• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:32
CEST 15:32
KST 22:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection1Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview4[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)7
Community News
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th81Weekly Cups (May 18-25): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League4Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double1Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results2
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th Changing from 12 to 8 is just asking for StarCraft TL Poll: How do you feel about the 5.0.16 PTR balance changes? Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection
Tourneys
GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 526 Rubber and Glue
Brood War
General
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm Grudge Match Event BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ VPN experiences Every Matchup's Top 5 Winrates (all ASLs & KSLs) Pros React To: ASL S21 Finals
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] WB Final & LB Semis - Saturday 21:00 CEST
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Trading/Investing Thread Dating: How's your luck?
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Customization Drives Loyalty…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1677 users

The Cause of SC2 Race Hatred: Match Making System

Blogs > DuncanIdaho
Post a Reply
DuncanIdaho
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States465 Posts
October 31 2011 03:48 GMT
#1
I think people just get tired of losing to the same matchup, and generally, it's been my experience, that I only really have trouble with one matchup at a time. Honestly, I think this is a limitation of the MMS, in that given an MMR, you generally crush up to 2 MU's (If you're random and have to know 9 MUs, well, Idk how it works for you, perhaps the MMS gives you equally challenging MUs all the time? thats my guess, but I don't play random, so idk...) and suck at the 3rd MU. This state generally makes you feel ill-will towards that 3rd race, unless its the mirror match, and then you just complain about how much the mirror is a joke.

So, I'm a Zerg player. For the longest time, I had trouble against terran, thought they were OP, and sort of hated them, albeit trying to be nice. Then, I learned the MU, and thought ZvZ was a joke. I learned that, climbed the ladder, and then it was protoss that was OP. I hated toss with a passion. Especially when I lost and they laughed at me. Then, it was terran again, after climbing a bit higher on the ladder. Now, I feel very confident in ZvZ, okay in ZvT, and completely lost in ZvP. I realize that this is not due to race imbalance, but rather, an issue with the MMS. Personally, I think the game would be much more fun if we had a seperate ladder for each MU, and thus we would truly win 50% of our games, as the MMS intends.

However, inevitably, you get the asshole, in all races, who'll laugh at you and call you a n00b as he crushes your little heart, maybe even telling you how your race is weak and his is OP, and you just have to deal with the fact. This tends to exacerbate the feelings of dread upon facing new opponents of the same race, possibly even hatred. Long story short, remember it's a game, try to be nice, and ignore the assholes, contenting yourself that while they brag about beating you to your face, they're quite likely crying that race X, their current MU they're struggling with, is OP.

~DI

The spice must flow... Grammar lesson: "than" is used for quantity comparisons, "then" is used for chronological statements. The next forum user who says, "I'd do such and such, THAN I'd do such and such else," is gonna make me cry...
Headshot
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1656 Posts
October 31 2011 03:55 GMT
#2
Just came in here to say that I love your username. Dune is awesome.
-
Warble
Profile Joined May 2011
137 Posts
October 31 2011 06:14 GMT
#3
Your idea makes a lot of sense to me. The one about how everyone has a matchup they don't play as well as the others, which leads to frustrations in that matchup, resulting in the impression of imbalance.

The idea of having different ratings for each matchup sounds good to me. At first I thought it would just make the profile page very complicated, but upon reflection, it seems they could just treat each matchup as different "teams" as it's done in 2v2 etc. You should definitely post your idea on the Bnet forums (and then ignore all replies to it).

And, yeah, I agree that skill-related BM is an issue. I wonder how much it exacerbates the ladder fear issue everybody's been talking about lately.
windsupernova
Profile Joined October 2010
Mexico5280 Posts
October 31 2011 06:18 GMT
#4
Nah race hatred existed in BW too.

Its overinflated ego most of the times.
"Its easy, just trust your CPU".-Boxer on being good at games
krazymunky
Profile Joined June 2008
United States727 Posts
October 31 2011 06:32 GMT
#5
On October 31 2011 15:18 windsupernova wrote:
Nah race hatred existed in BW too.

Its overinflated ego most of the times.


The good old days of 1a2a3a.
life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
October 31 2011 07:20 GMT
#6
On October 31 2011 15:32 krazymunky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 31 2011 15:18 windsupernova wrote:
Nah race hatred existed in BW too.

Its overinflated ego most of the times.


The good old days of 1a2a3a.

Cept now it's just 1a
AmericanUmlaut
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Germany2594 Posts
October 31 2011 09:29 GMT
#7
I like your idea. I'd also really like it if you could pick a matchup to search for, even if it was limited so that you had to play all races equally often over the long term. I get really frustrated when I sit down and practice a PvT build vs AI until I've got it really crisp, then log onto the ladder and get ten PvPs and PvZs in a row.
The frumious Bandersnatch
Deleted User 101379
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
4849 Posts
October 31 2011 09:46 GMT
#8
It's not really a problem with the matchmaking. Sure, we could have a seperate MMR for every single matchup, but that would make things far too complicated imho.

While it might be good for your ego, it only adds confusion aka "I'm Diamond but i get matched with masters players, why am i not getting promoted?" - "Because you only play masters in ZvZ and in ZvP and ZvT you get matched with platinum players"
munchmunch
Profile Joined October 2010
Canada789 Posts
October 31 2011 10:50 GMT
#9
Don't think a separate MMR for each matchup is necessarily the answer. But a practice ladder, where you could, say, hit a button to be matched up with a player of a desired race, would be pretty fun.
courtpanda
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
866 Posts
October 31 2011 11:00 GMT
#10
it seems like you always get streaks of getting matched up against the same race. and then you get a hatred for that race for the next week or so. like me with toss atm.
kamikami
Profile Joined November 2010
France1057 Posts
October 31 2011 11:26 GMT
#11
Hi I have a question : do Blizzard ban you for calling your opponent noob ? I just bought SC2 and after destroying the enemy I want to call him noob but I fear that Blizz will ban my account and steal 60€ from me so I didn't do it. But from this post it seems like there's no problem BMing the opponent at all ? Someone confirms it plz !!!

User was warned for this post
Khassar de Templari
Snuggles
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1865 Posts
October 31 2011 12:01 GMT
#12
I generally have a prophetic hatred for all players I bump into now and in the future. They get in my way of climbing the ladder. It's just because I suck simple as that. I grind out a few games every day with the burning passion to completely crush my opponent's soul and a their feeble attempts to end the game with their wonderful "standard" timing pushes.

Everyone on the sc2 ladder can go to hell. I've given up being so nice.
DuncanIdaho
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States465 Posts
November 08 2011 16:40 GMT
#13
On October 31 2011 12:55 Headshot wrote:
Just came in here to say that I love your username. Dune is awesome.


Hehe! TY for recognizing. I usually get crap like, "Hey man, are you from Idaho?" I then have to inform such players that unfortunately I must revoke their nerd licenses.
The spice must flow... Grammar lesson: "than" is used for quantity comparisons, "then" is used for chronological statements. The next forum user who says, "I'd do such and such, THAN I'd do such and such else," is gonna make me cry...
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Maestros of the Game
11:00
Preliminary Stage
SKillous vs Ryung
Maru vs sOsLIVE!
Ryung 1325
RotterdaM934
ComeBackTV 908
TaKeTV378
SteadfastSC194
Rex154
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Ryung 1322
RotterdaM 934
SteadfastSC 194
Rex 156
ProTech78
trigger 68
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 56299
EffOrt 1062
Mini 932
Zeus 618
Last 258
hero 136
sorry 66
Sexy 42
zelot 39
Sacsri 34
[ Show more ]
Sea.KH 30
ToSsGirL 30
Noble 13
Icarus 13
Dota 2
Gorgc5485
Dendi927
qojqva306
XcaliburYe152
BananaSlamJamma93
LuMiX1
Counter-Strike
byalli947
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor219
MindelVK11
Other Games
singsing2822
B2W.Neo984
Lowko442
DeMusliM205
Mew2King53
KnowMe50
amsayoshi37
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL264
Other Games
BasetradeTV175
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Response 4
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 6
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1032
• TFBlade720
Upcoming Events
IPSL
2h 28m
ZZZero vs WorsT
Julia vs eOnzErG
BSL
5h 28m
TerrOr vs Dewalt
Bonyth vs eOnzErG
Replay Cast
10h 28m
RSL Revival
17h 28m
Lambo vs Rogue
Clem vs TBD
herO vs TBD
Maestros of the Game
23h 28m
SHIN vs Nicoract
Rogue vs Gerald
ByuN vs Shameless
Cure vs TriGGeR
OSC
23h 28m
IPSL
1d 2h
Dragon vs Artosis
dxtr13 vs Hawk
BSL
1d 5h
Wardi Open
1d 22h
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
2 days
Maestros of the Game
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
Maestros of the Game
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
4 days
Maestros of the Game
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
6 days
Maestros of the Game
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Solar vs Classic
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: King of Kings
2026 GSL S1
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

2026 KK StarCraft Pro League
BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
Murky Cup 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Heroes Pulsing #3
Heroes Pulsing #2
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.