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Kwidowmaker
Canada978 Posts
On September 26 2010 13:29 Whole wrote: edit: However, I'm sure if you turn in this essay with the grammar errors fixed, I'm sure you could get an A. This is such an infuriating thought. I wrote an essay on a test in grade 10 and the only comment the teacher wrote was "not 5 paragraphs". Bitch got canned after a single year at my school :D | ||
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Magus
Canada450 Posts
On September 26 2010 12:59 Saechiis wrote: 13 and 14 year olds aren't mature enough for anything. In fact, it's probably the age at which teenagers are most out of control and naive. Around that age most are in school and will do anything that makes them look cool, including the stupid things they wouldn't do if they weren't under group pressure. Instead it should be: at the ages of 13 and 14 teenagers think they are mature enough to decide what is good for them and what isn't. I agree though that parents should be looked at to maintain the rules, but the fact is that a lot can't or won't and the government has to take responbility for that. I can't really help you because I just really disagree. Consider it a taste of what can be said to counter your plea. Also run a spelling check, nothing is worse for your credibility than grammatical errors like: "consiqences"  I'm going to dispute that, when I was 13/14 I didn't do anything stupid to look cool, cool people were douchebags. I was pretty much already set as resident nerd/encyclopedia though, but I was pretty happy in that spot anyway. Meh. Maybe the argument could be that people who don't already have their niche will do stupid stuff to find one? | ||
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Saechiis
Netherlands4989 Posts
I'll dissect this essay till I get sleepy o_O On September 26 2010 12:27 Diuqil wrote: So, I'm trying to make a pretty epic essay about the current curfew laws. I'm currently in 9th grade and would like it if you guys could help me out a bit(be harsh,please). This is my 5 paragraph persuasive essay: Teenagers should not have a curfew (your opinion), and the city should not be able to tell someone when they can and can’t be outside (your opinion). It should be the choice of the person and their guardian (your opinion). Instead of them parenting for the parents, the governement should focus on teaching how to properly parent a child (your opinion, never say should if you aren't going to give some facts to support it). It is logically the better method to teach then to control (your opinion, opinions are subjective, don't present them as truths unless you have proof). At the ages of thirteen and fourteen people should be considered adults (Why? Your opinion). At that age the person knows right from wrong (O rly? Proof?), and should be able to act mature and should be fully aware of the consiquences of their actions (Yes they should, but reality proves otherwise). So, when people who support a curfew law say “kids are more susceptible to bad influences such as drugs,” that is the individual’s choice to use drugs, nobody is forcing them to use the drugs, and at the age of thirteen people already know of the consequences (that using drugs is a choice doesn't make it legal, also lots of teenagers do these things because it's preceived to be cool and because friends are doing it too. Group pressure is really pressing "the forcing of drugs" and the fact that these kids aren't mature yet makes it all the more likely they will give in) Many people think because some kids are out at night, that they are always up to no good. That is a matter of how they view teenagers, and they are probably reflecting on what they did when they were young. ( Again, reality shows that every night there is at least some form of vandalism, drugs abuse, and/ or fighting by teenagers). Not all teenagers are bad, and just because they think teenagers are going to do bad things doesn’t mean they really are (Your argument is that we shouldn't judge all teenagers equally so we should treat all of them like they're angels?). It is a horrible reason, because its an assumption, not a fact (It's a fact that some teenagers will be making trouble if left unattended, leaving them alone because some of them are "good" is an equally horrible reason) The guardian of the child should be the one making the decisions of how long their child can stay out at night (Your opinion, plus some parents simply can't or won't). The government needs to teach how to parent properly.Teaching parents how to get into their childs lives and find out what they are doing through communication, not being nosey (this is all clearly written from a teenagers' perspective, you simply don't always get what you want. You're making it seem like parents should be taught the exact line between communication and being nosy, which is frankly not realistic or useful parenting at all. Teenagers are teenagers because they start to reject the authority their parents have over them and will actually actively try to prove their perceived independence by doing the opposite of what their parents want. The fact that they're trying to forcefully prove that they're independant is what separates them from being adult in the first place) This will improve the relationship with the guardian and child, which will in turn make the child take less riskier decisions when alone or with a group of friends. (Having nice talks with your parents won't prevent you from knocking up that pretty girl from high-school, also telling your friends you're not smoking a cigarette with them becuase you and your parents had a talk about it ... hell no. These arguments are all based on the perception that teenagers can make the right decisions by themselves, which isn't true in most cases.) The person makingb the decisions should be the individual’s guardian, not the government. (Your opinion again). Many people, view teens of today as how they were years ago, thinking they are trying to get in trouble, which is not true at all.(The human race has been around for a long time, rebellious teenagers have been a part of humanity since ages. "Maybe this generation will be different from the billions before" is just a question that defies logic. Statistically, most teenagers will get themselves in trouble at some point and so they're treated as such) Bad parenting makes bad children (Not true at all, good parents can have children that go down a bad road and vice versa) so when you try to blame someone for something they did, you also have to look into how they were raised. (You can't say, "well you are very likely to go smoke some dope and throw in windows with your friends, but hey, that's your parents fault. glhf!") Sorry if I was too harsh :S | ||
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RyuChus
Canada442 Posts
On September 26 2010 13:13 micronesia wrote: I think that still has an agreement problem. Anyone is singular but they isn't. Yeah, that's true. I think it should just be.. "The city should not be allowed to tell he/she when they.." | ||
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Foooky
Australia205 Posts
The format I perhaps would adopt is: intro: the general background PROBLEM CHILDREN lol, and then the predominant method of addressing this problem (curfew laws), followed by a discussion of the shortcomings of using this approach (which describes the body of the essay), and then ending with something like blah blah an alternative approach merits consideration. body: WHY R CURFEWS BAD? WHY WOULD AN ALTERNATIVE APPROACH BE GOOD? conclusion: due to my description of WHY this is a problem, and perhaps due to this (evidence??), we might want to recommend a change in practice or law, whereby curfews changed and the PROBLEM addressed using alternative means, i.e. in the form of parent education. this kind of format seems more logical to me. year 9s suck at english, if i were you i would just send the essay you have written in. | ||
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Kishkumen
United States650 Posts
I would also encourage you to ignore the guy who said you should use a thesaurus. I've read a lot of 9th grader essays (my senior year I had to grade piles of them as a TA), and one of the quickest ways to ruin your essay is to use a thesaurus. Thesauruses are good tools to remind yourself of words you already know, but many people assume that words listened in them are interchangeable. The result is an oddly worded essay that uses tons of synonyms that don't quite fit their contextual needs. If you use a thesaurus, only use it to remind yourself of words you already know and are comfortable using. There's not much that makes you seem less intelligent than a clear attempt to pad your essay by using vocabulary you're not familiar with. A lot of people have already poked holes in your argument and logic. It's a typical teenager essay that believes the world should revolve around teens and that adults clearly were never teens before. It makes your argument seem juvenile. You can argue against a curfew, but don't base it off of 13 and 14 year olds being mature, which anyone who has been 13 knows is a ridiculous statement. Try to view the issue from an adult perspective and then write your essay. You can still argue against a curfew, but hopefully it will place a little less faith in teens acting in a mature manner. Overall, I was impressed with your ability to stay on topic, which is actually something 9th graders really struggle with. Now you need to add more organization. Your main idea for each paragraph should be crystal clear. Right now, it's a little more murky. Think of what your main point is for each paragraph and concentrate solely on making that point. In your introduction and conclusion you should list those three points that are made in your body paragraphs. This is the simplest and most effective way to structure a 5-paragraph essay. If you just do that simple organization, your essay will be better than 95% of your peers. So your job is to a) come up with a clear thesis statement, b) come up with three ideas that help support that thesis and that will form the main ideas for your body paragraphs, and c) concentrate only on making those points listed in each paragraph. Those simple things will make your essay better than the vast majority of 9th graders, who have awful organization which makes their essays confusing and rambling. | ||
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Chairman Ray
United States11903 Posts
Teenagers should not have a curfew, and the city should not be able to tell someone when they can and can’t be outside. It should be the choice of the person and their guardian. Instead of them parenting for the parents, the governement should focus on teaching how to properly parent a child. It is logically the better method to teach then to control. I don't think this is the way to structure an introduction for a persuasive essay. You should speak with your teacher to see how he/she would like the introduction done. You need at least an identifiable thesis. At the ages of thirteen and fourteen people should be considered adults. At that age the person knows right from wrong, and should be able to act mature and should be fully aware of the consiquences of their actions. So, when people who support a curfew law say “kids are more susceptible to bad influences such as drugs,” that is the individual’s choice to use drugs, nobody is forcing them to use the drugs, and at the age of thirteen people already know of the consequences. The line is drawn between child and adulthood at 18 because teenagers are not able to think rationally. That is something that we accept under the status quo, and to argue otherwise would be an entirely different topic. In this persuasive essay, you are here to argue why curfew is bad, not why you think 13-14 year olds should be considered adults. Many people think because some kids are out at night, that they are always up to no good. That is a matter of how they view teenagers, and they are probably reflecting on what they did when they were young. Not all teenagers are bad, and just because they think teenagers are going to do bad things doesn’t mean they really are. It is a horrible reason, because its an assumption, not a fact. Although the prevention of youth crime is a valid argument, it is not the reason why curfews are imposed. Curfews are more to protect youth rather than protect against youth. Nighttime is very dangerous because street crimes can be committed without witness. During the day, this is not possible. Youth are a primary target for crime and by restricting the freedom of mobility of youth, we are protecting them. The guardian of the child should be the one making the decisions of how long their child can stay out at night. The government needs to teach how to parent properly.Teaching parents how to get into their childs lives and find out what they are doing through communication, not being nosey. This will improve the relationship with the guardian and child, which will in turn make the child take less riskier decisions when alone or with a group of friends. The person makingb the decisions should be the individual’s guardian, not the government. Many people, view teens of today as how they were years ago, thinking they are trying to get in trouble, which is not true at all.Bad parenting makes bad children, so when you try to blame someone for something they did, you also have to look into how they were raised. [/QUOTE] The government cannot feasibly teach every parent to be a good parent. Governments impose curfews as a way to make up for the mistakes that parents often make. It is very easy to put a few patrol officers around the block and return kids to their parents. Parents will be given an incentive to keep their kids indoors because they will be fined otherwise. This approach is much cheaper and much more effective than teaching parents how to raise their kids. ---------------- I cannot write your essay for you, but I can give you a few ideas to approach this issue. First and foremost, in a persuasive essay, you want to identify the reasons behind curfews, and then argue why these reasons are fallacious. The main reason behind curfews is to prevent crime done against youth. You should dedicate your second paragraph to arguing why this is fundamentally invalid. Secondly, you want to open up some lines of argumentation about the problems caused by curfew. One thing I can think of from the top of my head is that imposing a curfew asserts the false assumption that all youth are targets of crimes. Restricting the freedom of mobility of the youth punishes them for being the victim of crimes, rather than punishing the offenders of the crimes. This itself isn't an argument, if you write just this you will probably not get a very good grade, but it's a direction you can take and expand on. If you don't like it, you can also talk about how a lot of youth work night shifts in order to pay for college, and that would not be possible if curfews were in place. Be sure to provide deeper analysis on it though. This part should be your third paragraph. Thirdly you want to outline the benefits of not having a curfew. Try to picture a world without a curfew and a world with a curfew and write about why the world without a curfew would be better. By world I don't mean the entire globe, I just mean the scope that you are arguing it. This part should be your fourth paragraph. In your conclusion, you want to state the crux of the issue. By that I mean the ideologies behind curfew vs no curfew. You can say something like The issue of curfews really comes down to how much of a role should the state play in families or something like [/i]The central issue with curfew is an idea of public safety versus freedom[/i]. Of course you wouldn't do those specifically, they are just examples. Then you need to restate the points in your essay in order to tackle the crux. Just as an example to clear things up, you can say something like The issue of curfews really comes down to how much of a role should the state play in families. It is because of reason X and reason Y, and also because of harm Z that is caused by curfews, it really goes to show that the government has no role in the family. Under a society where we have curfew laws in place, we often see problem A and problem B, but under a society where curfew laws are not in place, we see yada yada yada. For these reasons, I stand strongly in opposition of curfew. That's the very basic structure of a conclusion. Maybe your teacher wants something else, so if unsure, ask him/her. Sorry if anything is unclear. It's 1am here so I probably wrote a bunch of ramble and I didn't even reread it. | ||
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Diuqil
United States307 Posts
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dogabutila
United States1437 Posts
Stylistically, it's better to not use contractions. Persuasive/argumentative essays in general work better when they sound professional/serious rather then casual. The other thing is that you have a bunch of run on sentences. Abuse of the comma is bad. I have this problem as well. It tends to happen when you try to write the same way as you talk. It doesn't nearly play out as well in writing though. Some commas are unnecessary, others should be periods. Alternatively, learn about the semicolon. Subject // tense agreement is important. In the beginning it sounds awkward, but once you do it the writing as a whole sounds more professional (which is good right?). Also, make sure you follow the formatting they gave you / teach you. It might not be the most exciting thing to read, but teachers in general (MS/HS) just grade on how well you follow what they teach, rather then any special thought or creativity etc. Work on your opening paragraph. It seems to be a little unfocused. The first line or two ought to both grab attention and introduce the issue. The last line should be the conclusion you want people to reach after reading your paper. Between this is a summary of the arguments or points you are going to make to help people reach that conclusion. For each paragraph the topic sentence also needs to be about what the rest of the paragraph is about // summarize the argument. The paragraphs themselves need to be more about your arguments for your conclusion rather then a refutation of arguments in opposition. The first 2 body paragraphs seem to be more addressing potential opposition arguments rather then supporting your own. Try coming up with 2 really good reasons why there should be no curfew. THEN think of the most likely argument somebody would use to say that there should be one and address that. Lastly, the conclusion is kind of weak. It's supposed to take all the arguments / points you made and tie them up to present the thought you want. Currently you only mention a few of the points you bring up, and it seems to be more of a jumbled mess then a logical thought progression. IMO, the teacher grading this is less likely to be grading on strengths of arguments and more on structure // adherence to whichever style manual they teach so don't worry too much about all the people ripping up your logic. Having said that, you still need to use good arguments. | ||
SirJolt
the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
On September 26 2010 12:32 micronesia wrote: Not my specialty, but I want to point out that you have several agreement issues: 'someone when they' someone is singular they is for multiple people 'person and their guardian' person is singular their is for multiple people etc Sadly, "they" and "their" are in increasingly common usage for the singular when gender is undefined, largely thanks to feminists' issues with the fact that "he" was the standard. Unfortunately, this leads to mistakes with plural/singular being made more and more often  | ||
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Divinek
Canada4045 Posts
On September 26 2010 19:43 SirJolt wrote: Sadly, "they" and "their" are in increasingly common usage for the singular when gender is undefined, largely thanks to feminists' issues with the fact that "he" was the standard. Unfortunately, this leads to mistakes with plural/singular being made more and more often so much so that it is evolving to actually mean a singular, it is becoming less and less incorrect lol. right out of the criminal code of canada if a peace officer has reasonable grounds to believe that, because of their physical condition, a person may be incapable of providing a breath sample... (subparagraph 254(3)(a)(ii)) and besides,' they' USED TO and really has always been used as a singular in many cases "Long before the use of generic he was condemned as sexist, the pronouns they, their, and them were used in educated speech and in all but the most formal writing to refer to indefinite pronouns and to singular nouns of general personal reference, probably because such nouns are often not felt to be exclusively singular: If anyone calls, tell them I'll be back at six. Everyone began looking for their books at once. Such use is not a recent development, nor is it a mark of ignorance. Shakespeare, Swift, Shelley, Scott, and Dickens, as well as many other English and American writers, have used they and its forms to refer to singular antecedents." | ||
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SirJolt
the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
It's sad that we have the word "one" to refer to these kinds of indeterminate-gender-singular-pronoun situations, but it's fallen so far out of common usage that it sounds contrived | ||
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Kishkumen
United States650 Posts
On September 26 2010 21:32 SirJolt wrote: I hadn't realised it wasn't a more recent thing until the last few weeks, but I had no idea the use of 'they' (singular) was so widespread. It's sad that we have the word "one" to refer to these kinds of indeterminate-gender-singular-pronoun situations, but it's fallen so far out of common usage that it sounds contrived As a linguisitics student, all I can say is "Down with prescriptivism!!!" There's nothing "sad" about people using a perfectly capable and useful construction that has been around for centuries. After all, "you" used to be plural and no one seems to have problems with using that pronoun in the singular. "One" can often sound stuffy and pretentious, especially if you use it every other sentence. "They" is by far the best gender-neutral pronoun, and it's clear that it's going to win the battle and become accepted in all but the most hyper-correct writing. | ||
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SirJolt
the Dagon Knight4002 Posts
Neither are bad things, by any stretch of the imagination, and certainly it's a question of usage... but as someone who very much enjoys language, it's hard not to be a little sentimental for the manner in which things are said  | ||
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