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Sweden33723 Posts
http://sc.gosugamers.net/thread.php?id=22272
Dr_Deadmeat made a post on gosugamers about making a starcraft instructional video (he wanted replays that showed specific things etc). Thought of something like this before but eh, unlike him, I was too lazy to ever do anything about it but now that he is..
Posted this over on gg.net;
Hehe, I've had this idea before as well, but I was thinking more of an instructional movie, ie someone talking and showing what to do on a first person screen.
Like make one about the early game, one about those 'little things' and common beginners mistakes, then strat specific ones and so on.
Good luck with it, I suggest you post on teamliquid.net as well for some more input 
Or, if you don't mind, I could make a thread about it and link this one?
Eitherway, it's a great initiative, nice to see you are not as lazy as I am :D
So, does anyone think it could be done? Could be like a great encyclopedia of BW knowledge for beginners I don't think it's a 1 man project tho, would need at least a player per race (preferably more, and preferably with good spoken english), video editors etc..
I find this idea really good to be honest, if you've ever seen a martial arts instructional video you'll know what I'm envisioning - showing techniques/tips individually then showing this technique when applied in a real game..
Post away =]
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Belgium6787 Posts
Like the progamer 'How To' vods by nada,themarine and yellow?
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i would much prefer good players take a rep or a vod and analysis the late and mid game situations and speak their thoughts + mindset like if they were playing it. The early game stuff is known by nearly all bw players and it isn't that hard to pick up and there are already many website + guides dedicated to it.
what i'm talking about is exactly what they do with chess and go games in China.
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Sweden33723 Posts
On May 29 2006 08:52 Xeofreestyler wrote:
Like the progamer 'How To' vods by nada,themarine and yellow?
No, not exactly, they play mock games kind of and only cover a single build order.
I'd want to do like one video on basics (ie splitting/cloning, basic micro rules, building placement, using buildings to improve mining, things like keeping up worker production and so on).
Then one that focuses on a specific matchup or race (ie a PvZ one would have some more PvZ specific tips like help on interpreting what you scout and show some build orders, discuss them, show the variations, show them in game with the player commentating like haduken said).
Maybe one that focuses on all those cute little tricks (killing invisible things with splash, jumping walls, manner pylon/gas rushing and when not to do it, dropship micro, marine micro, although I suppose some of these would be in the race specific videos).
It's a pretty ambitious project but would be really cool.
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Belgium6787 Posts
Oh I see
That would be cool yeah =)
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He wants to do like a feature video, I think the idea it's amazing, but it will take a while to develop it.
Gogo for it!.
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is awesome32282 Posts
I had this idea as well. Like showing a lurk ling force engagins a m&m group an letting them attack ground, and then showing they results with micro.
How do drone defence with sunks against a rush, muta micro, cloning.
the hardest part i found when i tried to play a little with this is making the specific maps for shwing this because i suck at making maps (like a map with a group of m&m vs some zerg force)
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I qoute myself from gosugamers.net and I say that I am in the middle of a exam round and if I am luky I can start on tuesday next week (6. july 2006) If I am lucky, and then I will start with downloading some vods, and making FPreps =)... Anyway, if you have any suggestions I have bookmarked both this site and the one at gosugamers so I will check it regulary =)
Thanks for all positive and helpfully response for now =)
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I love the idea and would love to help in this, but I don't see any way, because I suck at playing  If you have anything I could help you with, ask (and no, i don't have any video editing skills...).
Edit: I've watched thousands of reps, I'm not completely clueless 
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Cool, i can help with zerg ;D
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I can help with terran, I am gosu at all 3 but terran > all
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What format are you planning on?
If you're planning on doing a different video for each race, you might have to start at a higher level than "new player" since there is a lot of good advice that will not find it's place because it is not race-specific. (this is not limited to early game)
I like the idea of a single video, even if it's long (large to dl) so maybe you could find a way to connect all the individual videos in a comprehensive one instead?  Also the "gimmicks and tricks" part is something I'm sure will attract more audience than matchup-specific tips, even though they aren't as difficult to find out or learn.. so please be sure to include that
I really think that, aside from the quality of the advice, what this video needs is an easy to follow, logical and natural-flowing story-telling feel to it, with a balance between increasing the difficulty of the advice given and keeping it arranged by race, matchup or concept (macro, micro, game mechanics, basic unit counters, build orders, about terrain, scouting, about maps, map-specific, strategy and ..gimmicks?).
For example, you wouldn't want to include fragments from korean pros' first person vods until later in the video, when the viewer has supposedly assimilated the information provided and can make sense of what he sees. Analysis of specific pro games should also be reserved for the end of the video (although this part can be as long as all of the others combined), as they would require an undestanding of all the concepts individually and a new sense of combining them to reach an end result.
An alternative is an inbetween solution, that is, after the basics have been covered, have each matchup (or race) section start at low level and gradually increase in difficulty.
Another point I want to make, which is more of a request really is to always have in mind the importance of explaining why. Why does zeal/temp work vs pure hydra, why are chokes important, why proxy in middle of map etc. This will give more depth and is sure to immerse the viewer deeper than just a list of counters, build orders or things that simply "work".
In view of this, perhaps including a concise history of each matchup at some point in their individual videos will give a sense of how the game evolved (this will help to better understand for ex, why fast expanding is more popular than 2 years ago or why unit combinations have changed).. Nothing too fancy, but don't overlook how maps, overall technique and most of all strategy have evolved.
Maybe sprinkled and scattered in the video you could include the psychological aspect of the game. Not letting yourself be intimidated by your opponent, knowing to fake weaknesses, keeping cool after gaining an advantage (being aware that the player at a disadvantage plays more fiercely than before), not underestimating those rated lower than you, how making a bad decision and carrying it out is better than not making a decision at all, learning from mistakes. How it has become a "mind game" at the highest levels... Things that connect it to all other competitions.
Also please read the recommended threads , it's probably the most valuable collection of information you can find on this forum.
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Same here, I've been mussing about this idea too. But I know I don't have the skills to make a good video.
If anyone is interested I'll gladly make a "magazine" style guide as a backup to the videos. And I only have my humble writing skills, and newbish photoshoping skills to contribue. But I would gladly try to learn photoshop just for this project, cause hell I plan on learning it anyways.
And I if anyone else, who is more qualified, wants to take hold of this project, feel free to do so. I only ask that you let me help so I can learn from you
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I'm really excited about this idea, this is what I'm envisioning (is that a word? oO):
It would be two movies, which you could give out to interested friends, which, after watching them, would give them a good idea of what StarCraft is about. My goal wouldn't be to help advanced players, but to help the clueless.
I think I'd want to make (if I can help with anything -_-) the following movies:
A movie that generally answers the question what StarCraft really is. I keep having friends asking me, what the fuck it is that I always do on the computer and I can try to explain about StarCraft and the Korean scene, but they never really understand, because they can't even picture people going to a stadium to watch two people playing a video game. The video should contain imo:
- a very general explanation of what StarCraft is (a Strategy game with three battling races, where you have to build up an economy and train fighters to help you win the game over the opponent)
- what sets StarCraft apart from other strategy games (speed, strategical depth, etc., maybe show a few cool battle scenes)
- the Korean scene, how people there are professional StarCraft gamers, and show some games with a lot of people watching :p
- The point of this whole movie would be to make people want to play StarCraft, or make parents understand, what it is they’re kids are doing, so it would have to be very interesting and cool :p
The second movie would really go into the matchups and give advice, the thing Doctorasul was talking about in his post. It should definitely have a story feeling to it and become more and more detailed until the end. The general aim of the movie, would be that if some newbie watched (and a total game newbie as well) would have a good idea of what matters in StarCraft and what the 6 matchups are about and how they typically progress.
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Sweden33723 Posts
Not that I know if dr_deadmeat would be interested in this, but I think this could be a good community project, ie everyone pitching in :O
But maybe he just wanted to do this himself (just kinda realized that I might have stepped on his toes somewhat, in case this was something he wanted to do alone :>).
Although that doesn't really make it impossible for anyone else to copy him :D
It would be cool if it could be organized like you said, Orome, ie:
Introduction (what you wrote)
General BW concepts (ie a quick rundown of worker production, expanding, rushing, teching, maybe an introduction to some common BW terms, basic micro, ramps/high ground, trees..)
Race (and perhaps matchup) specific videos, going into more detail on how what was laid out in the first video changes depending on matchup and so on. Introducing build orders, matchup or race specific tricks etc.
Other (where you'd throw in the gimmicky stuff ).
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Even if everyone's pitching in, you definitely have to have people in charge, so he could still run the whole project
Edit: You posted again, while I was writing
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Sweden33723 Posts
On May 29 2006 17:56 Orome wrote:Even if everyone's pitching in, you definitely have to have people in charge, so he could still run the whole project Edit: You posted again, while I was writing
And a 3rd time :D!
Yeah, true =]
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The highest principle should be that it has to be watchable for non-nerds That's why I think you should put the whole gameplay into one movie, because I think there's a higher chance that people that are semi-interested are going to watch one movie covering everything, than six movies covering each matchup seperately. I also think the TvZ, TvP and PvZ should be explained in one, ie not showing the Terran's perspective first and then the Zerg's, but showing both together and how they react to each other. Even for people that aren't necessarily interested in becoming a progamer (my parents for instance :p), it could be interesting to watch, how the different strategies correspond to each other and what a player's goal is depending on what strategy he and his opponent used and so on.
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Sweden33723 Posts
Well, it seems like a very massive project to get it all into one video - would be easier to do it in steps at least (to maintain interest and motivation too).
But I guess the first video could include a basic rundown of strategies too or that it all could be made into one big video eventually.
Or one video like what you described and the rest later=]
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EPT
