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Edit:I decided not to go through with this for various reasons. A lot of the things said in this thread against doing this program I already had in my head but it helped to hear[read] it from other people. However, it is still a good thread to read over if you are in a similar situation or experience thinking about taking a break for an opportunity. I was very close to applying for the program. Thanks to everyone. Still, I hope to be in Korea again very soon, I love it there.
Hi,
If you've seen my old korea blog I guess you know that I'm a Korean-American. If you were around before blogs I guess you might have seen the first trip too.
First trip while on TL [2004]: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=14090
Second trip [2008]: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=71871
Rest of the posts from the second trip are under my blog link.
Since 2010 has started, I've had some troubles. A lot of them basically shook the majority of the plans I had made for myself for most of my adult life. I am 21 and I know that's relatively young but I feel really lost due to lots of things that have happened. I'd rather not get into it on TL but it included Car accident/injury/breaking up with long time gf/finances.
So I thought about what I could do to get myself mentally back on track and I didn't want to simply grind it out at my job this summer. I've done it before and it sucked. Ideally I'd want to go to Korea and teach since it is relevant to my long-term career goals. I want to be a interpreter for a international business or work for a government perhaps.
I was thinking about doing this:
http://talk.go.kr/
It's basically the only legal program sponsored by the Korean government that allows you to teach without a Bachelor's [BA] degree. I'm currently in my 3rd year at my university and I'd probably graduate in 1 or 1.5 years if I stayed here. I am an applied linguistics major and with that I would earn a TOEFL [ teaching english as a foreign language ] certification as well. So this is something I planned on doing anyway for 1-2 years after I graduated.
I spoke to all the people I knew that were knowledgeable and pretty much all of them said for me to go for it.
If I look at it in a short list the negatives are very few.
Pros: I get to teach, more experience to add to my resume, go to korea, take a break from my shitty situation here, see old friends etc...
Cons: I am putting university on hold, I'd have to start paying back my student loans, I have to choose a 6 months or 1 year contract which to me is a long time, probably wouldn't come out of it rich or anything since the program is for people without BA degrees.
There were threads before about this:
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=107304
It's pretty informative and I've seen pictures from this one guy I used to know who is doing it now.
I wanted to hear people's opinions on if I should do this or if anyone has heard or actually done the TALK program.
Another thing is since this program is not specifically designed for someone like me it would include lots of arts and crafty shit I've seen in pictures and things like doing dancing to ' build group morale ' and I feel like that's a total waste for me with my unique skills. I am a Korean-American fluent in both languages and because I look Korean I feel a lot of people would want a tutor like that. A lot of the problems in the other thread are avoided because I have been to Korea before, I have family and friends in Korea. Other than that, I would totally love to visit heritage sites and other stuff that is required by the program. I just genuinely love physically being in Korea wherever it is.
So if they get to this I expect people like Elric, NeverGG, quickstriker, d_so to comment so please do! I've already spoken to Susie [ so helpful! ] and got a lot to think over.
If I actually go through with this I expect to live off this program, and maybe teach private tutoring on the side through connections I made while in Korea during 2008. I feel adults would be more prone to pay for my teaching services. I am/have been learning specific methods to teach English at my university for my degree so I feel very qualified. I taught 3/4grade and 6/7 grade koreans in 2008 and even ended up tutoring 5 adults for free.
There are a few things, but important things, that would hold me back from doing this program. But overall I feel it is a good opportunity and I could probably do it and come out better for it.
Thanks for reading all or any of this and any comments would be great.
Edit: On another note, sc2beta is really fun. I've got to top 10 platinum ranks in 1v1 and 2v2 on a friend's account and then on my own when I got my invite from him. I really feel it could be a great game once its patched enough and expansions come out. Sorry to those who don't have it!
 
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Calgary25969 Posts
As part of the 1% of the TL community who has completed their bachelors: Don't do it. Get the degree then do it.
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On March 23 2010 04:31 Chill wrote:
As part of the 1% of the TL community who has completed their bachelors: Don't do it. Get the degree then do it.
don't listen to this man
think of it like this... jump ahead, ten, twenty years. okay, you graduated college and you have a marriage and a job. only your marriage doesn't have the same have that same energy that it used to have. you start to blame your job. you start to think about all those jobs you could have taken in your life and what might have happened if you'd taken a chance with one of them. well, this is one of those jobs. this korea job, think of it as time travel. from then until now to find out what you're missing out on. what this really could be is a gigantic favor to both you and your future wife to find out that you're not missing out on anything, that this korea job is going to be just as bad as your future one, totally boring, crappy. so then you know you made the right choice!
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On March 23 2010 04:31 Chill wrote:
As part of the 1% of the TL community who has completed their bachelors: Don't do it. Get the degree then do it.
Can you expand? Is it for reasons other than it's hard to go back and finish/I would get paid more with a degree anyway?
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Well...time to start talking about this again.... I went on an adventure about a year and half ago called the TaLK program and I have all the memories and stories regarding this through my memories to this moment as the first wave of ppl to take on the TaLK program....
Unfortunately, I'm studying for an exam that's in less than 2 hours atm and it's a 3 hour class.... then I gotta eat dinner, drive home, and perhaps about at 11 PM EST I'll probably see this again so ask me ANY WHATEVER QUESTIONS YOU WANT and I'll answer if you have any questions about the TaLK program... see ya later!
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mrmin123
Korea (South)2971 Posts
On March 23 2010 04:31 Chill wrote:
As part of the 1% of the TL community who has completed their bachelors: Don't do it. Get the degree then do it.
1%? That low?
But I agree with Chill. Just tough it out for another year and get your degree. After that go wild, but in my opinion if you get distracted now you might never go back to get your degree again.
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I agree with Chill. Just finish your degree first cause that is seriously the most important thing. Also going back to school after a break is so hard as you have probably heard before. Just finish school and then make big decisions like that.
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You know... come to think about it, maybe one of these days, I should create a "TaLK FAQ" so in case anyone is interested in a mass amount, it'll be just that easy... but not today, not tomorrow, not next week, sometime in future....
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On March 23 2010 04:36 QuickStriker wrote:
Well...time to start talking about this again.... I went on an adventure about a year and half ago called the TaLK program and I have all the memories and stories regarding this through my memories to this moment as the first wave of ppl to take on the TaLK program....
Unfortunately, I'm studying for an exam that's in less than 2 hours atm and it's a 3 hour class.... then I gotta eat dinner, drive home, and perhaps about at 11 PM EST I'll probably see this again so ask me ANY WHATEVER QUESTIONS YOU WANT and I'll answer if you have any questions about the TaLK program... see ya later!
Thanks a lot quick.
I just want to know any details you can give me. Where you were placed, what kind of day-to-day stuff I can expect. I don't think I'm gonna enjoy the orientation much but I guess its shorter now than when you did it? I want to get to the meat of the program and teach English to people that can absorb it. My personal opinion is 3-5th grade is probably too young, but every time I visit Korea I can't help but feel really bad for Korean students. The good ones have such strong work ethic, and until recently had school every Saturday on top of going to private academies after school every day. That's like 2 or 3x as much schooling as people in English speaking countries, yet because many Koreans only learn test-taking English they cannot succeed. I want to empower some of these people.
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On March 23 2010 04:37 mrmin123 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2010 04:31 Chill wrote:
As part of the 1% of the TL community who has completed their bachelors: Don't do it. Get the degree then do it. 1%? That low? But I agree with Chill. Just tough it out for another year and get your degree. After that go wild, but in my opinion if you get distracted now you might never go back to get your degree again.
On March 23 2010 04:37 kidd wrote:
I agree with Chill. Just finish your degree first cause that is seriously the most important thing. Also going back to school after a break is so hard as you have probably heard before. Just finish school and then make big decisions like that.
Don't agree with either of you or Chill. I went through the TaLk program b/c I was at a very low point of my life with having absolute no interest with what I was doing atm which was trying to get an engineering degree. I had to have a place and time to think it over and restart from my fallen failing point of life and it was TaLK program that allowed me to do so. Thus, I came back with a fresh renewed mind under total self-restart of what I call "Broadcast Journalism" now. So there, one example why I disagree.
Also, he didn't really mention what his current personal situation is, what if it's like me or there's a reason to do so? Maybe he needs a place to escape for half a year like I do? Etc.
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on second thought, i think getting ur college degree is best bc there are like thousands of kids going 2 korea to teach english or w/e, why be just another face in the crowd? if u can get ur degree u can really succeed and get better jobs, not just do something anyone who can speak korean can do. don't settle for just teaching language at minimum wage -_-
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Calgary25969 Posts
On March 23 2010 04:36 Ack1027 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2010 04:31 Chill wrote:
As part of the 1% of the TL community who has completed their bachelors: Don't do it. Get the degree then do it. Can you expand? Is it for reasons other than it's hard to go back and finish/I would get paid more with a degree anyway?
Empirical experience has shown me that the majority of people who "take breaks" from university end up worse off than if they had just finished, whereas people are way more likely to never complete their degree. It's massive -EV. No one comes back from relaxing and barely working to going to university "rejuvenated". They get used to being free and having income and then can't go back to living poor and grinding through university. I have worked blue collar summer jobs and a lot of people there are working 16 hour days because they are on a "15+ year break". Yes you are unique snowflake, except you're not. Grab your bootstraps, plough through, and then figure out what to do.
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Well the alternative is pretty bleak.
If I stay here I'll be working a minimum wage job anyway during the summer. I work at a Papa John's currently [ a pizza joint ] and I make like $7.25 an hour. If I stayed during the summer I'd get promoted to shift-runner which is like $9.00 an hour at 30 hours a week. That would sustain me but I got the job before I moved so from home>school>work I travel a 60 mile triangle every day.
The other ' possible ' alternative is getting a job at FedEx where my friend works. It's pretty ambitious but getting higher up in a international business like that is exactly what I'd like to do maybe work FedEx Korea. But anyway, if I got a job it'd be moving boxes for a while for like $9 anyway. I'm physically not 100% from the car accident and although they hire/fire very often at the FedEx my friend works at....its been stable for some time now.
My current situation is I'm barely scraping by on my $450+ month rent without plans for the summer. I don't have much to my name, and I'm emotionally distraught.
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Braavos36372 Posts
I don't think stopping school just to escape your current "bleak" situation is going to improve your life at all. It's just going to put your problems on hold. You should graduate, and once you have a full range of job options, then decide whether to go to Korea or not (is it even a sure thing to get into this Talk program?). It'll probably improve your prospects in Korea to have a degree anyway.
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I really gotta start studying for this quiz that's in one hour.. lol
On March 23 2010 04:46 Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2010 04:36 Ack1027 wrote:On March 23 2010 04:31 Chill wrote:
As part of the 1% of the TL community who has completed their bachelors: Don't do it. Get the degree then do it. Can you expand? Is it for reasons other than it's hard to go back and finish/I would get paid more with a degree anyway? Empirical experience has shown me that the majority of people who "take breaks" from university end up worse off than if they had just finished, whereas people are way more likely to never complete their degree. It's massive -EV. No one comes back from relaxing and barely working to going to university "rejuvenated". They get used to being free and having income and then can't go back to living poor and grinding through university. I have worked blue collar summer jobs and a lot of people there are working 16 hour days because they are on a "15+ year break". Yes you are unique snowflake, except you're not. Grab your bootstraps, plough through, and then figure out what to do.
Well I can agree with this and Chill does have several good points. However, like you said, that's not always the case and I use myself as an example once more. Thanks to my experiences and stay in Korea in the TaLK program, I'm more organized, focused, determined and also have a better idea of what the hell I wanna do with my life. But it's all based on what you do there and what you get out if you are going to make a commitment to go through this TaLK Program. Sure, you can slack off and do whatever you want besides the mandatory 15 hours of teaching per week, but if you're going to spend the rest of the time doing absolutely nothing, then there won't be much things to get out of the program. (Though I will be honest and I did watch a lot of SC on TV and spend time on TL half of the time...)
It's all about objective and purpose. I got mine in Korea and I hope you would be able to as well if you are going to plan to go into this program. Once again, see ya in about 8-9 hours!
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On March 23 2010 04:51 Hot_Bid wrote:
I don't think stopping school just to escape your current "bleak" situation is going to improve your life at all. It's just going to put your problems on hold. You should graduate, and once you have a full range of job options, then decide whether to go to Korea or not (is it even a sure thing to get into this Talk program?). It'll probably improve your prospects in Korea to have a degree anyway.
I understand that feeling and wanting to escape is not high on my list of wanting to do this.
It's something I planned on doing anyway, albeit on a larger scale. It would be nice to have this Talk program experience if I planned to do the programs later on that require a degree.
When I went to Korea in 2008 I felt similarly distraught and I came out of it feeling much better as an individual and went on to have one of my most successful academic semesters at school.
If I come back from doing this program, I would fully intend on finishing school and I would have more value theoretically [ actual money earned + experience ] than if I had just stayed here and worked. The thing is I have lots of incentives to finish my degree. Its a challenge/pride, I need it for any decent job, I specifically need it for my TOEFL certification and I need it to become an interpreter.
Again I am still not set 100% on this decision and it is good to hear all perspectives.
Edit: It is an application program so no it is not 100% that is another con. However I know 2 people that have done it and they have similar study habits as I do. Also Quickstriker here did it and I remember him saying they have around 1000 people or less total for the whole program and as the application deadline approaches they basically throw themselves to people. Also Susie has a connection. Mostly though I feel like I'd get in cuz I speak native korean [ which they say they prefer ] and I have previous teaching experience IN korea.
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Just sit and think about it for a while, let it ferment for a couple of weeks, then choose. I wouldn't listen to anyone here except the people who went and did the program or something similar.
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Calgary25969 Posts
On March 23 2010 04:46 Ack1027 wrote:
Well the alternative is pretty bleak.
If I stay here I'll be working a minimum wage job anyway during the summer. I work at a Papa John's currently [ a pizza joint ] and I make like $7.25 an hour. If I stayed during the summer I'd get promoted to shift-runner which is like $9.00 an hour at 30 hours a week. That would sustain me but I got the job before I moved so from home>school>work I travel a 60 mile triangle every day.
The other ' possible ' alternative is getting a job at FedEx where my friend works. It's pretty ambitious but getting higher up in a international business like that is exactly what I'd like to do maybe work FedEx Korea. But anyway, if I got a job it'd be moving boxes for a while for like $9 anyway. I'm physically not 100% from the car accident and although they hire/fire very often at the FedEx my friend works at....its been stable for some time now.
My current situation is I'm barely scraping by on my $450+ month rent without plans for the summer. I don't have much to my name, and I'm emotionally distraught.
How is that bleak? Why are you paying rent during the summer? Can't you live a home? Are you paying rent at home?
There are about 16 weeks of summer, which is approximately 600 hours. 450 * 8 is 3600. Conservatively, you need to find a full-time job at $6.00 an hour to be fine. Taking a year off is not an alternative to finding a summer job.
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I live on my own and support myself in all aspects. My mother and I had huge differences and she moved away to try and fix some things in her life as well 10 hours away.
So yeah I pay rent all year long there is no ' home '. Your calculations are correct but I'm sure by now you know that there is living costs/bills/food/water/phone etc...
It's also not finding a summer job. I already have a job.
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Calgary25969 Posts
On March 23 2010 06:06 Ack1027 wrote:
I live on my own and support myself in all aspects. My mother and I had huge differences and she moved away to try and fix some things in her life as well 10 hours away.
So yeah I pay rent all year long there is no ' home '. Your calculations are correct but I'm sure by now you know that there is living costs/bills/food/water/phone etc...
It's also not finding a summer job. I already have a job.
Then I would suggest you take out a student loan since it is nearly impossible to support yourself through university alone. Going to Korea for a year will not solve this.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
chill strategy forum mod
Strategy for life mod
get em
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Calgary25969 Posts
Also, as an aside without getting into your life too much, you should patch things up with your mom ASAP. 10 hours away is nothing that can't be overcome with a few flights. My parents live 40 hours away but I still see them once a year. Many people live far away from their parents and go home for summer. I don't want to pry into your situation but family is something you need and a forgiving and forgetting apology can go a long way!
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PM'd.
Edit: didn't want that information to be public...anyway I have both federal loans offered by my school. It's definitely doable to get by in school alone, as I know people personally who are doing that on top of even more burden than me...but yeah it's not something I would like to do. Just to give the other side of the argument, this talk program would give me some financial flexibility.
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On March 23 2010 06:15 {88}iNcontroL wrote:
chill strategy forum mod
Strategy for life mod
get em
Not sure of your score since I don't play on my friends account anymore [ got my own now ] but get back on top of 2v2's! It's weird not seeing your team up there it makes our division less cool yo!
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Well to play contrary to Chill's perspective, I am someone who took 6 months off from school and feels better about where and what to do with my life now.
In the end, the two questions you have to ask yourself and must have answers for are:
1. Will I be better in X months of doing whatever?
2. Am I sure that by taking X months off to do whatever will solve whatever problems that I have right now?
If you can't honestly answer those 2 or have very simplistic answers to them, then no, don't take time off because you don't have a clue on what you are doing and probably will end up like Chill mentioned earlier.
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thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
OK I only read 1/3 of the OP but I'm autoagreeing with Chill even though I havent read more than 10 words chill has written in this thread.
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Osaka27130 Posts
I think that it is important to get your degree done now, so that you have a wider range of options when you were. Imagine ...
1) You go on TALK now. You go for 6 months because it triggers your student loan repayments and you have to get back into school to call off the dogs. Unfortunately, you find that working in Korea means you make no money in the US because the won is so unbelievably weak right now. In the mean time you have had to pay for storage for all your stuff, you come back with no savings, and you have to find a new apartment, get back into school, and secure financing.
You also fall in love with the girl of your dreams in Korea, but because you have 18 months of school left you have to leave her.
2) You grind out your school by taking on additional loans. However, because of your certification and degree, the job you get in Korea pays more that what you would have made on TALK, and your timeline is not restricted by visa / finishing school obligations. You are also on a more flexible visa which means you can look for better opportunites. Because you are bilingual, your jobs are more dynamic than TALK, and look far better on your CV in the future. You get the girl.
You also get to play SC2 through your last year of college.
Seriously. Get the degree finished. Leaving without it paints you into a corner, while leaving with it gives you multiple avenues. If you have any questions about my exerience which has some similarities (but obviously some differences) let me know.
You also get the girl.
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It seems all the mods/admins of TL oppose this idea nor completely ignore the other perspective as well as my post. I mean I understand all your intent and also where each of you are coming from with your bias but I suppose it can't be helped. I mean I can go on with my talks of experience and some advices about this program but since in a debate like this where it's like a few of us vs the mods and everyone else, I'm just going to flip flop and just give up since I can tell I'll dig myself a deeper hole if I keep on going. And I like my hole just fine...
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Osaka27130 Posts
On March 23 2010 11:57 QuickStriker wrote:
It seems all the mods/admins of TL oppose this idea nor completely ignore the other perspective as well as my post. I mean I understand all your intent and also where each of you are coming from with your bias but I suppose it can't be helped. I mean I can go on with my talks of experience and some advices about this program but since in a debate like this where it's like a few of us vs the mods and everyone else, I'm just going to flip flop and just give up since I can tell I'll dig myself a deeper hole if I keep on going. And I like my hole just fine...
If it is coming across as mods vs you, I'm sorry it looks that way. I just think it speaks to the general place in life that we are at. I think it is great that it worked out for you so well. You certainly aren't in a hole.
If anything, it is important for Ack to get two sides to the argument, which I think he gets in this thread. The fact that the names are red and blue shouldn't matter in a discussion like this.
Can I ask you, out of the people you met on TaLK (assuming you mingled with other participants) what was the consensus with them? Were there any others in your situation? I am part of the JET program which requires graduates, and have been deeply disappointed with the quality of people I have met, to the point that I no longer tell people that I am on that program.
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3861 Posts
I think you should go. Chill, he won't be in Seoul, and he'll get a better perspective on things, plus his relatives live in Kyonggi and maybe this will be good for him to get closer to the family, culture while trying to figure out life without his ex.
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Thanks everyone. I'm gonna take some time to think this over. I'll let you know how it turns out.
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Korea (South)17174 Posts
don't go to a city thats not seoul
don't be a retard
do the right thing
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On March 25 2010 10:31 Rekrul wrote:
don't go to a city thats not seoul
don't be a retard
do the right thing
Alright alright I got it yo.
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EPT
