On March 16 2023 11:08 Zealgoon wrote: Who the hell would want to have anything to do with a company called Global Order?
Interesting read, thanks. Still hope Flash comes back eventually, never was a big fan of him even before the scandal but the competition isn't the same without him.
Actually, the competition is more interesting without him. Anyway all the mentioned scammers are scumbags.
On March 16 2023 14:48 Waxangel wrote: The most mind-blowing thing about Korean media consumption compared to the USA is how mid-size scandals can actually inflict severe and long-lasting damage to viewership. Stuff that's a minor PR speedbump in the states could destroy someone's career in Korea if it picked up momentum.
outrage optimized.
It's really sad to see how this toxic culture is causing so much damage, I think there's a lot of envy and insecurity going on around the world and it makes sense given the way we are running our society.
For me I at least, his reputation hasn't change one bit. He is still the best gamer I have ever seen play, a testament of a unique mind. Why would I care about his personal affairs when the devil is in the detail wich I certainly don't know because I dont know him on that level? And I don't need to, only by watching play BW I know with 100% certainty that he is an amazing human beeing,a one in a millon talent.
Flash you would have to learn to give a f$&% what some/most people think. Here in Argentina for years we had many many idiots who "loved" soccer but hated Messi with passion for some reason, this is how toxic we are. But ''the people that love football know Messi is the best'' right? So hurry up and come back, we are wating to see The Best
I've spent a lot of time in gaming communities with scandals (good job gamers) and my general feeling is that if no one in the community was actually directly hurt, it should be fine to let them return, but just be more wary of them in the future.
And honestly with crypto... yeah it's very scummy to promote a pump and dump, but it's the viewer's responsibility if they invest their own money into something shady. Maybe viewers will take this as a warning and start using their brains a bit more before listening to everything a streamer says.
Meanwhile, Flash's reputation will take a very deserved hit, so hopefully he feels some consequences for his actions.
I hope he comes back after properly reflecting and issuing a better apology (take responsibility and don't blame your mom...), and doesn't repeat this kind of mistake again.
EDIT: I read jinjin's later post about "undisclosed paid advertising" - also agree that's scummy, especially in the context of a crypto product, and should not be allowed
where was the evidence of "undisclosed paid advertising"? iirc in the previous thread there was never any evidence provided for any streamer advertising TO coin, including flash. its not advertising unless they explicitly mention TO coin on their stream, and none of the streamers did.
On March 21 2023 11:15 evilfatsh1t wrote: where was the evidence of "undisclosed paid advertising"? iirc in the previous thread there was never any evidence provided for any streamer advertising TO coin, including flash. its not advertising unless they explicitly mention TO coin on their stream, and none of the streamers did.
I mean, leading up to the incident, Suit came out of nowhere and was very prominent on a lot of popular streamers showing off his wealth and establishing himself as wealthy trustworthy figure. Then the scandal exploded when there was streamers advertising the TO coin application didn't it?
What I meant was undisclosed paid advertising was it was similar to the YouTube undisclosed advertising incident, but here, we have advertising for app and crypto coin itself but they didn't disclose their investment/stakes in it. (which is what all the fuss was about)
think this was the beginning of trouble point
anways, the outrage culture in first place is what's making it hard for FlaSh to comeback since the ball already rolled when he blotched his 1st apology and it grew to scale beyond what he could have managed after
I think Flash fully deserves another chance at streaming. He didn't do anything so wrong that redemption can't be an option. Knetizens need to calm their tits.
On March 21 2023 11:15 evilfatsh1t wrote: where was the evidence of "undisclosed paid advertising"? iirc in the previous thread there was never any evidence provided for any streamer advertising TO coin, including flash. its not advertising unless they explicitly mention TO coin on their stream, and none of the streamers did.
I mean, leading up to the incident, Suit came out of nowhere and was very prominent on a lot of popular streamers showing off his wealth and establishing himself as wealthy trustworthy figure. Then the scandal exploded when there was streamers advertising the TO coin application didn't it?
What I meant was undisclosed paid advertising was it was similar to the YouTube undisclosed advertising incident, but here, we have advertising for app and crypto coin itself but they didn't disclose their investment/stakes in it. (which is what all the fuss was about)
anways, the outrage culture in first place is what's making it hard for FlaSh to comeback since the ball already rolled when he blotched his 1st apology and it grew to scale beyond what he could have managed after
i touched on how the incident started in this post https://tl.net/forum/brood-war/574711-flashs-crypto-scandal?page=2#39 (an earlier post than the one i linked before) from the previous thread. the guy in the video is kote and hes a streamer that has pretty much nothing to do with starcraft.
the starcraft streamers got pulled into this when a "journalist" got hands on a shareholder record and saw their names on the list as investors. with suit already having had his name dragged through the mud, people like flash/britney/bisu/sea etc. were crucified for their mere association and presumed participation of pump and dump. thats completely different from saying they explicitly promoted the coin, which never happened.
On March 21 2023 11:15 evilfatsh1t wrote: where was the evidence of "undisclosed paid advertising"? iirc in the previous thread there was never any evidence provided for any streamer advertising TO coin, including flash. its not advertising unless they explicitly mention TO coin on their stream, and none of the streamers did.
I mean, leading up to the incident, Suit came out of nowhere and was very prominent on a lot of popular streamers showing off his wealth and establishing himself as wealthy trustworthy figure. Then the scandal exploded when there was streamers advertising the TO coin application didn't it?
What I meant was undisclosed paid advertising was it was similar to the YouTube undisclosed advertising incident, but here, we have advertising for app and crypto coin itself but they didn't disclose their investment/stakes in it. (which is what all the fuss was about)
anways, the outrage culture in first place is what's making it hard for FlaSh to comeback since the ball already rolled when he blotched his 1st apology and it grew to scale beyond what he could have managed after
i touched on how the incident started in this post https://tl.net/forum/brood-war/574711-flashs-crypto-scandal?page=2#39 (an earlier post than the one i linked before) from the previous thread. the guy in the video is kote and hes a streamer that has pretty much nothing to do with starcraft.
the starcraft streamers got pulled into this when a "journalist" got hands on a shareholder record and saw their names on the list as investors. with suit already having had his name dragged through the mud, people like flash/britney/bisu/sea etc. were crucified for their mere association and presumed participation of pump and dump. thats completely different from saying they explicitly promoted the coin, which never happened.
I know but that ad was when it exploded Flash was most involved out of sc guys for sure and suit definitely tried to deny streamers involvement. It was just allround pr disaster.
They promoted the company behind coin and flash was filming a lot of ad for crypto firms as well during that time. They havent moved on to promoting TO coin itself but the structure was set with him promoting global order and all. Yea nothing happened after due to scandal hard stopping but the parts to cogs were there so i can understand the outrage. I think people are right to be upset on that part since there was clear layered plan laid out for them to clearly see. People dont like it when people they looked up to as "honest & professional" betray that trust (altho i think constant circlejerking is bit much)
it's quite cynical to jump to conclusion that flash was intending to mislead or other investors were, but I don't think it's such a reach for people to react negatively. The outrage culture that goes around even to this day, yes, but I think it's reasonable for people to be upset over this
Also flash also mishandled his announcement super badly and that was disasterous too. You dont see guemchi getting that much flack anymore because he handled his apology swiftly and to the point.
At a base crypto seems like a scam, so I don't see what flash did as much worse than anyone else. And it happened at a time where everyone was pushing various levels of scam cryptocurrency, be it influencers or average people who thought they were investors.
Remember that time Elon Musk tweeted about Dogecoin and the price shot up despite Dogecoin being obvious satire about the value of crypto...
On March 24 2023 02:21 Eywa- wrote: At a base crypto seems like a scam, so I don't see what flash did as much worse than anyone else. And it happened at a time where everyone was pushing various levels of scam cryptocurrency, be it influencers or average people who thought they were investors.
Remember that time Elon Musk tweeted about Dogecoin and the price shot up despite Dogecoin being obvious satire about the value of crypto...
Also, I want to see FlaSh play in ASL again.
I saw something about how there is a potential lawsuit related to him inflating Dogecoin like that, but who knows
I wrote the script yea, and removed/cleaned some of the stuff that may not have been accurate from the posts and all since all the stuff was wrapped in outrage even to this day.
if you want more details on what happened afterwards, you can read evilfatsh1t's posts after on the thread
But why do people belive that starcraft streamers and AMAZING players are also good at finance ? I don't get it.
I only listen to a player if he tells something about starcraft and thats it !
Like fighters who stop competing and start talking about religion , money , politics etc. Mate, how is your opinion more entitled than anyone else ?
I love Jaedong with all my heart, but I will not buy a coin if he says so.
I will only buy something if it helps him directly and he admits. Then I'll do it in an instant, no problem ; i don't want anything in return nor do i want to earn some money later.
Yeah, this is one of those things, when a celebrity, actor or a streamer in this case promotes something like this I assume one of 3 scenarios: 1. They're getting paid to advertise and have no idea about the actual "product" (most likely) 2. They're getting scammed themselves 3. They're in on the scam Maybe some sort of combination of the three.
But unfortunately many people don't think like that and using someone recognizable with an established audience works, it works very well. Whatever the details really are, Flash was at least irresponsible and handled the fallout of the the situation badly. I hope he comes back, but I'd understand if he doesn't.
On April 06 2023 14:00 prosatan wrote: But why do people belive that starcraft streamers and AMAZING players are also good at finance ? I don't get it.
I only listen to a player if he tells something about starcraft and thats it !
Like fighters who stop competing and start talking about religion , money , politics etc. Mate, how is your opinion more entitled than anyone else ?
I love Jaedong with all my heart, but I will not buy a coin if he says so.
I will only buy something if it helps him directly and he admits. Then I'll do it in an instant, no problem ; i don't want anything in return nor do i want to earn some money later.
Did you not read what he wrote?
Flash has a reputation for making an absolute fortune from crypto investing in the past.
EPT
