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[TSL] PS.com TSL Ro8 Day 2 - Page 105

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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Musoeun
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States4324 Posts
February 15 2010 17:50 GMT
#2081
If Flash can lose a series to Kwanro, Idra can lose one to Nony. It doesn't make either of them bad players; unlucky, losers that day yes, bad no. I didn't see anyone suggest Flash should retire after losing to Kwanro. Why should Idra leave Korea - as some people are saying he should - because he lost a series to the colossal one-in-a-million games screwup of a canceled CC, against the only other foreign player who's done decently in Korea recently?

Not to take away from Nony, he did a fantastic job of keeping Idra off-balance (or predicting, not sure which, but Idra lost that series with the game two mistake; he was obviously rattled in game three as well (his micro was off).

Shit, as they say, happens. If the favorite won every time, why would we even play the games? I know it sucks for you if you were one of the people predicting nobody can beat Idra might as well crown him already, but it's not the end of the world.
Don't Shoot the Penguins. | Dance, 성은, dance! | Killer FanKlub | Action sucks. | Storm Terran hwaiting.
DwmC_Foefen
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
Belgium2186 Posts
February 15 2010 17:52 GMT
#2082
I think Idra made a deal with rekrul or something...

I mean, typing gg because your CC accidentally got cancelled?
And I think Idra is much better in general,

Either way, I was rooting for Nony but I expected at least one epic slugfest with 200pop each
How cool would that be :o
Zurles
Profile Joined February 2009
United Kingdom1659 Posts
February 15 2010 17:55 GMT
#2083
Idra played like total trash in everything except game 1 and that was an easy win.
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7328 Posts
February 15 2010 17:56 GMT
#2084
On February 16 2010 02:38 Sadistx wrote:
The game on outsider was so fucking painful to watch.

Idra, how the fuck do you let ONE SCARAB get 3 of your tanks to red? I'm one of the biggest IdrA fans, but honestly I have seen better reaver defense from D+ players - at least they spam a bunch of turrets so the shuttle doesn't get to this range so easily. Idra just let nony trade a goon for 2 tanks - this is not a mistake A+ players should be making.

Last game could have been saved by blocking nat with another supply depot - it might just have delayed the push enough to get siege up and 2 vults out.

Now if they were to play a Bo50, Idra would win without a doubt, but yesterday his play was undeniably subpar.



you obviously werent paying attention at all. He was doing the fantasy build which involves comsats and no turrets. He just got countered pretty well and It looked like he got siege late. He needed to build a few marines to at least force the shuttle around a bit until his wraith popped out.
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
baubo
Profile Joined September 2008
China3370 Posts
February 15 2010 17:58 GMT
#2085
Won't get a chance to watch the vods for a while. But why does Idra still get cheesed to death?

When I watch Koreans play in the WCG, they use these super-conservative uncheesable builds. Where they don't care even if the foreigner gets an early game advantage. I know Idra's not at that level, but no reason why should be going for greedy builds ever.
Meh
Empyrean
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
17082 Posts
February 15 2010 18:16 GMT
#2086
On February 16 2010 02:58 baubo wrote:
Won't get a chance to watch the vods for a while. But why does Idra still get cheesed to death?

When I watch Koreans play in the WCG, they use these super-conservative uncheesable builds. Where they don't care even if the foreigner gets an early game advantage. I know Idra's not at that level, but no reason why should be going for greedy builds ever.


The skill difference between the Koreans in WCG (mainly top Koreans such as Lux, Bisu, Stork, etc.) and Nony is greater than the skill difference between Idra and Nony to such an extent that if Idra used a super safe build that put him at a disadvantage, Nony would be favored to win.
Moderator
SuperArc
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Austria7781 Posts
February 15 2010 18:33 GMT
#2087
On February 16 2010 03:16 Empyrean wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 16 2010 02:58 baubo wrote:
Won't get a chance to watch the vods for a while. But why does Idra still get cheesed to death?

When I watch Koreans play in the WCG, they use these super-conservative uncheesable builds. Where they don't care even if the foreigner gets an early game advantage. I know Idra's not at that level, but no reason why should be going for greedy builds ever.


The skill difference between the Koreans in WCG (mainly top Koreans such as Lux, Bisu, Stork, etc.) and Nony is greater than the skill difference between Idra and Nony to such an extent that if Idra used a super safe build that put him at a disadvantage, Nony would be favored to win.


Siege expand is a very good build. Rax expand is just plain greedy, very much like 12nex.
Snow - future of protoss! :) Nada = baller
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44401 Posts
February 15 2010 18:35 GMT
#2088
On February 16 2010 01:54 samachking wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 16 2010 01:40 KwarK wrote:
On February 16 2010 00:53 1984 wrote:
Have you guys seen the strategy that Nony used in game 5 somewhere in Korean leagues? Just curious if Nony invented it, if so -- mad props to him

I don't think we've seen the build idra used in a progame. Nony used a specific counter. His play was caused by idra's.


Idra's build has been used before, the 2 estro terrans and Flash have been going 1rax CC recently TvP. Also Nony's build is not new, 4gate goon PvT is one of the strongest all ins if T is FEing, I remember Draco using it vs Midas in wcg 06 and even tastless mentioned that in the commentary.

Which was a very different context and, if I recall correctly, only 3 gate.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Glider
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
United States1353 Posts
February 15 2010 20:33 GMT
#2089
the tension of nony vs idras series was crazy, even tho no game end up going to late game, doesn't make them less exciting, i was on the edge of seat for the last game.

YellowEmperor
Profile Joined October 2008
Taiwan100 Posts
February 15 2010 20:46 GMT
#2090
Sen was obv. the favorite Played ZvZ much longer than Ret. Not just ZvZ but high level ZvZ.. Don't get me wrong Ret has shown amazing improvement in such short time. His ball sack has grown as well to bring his Z to the Z table in TSL. Hats off to that decision. Sen beat Savior once in ZvZ before right? Been a couple years, maybe somebody can refresh my memory.
When you learn something, use the heart.
CubEdIn
Profile Blog Joined April 2006
Romania5359 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-15 22:04:26
February 15 2010 22:03 GMT
#2091
On February 16 2010 02:56 Sadist wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 16 2010 02:38 Sadistx wrote:
The game on outsider was so fucking painful to watch.

Idra, how the fuck do you let ONE SCARAB get 3 of your tanks to red? I'm one of the biggest IdrA fans, but honestly I have seen better reaver defense from D+ players - at least they spam a bunch of turrets so the shuttle doesn't get to this range so easily. Idra just let nony trade a goon for 2 tanks - this is not a mistake A+ players should be making.

Last game could have been saved by blocking nat with another supply depot - it might just have delayed the push enough to get siege up and 2 vults out.

Now if they were to play a Bo50, Idra would win without a doubt, but yesterday his play was undeniably subpar.



you obviously werent paying attention at all. He was doing the fantasy build which involves comsats and no turrets. He just got countered pretty well and It looked like he got siege late. He needed to build a few marines to at least force the shuttle around a bit until his wraith popped out.


True, but that doesn't excuse the fact that one scarab dropped 3 tanks to the red zone. I said it myself right after the games: noob mistake. You'd expect someone like Idra to split tanks or something.
People who are bitching about the fact that nony didn't want to play a straight-up macro game are overlooking the fact that straight-up macro doesn't mean you're supposed to let your opponent cut every goddamn corner he can. Terrans should fear more, I hate these cocky 14cc builds vs P and Z, going on the "let's hope they don't scout here first" scenario.

This series has been the most fun to watch this whole TSL. By far.
Im not a n00b, I just play like one.
StorkHwaiting
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States3465 Posts
February 15 2010 22:10 GMT
#2092
JF vs White-Ra was more fun to me!!
sassy
Profile Joined December 2009
240 Posts
February 15 2010 22:27 GMT
#2093
On February 16 2010 02:56 Sadist wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 16 2010 02:38 Sadistx wrote:
The game on outsider was so fucking painful to watch.

Idra, how the fuck do you let ONE SCARAB get 3 of your tanks to red? I'm one of the biggest IdrA fans, but honestly I have seen better reaver defense from D+ players - at least they spam a bunch of turrets so the shuttle doesn't get to this range so easily. Idra just let nony trade a goon for 2 tanks - this is not a mistake A+ players should be making.

Last game could have been saved by blocking nat with another supply depot - it might just have delayed the push enough to get siege up and 2 vults out.

Now if they were to play a Bo50, Idra would win without a doubt, but yesterday his play was undeniably subpar.



you obviously werent paying attention at all. He was doing the fantasy build which involves comsats and no turrets. He just got countered pretty well and It looked like he got siege late. He needed to build a few marines to at least force the shuttle around a bit until his wraith popped out.


i think he had siege, he just didnt siege. And all 4 tanks stood there close to each other so yea, that 1 scarab cost him the game
crate
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States2474 Posts
February 15 2010 22:52 GMT
#2094
If more TvP games went like the Idra vs Nony series I might actually watch the matchup outside of TSL. (Well, except game 2, which wasn't much of a game.)

Wanted Idra to win (mainly because he plays terran and I'd rather see TvP and possible TvZ than PvP and PvZ), but congrats to Nony.
We did. You did. Yes we can. No. || http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/crate.html || twitch.tv/crate3333
monstar123
Profile Joined December 2008
United States516 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-16 10:55:06
February 15 2010 23:07 GMT
#2095
I could not leave this thread with no attention.
First of all, LOL Buehaha hahahahhahahah
Second thing, Thank you IDRA for your clown interviews and sucking games.
Third, all idiots who told me about idras skill and him not being a turtle can run their heads into the wall.
Waiting for another clown interview by idra, about how Nony was lucky that day.
The fourth, ROFL hahahahaha.
----------------------------------------------
We thank you for bringing attention to your terrible post history.
Harem
Profile Joined November 2007
United States11393 Posts
February 15 2010 23:12 GMT
#2096
On February 16 2010 08:07 monstar123 wrote:
I could not leave this thread with no attention.
First of all, LOL Buehaha hahahahhahahah
Second thing, Thank you IDRA for your clown interviews and sucking games.
Third, all idiots who told me about idras skill and him not being a turtle can run their heads into the wall.
Waiting for another clown interview by idra, about how Nony was lucky that day.
The fourth, ROFL hahahahaha.

Can't wait for another clown post by you either.
Moderator。◕‿◕。
BlackYoshi
Profile Joined June 2009
United States84 Posts
February 15 2010 23:14 GMT
#2097
On February 16 2010 02:50 Musoeun wrote:
If Flash can lose a series to Kwanro, Idra can lose one to Nony. It doesn't make either of them bad players; unlucky, losers that day yes, bad no. I didn't see anyone suggest Flash should retire after losing to Kwanro. Why should Idra leave Korea - as some people are saying he should - because he lost a series to the colossal one-in-a-million games screwup of a canceled CC, against the only other foreign player who's done decently in Korea recently?

Not to take away from Nony, he did a fantastic job of keeping Idra off-balance (or predicting, not sure which, but Idra lost that series with the game two mistake; he was obviously rattled in game three as well (his micro was off).

Shit, as they say, happens. If the favorite won every time, why would we even play the games? I know it sucks for you if you were one of the people predicting nobody can beat Idra might as well crown him already, but it's not the end of the world.

2nd 2010 Nate MBCGame Starleague
1st 2010 EVER OnGameNet Starleague
1st 2009 Averatec-Intel Classic Season 3
2nd 2008 TG-Intel Classic Season 1
1st 2008 XNote GOMTV Star Invitational
1st 2008 Bacchus OnGameNet Starleague

That's Flash. Flash has done enough that he'll drop a game sometimes (and its not like Kwanro is bad by anymeans, just like Nony). But Flash doesn't trash talk and has a quiet confidence, not a cocky "Nony can only beat me by cheesing" (like cheesing is somehow a less legitimate strategy?)

Here's idra:
a bunch of foreign tournaments that really don't mean shit to Korea and that any A-teamer would win.

Idra practices 12 hours a day and still couldn't beat a guy in a Bo5 who just got back into playing high-level Starcraft. At this point, Idra should just give up on SC in preparation for SC2, where maybe he can make a bigger splash (the SC pro scene will lose popularity when SC2 comes out rapidly)

And Idra lost one game because he spazed out and canceled his CC. Whats his excuse for losing on Outsider, or Game 5?

And being rattled by a mistake like the game 2 one is poor pressure management. Good athletes put mistakes behind them and focus on making the mistake irrelevant by getting themselves out of their situation. Idra was clearly rattled by the game 2, and then the game 3 loss.
monstar123
Profile Joined December 2008
United States516 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-15 23:15:15
February 15 2010 23:14 GMT
#2098
On February 16 2010 08:12 Harem wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 16 2010 08:07 monstar123 wrote:
I could not leave this thread with no attention.
First of all, LOL Buehaha hahahahhahahah
Second thing, Thank you IDRA for your clown interviews and sucking games.
Third, all idiots who told me about idras skill and him not being a turtle can run their heads into the wall.
Waiting for another clown interview by idra, about how Nony was lucky that day.
The fourth, ROFL hahahahaha.

Can't wait for another clown post by you either.



Here it is!
Now the interview, please
FaCE_1
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Canada6185 Posts
February 15 2010 23:25 GMT
#2099
just watch the game..
WoW. Great job by Nony, it was just awesome. Really did good build against Idra.

GG Nony.
n_n
Shotcoder
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States2316 Posts
February 15 2010 23:45 GMT
#2100
On February 16 2010 08:14 BlackYoshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 16 2010 02:50 Musoeun wrote:
If Flash can lose a series to Kwanro, Idra can lose one to Nony. It doesn't make either of them bad players; unlucky, losers that day yes, bad no. I didn't see anyone suggest Flash should retire after losing to Kwanro. Why should Idra leave Korea - as some people are saying he should - because he lost a series to the colossal one-in-a-million games screwup of a canceled CC, against the only other foreign player who's done decently in Korea recently?

Not to take away from Nony, he did a fantastic job of keeping Idra off-balance (or predicting, not sure which, but Idra lost that series with the game two mistake; he was obviously rattled in game three as well (his micro was off).

Shit, as they say, happens. If the favorite won every time, why would we even play the games? I know it sucks for you if you were one of the people predicting nobody can beat Idra might as well crown him already, but it's not the end of the world.

2nd 2010 Nate MBCGame Starleague
1st 2010 EVER OnGameNet Starleague
1st 2009 Averatec-Intel Classic Season 3
2nd 2008 TG-Intel Classic Season 1
1st 2008 XNote GOMTV Star Invitational
1st 2008 Bacchus OnGameNet Starleague

That's Flash. Flash has done enough that he'll drop a game sometimes (and its not like Kwanro is bad by anymeans, just like Nony). But Flash doesn't trash talk and has a quiet confidence, not a cocky "Nony can only beat me by cheesing" (like cheesing is somehow a less legitimate strategy?)

Here's idra:
a bunch of foreign tournaments that really don't mean shit to Korea and that any A-teamer would win.

Idra practices 12 hours a day and still couldn't beat a guy in a Bo5 who just got back into playing high-level Starcraft. At this point, Idra should just give up on SC in preparation for SC2, where maybe he can make a bigger splash (the SC pro scene will lose popularity when SC2 comes out rapidly)

And Idra lost one game because he spazed out and canceled his CC. Whats his excuse for losing on Outsider, or Game 5?

And being rattled by a mistake like the game 2 one is poor pressure management. Good athletes put mistakes behind them and focus on making the mistake irrelevant by getting themselves out of their situation. Idra was clearly rattled by the game 2, and then the game 3 loss.


2010
Winner of the ESL Major Series Season 5
2009
1st place WCG U.S.A. 2009
Winner of the first SC2GG[1] Starleague. March 2009
Winner of the inaugural ESWC competition[2]. May, 2009
Winner of the Valor Tournament[3], July 2009
Winner of the ESL Major Series S4[4], August 2009
Winner of WCG 2009 USA Finals[5], September 2009

yup IdrA looks like garbage to me. I seriously don't know how he even made it to the TSL. Being #1 in the ladder against mainly koreans? He seriously has nothing going for him in the foreign community losing this 1 tournament.

Seriously it's like Flash Losing to Stork. I don't know why this is such a big deal.
Shotcoder - C+ BW Terran, Gold LoL(ADC Main)
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