• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 15:34
CEST 21:34
KST 04:34
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners5Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview5[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21
Community News
[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June2Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th151Weekly Cups (May 18-24): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League6
StarCraft 2
General
TL Poll: How do you feel about the 5.0.16 PTR balance changes? Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview
Tourneys
Douyu Cup 2026 Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed Mutation # 528 Infection Detected Welcome to the External Content forum
Brood War
General
Data needed Quality of life changes in BW that you will like ? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW fans in southern Sweden, look here! 25 Years Since Brood War Patch 1.08
Tourneys
[BSL22] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CEST [ASL21] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread PC Games Sales Thread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Summer Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Trading/Investing Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Cricket [SPORT] NBA General Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How Streaming Impacts Game P…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8835 users

Should I give up on Terran?

Blogs > Fission
Post a Reply
Fission
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada1184 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-04 21:43:43
April 04 2012 21:43 GMT
#1
I'm writing this out of desperation.

I play ~50 games a day on the KR ladder. I've played some medium -high masters players there, including some people that I recognized (to my delight). Recently though, I've been flopping around helplessly in KR diamond with maybe a 30% win rate per day, and I'm losing to absolutely awful players of all races.

I am a slow player, I avg MAYBE 250 apm, 150 Eapm on a good day, and I'm finding that this straight up is just not good enough. I lose game after game after game to the minutest micro mistakes. Whats that? Look away from your army and the chargelots attack moved? gg wp, Find Match. What's that, you missed an emp and your army got shredded, and even though you're on 6 base to 2 base and have 30 rax you can't reinforce fast enough? gg wp, Find Match. What's that, you want to play mech in tvt? Too bad it's fucking terrible on 90% of the ladder maps...

I just don't get it. I gg almost every opponent, I watch my replays, I study pros, and I UNDERSTAND why I'm losing games - it's not a mystery. It just feels like I need to have mechanics that are unattainable for my physical capabilities to hold my own against masters kr level players. I feel like no amount of understanding will help me if I dont have the 400-500 apm required to do tvp engagements properly, and it's making me really unhappy that no amount of time and effort that I put into this game is giving me results.

What am I supposed to do?

*
NewDawn
Profile Joined March 2012
Canada120 Posts
April 04 2012 21:50 GMT
#2
With an average of 15 minutes per game, you play over 12 hours of Starcraft per day? I don't think that's a good thing >.<

Also, I don't think you need more than an average of 250apm. I mean, you might need to peak to 400/500, but never sustain that.

이지은 | 송지은 | 정은지 | 홧팅 ~ !
gumshoe
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada3602 Posts
April 04 2012 21:51 GMT
#3
Wait for hear of the swarm? Seriously though do you find the other races more enjoyable? No? Then don't switch, the biggest problem with high level sc2 is the game becoming a chore, if T is boring for you than you should switch, if it's not then switching wont make you more motivated, and motivation(plus star sense and wrist implants) are what will help you overcome bullshit.
gumshoe bullshitting at 120%~~Prplz
Fission
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada1184 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-04 22:03:55
April 04 2012 22:03 GMT
#4
On April 05 2012 06:50 NewDawn wrote:
With an average of 15 minutes per game, you play over 12 hours of Starcraft per day? I don't think that's a good thing >.<

Also, I don't think you need more than an average of 250apm. I mean, you might need to peak to 400/500, but never sustain that.



ALOT of games end very quickly. I play more like 6hrs a day,± a bunch
UmiNotsuki
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States633 Posts
April 04 2012 22:14 GMT
#5
Gogogo random it up!
UmiNotsuki.111 (NA), UNTReborn.932 (EU), UmiNotsuki (iCCup) -- You see that text I wrote above this? I'll betcha $5 that you disagree :D
SigmaoctanusIV
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States3313 Posts
April 04 2012 22:14 GMT
#6
Well if you do, Don't pick Protoss cause you'll be making the same thread in about a month with the way PvZ feels. Though Zergs seem to be doing really good lately.
I am Godzilla You are Japan
Denzil
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom4193 Posts
April 04 2012 22:19 GMT
#7
I can't tell if this is a troll thread or not.

do what the guy in the skill ceiling thread said

go break the floor and lay a new foundation
Anna: So Sen how will you prepare for your revenge v MC? Sen: With a smile.
dAPhREAk
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Nauru12397 Posts
April 04 2012 22:20 GMT
#8
maybe you should focus on clicking less and more efficiently than clicking more. because apparently your "250 apm" means you aren't very efficient.
Th1rdEye
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States1074 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-04 23:02:56
April 04 2012 23:02 GMT
#9
This is why people get paid to play this game...its not supposed to be a walk in the park. It's not supposed to make your ego feel good. If you want to improve, suck it up.

KR ladder is hard.. they dont let you win like they do on NA
from the days of: TheMarine [NC]...YellOw [H.O.T.]-Forever99 OgOgO [_MuMyung_] ChRh PlayGrrrr.... SlayerS_`BoxeR` [Oops]Reach [ReD]NaDa [DF]zergboy..!! Pusan[S.G] Nal_rA GARIMTO SSamJJang ChoJJa JinSu Silent_Control iloveoov H_PauL_WII JulyZerg [DaK]JoYo
teddyoojo
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Germany22369 Posts
April 04 2012 23:08 GMT
#10
i feel you.
terran is just fucked up right now t-t
when i watch the replay afterwards i cant even understand how my opponent manages to breathe on his own, yet he beat me. (top eu master)
that gets me even madder (?).
i think you whether have to deal with it or stop at all. i dont feel like raceswitching is a good option (atleast not for me and trust me, ive tried soo often)
Esports historian since 2000. Creator of 'The Universe' and 'The best scrambled Eggs 2013'. Host of 'Star Wars Marathon 2015'. Thinker of 'teddyoojo's Thoughts'. Earths and Moons leading CS:GO expert. Lord of the Rings.
achristes
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Norway653 Posts
April 05 2012 00:10 GMT
#11
I'd say stick to terran but maybe do some offracing on a smurf or smth. Terran is getting beat up pretty badly by both zergs and protosses (the average ladder player). But before all this discovering of strats/builds by protoss and zerg terran was easily the strongest race. Nowadays terrans are lagging behind in strategies and new stuff, so just wait until someone re-invents the terran metagame. OR wait for HotS. Your call.
youtube.com/spooderm4n | twitch.tv/spooderm4n | Random videos and games I feel like uploading
Maxd11
Profile Joined July 2011
United States680 Posts
April 05 2012 00:34 GMT
#12
Do pro sc2 players even have 250 APM now? There is no way that 250 APM could be considered slow in sc2. I guess just do whatever you have the most fun with unless you are making your living off sc2. Also I don't think I've ever seen a pro with 500 APM even in a battle.
I looked in the mirror and saw biupilm69t
DKR
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom622 Posts
April 05 2012 00:43 GMT
#13
On April 05 2012 09:34 Maxd11 wrote:
Do pro sc2 players even have 250 APM now? There is no way that 250 APM could be considered slow in sc2. I guess just do whatever you have the most fun with unless you are making your living off sc2. Also I don't think I've ever seen a pro with 500 APM even in a battle.



Morrow 400 spam APM is the highest I'm aware of. APM and EPM are such poor indicators or skill. Cause and correlation...
"1 base. Cheese man." - MKP. "[MVP] is not stylistic, his style is winning, which is the style you want to have." - Artosis
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 56m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 631
elazer 205
UpATreeSC 87
ProTech85
JuggernautJason64
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 1523
Dewaltoss 128
Hyun 28
NaDa 15
Shine 15
Dota 2
Gorgc8676
qojqva2341
Counter-Strike
fl0m8550
zeus617
byalli355
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu296
Other Games
Grubby3297
singsing1702
FrodaN1203
B2W.Neo638
JimRising 358
mouzStarbuck213
C9.Mang0183
ArmadaUGS143
XaKoH 79
Trikslyr42
Mew2King39
MindelVK10
OptimusSC21
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV136
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 39
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• TFBlade1059
Other Games
• imaqtpie779
• Shiphtur223
Upcoming Events
OSC
2h 56m
Replay Cast
4h 26m
OSC
17h 26m
Maestros of the Game
18h 26m
Classic vs Maru
Serral vs herO
TBD vs Clem
Replay Cast
1d 4h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 14h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 19h
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
1d 23h
eOnzErG vs Mihu
Messiah vs XuanXuan
Jaystar vs TerrOr
Dewalt vs Bonyth
eOnzErG vs XuanXuan
Mihu vs TerrOr
Messiah vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
[ Show More ]
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
2 days
Jaystar vs Dewalt
eOnzErG vs TerrOr
XuanXuan vs Bonyth
Mihu vs Dewalt
Messiah vs Jaystar
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
TerrOr vs Dewalt
OSC
3 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Replay Cast
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Season 22
2026 GSL S2
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
Acropolis #4 - GSB
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Murky Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Douyu Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #3
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.