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On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 05:40 Uligor wrote:
Why does this (indirect) "Flash vs Fantasy" discussion always have to occur. Both players are insanely awesome, both raped their opponent tonight and they're both friends. You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.> let the war continue! Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ.  How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17?
Don't get me wrong; I'm a huge Flash fanboy, and if anyone can threaten Jaedong's position as the G.O.A.T. it's Flash. It's just that 3 OSL's and 1 MSL vs Flash's 1 OSL and constant failures in all recent Starleagues makes it really hard to argue that Flash is actually better. Despite his age. He has the potential though, and hopefully he'll start winning Starleagues again.
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On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 05:40 Uligor wrote:
Why does this (indirect) "Flash vs Fantasy" discussion always have to occur. Both players are insanely awesome, both raped their opponent tonight and they're both friends. You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.> let the war continue! Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague?
How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? 
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On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 05:40 Uligor wrote:
Why does this (indirect) "Flash vs Fantasy" discussion always have to occur. Both players are insanely awesome, both raped their opponent tonight and they're both friends. You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.> let the war continue! Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in?
Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009.
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On November 26 2009 08:15 SuperArc wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 05:40 Uligor wrote:
Why does this (indirect) "Flash vs Fantasy" discussion always have to occur. Both players are insanely awesome, both raped their opponent tonight and they're both friends. You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.> let the war continue! Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009. We arent talking [and never were] about who is the more accomplished player, just who the better player is. Flash is on two 10+ winstreaks in seperate mu's and is breaking his [and likely everyones] elo peak. Jaedong is 55% in zvz since he lost to yellow in the group stages of bachus. Jaedong results have declined recently, Flash's have drastically improved. Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation.
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On November 26 2009 08:17 yhnmk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 08:15 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 05:40 Uligor wrote:
Why does this (indirect) "Flash vs Fantasy" discussion always have to occur. Both players are insanely awesome, both raped their opponent tonight and they're both friends. You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.> let the war continue! Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009. We arent talking [and never were] about who is the more accomplished player, just who the better player is. Flash is on two 10+ winstreaks in seperate mu's and is breaking his [and likely everyones] elo peak. Jaedong is 55% in zvz since he lost to yellow in the group stages of bachus. Jaedong results have declined recently, Flash's have drastically improved. Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation.
This is your opinion, not fact.
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On November 26 2009 08:17 yhnmk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 08:15 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 05:40 Uligor wrote:
Why does this (indirect) "Flash vs Fantasy" discussion always have to occur. Both players are insanely awesome, both raped their opponent tonight and they're both friends. You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.> let the war continue! Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009. We arent talking [and never were] about who is the more accomplished player, just who the better player is. Flash is on two 10+ winstreaks in seperate mu's and is breaking his [and likely everyones] elo peak. Jaedong is 55% in zvz since he lost to yellow in the group stages of bachus. Jaedong results have declined recently, Flash's have drastically improved. Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation.
Why should Flash be the better player when he had way less matches to play than JD (not due him being in Oz, but because he got much farther in SLs than Flash)? I also forgot to put in #3/4 MSL for JD's accomplishments in 2009.
Flash started to rape last quarter of 2009 whereas JD was hot all year.
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On November 26 2009 08:17 yhnmk wrote:
Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation.
Now that's one blind fanboy.
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On November 26 2009 08:23 SuperArc wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 08:17 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 08:15 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 05:40 Uligor wrote:
Why does this (indirect) "Flash vs Fantasy" discussion always have to occur. Both players are insanely awesome, both raped their opponent tonight and they're both friends. You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.> let the war continue! Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009. We arent talking [and never were] about who is the more accomplished player, just who the better player is. Flash is on two 10+ winstreaks in seperate mu's and is breaking his [and likely everyones] elo peak. Jaedong is 55% in zvz since he lost to yellow in the group stages of bachus. Jaedong results have declined recently, Flash's have drastically improved. Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation. Why should Flash be the better player when he had way less matches to play than JD (not due him being in Oz, but because he got much farther in SLs than Flash)? I also forgot to put in #3/4 MSL for JD's accomplishments in 2009. Flash started to rape last quarter of 2009 whereas JD was hot all year. What the hell are you talking about? Did you just fly over my post and pretend it said something other than it did? I am not arguing Flash is the better player career wise, I am calling him the better player AT THIS MOMENT, because he is playing MUCH better than Jaedong at this moment, and THAT is without question except moron jaedong fan boys. Thats why hes number 1 on the pr. Thats why his win rate is far superior. Thats why there are threads wondering when he will lose a tvt again. And Flash *has* played far more than JD lately, furthur cementing the already pitifully evident fact that you didnt actually understand my post.
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Maybe Flash is better, maybe he is not, but what is true, is that if things stay the way they are, in 10, 5 or even 3 years, Jaedong will be remembered as the more accomplished, and as a result, better player than Flash, if he is remembered at all. I bet there were a handful of people capable of playing better than MJ in basketball, but no average fan remembers them.
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On November 26 2009 08:34 lone_hydra wrote:
Maybe Flash is better, maybe he is not, but what is true, is that if things stay the way they are, in 10, 5 or even 3 years, Jaedong will be remembered as the more accomplished, and as a result, better player than Flash, if he is remembered at all. I bet there were a handful of people capable of playing better than MJ in basketball, but no average fan remembers them.
I hope you're not implying Flash won't be remembered. Since he sorta revolutionized TvP, perfected Terran management style, and won an OSL at 15 and is on his way to break every record ever set by a terran.
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How about we all shut up and just hope for a Flash vs Jaedong Bo5 final to settle this? And until then, we stop pretending we know what the outcome of that match would be right now.
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On November 26 2009 08:34 yhnmk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 08:23 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 08:17 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 08:15 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:
[quote] You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.>
let the war continue!
Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009. We arent talking [and never were] about who is the more accomplished player, just who the better player is. Flash is on two 10+ winstreaks in seperate mu's and is breaking his [and likely everyones] elo peak. Jaedong is 55% in zvz since he lost to yellow in the group stages of bachus. Jaedong results have declined recently, Flash's have drastically improved. Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation. Why should Flash be the better player when he had way less matches to play than JD (not due him being in Oz, but because he got much farther in SLs than Flash)? I also forgot to put in #3/4 MSL for JD's accomplishments in 2009. Flash started to rape last quarter of 2009 whereas JD was hot all year. What the hell are you talking about? Did you just fly over my post and pretend it said something other than it did? I am not arguing Flash is the better player career wise, I am calling him the better player AT THIS MOMENT, because he is playing MUCH better than Jaedong at this moment, and THAT is without question except moron jaedong fan boys. Thats why hes number 1 on the pr. Thats why his win rate is far superior. Thats why there are threads wondering when he will lose a tvt again. And Flash *has* played far more than JD lately, furthur cementing the already pitifully evident fact that you didnt actually understand my post.
Lets see them play before we start stuff like this. Flash had his chance to get to WCG and play all the big boys but he lost to Bisu.
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Russian Federation405 Posts
Most recently played Bo3 by Flash and by JD.
Flash: 2—0 vs HoGiL 09-10-28 in Ro32 EVER 2009 OSL
JD: 2—0 vs Bisu 09-11-14 in Semis WCG 2009 GrandFinal
JD: 2—1 vs Stork 09-11-15 in Final WCG 2009 GrandFinal
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Flash beat Fantasy in those indoor asia games if you want to count event matches.
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On November 26 2009 08:34 yhnmk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 08:23 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 08:17 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 08:15 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:On November 26 2009 06:47 yhnmk wrote:
[quote] You only say that because you know Flash is a better player than Fantasy. Of course you don't want a discussion you can never win. >.>
let the war continue!
Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009. We arent talking [and never were] about who is the more accomplished player, just who the better player is. Flash is on two 10+ winstreaks in seperate mu's and is breaking his [and likely everyones] elo peak. Jaedong is 55% in zvz since he lost to yellow in the group stages of bachus. Jaedong results have declined recently, Flash's have drastically improved. Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation. Why should Flash be the better player when he had way less matches to play than JD (not due him being in Oz, but because he got much farther in SLs than Flash)? I also forgot to put in #3/4 MSL for JD's accomplishments in 2009. Flash started to rape last quarter of 2009 whereas JD was hot all year. What the hell are you talking about? Did you just fly over my post and pretend it said something other than it did? I am not arguing Flash is the better player career wise, I am calling him the better player AT THIS MOMENT, because he is playing MUCH better than Jaedong at this moment, and THAT is without question except moron jaedong fan boys. Thats why hes number 1 on the pr. Thats why his win rate is far superior. Thats why there are threads wondering when he will lose a tvt again. And Flash *has* played far more than JD lately, furthur cementing the already pitifully evident fact that you didnt actually understand my post.
It is not ''without question, without debate, without reservation'' certain that Flash is the better player even right now. If they were to face in a Bo5 today JD would have AT LEAST 50% chance of winning. He's coming straight from raping the 2 best protoss players in the world in Bo3's.
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Jaedong's shoddy in ZvZ, Flash is shoddy in TvP.
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On November 26 2009 09:05 TwoStep wrote:
Jaedong's shoddy in ZvZ, Flash is shoddy in TvP.
Man, this just seems so weird to say, but it's true. :>
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On November 26 2009 09:06 TwoToneTerran wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 09:05 TwoStep wrote:
Jaedong's shoddy in ZvZ, Flash is shoddy in TvP. Man, this just seems so weird to say, but it's true. :>
I know, half a year ago this would be blasphemy.
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On November 26 2009 09:04 Holgerius wrote:Show nested quote +On November 26 2009 08:34 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 08:23 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 08:17 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 08:15 SuperArc wrote:On November 26 2009 07:50 yhnmk wrote:On November 26 2009 07:32 Malinor wrote:On November 26 2009 07:26 Orbifold wrote:On November 26 2009 07:19 Holgerius wrote:On November 26 2009 07:10 TwoToneTerran wrote:
[quote]
Flash is a better player than everyone, though. Jaedong with the Golden Mouse begs to differ. How many OSLs had JD won when he was 17? How long has it been since Flash won a StarLeague? How many MU's is jaedong on a 10+ game win streak in? Yeah and who is the player who won OSL twice, #3 WCG Korea, #1 WCG Grand finals, #2 WL, #2 PL finals this year? You can brag all you want at Flash's current streak, but JD is clearly THE player of 2009. We arent talking [and never were] about who is the more accomplished player, just who the better player is. Flash is on two 10+ winstreaks in seperate mu's and is breaking his [and likely everyones] elo peak. Jaedong is 55% in zvz since he lost to yellow in the group stages of bachus. Jaedong results have declined recently, Flash's have drastically improved. Flash is the better player, without question, without debate, without reservation. Why should Flash be the better player when he had way less matches to play than JD (not due him being in Oz, but because he got much farther in SLs than Flash)? I also forgot to put in #3/4 MSL for JD's accomplishments in 2009. Flash started to rape last quarter of 2009 whereas JD was hot all year. What the hell are you talking about? Did you just fly over my post and pretend it said something other than it did? I am not arguing Flash is the better player career wise, I am calling him the better player AT THIS MOMENT, because he is playing MUCH better than Jaedong at this moment, and THAT is without question except moron jaedong fan boys. Thats why hes number 1 on the pr. Thats why his win rate is far superior. Thats why there are threads wondering when he will lose a tvt again. And Flash *has* played far more than JD lately, furthur cementing the already pitifully evident fact that you didnt actually understand my post. It is not ''without question, without debate, without reservation'' certain that Flash is the better player even right now. If they were to face in a Bo5 today JD would have AT LEAST 50% chance of winning. He's coming straight from raping the 2 best protoss players in the world in Bo3's. Sorry, haha, I mean, you might be able to make an arguement that Jaedong is of comparable quality to Flash overall, but Flash's tvz is far better than jaedong's zvt atm. If I were to give him a 50% chance, it would purely be based on Flash's tendency to suck shit in b0x's, if I were to disregard that and look purely at abilities than I would 100% bet on Flash. In THAT match up.
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I think Flash is playing better Starcraft right at this moment, but ultimately player careers are judged on accomplishments and unless Flash turns his hot streak into Starleague trophies his current form means shit all.
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EPT
