EPTIf you thought they were trolls then you wouldn't have to argue against them like this, so even you dont believe they are trolls.
So stop fucking calling people that.
Rant on the Trolls - Page 2
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7mk
Germany10156 Posts
If you thought they were trolls then you wouldn't have to argue against them like this, so even you dont believe they are trolls. So stop fucking calling people that. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
It's painfully frustrating to read all the "arguments" based on statistics and shallow assumptions. There's nothing worse on TL than reading through pages and pages of posts made by people who are convinced that they know what they're talking about because they can read data from a TLPD page and check tournament results. | ||
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Firesilver
United Kingdom1190 Posts
On January 29 2012 21:39 7mk wrote: Goddamnit stop calling people you disagree with trolls, it's fucking stupid. If you thought they were trolls then you wouldn't have to argue against them like this, so even you dont believe they are trolls. So stop fucking calling people that. I have to agree with this 100%, there's a difference. Also, like many others have said, paragraphs would really help attract more people to read, it's hard enough as is. | ||
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Baobab
Korea (South)153 Posts
However, generally, Korean pros are way better than their foreign counterparts imo. If you look at GSL and then watch a random foreign tournament, you can immediately see the difference. Also, virtually every foreigner tournament, it always ends up either being the Koreans invitees battling it out for first prize, or a Korean invitee vs. one of the very best foreigners. Saying Koreans aren't overall more skilled than their foreign counterparts is a hard position to adopt, me thinks ^^ | ||
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Itsmedudeman
United States19229 Posts
On January 29 2012 21:27 Tyrant0 wrote: Not a genetic advantage as much as a geographic advantage, having such a small centralized country with excellent infrastructure; Compared to the vastness of NA and Europe. That's not even the gist of it. It's that starcraft BW was such a popular game that it's somewhat expected for a majority of their player base to have a long RTS background. It just gives them a better player pool to choose from, and then those guys get to train around many others just like them rather than amateur warcraft 3 players, and people who scraped B rank on iccup once. | ||
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TemujinGK
United States483 Posts
On January 29 2012 20:13 Plexa wrote: 1. is true 2. is relevant although if you practice on the server it isn't so bad @boonbag by that notion then jinro has placed as well I disagree that 1. is valid. Koreans aren't 'inherently' better. That implies some genetic predisposition. I think that it is fair to say that if you took the top 30 koreans they would be better than the top 30 foreigners on average, but there is nothing inherent to an individual korean, just the korean culture. | ||
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Iranon
United States983 Posts
On January 30 2012 00:16 TemujinGK wrote: I disagree that 1. is valid. Koreans aren't 'inherently' better. That implies some genetic predisposition. I think that it is fair to say that if you took the top 30 koreans they would be better than the top 30 foreigners on average, but there is nothing inherent to an individual korean, just the korean culture. What? Of course they aren't "inherently" better; nobody in their right mind things that being born to South Korean parents makes you objectively better at a specific video game. They're still better, though, largely because the top Koreans have a practice schedule that is just nuts by Western standards, and as a result they have the best possible practice partners too. Sure, there will always be a few players like Stephano who smash world-class players and make it look easy without even much practice, but the whole reason he's such a notable player is that that's an extremely uncommon exception to the rule. On the other hand, look at HuK, who is also on par with top-level Korean players, but that's because of the amount of work he puts in -- HuK is more dedicated to his SC game than almost anyone on this forum will ever be to anything. In the middle of those two extremes, you have basically every other foreigner. SeleCt and Ret and MaNa and SaSe and Dimaga and a hundred other people are all very good players, but not GSL-good. I'm sure they all could be GSL-good if they were put in the right environment, but most people just don't have a lifestyle where that's a possibility. | ||
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Br3ezy
United States720 Posts
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sc4k
United Kingdom5454 Posts
I really can't repeat this enough...SC BW was good because it was the manliest game ever made. SC2 is just WC3 with a few bells and whistles. So two main points: 1. It DOESN'T MATTER if foreigners can compete with koreans in sc2, because SC BW is the only game that matters. 2. Maybe when Koreans have completely ditched BW and gone for SC2 and foreigners STILL compete with them for 10 years, then I might have to agree that ONLY FOR SC2, which is by FAR less epic and manly and skilful than BW, foreigners aren't complete crap. | ||
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askTeivospy
1525 Posts
A) people are too scared to call anyone bad* B) they're koreans I do think koreans on the whole are better than foreigners only because of the attitude that they adopt when it comes to starcraft. I also think that because of this, the only reason why foreigners can compete against Koreans right now is because SC2 is more like 5% mechanics and 95% thinking (BW was an even split) * I mean we have a thread on "whos the most underrated pro" but no thread on who is the most overrated afaik o_O | ||
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PanN
United States2828 Posts
On January 30 2012 04:32 sc4k wrote: 1. It DOESN'T MATTER if foreigners can compete with koreans in sc2, because SC BW is the only game that matters. My god, such flawless logic and arguing abilities. | ||
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AnachronisticAnarchy
United States2957 Posts
On January 29 2012 21:08 hoby2000 wrote: + Show Spoiler + If black people are better at basketball, why are there still white people playing it? If hispanics are better at football, then why are there still WHITE, ASIANS and BLACK people playing it, and doing well? Your argument has some big holes in it. No one is better at a sport because of their ethnicity because by that logic we could say white people are better at ruling the world because most are born into middle or upper class families. More money = More likely to be succesful = more likely to be a leader in the supposed free world. However, we both know that white are people are not better at ruling the world - they're just born into better circumstances that foster that type of ideal. There are a lot of black people in the NBA because a lot of them grow up in low class suburbs where they don't have money for video games, or nice cars, or gold rings - They have a public park with a basketball hoop, so that's what they end up learning and becoming good at. If race plays a card in how good someone is at something, then you have to assume it works for all parts of life. If that were true, then people shouldn't try to go outside the limits of their race's accomplishments... but people do it anyway. TL;DR - Race doesn't mean ANYTHING when it comes to being better at something. Also, as to not derail this blog, I think the OP has some legit concerns, and I enjoyed reading this entry. It's not really common for me to read blogs in the first place, let alone an entire wall of text with little to no formatting. But your subject matter interested me. I agree that a lot of people down play the abilities of others (see: my reply in the first half of this post) because of supposed restrictions, but in the end... Nerchio played his games pretty well. Jjaki is was obviously a little under prepared for it, but played well enough to win. I must say that Nerchio is looking pretty damn strong. Hope to see him in future tournaments. I know he was in HSC3, but I want to see him at MLG Don't be naive. Of course certain races are biologically different and of course those differences allow them to be better at some things. Also, your argument about basketball is fallatic. Blacks are biologically better at it. This is fact. You assume that they are so much better that every single white guy should just never bother picking up a basketball and go play baseball or something. That is not a valid assumption. Some races are better at certain things. On the topic, some cultures are better at certain things. The Korean culture teaches them things like a strong work ethic, allowing them to do better than foreigners because they are willing to work harder and practice with a higher quality than most foreigners. | ||
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Mothra
United States1448 Posts
On January 30 2012 05:21 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote: Also, your argument about basketball is fallatic. lol do you mean fallacious? I think "your argument is phallatic" is even better! | ||
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Jisall
United States2054 Posts
On January 29 2012 18:56 darkscream wrote: First of all OP, edit your post and break it up. Paragraphs, man. Secondly though I do agree. I knew watching that nerchio v jjakji game that everyone would say 1) KOREAN IS BETTER and 2) ONLY REASON IT WAS CLOSE CUZ OF LAG that's what they say every time any foreigner faces any korean, even if both players are connecting to a distant server (as the case in IPL, I believe both players connect to NA) its sad but, the brainwashed masses + the diehard BW fanboys will always value koreans over foreigners, not recognizing that top foreigners can at least match mid-top koreans (and lets face it, jjakji did win a Code S, but he isn't quite as powerful as MVP or MC yet).. don't let it get to you, just watch the games and have fun, read as little forums as possible if it cheese you off :D Haha thanks bro. Thats what i do. I normally just ignore it. Shit just built up so i needed to vent out before i started speaking my mind in the LR threads. changed it a lil to make it more readable. I realized that my sentiments weren't going to take well lol | ||
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