• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:15
CEST 13:15
KST 20:15
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202559RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16
Community News
BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed19Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll8Team TLMC #5 - Submission re-extension4
StarCraft 2
General
Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings What tournaments are world championships? RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing
Tourneys
Esports World Cup 2025 FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava
Brood War
General
[Update] ShieldBattery: 2025 Redesign Ginuda's JaeDong Interview Series BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues CSL Xiamen International Invitational [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? [G] Mineral Boosting Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile CCLP - Command & Conquer League Project
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Post Pic of your Favorite Food! Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 921 users

[pokemon rmt] ninjas and greninja

Blogs > Dead9
Post a Reply
Dead9
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States4725 Posts
October 31 2013 06:47 GMT
#1
Hi everyone dead9 here with a rundown of my greninja-based HO team. I decided to use greninja because water shuriken is a pretty cool move and I thought it'd be fun to build a subliechi set around it. It peaked in the top 10 on pokemon showdown with a 27-4 record (proof http://i.imgur.com/EJvK2KU.png), which isn't particularly impressive because nobody has any idea what they're doing right now but I think the team is reasonably strong at least. It has a couple of holes, but since it's HO the team can generally play around it.

Since this team was to be built around greninja I obviously started off the team with greninja. I threw on rotom-w to lure out water resists like ferrothorn and gastrodon. Scizor was picked out next since he and rotom-w are best buddies and resist most of each other's weaknesses, plus he helps to lure out more bulky waters like rotom-w and jellicent. I needed a stealth rocker and I don't have a spinblocker so I decided to use skarm. The extra bit of damage from spikes helps a lot for wearing teams down. Next up was gyarados-m to lure out more water resists. I had scarf politoed in this slot for a while since he could set up rain for greninja, rotom-w, and scizor as well but I found that 5 turns of rain wasn't really worth it. Finally I picked up alakazam to revenge kill anything giving me issues.



[image loading]
MANGEKYOU IN THE EYES
ONLY SEE BLOOD WHEN A NINJA CRIES


Greninja @ Liechi Berry
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Jolly Nature
IVs: 26 HP
- Water Shuriken
- Waterfall
- Night Slash
- Substitute

As a master ninja greninja uses his genjutsu substitute to lower his hp into torrent/liechi range. With his mangekyou water shurikens he can sweep through scarf and priority pokemon. After he hits 25% HP, liechi berry and torrent both activate, so on top of his water STAB he has a 3.375x multiplier on all his water moves. This means water shuriken is effectively a 152 BP priority move (~50 BP per hit) and waterfall is a 270 BP move with flinch chance. Night slash for additional coverage on certain pokes (starmie, latios, and also weakened ferrothorns). I considered rain dance over night slash for extra bonus damage (5x damage on all water moves), but it's too hard to get a free turn to rain dance. 26 HP IVs so that his HP is a multiple of 8. That means 2 switches into stealth rocks does 25% damage exactly, and one sub does 25% damage exactly, so I can activate liechi after 3 subs. The lowered HP doesn't really make a difference because at 25% he'll die to anything that breathes at him the wrong way anyway. Jolly over adamant mainly to outspeed starmie, latios, and latias. I considered adamant but I think outspeeding those three is more important. The rest of my team is set up to weaken their team enough that greninja can sweep. Greninja is my main win condition and doubles as a revenge killer.

[image loading]
I WILL NOT DIE HERE!
DESTINED TO DISCOVER THE TRUE MEANING BEHIND EVERYTHING!
DESTINED TO TAKE CONTROL OF EVERYTHING IN THIS WORLD!

Rotom-Wash @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 36 SAtk / 220 Spd
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Rest

Rotom-w snakes through matches with his volt switch. With chesto resto rotom-w can pull an orochimaru and come back from the dead for round two after being fatally wounded. Rotom-w is the best lead in the game; he doesn't really have any bad lead matchups, unless your opponent opens with like gastrodon or something crazy. Usually I lead with skarm, but rotom-w is a nice backup if I expect a bad matchup for skarm (like aerodactyl or whatever). It also lets me eat a spore or a sleep powder, and in some cases it lets me to fake a choiced set and surprise hydro pump or will-o-wisp their mamoswine or something. 0 Atk IVs so I don't hurt myself in my confusion, though that's not really a big deal most of the time. This thing also destroys the currently extremely popular talonflame and aegislash so that's nice. I've been considering a bulkier EV spread since this thing has to check so many pokemon for me but then I get outsped by breloom and speedier scizors and I don't know if that's worth it.


[image loading]
I WORK HARD AND I NEVER GIVE UP!
THAT IS MY GIFT
THAT IS MY NINJA WAY!


Scizor @ Metal Coat
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 76 Spd / 180 HP
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Roost

Like rock lee scizor wins games through his never-give-up attitude. Even after breaking his physical body he can open his inner gates with roost to continue fighting. He uses his iron fists and taijutsu mastery to punch through the opposing team. Generally scizor fakes a band early on, and later comes in, roosts off damage and/or swords for the sweep. He can set up on a lot of targets, and lures out bulky waters like rotom-w so greninja can later sweep. U-turn allows him to bait out physical walls. For example, u-turn/volt switching back and forth between rotom-w and scizor allows him to wear down skarm switchins. Sometimes you can swords, then u-turn out when they switch in a bulky water (eg rotom-w) expecting the bullet punch. Also a lot of players switch setup bait like aegislash and gliscor into scizor expecting the u-turn or bullet punch, which means free swords and roosts. Scizor functions as a lure, revenge killer, and secondary win condition. 76 Spd EVs to outspeed wobbuffet, almost all ttar, skarm, and anything else under base 70 speed.

[image loading]
YO! IM JIRAIYA!
YOU CAN SEND ME A LOVE LETTER LATER <3


Skarmory @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spd / 252 Atk
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Taunt
- Brave Bird

Jiraiya skarmory sacrifices his life for the team. Like a true team player, he always lays down his ninjutsu stealth rocks and tries to get a few layer of spikes up as well. He can rasengan brave bird to kill both himself and his opponent after sturdy activates to prevent spinning. Maximum speed to outspeed opposing leads and maximum attack for maximum power. Taunt prevents slower leads from setting up rocks or whatever else. A common opening against my skarm is rotom-w volt switch into spinner, which puts me within brave bird suicide range so I can sac himprevent the spin, and switch into something to either KO the spinner (greninja on starmie, rotom-w on donphan, etc) or set up for free. Gyarados in particular can set up on most of the common spinners.

[image loading]
BELIEVE IT!

Gyarados @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 168 Spd / 252 Atk / 88 HP
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Ice Fang
- Earthquake

Gyarados switches into mega nine tailed fox form to cleave teams apart. Like naruto, gyarados is a team player and the main character of this team. He rarely sweeps but he sets up everything for all the other pokemon. If you stay in non-mega form you can eat u-turns and close combats to set up (especially with intimidate), and switching to mega form lets you eat a volt switch or tbolt. With 168 speed EVs and a positive nature gyarados outspeeds base 130s (aka jolteon) after a dragon dance. Attack is maxed out for maximum damage, and the rest is dumped into HP for easier setup. Water/ice/ground is very good coverage, especially with mold breaker, which lets him hit levitate pokes with EQ. For example, gyarados OHKOs rotom-w at +1, which is obviously very nice. Gyarados punches holes in the opposing team and/or weakens their water resists.

[image loading]
THE ONLY ONE BRINGING DOWN VENGEANCE...
IS ME


Alakazam @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Like shikamaru, alakazam uses his massive intellect to pick at my enemy's weaknesses. With his genjutsu magic guard focus sash he's guaranteed at least one hit, and with his careful deliberation he can ohko any opposing pokemon with his ninjutsu. He rarely does much more than revenge kill one or two pokemon, but that's what he's there for. He can also eat predicted will-o-wisps, leech seeds, and toxics with his genjutsu mastery. My entire team is very squishy, so I often have to save alakazam for specific pokemon. The biggest issues for the team are mega-luke, mega-gengar, and jolteon. Specs jolteon sweeps my entire team after scizor/rotom-w are weakened with thunderbolt, so I have to save alakazam against him. Luke sweeps through scizor since close combat OHKOs. Often I have to sac scizor to weaken jolteon/luke with a bullet punch so alakazam can revenge kill them more reliably. 2 Atk IVs for maximum power HP Ice and to reduce confusion damage. Psychic over psyshock because blissey and volcarona aren't major concerns for my team. Psychic/shadowball/focusblast has perfect coverage, but I'm running HP Ice as well to OHKO the ever-common ground/flying and dragon/flying pokemon.

Anyways that's the team and it's doing well at the moment, but I don't know how well it'll work when the metagame settles a little more. Feel free to make suggestions but I don't know if I'll be playing this team any time in the near future; this team's mostly retired since I've played so many games on it (on top of my 27-4 run I played probably another ~50 games testing different pokes and different sets). Enjoy!

Pokemon is fun guys

*****
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
October 31 2013 06:50 GMT
#2
jesus christ oliver lay off the shrooms
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
RLTY
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States965 Posts
October 31 2013 06:53 GMT
#3
Krazy team Krazy song Krazy player
what more can i say 5/5

btw if you guys dont know this guy is pretty much the arteezy of pokemon
Fishgle
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States2174 Posts
October 31 2013 11:26 GMT
#4
What are your thoughts on Infiltrator Noivern? (it outspeeds your alakazam and greninja), can learn Shadow Ball, Flamethrower, Dragon Pulse, Psychic, Focus Blast... pretty decent coverage.
aka ChillyGonzalo / GnozL
Roe
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Canada6002 Posts
October 31 2013 11:58 GMT
#5
that first pokemon looks like something from a creepypasta :o
strongandbig
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States4858 Posts
October 31 2013 12:01 GMT
#6
Hahaha man I wanna be the arteezy of pokemon
"It's the torso" "only more so!"
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States44300 Posts
October 31 2013 12:16 GMT
#7
I don't know what parts of this blog make sense and which are satire, although I like the Pokemon and Naruto references, as well as the face of the Pokemon. So... 5/5 lol
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Cool Cat
Profile Joined June 2009
United States1644 Posts
October 31 2013 12:24 GMT
#8
lmao
TheKefka
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Croatia11752 Posts
October 31 2013 12:50 GMT
#9
i wish a slow and painful death upon every single rotom user
Cackle™
Milkis
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
5003 Posts
October 31 2013 14:39 GMT
#10
Heracross weak.
Dead9
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States4725 Posts
October 31 2013 18:47 GMT
#11
On October 31 2013 20:26 Fishgle wrote:
What are your thoughts on Infiltrator Noivern? (it outspeeds your alakazam and greninja), can learn Shadow Ball, Flamethrower, Dragon Pulse, Psychic, Focus Blast... pretty decent coverage.

i think its best set is specs draco meteor, boomburst, flamethrower, u-turn/focus blast
the only problem is he doesn't actually do that much damage without specs
LO might be workable but i dunno haven't really played around with noivern
he's worn down fairly easily with rocks into bullet punch range

On October 31 2013 23:39 Milkis wrote:
Heracross weak.

literally 4 of my pokemon are really strong checks to heracross lol
5 if u count non-scarf heracross but non-scarf heracross is awful
Milkis
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
5003 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-31 19:20:05
October 31 2013 19:16 GMT
#12
On November 01 2013 03:47 Dead9 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 31 2013 20:26 Fishgle wrote:
What are your thoughts on Infiltrator Noivern? (it outspeeds your alakazam and greninja), can learn Shadow Ball, Flamethrower, Dragon Pulse, Psychic, Focus Blast... pretty decent coverage.

i think its best set is specs draco meteor, boomburst, flamethrower, u-turn/focus blast
the only problem is he doesn't actually do that much damage without specs
LO might be workable but i dunno haven't really played around with noivern
he's worn down fairly easily with rocks into bullet punch range

Show nested quote +
On October 31 2013 23:39 Milkis wrote:
Heracross weak.

literally 4 of my pokemon are really strong checks to heracross lol
5 if u count non-scarf heracross but non-scarf heracross is awful


Ehhhhhhhh. Mega Heracross can 2hko your entire team. I'd be more careful. Nothing can really swap into it (and Heracross wont care about your rotom since it 2hkos with rock blast anyway). The only thing is your skarmoy cause you're maxing speed so you could kill it with a surprise drill peck or something if they're overconfident. Your checks aren't really checks cause of how you run EVs.

I'm mostly joking though since almost every team is heracross weak/Lucario weak !
Dead9
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States4725 Posts
October 31 2013 19:45 GMT
#13
oh i thought you were talking about standard heracross
nothing in my team can switch into anything i just sac pokes constantly lol

i'm generally either volt switching/u-turning, revenge killing with alakazam, or setting up, so heracross has very little opportunity to switch in
and either way even if he does get in alakazam outspeeds and ohkos him with psychic

heracross can punch holes but he's way too slow to actually threaten most teams
Milkis
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
5003 Posts
October 31 2013 20:02 GMT
#14
On November 01 2013 04:45 Dead9 wrote:
oh i thought you were talking about standard heracross
nothing in my team can switch into anything i just sac pokes constantly lol

i'm generally either volt switching/u-turning, revenge killing with alakazam, or setting up, so heracross has very little opportunity to switch in
and either way even if he does get in alakazam outspeeds and ohkos him with psychic

heracross can punch holes but he's way too slow to actually threaten most teams


which is how you would normally use it anyway (punch holes for easier sweep with something similar later)
Dead9
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States4725 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-10-31 20:17:19
October 31 2013 20:12 GMT
#15
yeah but you're using a mega slot for something that can be done by other pokemon with more utility
infernape, terrakion, conkeldurr, etc can do more or less the same thing and are generally more useful due to speed/priority

edit: that's not to say mega heracross is bad, i think he's decent
losing 10 speed and scarf and moxie/guts is a pretty big blow tho tbh
xxpack09
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States2160 Posts
October 31 2013 22:07 GMT
#16
Why do you have metal coat on Scizor? Is it just to bluff band? Otherwise, lefties just seems better.

I really love this team tho--I fell in love with Custap lead Skarm at the beginning of BW2, and I like how you're using 2 priority users plus sashkazam to play around your lack of a scarfer.

The one major thing I see is a bit of water overlap, which admittedly was never a problem in gen V because rain was stupidly OP, but who knows how this meta will look like.
Dead9
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States4725 Posts
October 31 2013 22:41 GMT
#17
most of the time scizor is just u-turning out so it's nice to bluff band
and it adds a bit more power behind bullet punch for revenge killing or sweeping
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Esports World Cup
11:00
2025 - Final Day
Serral vs CureLIVE!
Solar vs Classic
ComeBackTV 1830
Hui .435
TaKeTV 420
Fuzer 306
3DClanTV 232
Rex183
JimRising 113
CranKy Ducklings100
Reynor79
BRAT_OK 52
SpeCial18
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Hui .435
Fuzer 306
Rex 183
JimRising 113
Reynor 79
ProTech65
BRAT_OK 52
SpeCial 18
StarCraft: Brood War
Horang2 10255
Nal_rA 1993
Shuttle 1985
Larva 624
Bisu 589
BeSt 452
Barracks 401
Stork 286
EffOrt 272
actioN 259
[ Show more ]
ToSsGirL 240
TY 170
Soulkey 150
Soma 139
Snow 131
Dewaltoss 130
ggaemo 121
Hyun 111
Mini 77
Rush 70
ZerO 70
sorry 69
JulyZerg 65
Backho 57
Sharp 30
sSak 24
Icarus 16
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
soO 11
Shinee 10
Dota 2
XcaliburYe228
Gorgc0
Counter-Strike
allub209
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor78
Other Games
gofns3532
singsing1886
Beastyqt609
B2W.Neo478
ArmadaUGS89
QueenE53
ZerO(Twitch)10
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV313
League of Legends
• Nemesis2588
Upcoming Events
OSC
2h 45m
CranKy Ducklings
22h 45m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 2h
CSO Cup
1d 4h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 6h
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
FEL
1d 21h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Online Event
4 days
[ Show More ]
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Xiamen Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
CC Div. A S7
Underdog Cup #2
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.