• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:36
CEST 00:36
KST 07:36
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies18Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)5Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview5[ASL21] Ro4 Preview: On Course12
Community News
Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double0Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results2Weekly Cups (May 4-10): Clem, MaxPax, herO win1Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !18Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple0
StarCraft 2
General
herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists
Tourneys
Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 527 Hell Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 526 Rubber and Glue Mutation # 525 Wheel of Misfortune
Brood War
General
25 Years Since Brood War Patch 1.08 (Spoiler) ASL21 Winner's Interview vespene.gg — BW replays in browser [ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies UA StarCraft: Mawin (T) vs hanniGan (P) Showmatch
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV ZeroSpace Megathread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Trading/Investing Thread US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software)
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Esports Organizations: Raisi…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1253 users

My thread for observations about Zerg

Blogs > Galois
Post a Reply
Galois
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States124 Posts
August 28 2010 10:49 GMT
#1
I will make this my personal thread for interesting shit I found out out the Zerg that I don't see other people ever bring up on the forums... although I admit that I've never really paid a lot of attention to the Zerg threads in the Strategy forum due to the stigma it has nowadays.

In my previous blog post I wrote that I was feeling the call of the swarm. I feel horrible.

Nevertheless, I've been reading the Zerg strategy section on Liquipedia (because nobody answered my question in the previous blog post about whether or not it was worthwhile to do so, so I assumed that it was)... and when I came across this passage...

When to Build Your Next Hatchery: When a Zerg player has determined that it is best to play with X Hatcheries, (let us say that X is six in this case, and that it's a ZvP in which the Protoss has two bases), the question is, when should Zerg build their next Hatchery? Zerg should always build their next Hatchery as soon as possible, as long as none of their current Hatcheries are at three Larvae. In other words, if the Zerg player lets all of his or her current Hatcheries run idle until all current Hatcheries have three Larvae each, will the Zerg player have 300 Minerals by that time? If so, then the Zerg should make another Hatchery. If not, then the Zerg player needs to build more Drones.


... I decided to find out where this point was with the Zerg in SC2.

The magic number of Drones necessary to get to 300 minerals is 12. 11 Drones will get you to 285.

So by the BW logic, in SC2 the most optimal time to build another Hatchery (note that I didn't say expand) is when you hit 12 Drones. I would guess that Drone #13 goes to Pool and Drone #14 goes to make another Hatchery... or an Extractor then Hatchery.

I don't see the pros do this, though. I watched some Dimaga replays and he always gets his Pool and Extractor on 15.

*
It's gonna take a lot to drag me away from you / There's nothing that a hundred men or more could ever do
Galois
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States124 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-28 10:53:24
August 28 2010 10:52 GMT
#2
Also, as I watch Jaedong-Flash in the finals here, I can't help but think that the Zerg need a Dark Swarm. Its like the Zerg's way of telling the Terran armies to fuck off.

I'm not used to looking at things from a Zerg perspective...
It's gonna take a lot to drag me away from you / There's nothing that a hundred men or more could ever do
Galois
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States124 Posts
August 28 2010 11:09 GMT
#3
Something else I noticed:

Buildings that you make using the Hatchery-cancel trick will stop dying with even the smallest amount of creep underneath them:

[image loading]

[image loading]
It's gonna take a lot to drag me away from you / There's nothing that a hundred men or more could ever do
Ry-Masta-T
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States478 Posts
August 28 2010 11:11 GMT
#4
i think the key is the 3 larva stipulation. People drone up to 14 or 15 because getting a hatch on 13 will force you to delay drone production early and without those drones, you wont have the income to support the second hatchery. Getting a queen first is typically better, so people get that pool before the hatch more often than not.
Speak the word...
Galois
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States124 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-28 12:26:31
August 28 2010 11:47 GMT
#5
I just looked more at it and the rule in BW that I quoted in the op can apply here just as well. Its not that it isn't cost-effective... its just that there's a better option, and that's the Spawn Larvae by the Queen.

A Hatchery takes 120 seconds to build and larvae take 10 seconds to spawn.

A Queen needs 50 real-time seconds (it takes 1.5 real-life seconds to get 1 energy) to be able to setup the Spawn Larvae and 40 more seconds to get the larvae to mature.

So if your Queen timing is bad then its most cost-effective to have the Queen handle 2 Hatcheries so that you can get off 2 Larvae spells at once.

Even though I never read Chill's thread about about this stuff at the Blizzcon those years ago (because I hated Zerg), I'm pretty sure that this is the jist of what that long thread was about.

So Hatcheries are only worthwhile to use for expansions, not for a macro boost. That explains why there's so many 1 base matches in this game!
It's gonna take a lot to drag me away from you / There's nothing that a hundred men or more could ever do
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Patches Events
19:30
Patches' Patch Clash #7
RotterdaM614
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 614
ProTech95
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 18181
Artosis 479
Zeus 79
NaDa 33
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm115
League of Legends
JimRising 603
Other Games
gofns16529
summit1g13735
tarik_tv11613
FrodaN4953
Grubby4291
Liquid`RaSZi3116
shahzam501
KnowMe345
kaitlyn49
RuFF_SC23
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1289
BasetradeTV88
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 57
• musti20045 42
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21299
Other Games
• imaqtpie1139
• WagamamaTV339
• Shiphtur311
• tFFMrPink 15
Upcoming Events
OSC
1h 24m
Universe Titan Cup
12h 24m
Rogue vs Percival
Wardi Open
13h 24m
Monday Night Weeklies
17h 24m
Replay Cast
1d 1h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 12h
GSL
2 days
herO vs Classic
Cure vs Clem
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
GSL
3 days
Maru vs SHIN
Zoun vs Rogue
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Spring Champion…
3 days
SKillous vs Strange
Lambo vs Strange
Ryung vs Strange
Lambo vs Ryung
Ryung vs SKillous
Lambo vs SKillous
Replay Cast
4 days
Maestros of the Game
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
TBD vs SHIN
TBD vs Rogue
IPSL
5 days
ZZZero vs WorsT
Julia vs eOnzErG
Replay Cast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
IPSL
6 days
Dragon vs Artosis
dxtr13 vs Hawk
BSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W8
2026 GSL S1
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

2026 KK StarCraft Pro League
BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
YSL S3
Acropolis #4
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals

Upcoming

CSCL: Masked Kings S4
Escore Tournament S2: King of Kings
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
Bounty Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.