• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:40
CEST 07:40
KST 14:40
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters9[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244
Community News
Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism4Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon?118Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)9Weekly Cups (August 24-30): Patches' balance mod takes over3New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!46
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) SC4ALL: II Winner Will Earn a Spot at HSC 30! Weekly Cups (August 24-30): Patches' balance mod takes over
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) 2026 GSTL Announcement Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 542 The Ascended Mutation # 541 Binary Choice The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 540 Dodge This
Brood War
General
Official StarCraft website teases new content ahead of BlizzCon? [ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters ASL22 General Discussion Pros React To: Calm's Big Brain Play Vs Mini New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro16 Group B [Megathread] Daily Proleagues 2v2v2v2 Tournament [ASL22] Ro16 Group A
Strategy
Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread EVE Corporation Diablo IV [Maplestory Hardcore] Let's Play~!! General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
F* the Children and Get Off …
TrAiDoS
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Regacy Esports: The Bh…
regacyesports
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7317 users

The Stage is Set

Blogs > Chef
Post a Reply
Normal
Chef
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
10810 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-10 00:02:31
February 09 2011 22:14 GMT
#1
The last four competitors in the MSL are all Zerg.


[image loading]
(Z)ZerO

[image loading]
(Z)great

[image loading]
(Z)Jaedong

[image loading]
(Z)Hydra


(Z)ZerO is the stronger than his clone SoulKey. Zero's ZvZ in the past ten games is 5-5. His overall ZvZ percentage is 50%. Does that mean things are bleak? Not at all. Of all ZvZers, Zero shows the most hope for innovation in this matchup. He was the first played I saw to use Queens in ZvZ effectively, and his attempts to rebuild the matchup could account for his relatively poor record, since trying new things is always a risky endeavor.

(Z)great has been a solid player for a long time now. He doesn't particularly shine, but he is an opponent that always needs to be taken seriously. This season he must be hoping to prove that he is not just a proving ground for S class players. His ZvZ record is 6-4 in the past ten games, and his overall ZvZ record is 55.13%, the best results of any of his matchups. His standard, somewhat predictable play seems to be his downfall, but if he breaks out of his box he could become a force to be reckoned with. (edit: apparently I'm somewhat wrong on this account. Of the legendary ZvZs this last year, Great has been a part of at least one, and some say he is quite an interesting player!)

(Z)Jaedong hardly needs a description. His ZvZ was dubbed JvZ long ago, and hasn't been questioned yet. His style is somewhat straight forward, and like most S-class player's mirror matchups, he gains his advantages from simply being better, faster, and stronger. Jaedong's is 7-3 in his last ten ZvZ games, and has a staggering 76.47% overall ZvZ record. In a matchup which used to be called luck, Jaedong has standardized many safe builds which effectively even the playing field and allow the better player to win. Of all the players, Jaedong has the least reason to innovate because of his already intensely strong game.

(Z)Hydra has become an incredibly strong player this year. His temperament reminds me of Flash and he plays a very straight up game. His ZvZ in the last ten games is 9-1, even better than Jaedong's, and his overall ZvZ is a fair 57.13%, making it technically his worst results.

But there's a wrench in this machine. For the past week or so there has been no OSL. There has been no Proleague. The only responsibility these four players have is the MSL, and the only matchup left to play in the MSL is ZvZ. If there was ever a time to change ZvZ, it's right now. The motivation is there, especially for Zero, to do something bold. Don't miss the final rounds of this MSL. It's gonna get real.

(FYI Great vs Zero is tonight! In case you couldn't tell since the 'upcoming events' on the sidebar is only showing events no one cares about )

BetterTwin vs Great
Lee Scowl vs ChinZerg

Fighting~! ^^

*****
LEGEND!! LEGEND!!
Megaliskuu
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5123 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-09 22:17:50
February 09 2011 22:16 GMT
#2
I'm super pumped for this! This is gonna be like Avalon MSL finals but 10x Better!!! Hoping for some really exciting play from both zero and great!
|BW>Everything|Add me on star2 KR server TheMuTaL.675 for practice games :)|NEX clan| https://www.dotabuff.com/players/183104694
darmousseh
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States3437 Posts
February 09 2011 22:21 GMT
#3
So much zerg :p They are swarming over all the msl. I think execution > strategy so no matter what anyone throws at jaedong he will probably just come out on top.
Developer for http://mtgfiddle.com
jpak
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States5045 Posts
February 09 2011 22:26 GMT
#4
In one ZvZ:
Hive-tech. This ZvZ could potentially be a game-breaking series filled with innovative gameplay.

In the other ZvZ:
The greatest battle of mechanics yet. Jaedong, the JvZ master, vs. Hydra, the one who overcame disadvantages in BO with pure muta micro.
CJ Entusman #50! #1 클템 fan TL!
Chef
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
10810 Posts
February 09 2011 22:38 GMT
#5
Hydra won his last round 3-0 in a ZvZ to get here, while Jaedong has to play a ZvP and it was a close 3-2.

Zero went 3-0 in his ZvP, while Great went 3-2.

Will this affect each players confidence? I think especially hydra is at a mental advantage, because this is more ZvZ, and he's had so much success lately in his ZvZ. Meanwhile, Jaedong had Snow try to tell him he wasn't god and only just managed to deliver a counterpoint. Zero is a player who probably won't take too much from his 3-0 in ZvP, as he is confident in that matchup and now he's being forced to play something different. Great, however, might be a little shaken from his hard road into the ro4.

Things to think about! My favourites are Zero and Jaedong, but neither are going to be getting a free pass from their opponents.
LEGEND!! LEGEND!!
Musoeun
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States4324 Posts
February 09 2011 22:41 GMT
#6
great's totally not a standard Zerg. He was one of the first to experiment with spore builds and then Hive builds in general.

Just thought I'd point that out.
Don't Shoot the Penguins. | Dance, 성은, dance! | Killer FanKlub | Action sucks. | Storm Terran hwaiting.
Chef
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
10810 Posts
February 09 2011 22:48 GMT
#7
Ah, sorry. I don't follow him, so I just said that because nothing about him has ever stood out to me. I know he was in one of the epic ZvZs that occurred in the last ZvZ, but I never saw him do anything again so :S If you can elaborate more on Great that would be lovely
LEGEND!! LEGEND!!
Impervious
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada4222 Posts
February 09 2011 22:49 GMT
#8


CSL + school + SC2 has been eating at my SCBW time..... This would be soooooooo worth watching if I could.....
~ \(ˌ)im-ˈpər-vē-əs\ : not capable of being damaged or harmed.
emperorchampion
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada9496 Posts
February 09 2011 22:53 GMT
#9
Lee Jaedong Fighting!!!
TRUEESPORTS || your days as a respected member of team liquid are over
DoctorHelvetica
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States15034 Posts
February 09 2011 23:15 GMT
#10
Rooting for Zero. That kid deserves a starleague win
RIP Aaliyah
Tony Campolo
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
New Zealand364 Posts
February 09 2011 23:20 GMT
#11
ZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.
While you were sleeping last night, 30,000 kids died of starvation or diseases related to malnutrition.
Kenpachi
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States9908 Posts
February 09 2011 23:39 GMT
#12
im sorry but Jaedong is no longer king of ZvZ or Bo5s. Hydra to overtake the dong and show the world who the next bonjwa is
Nada's body is South Korea's greatest weapon.
Trozz
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Canada3456 Posts
February 09 2011 23:40 GMT
#13
I hope Hydra wins.
He's got tough competition.
Let's see those 5 pools!
A build is not a guess, an estimation or a hunch, a feeling, or a foolish intuition. A build is a dependable, unwavering, unarguably accurate, portrayer of your ambition.
IamBach
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States1059 Posts
February 09 2011 23:55 GMT
#14
I think this is a really great point.
On February 10 2011 07:14 Chef wrote:
But there's a wrench in this machine. For the past week or so there has been no OSL. There has been no Proleague. The only responsibility these four players have is the MSL, and the only matchup left to play in the MSL is ZvZ. If there was ever a time to change ZvZ, it's right now.

I think we can expect some really interesting games!!
Just listen http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__lCZeePG48
Kyuukyuu
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada6263 Posts
February 09 2011 23:58 GMT
#15
Heh, someone hasn't watched many ZvZs featuring Great . One of the first Zergs to semi-consistently go to Hive tech and/or 3 bases whenever the situation allowed him to (eg. great vs JD @ Medusa).

There are tons of threads lying around about the innovation of Hive ZvZ but to generalize it in a nutshell I would say Great prefers a more economic, spore-based teching pattern (3 base spore -> hive) compared to the Woongjin Zergs who like their 2 base hive.

Certainly he isn't the boringly standard opponent (in this matchup at least) that you claim him to be
SushilS
Profile Joined November 2010
2115 Posts
February 10 2011 00:03 GMT
#16
On February 10 2011 07:16 Megaliskuu wrote:
I'm super pumped for this! This is gonna be like Avalon MSL finals but 10x Better!!! Hoping for some really exciting play from both zero and great!

Lol were you bein sarcastic.... ZvZ FTLLLL..
iceiceice: I’m going to make this short; I am the one true tinker player.
Froadac
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States6733 Posts
February 10 2011 00:21 GMT
#17
On February 10 2011 08:15 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Rooting for Zero. That kid deserves a starleague win

That he does.

Sort of bummed it's all zvz, although admittedly they have been getting more interesting on average recentlyi.
Sfydjklm
Profile Blog Joined April 2005
United States9218 Posts
February 10 2011 00:48 GMT
#18
:D
twitter.com/therealdhalism | "Trying out Z = lots of losses vs inferior players until you figure out how to do it well (if it even works)."- Liquid'Tyler
Ideas
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States8174 Posts
February 10 2011 01:41 GMT
#19
hoping for zero or JD to take it all. zero definitely has spent enough time in the A class to deserve a title, and JD has been denied his 6th starleague title far too many times.
Free Palestine
alffla
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Hong Kong20321 Posts
February 10 2011 01:44 GMT
#20
COME ONNN I MSIS U BROOD WAR WTFFF its been so longg i would watch a billion zvzs now
Graphicssavior[gm] : What is a “yawn” rape ;; Masumune - It was the year of the pig for those fucking defilers. Chill - A clinic you say? okum: SC without Korean yelling is like porn without sex. konamix: HAPPY BIRTHDAY MOMMY!
Ideas
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States8174 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-10 02:07:12
February 10 2011 02:05 GMT
#21
yea this super long break for lunar new years sucks :\

round1 of winners league wasnt even over yet! wtf
Free Palestine
Conversion
Profile Joined April 2010
United States3308 Posts
February 10 2011 03:45 GMT
#22
i'd rather watch a billion zvzs than a billion tvts

i think the latter would take me years... T___T

gogogogo hydra :DD avenge snow !
Normal
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 21m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
EnDerr 7
ProTech7
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 2560
sSak 70
Hm[arnc] 34
Mind 32
Noble 11
Icarus 9
ZergMaN 0
Dota 2
monkeys_forever375
League of Legends
JimRising 768
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox518
Other Games
summit1g9405
WinterStarcraft463
C9.Mang0300
Maynarde85
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH359
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21448
• lizZardDota278
League of Legends
• Lourlo1379
Upcoming Events
Kung Fu Cup
5h 21m
Replay Cast
18h 21m
The PondCast
1d 4h
KCM Race Survival
1d 4h
Escore
2 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Shopify Rebellion Sundays
4 days
Spirit vs Mixu
Clem vs TBD
RSL Revival
4 days
[ Show More ]
BlizzCon
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
WardiTV Weekly
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
GSL
6 days
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-08
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
RSL Revival: Season 6
Calamity Invitational
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: King of Kings
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
SC4ALL II: Brood War
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.