• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:47
CEST 03:47
KST 10:47
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy9[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple1BSL Season 235Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon101Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism10
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool How do you feel about the StarCraft shooter announcement at BlizzCon 2026? The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple
Tourneys
Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Announcement RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 544 Double Trouble The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses Mutation # 542 The Ascended
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion screpdb: new Starcraft reporting tool Bot on ladder [ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy new ranked ladder hack?
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro8 Day 2 [ASL22] Ro16 Group D [ASL22] Ro8 Day 1 [IPSL] IPSL is Back With Winter 26-27!
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Diablo IV Nintendo Switch Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine All you football fans (soccer)!
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Gaming Intensity, Problemati…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7240 users

The Last Bonjwa, Part 1

Blogs > Shady Sands
Post a Reply
1 2 3 Next All
Shady Sands
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4021 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-26 11:28:24
November 26 2012 10:59 GMT
#1

末 代 本 座



In many ways, (Z)sAviOr was a watershed for Brood War.

+ Show Spoiler +
On a purely non-game level, Savior fucked the scene over with his match-fixing shenanigans. I sincerely believe that had a player of his caliber not gotten involved (e.g. had it just been confined to B-teamers, Lux, and Hwasin) BW would not have died as quickly as it did. But that isn't what this article is about.


Past a certain point (namely, (T)NaDa's final title in 2006) most progamers, I would say, had decent enough micro, macro, and APM that these stopped setting players apart. Yet some players kept winning while others didn't.

Savior was the first progamer to fully apply the three most important modern differentiating concepts of high-level Brood War (and SC2)--what I like to call "build order/passive tactics", "metagame/intuition", and "army positioning/harass/active tactics".

While later players would refine those three concepts into perfection, Savior marks the point at which being good at Brood War stopped being about building new tools to set oneself apart, and instead became about using that existing toolkit better and better.

The toolkit can also be analogized along the lines of three much older games:

1. Build order/passive tactics is most like Go, where the objective is to manage the risk and reward of a "build pattern" to "get bigger and stay bigger" (secure a large economic, tech, or army size advantage) at some point or throughout a particular game.
2. Metagame/intuition is most like Poker, where the objective is to cleverly utilize the fog of war to force the opponent to guess wrong while maximizing your chances of guessing right
3. Army positioning/harass/active tactics is most like Chess, where you are establishing positions with the army you have to inflict disproportionate damage or force a mate.

Certain players post BW epitomized each of these traits or combinations of them, but never all three at once... except for what we now know to be The Last Bonjwa of Broodwar.

[image loading]
Flash's Cyworld Banner, circa 2010.


(T)Flash, primus inter pares of the post-Savior era, started in 2007 as a cheeser and pretty mediocre macrobot, but by 2008, he had pretty much solidified his status as the best "Go" player of Starcraft.

Flash's 2008-11 builds are literally works of art. The first and foremost reason I became a Flash fan is because I like players with good rhythm, and Flash's builds are like listening to a good Nujabes piece--so many different complex, subtle timings stacked on top of each other, always keeping the opponent off balance until the final, devastating, blow. And since they're builds, not battles, and hence, not necessarily even interactive with what the other guy is doing, oftentimes there was no way for the opponent to stop Flash once he got started. Flash winning became inevitable; as soon as an opponent let Flash grasp some small build or timing advantage, he'd use that to force the windows open wider and wider until he was 70 supply ahead of a Protoss or doing 10 (that's right, ten) base Terran mech vs a 4 base Zerg


Flash said he did this strategy in revenge, since Free humiliated his teammate ForGG in game 2 with scouts, the most useless BW Protoss unit. Only Flash can BM like this.


On the flip side, Flash became the best player at dissecting other builds, often on the fly, and prepping his own counter-timings when his opponents had not even seen them in hours of practice.

That was why I fell in love with Flash. Flash brought a sense of harmony to the chaos of Starcraft; he made Brood War make sense for me--it was no longer a game about clicking fast or sexy micro (which never appealed to me), but about making the best calculations on the information available... about making the right choices... and Flash was always right. He was the perfect paragon of logical harmony, and him winning meant all was right and orderly.

Then, in 2009, Flash learned Poker.

****
Что?
Ahzz
Profile Joined May 2007
Finland780 Posts
November 26 2012 11:31 GMT
#2
nice writeup. Funny how I found a two year old broodwar game to be more interesting than a recent SC2 game. Lulz.
NicksonReyes
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Philippines4431 Posts
November 26 2012 11:48 GMT
#3
Can't wait for Flash to "learn" SC2. Flash left all his decision making skills in BW and brought none for SC2.

5/5. Gonna be waiting for the next parts.
"Start yo" -FlaSh
Fueled
Profile Joined October 2011
United States1610 Posts
November 26 2012 13:12 GMT
#4
Very nice post 5/5

Can't wait for Flash to "learn" SC2. Flash left all his decision making skills in BW and brought none for SC2.

You and me both, man.
The Wood League - Where a double gas opening can still mean a Marine/SCV all-in
Wildmoon
Profile Joined December 2011
Thailand4189 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-26 13:57:50
November 26 2012 13:54 GMT
#5
Nice write up. Mvp kinda play this style too and he happened to be the most dominant and successful in SC2. I still remember his final against Life where he lost but he made a perfect mech build to fight against Life and almost beated him if not for derp attack in the end while Flash himself said that you can't beat Life with mech. I am waiting for real Flash to show up in SC2.
fabiano
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Brazil4644 Posts
November 26 2012 13:57 GMT
#6
I personally believe that, unfortunately, SC2 design + current maps + SC2 being purposely incomplete crops out quite a lot of what differentiates a good player from a godly player.

I also think that Flash play style was the most boring of the top players. Watching Bisu and Jaedong playing was 100x more exciting.
"When the geyser died, a probe came out" - SirJolt
Sawamura
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Malaysia7602 Posts
November 26 2012 14:04 GMT
#7
Flash can't change sc2 but blizzard can ..
BW/KT Forever R.I.P KT.Violet dearly missed ..
Caladbolg
Profile Joined March 2011
2855 Posts
November 26 2012 14:46 GMT
#8
Flash isn't the primus inter pares post-Savior. He was the greatest of his generation, a different level entirely.
"I don't like the word prodigy at all. To me prodigy sounds like a person who was 'gifted' all these things rather than a person who earned all these talents by hard training... I must train harder to reach my goal." - Flash
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
November 26 2012 15:07 GMT
#9
On November 26 2012 22:57 fabiano wrote:
I also think that Flash play style was the most boring of the top players. Watching Bisu and Jaedong playing was 100x more exciting.


I think many people found him boring because he won too much.

On November 26 2012 23:46 Caladbolg wrote:
Flash isn't the primus inter pares post-Savior. He was the greatest of his generation, a different level entirely.


In 2008 and early 2009, he was probably one of the lesser among equals. When "he learned poker," as Shady put it, things changed.

Also, @Shady: I'm eager to see how you talk about the "chess" aspect, since Flash was not really the best at micro or tactics... maybe I'm wrong
Writer
ZeaL.
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States5955 Posts
November 26 2012 15:20 GMT
#10
Hwasin was not a B-teamer wtf. He was playing consistently for STX till the end.
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
November 26 2012 15:34 GMT
#11
On November 27 2012 00:20 ZeaL. wrote:
Hwasin was not a B-teamer wtf. He was playing consistently for STX till the end.


he said "B-teamers, Lux, and Hwasin," separating Lux and Hwasin from the "B-teamers."

Of course I don't think Yarnc, type-b, or Upmagic were B-teamers either, so...
Writer
FromShouri
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States862 Posts
November 26 2012 16:20 GMT
#12
On November 27 2012 00:20 ZeaL. wrote:
Hwasin was not a B-teamer wtf. He was playing consistently for STX till the end.


He was more a crowd star then someone who was a true A teamer imo around that time.

On November 27 2012 00:34 ]343[ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 27 2012 00:20 ZeaL. wrote:
Hwasin was not a B-teamer wtf. He was playing consistently for STX till the end.


he said "B-teamers, Lux, and Hwasin," separating Lux and Hwasin from the "B-teamers."

Of course I don't think Yarnc, type-b, or Upmagic were B-teamers either, so...


I don't think Go.Go was either but alas, I had forgotten about Upmagic! T.T He was my fav estro terran.
Limited Edition, lets do some simple addition, $50 for a T-Shirt is just some ignorant bitch shit.
Torenhire
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States11681 Posts
November 26 2012 16:31 GMT
#13
On November 27 2012 00:07 ]343[ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2012 22:57 fabiano wrote:
I also think that Flash play style was the most boring of the top players. Watching Bisu and Jaedong playing was 100x more exciting.


I think many people found him boring because he won too much.


That's my thoughts, anyways. One of the reasons I became such a big Shuttle fan was that the kid was like...Brood War Schitzo, sometimes he would show up and be like CHOO CHOO MOTHERFUCKERS ALL ABOARD THE PAIN TRAIN and other days he would show up and look like he picked up Brood War two weeks ago.

I love the inconsistency, it makes the highs higher and the lows lower. Flash was just so stale to watch, it got boring watching him shove people aside and win. The only exciting (okay not only, but 90%) Flash games are ones where he loses because someone had to do some ridiculous shit to try and beat him, and even then it was never an easy win.
SirJolt: Well maybe if you weren't so big and stupid, it wouldn't have hit you.
endy
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Switzerland8970 Posts
November 26 2012 16:42 GMT
#14
Wait, so Flash never learned Chess ? His perfect turret placement against mutas, the tanks positioning that allowed him to take super fast thirds in TvP, his m&m micro were all trademarks.

Anyway, I am glad that you decide to use your great writing skills to write a piece of Brood War history

5/5
ॐ
Cortza
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
South Africa328 Posts
November 26 2012 17:10 GMT
#15
Really enjoyed reading this and getting to know some of the Brood War history.
Waxangel
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
United States33701 Posts
November 26 2012 17:36 GMT
#16
with my curse, may your thread devolve into savior infighting
AdministratorHey HP can you redo everything youve ever done because i have a small complaint?
JieXian
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Malaysia4677 Posts
November 26 2012 17:51 GMT
#17
On November 26 2012 19:59 Shady Sands wrote:
Then, in 2009, Flash learned Poker.


Don't get that part... is this about the 2 rax bunkering and 14 CCing?
Please send me a PM of any song you like that I most probably never heard of! I am looking for people to chat about writing and producing music | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noD-bsOcxuU |
Tatari
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States1179 Posts
November 26 2012 18:46 GMT
#18
On November 27 2012 02:36 Waxangel wrote:
with my curse, may your thread devolve into savior infighting


Dunno if we should begin packing up or start making the popcorn.
A fed jungler is no longer a jungler, but a terrorist.
ArvickHero
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
10387 Posts
November 26 2012 19:15 GMT
#19
Enjoyable read but you could just simply describe the first point as "strategy" lol
Writerptrk
Shady Sands
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4021 Posts
November 26 2012 20:19 GMT
#20
On November 27 2012 02:36 Waxangel wrote:
with my curse, may your thread devolve into savior infighting

You just hate Flash.
Что?
1 2 3 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Cup
00:00
#100
PiGStarcraft556
SteadfastSC69
CranKy Ducklings40
davetesta19
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft556
ByuN 241
SteadfastSC 69
-ZergGirl 60
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 9768
Rain 2021
GuemChi 1529
Artosis 657
Hyun 65
910 40
Dota 2
monkeys_forever580
League of Legends
Doublelift4089
Counter-Strike
taco 425
minikerr24
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox599
Other Games
summit1g12411
Coldzera 818
JimRising 550
Day[9].tv481
C9.Mang0385
Maynarde164
ViBE164
Livibee20
Sick18
CosmosSc2 15
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick602
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 94
• EnkiAlexander 32
• mYiSmile118
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP15
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• Day9tv481
Upcoming Events
Kung Fu Cup
9h 13m
The PondCast
1d 8h
Replay Cast
1d 22h
Korean StarCraft League
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
GSL
4 days
Yamato Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
WardiTV Weekly
5 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Calamity Invitational
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.