all sorts of backgrounds, are too stupid to do it.
|
On June 10 2016 02:54 Plansix wrote:
People protest systematic oppression which has been impeding them their entire life by disrupting some students studies for a few minutes. I, for one, am outraged at this terrible injustice. Also outraged at the guy who farted three chairs down when I was studying for an exam. How dare he eat gassy food before coming to the library? The smell was unbearable, I couldn’t’ get anything done.
I sort of love how the same 3-4 posters come in every day to tell everyone their opinions on racism and how it isn’t a problem, demanding everyone prove them wrong as they regurgitate the same points over and over. Its leads to a lot of nice, productive discussions.
You're mocking the regressive SJW movement more than you are me right now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
