• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 06:59
CEST 12:59
KST 19:59
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview7[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21
Community News
Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28)10[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June4Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0
StarCraft 2
General
Daily SC2 Player Grid - feedback wanted StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th TL Poll: How do you feel about the 5.0.16 PTR balance changes? Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview Updates to The Core/Core Lite for v5.0.16?
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) GSL CK #4 20-21th June Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
Mutation # 530 One For All The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed Mutation # 528 Infection Detected
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ VPN experiences Data needed vespene.gg — BW replays in browser
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals [BSL22] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CEST Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Relatively freeroll strategies Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread ZeroSpace Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason Total War: Warhammer 40K
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI UK Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread [H]Internet/Gaming Cafe Tips and Tricks
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT] NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How To Predict Tilt in Espor…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 11559 users

[Stream] Sea playing BW - Page 11

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 9 10 11 12 13 16 Next All
vOdToasT
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Sweden2870 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-19 01:06:06
December 19 2012 01:05 GMT
#201
On December 19 2012 09:50 Cele wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 08:24 Glioburd wrote:
I remember Sea was saying at an interview that he found SC2 funnier than BW, basically he said he prefered SC2. We know what he think actually. I agree with Ribbon, I don't think it's possible for a former BW pro to prefer SC2. Especially those who made results.


Yeah and ofc you can`t take korean players for serious, if they say something alike" at first i disliked sc2 but now i feel its a good game". It is expectated from this players to communicate in a positive way about the game, not to speak their minds.

Doing the opposite would

1) hurt the professionality of the players

2) Shed a bad light on their teams and sponsors

3) bring hate from sc2 fanboys, since the sc2 community is like an angry hive of wasps anyway.


Back when PvZ was heavily Zerg favoured (55 - 65% statistically for Zerg on like, every map) some pro Protoss users, when asked about it in interviews, pretended like nothing was wrong. Lol. Obviously something was wrong - the maps. Many of them didn't allow for forge expanding, or even for good 1 gate expanding.

There have been some maps that favour Protoss in PvZ (like Othello: ~55% PvZ), but not as many as favour Zerg.
If it's stupid but it works, then it's not stupid* (*Or: You are stupid for losing to it, and gotta git gud)
Ribbon
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5278 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-19 01:47:45
December 19 2012 01:37 GMT
#202
On December 19 2012 07:27 N.geNuity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 06:30 DyEnasTy wrote:
On December 19 2012 02:39 ChoiSulli wrote:
lol as if this is so surprising. I will be shocked the day someone who has played BW comes out and says they prefer SCII


Fantasy?


fantasy also explicitly said "hellions suck" in a PL interview after winning a match in hybrid league.

people opinions are mixed obviously


That's not an opinion on the game, that's a balance whine.

On December 19 2012 09:50 Cele wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 08:24 Glioburd wrote:
I remember Sea was saying at an interview that he found SC2 funnier than BW, basically he said he prefered SC2. We know what he think actually. I agree with Ribbon, I don't think it's possible for a former BW pro to prefer SC2. Especially those who made results.


Yeah and ofc you can`t take korean players for serious, if they say something alike" at first i disliked sc2 but now i feel its a good game". It is expectated from this players to communicate in a positive way about the game, not to speak their minds.


As someone who follows the SC2 scene, let me assure you that SC2 pros bitch about the game incessantly. Idra's the most famous (though, oddly enough, he seems to like HotS), but they all do it. Foreigners a bit more than Koreans, but DRG had a rant on why Force Field was bullshit, and everyone hated Vortex so badly that even Blizzard's official explanation for why it got nerfed into oblivion in HotS was ripped directly from Idra. Every SC2 vs BW thread has someone cite that big post from LaLuSh about how SC2 bases have too many mineral patches and it fucks up the game etc (I have several disagreements with that post, but that's neither here nor there).



Nony made a video of why BW carriers were better than SC2 carriers, which got popular enough that it led to Blizzard letting Carriers change targets at leash range. Small change compared to the difference, but a change.

SC2 fans are a bit weird. They get defensive if the game is attacked on a forum, but agree strongly with those same arguments from an SC2 pro, especially one with a BW background.

Now, yes, the KeSPA players might be different because KeSPA has major issues, but I imagine we'll be seeing that discipline break before too long. Bisu, at least, has to loathe SC2, if for no other reason than a game he was godly at got replaced with a game he's...*checks TLPD* 3-7 in, and not even getting fielded in SKT's last game. Two of those wins were against Sea!

But, like I said. I think a lot of them are holding their tongues until HotS comes out.

I really wish the BW pros were more vocal, though. Might get some things changed if there was an outcry.
Black[CAT]
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Malaysia2589 Posts
December 19 2012 02:10 GMT
#203
Sea streaming on Afreeca???
You mean ESPORTS isnt a synonym for SC2? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch 2 with Cherry Blue Switches- BW or SC2? Why not both?
TheyCallMePops
Profile Joined August 2011
United States81 Posts
December 19 2012 02:18 GMT
#204
Yeah snipealot2 is restreaming him

Im so sad he retired, he was on my PL fantasy team and everything. His play was becoming so fantastic so quickly, sad to see his passion fade. Hopefully he finds fun/love in Brood War on afreeca though!
Antisocialmunky
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States5912 Posts
December 19 2012 02:24 GMT
#205
He retired from flying into tourneys into streaming Broodwar from his house. I wouldn't call that a retirement, I'd call that a promotion.
[゚n゚] SSSSssssssSSsss ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Marine/Raven Guide:http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=163605
jinorazi
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)4948 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-19 02:40:59
December 19 2012 02:40 GMT
#206
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*

User was warned for this post
age: 84 | location: california | sex: 잘함
Obstikal
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
616 Posts
December 19 2012 03:20 GMT
#207
I had to triple-take when I put up my good night stream(snipealot) and saw him there.
AnomalySC2
Profile Joined August 2012
United States2073 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-19 03:38:35
December 19 2012 03:38 GMT
#208
[QUOTE]On December 19 2012 10:37 Ribbon wrote:
[QUOTE]On December 19 2012 07:27 N.geNuity wrote:
[QUOTE]On December 19 2012 06:30 DyEnasTy wrote:
[QUOTE]On December 19 2012 02:39 ChoiSulli wrote:
lol as if this is so surprising. I will be shocked the day someone who has played BW comes out and says they prefer SCII[/QUOTE]

Fantasy?[/QUOTE]

fantasy also explicitly said "hellions suck" in a PL interview after winning a match in hybrid league.

people opinions are mixed obviously

That's not an opinion on the game, that's a balance whine. [/QUOTE]

Him thinking sc2 imbalanced isn't an opinion....?
Ribbon
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5278 Posts
December 19 2012 03:38 GMT
#209
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*


Now, that's actually a pretty serious accusation. Nony was free to make a big video on why SC2 carriers suck and I think even get it featured. Why wouldn't Sea have the same right?

He probably just doesn't want to start a fight over it.
Shana
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Indonesia1814 Posts
December 19 2012 05:35 GMT
#210
Can we just stop BW vs sc2 crap please?
Believing in what lies ahead. | That which we call a rose, by any other name would smell as sweet.
GolemMadness
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada11044 Posts
December 19 2012 05:50 GMT
#211
On December 19 2012 12:38 Ribbon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*


Now, that's actually a pretty serious accusation. Nony was free to make a big video on why SC2 carriers suck and I think even get it featured. Why wouldn't Sea have the same right?

He probably just doesn't want to start a fight over it.


Not that I'm agreeing with him, but there's a difference between making a video on how carriers can be improved and saying that the game is bad.
http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=FLABREZU
ne4aJIb
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Russian Federation3209 Posts
December 19 2012 06:54 GMT
#212
HE IS STREAMING AGAIN!!![image loading]
Bisu,Best,Stork,Jangbi and Flash, Fantasy, Leta, Light and Jaedong, Hydra, Zero, Soulkey assemble in ACE now!
TaShadan
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany1981 Posts
December 19 2012 08:53 GMT
#213
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*


is this a real quote of a conversation?
Total Annihilation Zero
Black[CAT]
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Malaysia2589 Posts
December 19 2012 09:10 GMT
#214
On December 19 2012 17:53 TaShadan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*


is this a real quote of a conversation?


Are you seriously asking that question?
You mean ESPORTS isnt a synonym for SC2? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch 2 with Cherry Blue Switches- BW or SC2? Why not both?
TaShadan
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany1981 Posts
December 19 2012 09:24 GMT
#215
On December 19 2012 18:10 Black[CAT] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 17:53 TaShadan wrote:
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*


is this a real quote of a conversation?


Are you seriously asking that question?


yes i do

are you seriously asking?
Total Annihilation Zero
kusto
Profile Joined November 2010
Russian Federation823 Posts
December 19 2012 13:11 GMT
#216
On December 19 2012 18:24 TaShadan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 18:10 Black[CAT] wrote:
On December 19 2012 17:53 TaShadan wrote:
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*


is this a real quote of a conversation?


Are you seriously asking that question?


yes i do

are you seriously asking?


Come on, this conversation is obviously NOT real.
...
the game is the game
N.geNuity
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States5112 Posts
December 19 2012 13:25 GMT
#217
On December 19 2012 10:37 Ribbon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 07:27 N.geNuity wrote:
On December 19 2012 06:30 DyEnasTy wrote:
On December 19 2012 02:39 ChoiSulli wrote:
lol as if this is so surprising. I will be shocked the day someone who has played BW comes out and says they prefer SCII


Fantasy?


fantasy also explicitly said "hellions suck" in a PL interview after winning a match in hybrid league.

people opinions are mixed obviously


That's not an opinion on the game, that's a balance whine.



from what I can remember, the commentators asked like "aw, the terrorist, you must be enjoying hellions in sc2 right? What do you think of them, they are close to the pulture....."

and he responded with that. I'm 70% sure the question was like that, one of the many hybrid league questions that tried to compare bw to sc2 for the viewers in the post match interviews (immediately post match, not formal fomos/daily esports interviews). But the question I believe was about enjoyment, fwiw.

not important anyways since it literally was a 5 second response in a random after-match interview.
iu, seungah, yura, taeyeon, hyosung, lizzy, suji, sojin, jia, ji eun, eunji, soya, younha, jiyeon, fiestar, sinb, jung myung hoon godtier. BW FOREVERR
[Aot]_Aether
Profile Joined May 2012
United States89 Posts
December 19 2012 14:25 GMT
#218
I gotta say, snipealot is the coolest. I've been seeing Fantasy, Nada, Bisu, Miya, and Sea play great games all day. It's the best. I hope this means that fans are interested enough maybe to put together some of their own leagues.
Tell me builds to help me win, please. :)
sabas123
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands3122 Posts
December 19 2012 14:46 GMT
#219
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*

how did you get that?
The harder it becomes, the more you should focus on the basics.
[Aot]_Aether
Profile Joined May 2012
United States89 Posts
December 19 2012 15:12 GMT
#220
On December 19 2012 23:46 sabas123 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2012 11:40 jinorazi wrote:
Sea: I really can't get into sc2, i'm trying really hard but its frustrating the more i play. There is no reason for me to play, having fun is priority, i'm going to retire.
Nazgul: Whats wrong? You were so excited at first.
Sea: Starcraft 2 is not fun.
Nazgul: Hmm, if you're that determined I can't stop you, just dont say sc2 sucks, we're a sc2 team heading the sc2 scene after all.
Sea: Sure, no problem.

*Boots up BW*

how did you get that?

Mild creativity.
Tell me builds to help me win, please. :)
Prev 1 9 10 11 12 13 16 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 97
CranKy Ducklings37
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SortOf 177
Rex 45
Ryung 38
MindelVK 13
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 2136
Horang2 858
Soulkey 614
Jaedong 521
Noble 471
Pusan 336
ZerO 273
Light 195
Larva 195
BeSt 152
[ Show more ]
EffOrt 130
hero 126
Leta 124
actioN 118
Last 85
Sharp 80
ggaemo 79
Hyun 72
Free 69
ToSsGirL 55
JYJ 38
Backho 37
Killer 33
Aegong 27
sorry 25
Hm[arnc] 25
sSak 22
Movie 22
Bale 18
GoRush 17
HiyA 16
soO 15
Terrorterran 14
zelot 9
Liquid`Ret 7
IntoTheRainbow 5
Dota 2
XcaliburYe142
League of Legends
JimRising 315
Counter-Strike
olofmeister561
shoxiejesuss339
Other Games
Liquid`RaSZi867
crisheroes218
Happy119
Trikslyr26
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream6407
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 1139
Other Games
gamesdonequick478
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 41
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP19
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 5
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos750
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Spring Champion…
1m
MaxPax vs SHIN
ByuN vs herO
Solar vs Zoun
WardiTV91
TaKeTV 61
Rex45
Ryung 38
IntoTheiNu 36
OSC
2h 1m
OSC
13h 1m
CranKy Ducklings
23h 1m
WardiTV Spring Champion…
1d
Cure vs SKillous
WardiTV Spring Champion…
2 days
GSL
2 days
Maru vs ShoWTimE
Classic vs Reynor
herO vs Lambo
Solar vs Clem
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
2 days
XuanXuan vs Jaystar
Mihu vs Messiah
eOnzErG vs Dewalt
Bonyth vs Jaystar
TerrOr vs Messiah
XuanXuan vs Mihu
eOnzErG vs Jaystar
Replay Cast
2 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
3 days
[ Show More ]
GSL
3 days
Patches Events
3 days
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
3 days
Dewalt vs Messiah
Bonyth vs Mihu
TerrOr vs XuanXuan
eOnzErG vs Messiah
Jaystar vs Mihu
Dewalt vs XuanXuan
Bonyth vs TerrOr
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Douyu Cup 2020
6 days
Oliveira vs Trap
Jieshi vs XY
soO vs FanTaSy
TY vs Coffee
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-06-16
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
SCTL 2026 Spring
Maestros of the Game 2
WardiTV Spring 2026
Murky Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Douyu Cup 2026
BCC 2026
Heroes Pulsing #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.