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On June 07 2010 20:10 darktreb wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:09 J1.au wrote:
Flash should've expected the 14cc. Disappointed. What should he have done differently? Ruby even checked the center for proxies, so unless you're going to go all-in on a map like Grand Line TvT to counter 14cc, there's not much to do other than 14cc yourself (and there's no way he could live down losing to a BBS by doing that).
I'm confused. If Ruby can get away with 14cc'ing just by scouting the centre for proxies, why can't Flash?
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omg I just woke up and start scrolling slowly slowly the results,Yellow wins! ace wins! hell it feels so good 
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STX now in very close striking distance to first place. They probably benefit most from this match.
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On June 07 2010 20:21 letian wrote:
This is why some say Flash is a poor bo5 player incapable of playing critical matches even when he's on the top, I'm happy for Ruby!)))
Dumbest post yet.
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Big issue with Flash is that he's completely predictable but a lot of the time still manages to win because he macros better than you and generally makes better decisions most of the time. Its a common theme in nearly all of his TvTs this year; opponent takes massive risk, Flash nearly loses the game but just plays a lot better and then manages to win.
On June 07 2010 20:17 StylishVODs wrote:Flash must practice his TvT some more! it has been looking abit questionable the last 10 games or so.. anyway GG's. everyone goes 14 cc against him except when they bbs
Practice isn't going to help Flash. He's very good, probably the very best, at the matchup but he's fallen into the same ditch his TvP was once in. He's just too predictable and the opponent knows if he sees Flash do so and so, he can do whatever and get away with it.
On June 07 2010 20:21 J1.au wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:10 darktreb wrote:On June 07 2010 20:09 J1.au wrote:
Flash should've expected the 14cc. Disappointed. What should he have done differently? Ruby even checked the center for proxies, so unless you're going to go all-in on a map like Grand Line TvT to counter 14cc, there's not much to do other than 14cc yourself (and there's no way he could live down losing to a BBS by doing that). I'm confused. If Ruby can get away with 14cc'ing just by scouting the centre for proxies, why can't Flash?
Because Ruby can just assume Flash will do the exact same two opening builds over and over if there isn't a proxy.
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Who cares about Flash losing when YellOw wins a game ? <3 <3 <3
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On June 07 2010 20:21 snowdrift86 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:10 POWEROUTAGE wrote:
Seeing Flash get sniped in ace all the time is amazingly annoying. KT should persist with sending out one of violet forgg and stats to make them viable aces so as to prevent snipes like these.
When that happens, people complain that Flash wasn't sent out.
you shouldve realized by now that those who rages everytime flash isnt send for ace is not fans of KT since they are just watching the games for entertainment value. ask every die hard KT fan and you'll here the same answer: MORE CHINTOSS!
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u gotta skate8152 Posts
I switched the stream off because I didn't wanna watch some boring TvT rape.
Then I came back to open the results and...
![[image loading]](http://www.deadbored.net/qt3/omg_cat.gif)
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On June 07 2010 20:21 J1.au wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:10 darktreb wrote:On June 07 2010 20:09 J1.au wrote:
Flash should've expected the 14cc. Disappointed. What should he have done differently? Ruby even checked the center for proxies, so unless you're going to go all-in on a map like Grand Line TvT to counter 14cc, there's not much to do other than 14cc yourself (and there's no way he could live down losing to a BBS by doing that). I'm confused. If Ruby can get away with 14cc'ing just by scouting the centre for proxies, why can't Flash?
Well scouting the center isn't foolproof, especially on a big map like Grand Line with lots of buildable proxy spots. But Ruby is willing to take a chance that if there's a proxy it's at the center, whereas Flash isn't (and shouldn't) be willing to simply take that chance. If players have a brilliant proxy cheese planned, they're saving it for him, and he knows it.
So it's not quite the same, due to that.
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On June 07 2010 20:22 KizZBG wrote:I switched the stream off because I didn't wanna watch some boring TvT rape. Then I came back to open the results and...
That's one cool cat!
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On June 07 2010 20:21 darktreb wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:21 letian wrote:
This is why some say Flash is a poor bo5 player incapable of playing critical matches even when he's on the top, I'm happy for Ruby!))) Dumbest post yet.
why? the results speak for themselves
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On June 07 2010 20:22 Subwoofermate wrote:
Big issue with Flash is that he's completely predictable but a lot of the time still manages to win because he macros better than you and generally makes better decisions most of the time. Its a common theme in nearly all of his TvTs this year.
Honestly Flash isn't THAT predictable in TvT. If you've watched all his games he's played a lot of different styles this year (such as his last game on MP against Ruby in round 4, not the one today, where he Vulture-drop Wraithed Ruby to death immediately). The MVP series is another example where he mixed it up.
But yeah, he's fairly predictable. You know he's not going to BBS for sure. You know he's probably going to play for his late game strengths. And the thing is, you're not preparing to beat Flash in a bo99, just a bo1. So you can take a chance and assume he'll play the expected style on a map and if he doesn't you get owned but who cares everyone expected it (Snow on FS was another good example of this ... had Flash played a different style that game it probably would have been very different, and Flash does indeed have several FS styles but one most common one which Snow guessed correctly for). On the other hand, if you're right you beat Flash and it's a big deal!
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On June 07 2010 20:26 letian wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:21 darktreb wrote:On June 07 2010 20:21 letian wrote:
This is why some say Flash is a poor bo5 player incapable of playing critical matches even when he's on the top, I'm happy for Ruby!))) Dumbest post yet. why? the results speak for themselves
Please stop posting.
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Well actually. I think this issue of losing more then you should in your mirror matchup is because of playing too many mirror games. That way opponents have so many resources for studying your game. I think this is also what happened with jd when he was struggling with his zvz after the zvz finalfest season.
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On June 07 2010 20:23 darktreb wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:21 J1.au wrote:On June 07 2010 20:10 darktreb wrote:On June 07 2010 20:09 J1.au wrote:
Flash should've expected the 14cc. Disappointed. What should he have done differently? Ruby even checked the center for proxies, so unless you're going to go all-in on a map like Grand Line TvT to counter 14cc, there's not much to do other than 14cc yourself (and there's no way he could live down losing to a BBS by doing that). I'm confused. If Ruby can get away with 14cc'ing just by scouting the centre for proxies, why can't Flash? Well scouting the center isn't foolproof, especially on a big map like Grand Line with lots of buildable proxy spots. But Ruby is willing to take a chance that if there's a proxy it's at the center, whereas Flash isn't (and shouldn't) be willing to simply take that chance. If players have a brilliant proxy cheese planned, they're saving it for him, and he knows it. So it's not quite the same, due to that.
Okay, thanks for explaining. Love your posts BTW.
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On June 07 2010 20:21 snowdrift86 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:10 POWEROUTAGE wrote:
Seeing Flash get sniped in ace all the time is amazingly annoying. KT should persist with sending out one of violet forgg and stats to make them viable aces so as to prevent snipes like these.
When that happens, people complain that Flash wasn't sent out.
True that, but a team's obligation is to win first above appeasing the fans. Sending Flash out every single time is very predictable and we can all see how this arrangement has worked out. Especially this game where it is clear that Flash lost to the better prepared player who seemingly only practiced on this map to snipe Flash. Ruby wasn't even 10% as good on match point. Sending stats/forgg/violet out occasionally would remedy this a little IMO.
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On June 07 2010 20:26 letian wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:21 darktreb wrote:On June 07 2010 20:21 letian wrote:
This is why some say Flash is a poor bo5 player incapable of playing critical matches even when he's on the top, I'm happy for Ruby!))) Dumbest post yet. why? the results speak for themselves
He's a poor bo5 player? Since 2008 he's lost bo5's to the following players:
- Jaedong
- forGG
- Effort
Each time he lost a bo5, his opponent was the league winner.
And how can you say a guy is "incapable of playing critical matches" when he's won leagues the last two seasons? Simply retarded.
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On June 07 2010 20:28 iLoveKT wrote:
Well actually. I think this issue of losing more then you should in your mirror matchup is because of playing too many mirror games. That way opponents have so many resources for studying your game. I think this is also what happened with jd when he was struggling with his zvz after the zvz finalfest season.
yes i think it can be the reason too, I remember that after so many wins vs Z, Jae also started to lose a lot
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On June 07 2010 20:28 darktreb wrote:Show nested quote +On June 07 2010 20:22 Subwoofermate wrote:
Big issue with Flash is that he's completely predictable but a lot of the time still manages to win because he macros better than you and generally makes better decisions most of the time. Its a common theme in nearly all of his TvTs this year.
Honestly Flash isn't THAT predictable in TvT. If you've watched all his games he's played a lot of different styles this year (such as his last game on MP against Ruby in round 4, not the one today, where he Vulture-drop Wraithed Ruby to death immediately). The MVP series is another example where he mixed it up. But yeah, he's fairly predictable. You know he's not going to BBS for sure. You know he's probably going to play for his late game strengths. And the thing is, you're not preparing to beat Flash in a bo99, just a bo1. So you can take a chance and assume he'll play the expected style on a map and if he doesn't you get owned but who cares everyone expected it (Snow on FS was another good example of this ... had Flash played a different style that game it probably would have been very different, and Flash does indeed have several FS styles but one most common one which Snow guessed correctly for). On the other hand, if you're right you beat Flash and it's a big deal!
Series matches are a lot different to proleague matches. There's so many games and Flash basically has to prepare for all for them.
Flash knows his late game is miles better than everyone else so he'll do whatever macro orientated build to get into this position (there are only so few macro orientated builds to choose from however). I think I can count on a single hand the amount of times he's attempted some sort of two factory build or tried some Forgg-like build order.
The person saying Flash is a bad series player is dumb as hell since a Bo1 is no way comparable to a series match: Flash actually mixes it up in a series match.
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1. You roll a dice and guess what Flash is gonna do.
2. You either:
2.1 Get it right -> you beat Flash -> You feel like God.
2.2 Get it wrong -> you get owned -> You walk to your teammates and everyone shrugs because it was motherfucking Flash.
This applies for non-Jaedong only though.
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EPT
