EPTBot on ladder - Page 24
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prosatan
Romania9360 Posts
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4129 Posts
EDIT: and next game pluto lost to a 2-hatch muta build. It was already noticable that pluto's builds are not very optimized, so clearly its timings are way off when it comes to muta rush from 2 hatch. | ||
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Vasoline73
United States8133 Posts
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Bonyth
Poland619 Posts
Usually, in PvZ match up, the player with higher economy wins. Against AI, Hero had 40k vs 30k resources mined, and the AI still won. | ||
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Vasoline73
United States8133 Posts
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RowdierBob
Australia13525 Posts
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Bonyth
Poland619 Posts
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Crimson)S(hadow
Philippines935 Posts
On September 28 2026 06:02 p4fn2w wrote: Is this the score vs Korean pros so far? (not counting the early games before Sept 26, where it seems like it used to use maphack which makes it play worse / buggy) pluto vs larva: PvZ: 6-0 PvT: 1-0 pluto vs effort: PvZ: 5-3 pluto vs mini: TvP: 2-2 PvZ: 0-1 pluto vs snow: TvP: 1-4 ZvP: 1-0 pluto vs soma: PvZ: 12-8 pluto vs best: TvP: 4-0 pluto vs last: PvT: 2-1 ZvT: 0-1 TvT: 5-1 total stats by matchup, pluto vs pros: PvZ: 23-12 TvP: 7-6 TvT: 5-1 PvT: 3-1 ZvP: 1-0 ZvT: 0-1 I might got some data wrong, feel free to correct my stats Larva's total score is Larva 11 - 19 Pluto, though I don't know if he played the bot more after that. he played pretty much every matchup, he beat pluto at least once in ZvP, and legitly in a PvZ late game, without gimmicking it with reavers. iirc in the PvZ he held a 973 type 3h/4h hydra, though probably not exactly 973 since the bot has bad build order optimization | ||
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RowdierBob
Australia13525 Posts
On September 28 2026 17:25 Bonyth wrote: yes, just defend mutas with goons (xD) It was using cairs too! I know it feels really clunky when you’re watching it but holy shit was it ripping through Larva and Soma. I get humans can’t micro like Pluto can but the early goon/cair/slow zeal builds seemed to nullify Zergs having free rein over the early game. What’s the harm in experimenting? | ||
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Connor56205
43 Posts
I posted Bests FPVOD vs Pluto currently working on Somas | ||
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Scarlett`
Korea (South)2437 Posts
On September 28 2026 18:19 RowdierBob wrote: It was using cairs too! I know it feels really clunky when you’re watching it but holy shit was it ripping through Larva and Soma. I get humans can’t micro like Pluto can but the early goon/cair/slow zeal builds seemed to nullify Zergs having free rein over the early game. What’s the harm in experimenting? u die to hydras as a human | ||
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Terrorbladder
2755 Posts
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Connor56205
43 Posts
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iFU.pauline
France1768 Posts
On September 28 2026 16:13 Bonyth wrote: AI's strenght comes from individual unit control. It's as if there is as many players as there are units. Usually, in PvZ match up, the player with higher economy wins. Against AI, Hero had 40k vs 30k resources mined, and the AI still won. Which makes me assume that if we remove from the AI the abilities to select unlimited amount of units, multitask over multiple screens at the same time and reduce APM cap to something like 300 apm. We are basically removing everything which makes the bot strong. Such limitation would render it much weaker to a point where it would probably not be interesting anymore. Let's see. | ||
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Crimson)S(hadow
Philippines935 Posts
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iopq
United States1182 Posts
On September 28 2026 18:39 iFU.pauline wrote: Which makes me assume that if we remove from the AI the abilities to select unlimited amount of units, multitask over multiple screens at the same time and reduce APM cap to something like 300 apm. We are basically removing everything which makes the bot strong. Such limitation would render it much weaker to a point where it would probably not be interesting anymore. Let's see. it's already limited to 240 APM, but it selects the units one by one, so it's more like 240 APM BUT unlimited unit/building selection | ||
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fLyiNgDroNe
Belgium4129 Posts
- we keep saying that broodwar is a game with an unreachable ceiling. Pluto is a perfect visualization of that - game's meta development was pretty stagnant for a long time (constantly evolving but very incrementally). Pluto potentially gives new ideas. Good or bad - doesn't matter, they are new. Interesting to see how new ideas work or don't work - battle outcome calculation. Its really fascinating to me to see how it pulls out from battles where it has disadvantage and how it pounces once it calculates it has an upper hand what is not great about pluto: - clearly undertrained in some areas - not utilizing all the spellcasters to their highest potential (queens, defilers, arbiters, dark archons) - seems to suck at scouting bases (doesn't attack undefended bases) obviously very subjective, but summarizes why this sparked curiosity and hype | ||
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Scarlett`
Korea (South)2437 Posts
On September 28 2026 19:26 iopq wrote: it's already limited to 240 APM, but it selects the units one by one, so it's more like 240 APM BUT unlimited unit/building selection selecting a unit counts as apm for a player tho so its not 240 apm. its 240 individual unit orders also stuff like selecting an enemy to check its hp counts as an apm but it doesnt have to do that it feels like 2x faster than a 400 apm progamer right now to play against building a unit as well -> player has to select each building then queue a unit so its 2 actions per unit; but the bot doesnt count the select as an action so its 480 apm for production | ||
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TMNT
3372 Posts
Which is also why humans can't copy anything from these approaches. | ||
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LUCKY_NOOB
Bulgaria1593 Posts
On September 28 2026 19:51 fLyiNgDroNe wrote: what is great about pluto imo: - we keep saying that broodwar is a game with an unreachable ceiling. Pluto is a perfect visualization of that - game's meta development was pretty stagnant for a long time (constantly evolving but very incrementally). Pluto potentially gives new ideas. Good or bad - doesn't matter, they are new. Interesting to see how new ideas work or don't work - battle outcome calculation. Its really fascinating to me to see how it pulls out from battles where it has disadvantage and how it pounces once it calculates it has an upper hand what is not great about pluto: - clearly undertrained in some areas - not utilizing all the spellcasters to their highest potential (queens, defilers, arbiters, dark archons) - seems to suck at scouting bases (doesn't attack undefended bases) obviously very subjective, but summarizes why this sparked curiosity and hype Not a single new idea. You can read posts from random D ranks going back as far as the game release saying things like: why dont u use ghosts? The execution is new but also superhuman... Its not like pros dont know ghosts exist. Of course if it inspires humans to be better in some way that would be great. Its not a TAS in Super Mario Bros. | ||
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