EPTmore likely that joke will kill itself much ealier than the 12yrs BW lived
but i fail to see the end of BW somewhere near in time
Stop Worrying! - Page 6
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Kim_Hyun_Han
706 Posts
- but i fail to see the end of BW somewhere near in time | ||
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ppshchik
United States862 Posts
ICCUP community is way more mature. | ||
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rick-dmg
Canada36 Posts
On September 29 2010 15:07 Ideas wrote: this basically boils down to "bw graphics bad. it's not fair that someone with more experience at a task than me is better at it just because they know what to do!" No, it doesn't boil down to that. You missed it completely. Reply fail. On September 29 2010 15:07 Ideas wrote: also, who the fuck cares about ESPORTS. i care about BW. most esports (well, all esports outside of BW really) are fucking awful and i have no interest in them. BW is the only real esport in my eyes. you act like we must all make this sacrifice and play a shittier game just so ESPORTS can grow, but who gives a fuck. i just want to have fun playing BW and watch JD win the OSL again. Well, if you didn't notice... my whole reply was towards someone that was specifically discussing eSports. I am not trying to have a "BW should live-forever discussion". I was replying to someone that was interested in the future of eSports. Your entire reply is irrelevant, since you aren't even discussing things with the same end-goal. You just want to keep some ancient game alive... because you and other people have sunk so much time into it that you have an unfair advantage. What would you think if some nutcase was saying "SC:BW is ruining the mammoth hunting scene... why can't we just stick with something we all have experience with... blah blah". Get over it... BW is dying and WILL disappear at some point. You may enjoy it, and that is great... but that doesn't change the facts. Sorry. | ||
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rick-dmg
Canada36 Posts
On September 30 2010 01:14 ppshchik wrote: SC2 is an overrated trash game. SC2 ladder is filled with a bunch of kiddos and warcraft 3 players who cheese and all in you. ICCUP community is way more mature. By definition, yes... the game has had longer to "mature". If you mean more mature when it comes to discussing things... re-read your post. You sound like an 80 year old man - who rejects all innovation and thinks new technology/ideas are stupid. Congrats - I'm sure a lot of people enjoy hearing you nag on anything modern. If that negative attitude is maturity - I don't want it. | ||
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TurboDreams
United States427 Posts
You just want to keep some ancient game alive... because you and other people have sunk so much time into it that you have an unfair advantage. What would you think if some nutcase was saying "SC:BW is ruining the mammoth hunting scene... why can't we just stick with something we all have experience with... blah blah". Get over it... BW is dying and WILL disappear at some point. You may enjoy it, and that is great... but that doesn't change the facts. Sorry. So all your anger is fueled by someone who played an older game has an unfair advantage over you? On a side note, I really think that as long as the South Koreans still have interest in BW, it will continue to live on. | ||
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Garaman
United States556 Posts
but forced to play koreans all the time, i believe my gaming has gotten alot better skillwise. i am doing quite well with my switch from protoss -> terran -> to zerg currently. in z v t my weakest matchup, i've been getting better at facing terran. i can do my hive transition quite well, and im good at sandwiching the midgame army now. the problem arises when the fucker switches from bio - > mech. but neways bw is not dead i love the game nothing like a beautiful, comeback game in a 30-40 minute macro dukefest win! | ||
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tbrown47
United States1235 Posts
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Ideas
United States8158 Posts
On September 30 2010 01:25 rick-dmg wrote: No, it doesn't boil down to that. You missed it completely. Reply fail. im pretty sure it did. what does it boil down to then? do you understand how forums work? just replying "no you're wrong" is not a very good rebuttal at all. You just want to keep some ancient game alive... because you and other people have sunk so much time into it that you have an unfair advantage. What would you think if some nutcase was saying "SC:BW is ruining the mammoth hunting scene... why can't we just stick with something we all have experience with... blah blah". Get over it... BW is dying and WILL disappear at some point. You may enjoy it, and that is great... but that doesn't change the facts. Sorry. do you honestly think the reason I think SC2 sucks is because im as good in it or something? rofl in BW i've been playing for 3 years and im only C-. in SC2 im easily in the top 5%. I get my ass kicked on BW sooo much compared to SC2. and if anything, getting my ass kicked all the time on ICCUP is a reason I like BW more, I like always feeling like the underdog and always having to improve myself and learn the game more. SC2 is worse than BW in a plethora of areas, not just "it takes less skill". honestly i dont think that SC2 takes much less skill at all, it's just fucking boring, even if it's almost as hard as BW (and by hard I dont mean "hard to get to top rank" or something but rather "to play the game perfectly"). | ||
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GunSlinger
614 Posts
EDIT: Okay I lied, I was very worried but I've found faith again simply by playing the game. Give it a try guys. | ||
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Ocular
Canada141 Posts
On September 27 2010 11:35 l10f wrote: I completely agree with you except that I'm more worried about the proscene than the casual BW players;; Agreed. | ||
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rick-dmg
Canada36 Posts
On September 30 2010 01:31 Musiq wrote: So all your anger is fueled by someone who played an older game has an unfair advantage over you? On a side note, I really think that as long as the South Koreans still have interest in BW, it will continue to live on. Aha, no anger here. Just having a discussion. I don't doubt BW will continue to live on for a while... it just won't see any significant growth. There seems to be two debates in this thread. One that says BW will continue (which I can agree with - to a certain extent) and one that thinks it is the future of eSports (which IMO is not going to happen). No point in trying to convince me that BW will continue to be played by some players... it just isn't the future of eSports and is going to slowly fade out (till very few are still playing it). | ||
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rick-dmg
Canada36 Posts
On September 30 2010 02:17 Ideas wrote: im pretty sure it did. what does it boil down to then? do you understand how forums work? just replying "no you're wrong" is not a very good rebuttal at all. Yes, I understand how forums work. I also understand how trolls like you work. My original post is still there for you to read. You can attempt to "sum it up" in some biased way, or you can actually attempt to understand someone elses perspective. I understand your perspective, I just disagree with it. No hard feelings... You want BW to live on forever. I simply don't believe it has much future. Will people continue to play it... probably (to some degree). But is it likely to see any significant growth - very doubtful for the reasons I pointed out. The top players are there because they have a lot of experience. Unlike any other major sport (basketball, hockey, etc.) there is very little turn-over in the top players. So, you have guys that are just getting better and better... while others are joining with very little comparative experience. Makes for a repeating podium (can you actually deny that?). On September 30 2010 02:17 Ideas wrote: in BW i've been playing for 3 years and im only C-. in SC2 im easily in the top 5%. I get my ass kicked on BW sooo much compared to SC2. and if anything, getting my ass kicked all the time on ICCUP is a reason I like BW more, I like always feeling like the underdog and always having to improve myself and learn the game more. SC2 is worse than BW in a plethora of areas, not just "it takes less skill". honestly i dont think that SC2 takes much less skill at all, it's just fucking boring, even if it's almost as hard as BW (and by hard I dont mean "hard to get to top rank" or something but rather "to play the game perfectly"). Well yes.. SC2 is a new game. So everyone is much closer in experience. There are still some players that are clearly better (many ex-BW pros), but they don't have as significant of a strategic advantage... yet. This quote of yours proves my point. You do poorly in BW because so many players have MASSIVE experience over you. The whole idea of "natural talent" is mostly BS. Players beat you cause they have been playing longer... plain and simple. Every new idea you have... they have seen it and know how to beat it. Very little room for innovation - especially if you are relatively new to the game. SC2 resets all that. Tons of room for people to showcase their true creativity, and their ability to adapt to a whole new set of options. You may not agree with me that it is a good thing, but you can't deny that this is what is actually happening. Within a year or two... there WILL BE pros that are unstoppable by newcomers. Right now, yes... it's pretty easy to be top 5%, but obviously that will change. I'm sure in the first 3 months of BW - it was relatively easy too. Everyone thinks BW is somehow magically different, but the only difference it has is time. SC2 will make up for that eventually... and when BW is almost dead and gone, those that stuck it out will wish they kept up with SC2 when it is huge. | ||
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limonovich
England226 Posts
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.ImpacT.
United States390 Posts
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mimikami
France77 Posts
On September 30 2010 05:35 .ImpacT. wrote: BW Proscene is dying because the GSL is so epic to watch, and has such an amazing prize pool ;_; $87,500 for first place T.T I bet you haven't watched any OSL final then, after that you can have a new definition of the word "epic". The reason that BW is dying, if it is dying at all, is because Blizzard want to kill it to promote SC2 and make more money. | ||
swanized
Canada2480 Posts
On September 30 2010 05:30 limonovich wrote: sc newcomer here, a sc2 trial got me into sc over the summer. i have not played much of either to really have a formidable opinion, but i can already tell that bw is a game which requires a lot more multitasking and micro. from my perspective bw = cs 1.6, sc2 = css, with sc2 not being broken like css but still easier than bw. i wish i had gotten into sc a lot earlier as i'm totally overwhelmed by the sheer awesomeness of the game(s) and community. imho, long live bw. a nice thing to here ^^ | ||
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swanized
Canada2480 Posts
On September 30 2010 05:53 mimikami wrote: I bet you haven't watched any OSL final then, after that you can have a new definition of the word "epic". The reason that BW is dying, if it is dying at all, is because Blizzard want to kill it to promote SC2 and make more money. this defenitely also, let's turn progamers into prize-hunters once again... sounds like a really good idea | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 30 2010 05:53 mimikami wrote: I bet you haven't watched any OSL final then, after that you can have a new definition of the word "epic". The reason that BW is dying, if it is dying at all, is because Blizzard want to kill it to promote SC2 and make more money. I wouldn't go so far as to say that's the sole reason (though it's very likely a factor), seeing as attendance at pro SC1 events was declining since well before SC2 was relevant. Someone else will have the actual statistics on this, but IIRC PL Finals attendance has been rapidly declining for the last 4-5 years. | ||
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funnybananaman
United States830 Posts
On September 30 2010 05:35 .ImpacT. wrote: BW Proscene is dying because the GSL is so epic to watch, and has such an amazing prize pool ;_; $87,500 for first place T.T Partially true, but you have to think these things through. Why does it have $87,500 for first place? Because it has 1000x more viewers. Sponsors give money to what people want to see, NOT the other way around. And the fact is right now most people want to see sc2. So it isn't really fair to blame the sponsors. They don't give a shit lol they'd give that much money to brood war in a second if they thought enough people still cared about it. | ||
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meathook
1289 Posts
On September 29 2010 14:52 rick-dmg wrote: You do realize virtually everything good in the world comes about through progress, right? Do you think the NBA would be a big success if they were still shooting the ball into wooden barrels where they had to pull the ball out the top every time? How about the NHL only playable on actual ice rinks in some frozen wasteland? They had an audience... but it wasn't exactly growing. As it stands, SC:BW is not "dying", but it is not picking up success anywhere besides Korea. Nobody in the rest of the world cares about it, and due to its brutal graphics... it obviously has a shelf life that MUST end (at least in the eyes of the viewing public). So, to say people that want to expand, update, and move the eSport scene forward are somehow it's greatest enemies - is just a really short-sighted thing to say. The game has a brutal learning curve where you simply cannot compete unless you have been playing it for many years. IMO, that isn't as much "skill" anymore... and is more muscle memorization + repetitive gameplay. If I start playing today... there is ZERO chance I will ever beat players that have 10+ years of experience. Not because they are inherently smarter players, but because they have a huge experience advantage that would make ANY idiot play better than a new participant. Do you want pros that win simply based on an unfair experience-advantage, or based on the fact they can adapt and create new strategies in a fresh new game? Personally, I think the real skill comes from being able to adapt and learn something new from time to time. I think a refresh like SC2 gives the game a huge opportunity for growth, and resets at least some of the experience (obviously macro/micro/multi-tasking still plays a significant role). There is such a huge opportunity for eSports to actually materialize into something significant in the entire world. It's sad to see people cling to a game that clearly has no growth potential... and it's just plain frustrating to hear them proclaim that moving the scene forward is somehow a negative thing. LOL, kid.. you're a real piece of work. It's pretty obvious you're a troll and/or completely relieved of intelligence; either way, you should be happy for all the attention that you got in this thread with your flamebait. Just to dispel some of the shitty conjectures that you have brought to this discussion for the sake of other readers: 1. Explain please how a game like chess, which in some instances does not even have graphics, is able to maintain a player base and audience 2000 years after its inception? 2. Your wails regarding the "experience imbalance" new players supposedly experience when undertaking BW is founded only by the fact that you're most likely a D- noob who never managed to win a single game, was too lazy to learn to be better and wrote it off on the belief that everyone else has played the game so long that it is simply impossible for someone new to beat someone who has been playing the game longer than they have. There are many examples of players taking up SC and reaching the top echelons after a short period of time, here are the two most prominent examples of this: Kolll, a German player who competed in the WCG Grand Finals after merely a year or something of playing. He started playing the game at a point when it was saturated with talent and experienced players. And in the Korean proscene there is most notably  By.Baby.These are examples taken off the top of my head. Obviously, they are not the only cases out there. Tl;dr: rick-drm, STFU. | ||
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