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[SPL] Grand Final: KT Rolster vs SK Telecom T1 - Page 263

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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PoP
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
France15446 Posts
August 07 2010 13:46 GMT
#5241
On August 07 2010 22:44 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:42 PoP wrote:
Funny how every time a team won the coach apparently "outguessed" the opponent's. Bisu getting a PvP, Fantasy a TvZ (say whatever you want, he's been really good at it lately), S2 a ZvP and Canata a TvP (statistically his best matchup over the last few months) looked like excellent matchups for T1 overall.


Stats PvP, Violet PvT, Flash TvZ are pretty ideal. Hoejja vs Fantasy is an excellent draw for KT because we don't rely on Hoejja's win, as is tempest vs and SKT zerg apparently.


That's true. But it wasn't that bad at all for T1. Fair draw for both teams imo.
Administrator
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
August 07 2010 13:47 GMT
#5242
On August 07 2010 22:44 Subversive wrote:
Out of these 262 pages and around 5200 posts I wonder how many are of SKT1 fans making excuses? Assuming only 1000 are from end of set 6 I'm going to assume about 400 are complaints and whinging.


SKT1 has been pretty cordial. A few people are pseudo-analyzing the games, but most of them are admitting defeat humbly. Don't be so presumptuous.
Remember Violet.
SimonB
Profile Joined September 2008
United States1088 Posts
August 07 2010 13:47 GMT
#5243
On August 07 2010 22:44 Subversive wrote:
Out of these 262 pages and around 5200 posts I wonder how many are of SKT1 fans making excuses? Assuming only 1000 are from end of set 6 I'm going to assume about 400 are complaints and whinging.

SKT fans have been good. Sure, there are always some bad apples, but I've been much more of a sore winner than they have generally been sore losers.

Can't say the same for CJ fans.
PoP
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
France15446 Posts
August 07 2010 13:47 GMT
#5244
On August 07 2010 22:45 Milkis wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:43 PoP wrote:
How big was the crowd btw?


30K


Jeezus.
Administrator
johanes
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Czech Republic2229 Posts
August 07 2010 13:48 GMT
#5245
On August 07 2010 22:46 KumquatExpress wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:40 johanes wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:37 ArvickHero wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:33 Zona wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:28 ArvickHero wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:19 roronoe wrote:
I think the biggest blame goes on bisu/coaching staff for letting bisu use that build.

Honestly, I don't think they expected the KT players to take such risky but high reward decisions. Every KT player had something non-standard prepared in order to snipe SKT's players, and had Bisu played on the fifth set instead of the second.. I'm sure Bisu would've used a different build, after it became apparent that KT players were using builds tailored to SKT's players.

KT prepared amazingly, but they had some luck with having such a crucial player coming out so early

Well it is an advantage of being able to watch your opponent's entire playoff run while showing off nothing of your own. Wonder how exhausted the SKT T1 players are after the nonstop weeks of intense practice for the continual playoff rounds?

I don't think they were that exhausted tbh.. its just Coach Park was completely outguessed. Like Bisu vs Stats, even though Stats heavily outnumbered Bisu, the battle still ended w/ Stats losing a disproportionate amount of troops, but the economic advantage was just too much. Had Stats not taken such risks, I think he would've lost the game. The players seemed to be in top shape, but they played too "standard"
Bisu is not in a good shape, he did won last few PvPs, but he was at disadvantage in majority of them and won due to better battle micro/opponents mistakes. Haven't seen decisive PvP from him recently


Sorry, how were you planning to win a mirror matchup without battle micro? You either harass your opponent, giving you the economic edge, you have better army positioning in fights, which translates somewhat to battle micro, or you can just sit back and macro. Just because a pvp goes into a 3-base macro game does not mean both of the players suck.

You want a decisive PvP, go watch 4 gate goon vs one gate expand.

look at Bisu's matches vs Pure, if Pure were capable of not doing stupid mistakes like fighting up the hill he would've won
MrHoon *
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
10183 Posts
August 07 2010 13:48 GMT
#5246
On August 07 2010 22:43 PoP wrote:
How big was the crowd btw?

30,000

last PL was between 20-40000

the PL before that was 15000

the PL before taht was 70000

and the PL before that was 30000

Keep in mind today was a "Heat Wave" day so not many people left their houses
dats racist
SimonB
Profile Joined September 2008
United States1088 Posts
August 07 2010 13:48 GMT
#5247
On August 07 2010 22:35 moopie wrote:
Only disappointing thing about tonight (aside from hoejja and forgg losing ) was that Reach and Yellow didn't get on stage at the end. They are part of the family, and they will be again soon, they should have shared in the victory.

Montage at the end is decent at best.

I'm almost certain I saw Yellow on stage with a KT champion shirt on. Didn't see Reach.
LetMeShine
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
979 Posts
August 07 2010 13:49 GMT
#5248
Only person you can really be pissed at is Canata because I have no idea why he thought that proxy was a good idea against protoss.
moopie
Profile Joined July 2009
12605 Posts
August 07 2010 13:49 GMT
#5249
On August 07 2010 22:48 SimonB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:35 moopie wrote:
Only disappointing thing about tonight (aside from hoejja and forgg losing ) was that Reach and Yellow didn't get on stage at the end. They are part of the family, and they will be again soon, they should have shared in the victory.

Montage at the end is decent at best.

I'm almost certain I saw Yellow on stage with a KT champion shirt on. Didn't see Reach.

Did you? I saw them both at the end in the audience (at the front), when Violet was getting interviewed about the KONG dance and they cut to yellow and they were both blushing. Didn't see them go on stage though.
I'm going to sleep, let me get some of that carpet.
SimonB
Profile Joined September 2008
United States1088 Posts
August 07 2010 13:51 GMT
#5250
On August 07 2010 22:49 moopie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:48 SimonB wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:35 moopie wrote:
Only disappointing thing about tonight (aside from hoejja and forgg losing ) was that Reach and Yellow didn't get on stage at the end. They are part of the family, and they will be again soon, they should have shared in the victory.

Montage at the end is decent at best.

I'm almost certain I saw Yellow on stage with a KT champion shirt on. Didn't see Reach.

Did you? I saw them both at the end in the audience (at the front), when Violet was getting interviewed about the KONG dance and they cut to yellow and they were both blushing. Didn't see them go on stage though.

I thought I did, but now I'm having doubts since nobody else seems to have. I remember I posted "KONG!" when it happened, but nobody else commented on it.
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51507 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-07 13:54:29
August 07 2010 13:53 GMT
#5251
On August 07 2010 22:48 MrHoon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:43 PoP wrote:
How big was the crowd btw?

30,000

last PL was between 20-40000

the PL before that was 15000

the PL before taht was 70000

and the PL before that was 30000

Keep in mind today was a "Heat Wave" day so not many people left their houses


2004-07-17 스카이 2004 프로리그 1라운드 결승전 - 10만명 (SKY PL 2004 R1 100,000)
우승 웅진(당시 한빛), 준우승 SK텔레콤
2005-07-30 스카이 프로리그 2005 전기리그 결승전 - 12만명 (SKY PL 2005 R1 120,000)
우승 SK텔레콤, 준우승 KT(당시 KTF)
2006-07-29 스카이 프로리그 2006 전기리그 결승전 - 4만명 (SKY PL 2006 R1 40,000) (Note: it was pouring rain, hard)
우승 SK텔레콤, 준우승 MBC게임
2007-08-04 신한은행 프로리그 2007 전기리그 결승전 - 7만명 (Shinhan PL 2007 R1 70,000)
우승 삼성전자, 준우승 화승(당시 르까프)
2008-08-09 신한은행 프로리그 2008 결승전 - 3만명 (Shinhan PL 2008 30,000)
우승 삼성전자, 준우승 하이트(당시 온게임넷)
2009-08-07 신한은행 프로리그 08-09 결승전 1차전 - 1만 5천명 (Shinhan PL 08-09 15,000)
승 SK텔레콤, 패 화승
2009-08-08 신한은행 프로리그 08-09 결승전 2차전 - 4만명 (Shinhan PL 08-09 40,000)
우승 SK텔레콤, 준우승 화승
2010-08-07 신한은행 프로리그 09-10 결승전 - 3만명 (Shinhan PL 09-10 30,000) (Note: Extreme Heat Wave)
우승 KT, 준우승 SK텔레콤
Commentator
PoP
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
France15446 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-07 13:59:54
August 07 2010 13:55 GMT
#5252
On August 07 2010 22:53 GTR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:48 MrHoon wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:43 PoP wrote:
How big was the crowd btw?

30,000

last PL was between 20-40000

the PL before that was 15000

the PL before taht was 70000

and the PL before that was 30000

Keep in mind today was a "Heat Wave" day so not many people left their houses


2004-07-17 스카이 2004 프로리그 1라운드 결승전 - 10만명 (SKY PL 2004 R1 100,000)
우승 웅진(당시 한빛), 준우승 SK텔레콤
2005-07-30 스카이 프로리그 2005 전기리그 결승전 - 12만명 (SKY PL 2005 R1 120,000)
우승 SK텔레콤, 준우승 KT(당시 KTF)
2006-07-29 스카이 프로리그 2006 전기리그 결승전 - 4만명 (SKY PL 2006 R1 40,000) (Note: it was pouring rain, hard)
우승 SK텔레콤, 준우승 MBC게임
2007-08-04 신한은행 프로리그 2007 전기리그 결승전 - 7만명 (Shinhan PL 2007 R1 70,000)
우승 삼성전자, 준우승 화승(당시 르까프)
2008-08-09 신한은행 프로리그 2008 결승전 - 3만명 (Shinhan PL 2008 30,000)
우승 삼성전자, 준우승 하이트(당시 온게임넷)
2009-08-07 신한은행 프로리그 08-09 결승전 1차전 - 1만 5천명 (Shinhan PL 08-09 15,000)
승 SK텔레콤, 패 화승
2009-08-08 신한은행 프로리그 08-09 결승전 2차전 - 4만명 (Shinhan PL 08-09 40,000)
우승 SK텔레콤, 준우승 화승
2010-08-07 신한은행 프로리그 09-10 결승전 - 3만명 (Shinhan PL 09-10 30,000) (Note: Extreme Heat Wave)
우승 KT, 준우승 SK텔레콤


120K in 2005? Seriously? Wow.
Administrator
J1.au
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Australia3596 Posts
August 07 2010 13:55 GMT
#5253
On August 07 2010 22:53 GTR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:48 MrHoon wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:43 PoP wrote:
How big was the crowd btw?

30,000

last PL was between 20-40000

the PL before that was 15000

the PL before taht was 70000

and the PL before that was 30000

Keep in mind today was a "Heat Wave" day so not many people left their houses

2009-08-07 신한은행 프로리그 08-09 결승전 1차전 - 1만 5천명 (Shinhan PL 08-09 15,000)
승 SK텔레콤, 패 화승

What happened here?
okum
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
France5778 Posts
August 07 2010 13:56 GMT
#5254
Better luck next time, SKT fans!

Flash fighting!
Flash fan before it was cool | Coiner of "jangbang"
Ikonn
Profile Joined October 2009
Netherlands1958 Posts
August 07 2010 13:58 GMT
#5255
On August 07 2010 22:55 J1.au wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:53 GTR wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:48 MrHoon wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:43 PoP wrote:
How big was the crowd btw?

30,000

last PL was between 20-40000

the PL before that was 15000

the PL before taht was 70000

and the PL before that was 30000

Keep in mind today was a "Heat Wave" day so not many people left their houses

2009-08-07 신한은행 프로리그 08-09 결승전 1차전 - 1만 5천명 (Shinhan PL 08-09 15,000)
승 SK텔레콤, 패 화승

What happened here?


it was the first day of the finals with a super ace format, so nothing was going to be decided yet
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
August 07 2010 13:58 GMT
#5256
On August 07 2010 22:55 J1.au wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:53 GTR wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:48 MrHoon wrote:
On August 07 2010 22:43 PoP wrote:
How big was the crowd btw?

30,000

last PL was between 20-40000

the PL before that was 15000

the PL before taht was 70000

and the PL before that was 30000

Keep in mind today was a "Heat Wave" day so not many people left their houses

2009-08-07 신한은행 프로리그 08-09 결승전 1차전 - 1만 5천명 (Shinhan PL 08-09 15,000)
승 SK텔레콤, 패 화승

What happened here?


Day 1 in the super ace format. Not many people came because it wasn't as big a deal, as there was definitely going to be a deciding bo7 the next day.
Remember Violet.
Lann555
Profile Joined February 2010
Netherlands5173 Posts
August 07 2010 13:58 GMT
#5257
On August 07 2010 22:47 SimonB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2010 22:44 Subversive wrote:
Out of these 262 pages and around 5200 posts I wonder how many are of SKT1 fans making excuses? Assuming only 1000 are from end of set 6 I'm going to assume about 400 are complaints and whinging.

SKT fans have been good. Sure, there are always some bad apples, but I've been much more of a sore winner than they have generally been sore losers.

Can't say the same for CJ fans.



Probably has something to do with Flash only winning one game. If he had won two, you might see some more bullshit about SKT being the deeper team and stuff. But KT really is a deserving champ and us SKT fans should be pretty happy with the beautifull run through the playoffs. Beating CJ was truly a pleasure (the rest was just icing on the cake) and Fantasy doing so well in Ace matches was good for all us Fantasy fans
Fantasy Fan! Gogogo vultures
ArvickHero
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
10387 Posts
August 07 2010 14:00 GMT
#5258
On August 07 2010 22:42 PoP wrote:
Funny how every time a team won the coach apparently "outguessed" the opponent's. Bisu getting a PvP, Fantasy a TvZ (say whatever you want, he's been really good at it lately), S2 a ZvP and Canata a TvP (statistically his best matchup over the last few months) looked like excellent matchups for T1 overall.

Excellent matchups for T1.. on paper. KT was able to abuse SKT's predictability and came prepared w/ special builds for the occasion. 1 gate core expo w/ a fast third, would've only worked against Bisu's DT Forge FE. When Fantasy goes bionic, it's either 1-1-1 or 4 rax.. and Hoejja nearly damn won that w/ his smart mass muta/ling mid-game army to crush the 4 rax army. Why s2 went Mutas on a map where Sair/Reaver is a very big possibility, I don't know at all.. but a big early game econ advantage plus a BO win was too much for s2. Hell, even ForGG had something special prepared. His strong FD would've killed Best if he had expanded after 3 Dragoons.. unfortunately I think Best saw the mass of marines before he was attacked so unlucky for ForGG.

I don't know why you say Canata drawing a TvP was good though, he's always terrible at that match up even if he wins. That inbase proxy showed how confident he was to play TvP.
Writerptrk
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
August 07 2010 14:06 GMT
#5259
On paper we were even on matchups, in practice we weren't close.
Remember Violet.
bubblegumbo
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Taiwan1296 Posts
August 07 2010 14:07 GMT
#5260
At last KT broke the curse
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper is a genius. For man to survive, they need toilet paper!"- Nal_rA
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