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/in
I will not be replaced.
It would be awesome if I was SK this time around 
Although I still need a lot of work to my town play so more games where I can improve it are better.
I guess being scum is not that bad, it's just a little bit more stressful but you waste less time (than if you were town), so it wouldn't bother me (I don't really need to improve my scum play that much though....although it's been some games since I was scum so I don't have to lose practice >_> )
Well, let's see, whatever I get it will be awesome anyways (since it's a mini and mini's are awesome)
If I'm town I better have a blue role though > : (
(I'm never blue when town....and when I am the VT roles are better  )
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On July 09 2012 08:00 marvellosity wrote:
/in
gonzaw, even not in-game you talk a lot <3
I wonder what would happen if I just go all "lurking" all of a sudden in one of these games >_> <_<
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On July 09 2012 08:08 marvellosity wrote:
gonzaw, then I lynch you immediately! ^_^
But let's not be silly, it's never going to happen :D
lol .... we shall see >_>
(also if I every "lurk" this game I'll point out to this post and say that I'd do it regardless of alignment just to piss marv off, so don't call me scum or anything <_< )
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Yo whats up dudes. I forgot how many scum there were, where they 4?
Anyways, first things first:
Millers Claim!
Masons Claim!
Nobody discuss this, nobody argue this, nobody contradict this. It's been discussed to death in every single game before this one so if you want to see reasons why those 2 should happen reread those games/guides/post-game analysis, don't clutter this thread up saying "oh no Millers shouldn't claim because the cop will get a red check!" or some bullshit.
Was that clear?
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On July 12 2012 07:36 Vivax wrote:
I like gonzaws idea for the miller, but not for the masons. The masons should stay secret to pull off team stunts.
On July 12 2012 07:32 gonzaw wrote:
Yo whats up dudes. I forgot how many scum there were, where they 4?
Anyways, first things first:
Millers Claim!
Masons Claim!
Nobody discuss this, nobody argue this, nobody contradict this. It's been discussed to death in every single game before this one so if you want to see reasons why those 2 should happen reread those games/guides/post-game analysis, don't clutter this thread up saying "oh no Millers shouldn't claim because the cop will get a red check!" or some bullshit.
Was that clear?
For instance here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=321159¤tpage=55#1100
And all the discussion from before in that thread and shit (couldn't find another game where the whole "masons claim on D1" thing was explained thoroughly though ).
lol how did you do that? (off-topic)
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On July 12 2012 07:40 talismania wrote:
I kinda think a roleblocker should come out too, with the idea being that a jailkeeper protects him (and scum don't know if there is or isn't a jailkeeper and doesn't know to risk a hit or not) and simultaneously removes the roleblock annoyance from the equation + makes it so if someone does get roleblocked we know scum has a roleblocker too. And I think that's important setup info since if this c9++ thing is to be believed then a scum roleblocker means there's at least 3 scum (unless wbg has strayed a long way away from that wiki). If roleblocker does exist but doesn't want to come out then I kindly request he not use his power at all until it makes sense.
This thing I'm not to sure about.
One person on the mafia team may carry out the kill each night. The mafia can choose not to kill. The mafia can kill each other. If the mafia member chosen to kill on a particular night is roleblocked, no kill will occur.
This means that the Town RBer is only helpful when he RBes the scum player that sends the hit, or he RBs the SK (if there is one).
RBing a Mafia Roleblocker may seem cool, but it's not that big of a deal. Because:
1)The Town RBer has to guess correctly who's the scum RBer
2)The scum RBer RBed a Power Role and not a VT/SK.
For those 2 to happen he has to be VERY lucky. Most likely he won't target the RBer, and even if he does the RBer may RB a VT/SK (or scum may not even RB at all to induce WIFOM).
In this case there is a great chance the Town RBer RBing a Mafia RBer (lol, RB) would be a waste.
RBing a Mafia Godfather only works when:
1)The Town RBer guesses correctly and targets the Godfather
2)A Cop checks the Godfather that night, and somehow is sure his target wasn't Framed
Basically the same as the Mafia RBer one, the chances of both happening are very little.
RBing a Mafia Framer works exactly the same (his RB works only if the Framer framed someone the cop actually checked).
That basically means he's only helpful when he targets 1-2 guys out of 12, and like 7-8 other guys he targets could be harmful to town (if those townies are blue).
So perhaps the RBer claiming would be the best, and have him not RB at all.
This means that:
- He won't miss and RB Town Power Roles
- We won't have to WIFOM about him being Mafia RBer and RBing townies on purpose
- If he did choose to RB, because of the reasons above he would most likely fail
So I think the Town RBer should claim and not RB at all.
I don't know about the Jailkeeper protecting him, since there can be more important people to protect. Also, if we tell the Jailkeeper "Do what you want, if you want to protect the claimed RBer then do so" scum won't know if the Town RBer will be protected whether there is a JK or not (also they won't know if there isn't a town JK if they successfully kill the Town RB at night).
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On July 12 2012 08:05 talismania wrote:
@gonzaw on the RB: yeah for sure I don't think there's any point to a RB using their power. Jailkeeper can do as they please as long as the threat is out there it's fine. There's only one case I can think of off the top of my head where it's good for jailkeeper to protect (scum RB fake claims town RB, jailkeeper doesn't protect him, someone else claims RB'd, the scum RB claims he withheld his power, WIFOM) but that seems rather unlikely to occur.
If we try to create scenarios WIFOM-proof we'll waste lots of resources and time, and most of the time it's not even that useful (protecting a claimed Town RBer isn't a "game-breaking plan for town to win", yet it takes away the JK's ability to save someone at night).
So yeah let's keep it simple....at least until we find a better plan
Also, cool this game has PMs/Chat/stuff.
If someone has Skype contact me, I'm gonzaw308
Or use the mafia chat thingy
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On July 12 2012 08:10 s0Lstice wrote:
PMs
PMs are not allowed in this game.
from the OP..
Out of thread communication: It is common for mafia (and town circles if PMs are allowed) to use a medium outside of TL such as QuickTopics or IRC to communicate during the game. Please be mindful that other players may be more tech savvy than you and they may attempt impersonate members of your team or attempt to infiltrate your chat. You use these media at your own risk.
??
Did I miss something?
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On July 12 2012 08:14 NoSmurfHere wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 08:08 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 08:05 talismania wrote:
@gonzaw on the RB: yeah for sure I don't think there's any point to a RB using their power. Jailkeeper can do as they please as long as the threat is out there it's fine. There's only one case I can think of off the top of my head where it's good for jailkeeper to protect (scum RB fake claims town RB, jailkeeper doesn't protect him, someone else claims RB'd, the scum RB claims he withheld his power, WIFOM) but that seems rather unlikely to occur. If we try to create scenarios WIFOM-proof we'll waste lots of resources and time, and most of the time it's not even that useful (protecting a claimed Town RBer isn't a "game-breaking plan for town to win", yet it takes away the JK's ability to save someone at night). So yeah let's keep it simple....at least until we find a better plan
Also, cool this game has PMs/Chat/stuff. If someone has Skype contact me, I'm gonzaw308Or use the mafia chat thingy PMs are NOT allowed.
I repeat, NOT ALLOWED.
Are IRC, Chats and stuff allowed instead?
lol that OP is pretty confusing
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On July 12 2012 08:17 NoSmurfHere wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 08:15 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 08:14 NoSmurfHere wrote:On July 12 2012 08:08 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 08:05 talismania wrote:
@gonzaw on the RB: yeah for sure I don't think there's any point to a RB using their power. Jailkeeper can do as they please as long as the threat is out there it's fine. There's only one case I can think of off the top of my head where it's good for jailkeeper to protect (scum RB fake claims town RB, jailkeeper doesn't protect him, someone else claims RB'd, the scum RB claims he withheld his power, WIFOM) but that seems rather unlikely to occur. If we try to create scenarios WIFOM-proof we'll waste lots of resources and time, and most of the time it's not even that useful (protecting a claimed Town RBer isn't a "game-breaking plan for town to win", yet it takes away the JK's ability to save someone at night). So yeah let's keep it simple....at least until we find a better plan
Also, cool this game has PMs/Chat/stuff. If someone has Skype contact me, I'm gonzaw308Or use the mafia chat thingy PMs are NOT allowed.
I repeat, NOT ALLOWED. Are IRC, Chats and stuff allowed instead?lol that OP is pretty confusing Only if I have given you a QT link.
The OP is not confusing, it's the same clause from every OP as every game since PYP:I from October.
Check the model OP thread if you don't believe me.
I swear to God that I've seen some games that put "Out of thread communication is not allowed" in that part of the OP, and the ones that did put that "Use these media at your own risk" part where the ones that allowed out of thread communication.
...although now that I read the past few games I see they are all the same...huh, I guess I never noticed it and assumed it was the former
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So, if the lynch was right now I'd want to kill one of these 3 guys:
On July 12 2012 07:56 Risen wrote:
Welcome to ICBINTMM in which Risen does not post in caps or call anyone an idiot THE ENTIRE GAME. Stay tuned to see if this actually happens......
On July 12 2012 07:33 strongandbig wrote:
sup bros
i am currently watching Le Closer in french in my hotel room.
Scum y'all best get ready to get motherfucking interrogated
On July 12 2012 06:33 Mattchew wrote:
alight lets do this.
no zentor means no policy lynch based on names for me.
You can see the recurring theme in all 3 (just 1 post, promising something/appearing they are eager to start but not doing anything else later).
marv, talismania, anybody active, what do you think about these guys? If you had to kill one of them which one would you choose and why? (if you don't want to kill anyone then say so).
Also this guy could die too:
On July 12 2012 08:05 austinmcc wrote:
Screw the number and size of posts. I'm not a scientist, but it looks like talismania's been town --> scum --> town --> scum --> town. Therefore, he's scum this game.
I know that millers are supposed to claim D1, but I don't see why we'd want claims on other roles right now. Except from marv, who needs to let us know whether he's a vigi or scum this game, since those are the only roles that he rolls.
But at least he put a little bit more effort (although that's not town-telling)
Dropbear and Milton haven't even posted, but well we can't do anything about it.
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On July 12 2012 09:49 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 09:36 gonzaw wrote:So, if the lynch was right now I'd want to kill one of these 3 guys: On July 12 2012 07:56 Risen wrote:
Welcome to ICBINTMM in which Risen does not post in caps or call anyone an idiot THE ENTIRE GAME. Stay tuned to see if this actually happens...... On July 12 2012 07:33 strongandbig wrote:
sup bros
i am currently watching Le Closer in french in my hotel room.
Scum y'all best get ready to get motherfucking interrogated On July 12 2012 06:33 Mattchew wrote:
alight lets do this.
no zentor means no policy lynch based on names for me. You can see the recurring theme in all 3 (just 1 post, promising something/appearing they are eager to start but not doing anything else later). marv, talismania, anybody active, what do you think about these guys? If you had to kill one of them which one would you choose and why? (if you don't want to kill anyone then say so). Also this guy could die too: On July 12 2012 08:05 austinmcc wrote:
Screw the number and size of posts. I'm not a scientist, but it looks like talismania's been town --> scum --> town --> scum --> town. Therefore, he's scum this game.
I know that millers are supposed to claim D1, but I don't see why we'd want claims on other roles right now. Except from marv, who needs to let us know whether he's a vigi or scum this game, since those are the only roles that he rolls. But at least he put a little bit more effort (although that's not town-telling) Dropbear and Milton haven't even posted, but well we can't do anything about it. Any particular reason you're trying to push something on people with a low post count in thread so early? Didn't even know lurking was possible at this point. So you're either an extremely eager townie or scum looking for easy targets to push early.
Thank you captain obvious. Instead of posting tautologies, do you have an opinion on said subject? (i.e do you think I'm extremely eager townie or do you think I'm scum looking for easy targets to push?)
Any particular reason you just instantly come out out of nowhere once your name was called out? (did you just admit you were lurking?)
But yeah, I saw the thread was pretty slow and wanted to spice things up, and I think you 3 guys are the most likely to be scum at the moment (I find solstice+sciberbia+Vivax+talis+keirathi pretty town at the moment, leaving you guys+the inactives)
On July 12 2012 09:47 marvellosity wrote:
naw, I'm not killing anyone based on one post right at the beginning of the game (especially as pregame was quite active/friendly, it spilled over)
I'd rather lynch talis for his never-ending bullshit on listing names and reasons.
That plan of his is similar to his "utter stupid" plan he made as scum (the one where he wanted to force everybody to make a case and shit), but not that much to be honest.
But I don't see him as scummy at the moment, he seemed pretty interested in the discussion and made sense with his posts (also it makes me think he wouldn't go through the trouble of making that giant spreadsheet with the post of his past games if he was scum)
Seriously, 24 hours into day 1 and we're supposed to come up with reasons on 3 different people for why they might be scum? It's just nonsense.
Why the aggressiveness? I'm trying to provide some discussion.
Why is it nonsense to.....you know...try to find scum?
Or... wait for it... I have an idea! If someone says something a person finds scummy, they can call them out and bring it to the thread! Wow, marv, you say - an amazing plan!
Or we can wait for nothing at all to happen, which is basically what happens every single game I'm in where I stop posting and "wait for people to post on their own" (yeah it happens every single time, at least when I'm town).
People shouldn't be 'forced' to make effort, the making of the effort willingly is what helps gives us our reads on people.
Posting single thoughts on those 3 guys isn't making an effort I think, nor is saying "Yeah I'd kill them" or "No I wouldn't kill them" (specially considering they only have 1 post).
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On July 12 2012 10:00 gonzaw wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 09:49 Risen wrote:
Any particular reason you're trying to push something on people with a low post count in thread so early? Didn't even know lurking was possible at this point. So you're either an extremely eager townie or scum looking for easy targets to push early. Thank you captain obvious. Instead of posting tautologies, do you have an opinion on said subject? (i.e do you think I'm extremely eager townie or do you think I'm scum looking for easy targets to push?)
In hindsight this came out more aggressive than I meant it :/
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On July 12 2012 10:15 s0Lstice wrote:
maybe I misread, but I'm pretty sure Marv was addressing Talis with those lines you quoted, gonzaw.
As far as the names you listed, I wouldn't want to kill any of them right now. Austin has easy town meta, I feel confident I can recognize it. Mattchew, Risen, and s&b are just blank pages. I am nervous however of Risen making a conscious effort to change his play-style. I read him right in SSB64 but just barely.
Really? I thought he was talking about me (since I did post 3 people and wanted people to post some reasoning on them)
On July 12 2012 10:44 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 10:38 Risen wrote:On July 12 2012 10:34 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 10:00 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 09:49 Risen wrote:
Any particular reason you're trying to push something on people with a low post count in thread so early? Didn't even know lurking was possible at this point. So you're either an extremely eager townie or scum looking for easy targets to push early. Thank you captain obvious. Instead of posting tautologies, do you have an opinion on said subject? (i.e do you think I'm extremely eager townie or do you think I'm scum looking for easy targets to push?) In hindsight this came out more aggressive than I meant it :/ It's cool. It's nothing compared to what I handled from igrok my last game. Anywho, I was just pointing out I found it odd you would try and push people onto "lurkers" so early on. I don't think anything about you. There's nothing to go on right now. I don't think that post was in your favor, though. He wasn't pushing lurkers he was pushing people that posted that sounded excited to participate and post and then didn't.
Exactly...
....ehmm...you were one of those guys >_>
Well....okay I don't know what else to say? I found you guys suspicious because of that, so unless someone thinks Vivax+solstice+sciberbia+talis+keirtaht could be scum one of you HAS to be scum basically (even based on numbers alone)
Does anybody think one of those guys above I mentioned could be scum? (I'd post why I think they are town but only if there are suspicions on them).
Well...maybe I'm going too fast though :/
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Getting killed on N1 every game does that to you. I just want to find the whole scumteam on D1 and lynch them all >_>
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On July 12 2012 15:38 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 15:14 DropBear wrote:On July 12 2012 15:06 Keirathi wrote:
I don't think anyone is saying roleblocker should never, under any circumstances, use their power.
But it needs to be used with extreme caution because you probably have a higher chance (or at the very least, equal) of blocking a town blue than blocking a KP if you just pick randomly.
There are certainly situations where it can be a useful power, of course, but its much safer just to not use it until you have good, solid reads. People have in fact said that it shouldn't be used period. Gonzawtalismania Then I completely disagree with them. I'm still not positive they mean that there is a never a situation where RB can be useful, but if they think that then I encourage them to think harder.
Obviously there are exceptions. If there are 2 "very obvious scum" or something (and only 2 scum remain) then he can try to RB those.
But him trying to RB at random on N1 or even on N2 seems too risky to me, specially if that guys doesn't have very good reads (and isn't lucky).
@Dropbear: I don't like your attitude.
You just busted into the thread, basically discredited everything everybody said, and discredited every accusation anybody else has done, and that's it. All the while acting like you own the place or something (without actually taking charge).
However you are not progressing at all, you are just complaining.
Actually lets get the ball rolling (this thread is VERY silent so far, hopefully this changes that):
##Vote: Dropbear
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On July 12 2012 22:52 Mattchew wrote:
lets just call him confirmed town over and over again and maybe scum will do our read for us.. and if not we lynch him day 3
oh shit they can read this too cant they
I like this idea :3
talismania:
Actually follows the plan - as I said seems rather townie. Especially the timing.
...wait...
..I wasn't following your plan >_>
I didn't know you wanted people to post 3 reads and shit later, I thought it was your usual "Post a case by the 24 hour mark" plan so I ignored it
On July 12 2012 23:35 strongandbig wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 22:39 Mattchew wrote:
Strong I feel like the entirety of your posts could easily be made by either town or scum, if this is you trying to establish your alignment you have done a poor job with me. Your post is longwinded and looks to explain your thought process, but we both know that 95% of your posts content has nothing to do with this game at all. Not only that but your early attempt at a read on marv does not even account for his other posts in the thread. And your reasoning for voting him from this game is too, extremely weak.
Sorry bro, but that's kind of the nature of the game I guess - any post could be made either by scum or by town? Do you have any suggestions as to how to be more townie? Meanwhile, I feel like there's something to be read in Gonzaw's post about Derpbear - I'm just not sure what. Dropbera accuses Gonzaw of tryharding overmuch, when he's just Gonzawing - then Gonzaw attacks him in a way that I'm pretty sure either exaggerates or straight up mischaracterizes dropper's tiny filter. hmmmmmmmmmmm...... I'll think some more about this later tonight. Gonzaw, have you and DropBurp ever played together before?
The thing is his behaviour struck me as odd, and I wanted to "get the ball rolling" to see what happened..
Apparently nobody even commented on it, which was what I was expecting to.
I was not confident in Dropbear being scum, but I got a feeling he could.
Him later just discrediting my FoS, and general aggressiveness doesn't make me very comfortable FoSing him, since it's always more likely townies that do such thing; although I'm still wary of him buddying up to marv there and jumping on the Vivax bandwagon.
*sigh* However that's not decisive evidence, yet he's still one of my candidates for scum.
I'll reread some stuff and respond to other stuff later (just want to have the unvote right now so I don't have a vote and another one later, and so this post isn't huge)
##Unvote: DropBear
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About Vivax: (Fuck I need to use these tags again >_>)
Marv, I don't agree with your read on Vivax either
On July 12 2012 07:07 Vivax wrote:
We should lynch Mattchew cause his avatar is a zerg.
Keirathi is the serial killer.I know it.
On July 12 2012 07:21 Vivax wrote:
We don't have much movement yet, so I have used my psychic powers to determine the first scum player:
sciberbia
Let's hear his defense.
I don't see a "relatively noob" scum posting like this as soon as the game starts.
He "jokingly" accused 3 people by that point, and seemed cheerful about it. That's not how noob scum play (why would they try to "joke" accuse people if it puts them more in the spotlight as SOON as the game starts?), hell they even rarely post at the very beginning of the game at all, and they never appear cheerful or anything. Why? Because they are scum that's why, they have to check their scum QT, check their buddies, talk to them, think how they are going to proceed, etc.
Someone more experienced could pull this off, but I even doubt that.
That's what made me think Radfield wasn't scum on iGrok's game and I was right, basically no scum jumps right into the action at the very start of the game and start joking around and posting without hesitating at all.
On July 12 2012 17:21 Vivax wrote:
##unvote strongandbig
##Vote Miltonkram
Well you said you were watching something on tv yesterday and would start calling out scum soon, so I thought you were monitoring the game.
Anyway, that was a pretty informative post about marv, you have my seal of approval for unlurking.
Now I wanna see something from Milton :p.
I also don't see him posting like this as scum. His vote+unvote on S&B wouldn't make much sense to do it as scum.
Why would he do that as scum? Why would he vote someone when almost nobody else had voted at all, and then unvote him immediately after when that guy posts and never speak of him again? It doesn't seem to cause any confusion or push any scum agenda, since if he wanted to cast doubt on S&B he could have continued to do so after his post.
That's not entirely definitive to think he's town, but for me it's VERY definitive for not lynching him on D1.
About marv:
At first I found your behaviour odd as well. Because you seemed very aggressive, and very eager to stir shit, like this:
On July 12 2012 09:47 marvellosity wrote:
naw, I'm not killing anyone based on one post right at the beginning of the game (especially as pregame was quite active/friendly, it spilled over)
I'd rather lynch talis for his never-ending bullshit on listing names and reasons.
Seriously, 24 hours into day 1 and we're supposed to come up with reasons on 3 different people for why they might be scum? It's just nonsense.
Or... wait for it... I have an idea! If someone says something a person finds scummy, they can call them out and bring it to the thread! Wow, marv, you say - an amazing plan!
People shouldn't be 'forced' to make effort, the making of the effort willingly is what helps gives us our reads on people.
On July 12 2012 19:22 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 16:51 strongandbig wrote:Hey bros For people who weren't in ssb or mtg mafias, just wanted to let you guys know I am currently in Europe, where I don't have a cell phone data plan. This means I can only post when I have wifi, which is a change from my normal method. I've also been busy at work so please don't expect much from me before 8pm CET.
Now for serious stuff: I'm going to be watching marv like a motherfuking hawk. I think hosts tend to try to "balance" games sometimes by tweaking their scum team selection; however, that can and has led to extra info from town through balance speculation. Marvellosity makes an extremely tempting player for hosts to do this kind of balancing, because his scum play is empirically very good, but he isn't a "veteran" so he's not likely to be the subject of balance speculation. I also suspect bugs of doing this kind of balancing. + Show Spoiler [reasons, from wheel of fortune.] +The last of his c++ games I played in was wheel of fortune. That was a stacked game and I was one of the worst players in it, although I did eventually manage to figure out the scum team (and got shot for having correct reads before I could push some of them). With the benefit of hindsight, that scum team looks almost perfectly balanced for the player base. Radfield was town, ace was scum. VE and Forumite were both good players, but only on the edge of being full-on vets. I firmly believe that town would have won that game if Radfield hadn't decided to use a DT check on Ace, who was godfather. That kind of closeness is the sign of a well-balanced game; and the odds that both town and scum would have their best player as their best power role are very small from pure chance. So what does this mean? I am NOT proposing to policy lynch marvellosity; if he's town he can be a great asset, and besides that's totally against the spirit of the game. What I AM saying is that I think when someone points out something scummy he does, we should take it pretty seriously. Pure chance wouldn't explain why he has rolled scum in something like half his games since our first game together (noob 6) while I have rolled it once - him being good and me not does explain that.
NOW: having told you why you should pay attention, I'm going to point out something scummy marv has done. That thing is: propose/say he would be okay with lynching Talismania. Talismania's plan IS anti town. When Ace is host and he tells an obs QT how good a plan is for scum, you better believe he knows what he's talking about. Systematic case proposing plans give scum an excuse to make shitty reads and blend in, because everyone is making shitty cases and dumb reads. That kind of plan dilutes good information and adds bad information. HOWEVER: Talismania proposes this plan as town. All the time. Like, every game. Usually "pushing scummy plans" is a decent scum tell; but this specific player pushing this specific plan is not. And Marvellosity should know this. Marv has obs'd at least two games where Talismania proposed this plan or a variation of it (ssb, bangbang). Tali has proposed this in other games. Marv is the kind of player who pays attention; he should also know that I've pushed tali hard for these plans in the past, as have others. Marv putting tali forward as his first lynch candidates comes down to an easy push on an easy target for reasons he should know are bad. Marv, I'm watching you.+ Show Spoiler [on Talismania, briefly] + I'm not saying tali is an easy target in general, like kenpachi or grush would be. He's not that kind of shitty player slash bad case magnet. It's just that for marv to propose him for lynch based on that plan is scummy. ##Vote: strongandbigDamn this game is easy. First section is fluff. Second section is a completely insidious attempt to create additional suspicion on to me under the guise of "balance". He spends time saying people should scrutinise me especially for mythical 'balance' reasons... that for some reason are working exactly like he says and no other way. As to "I should know this" about talismania. I didn't really obs SSB so much (I think there is even a comment in the post-game where someone said Risen had no credibility but i did not know because I hadn't followed that closely). But in bang bang talis was SCUM and proposed similar. And I still find the plan scummy whether he proposes it as town or scum. One last point on his shitty balance bullshit - " Pure chance wouldn't explain why he has rolled scum in something like half his games since our first game together (noob 6) while I have rolled it once - him being good and me not does explain that." I have rolled scum TWICE. I have said in at least one other thread recently (maybe MTG?), directly in response to him I think, that I have only rolled scum TWICE. This is not half the time. This whole post is the worst thing I've ever seen. ##Vote: strongandbigI'm doing it twice because I feel so strongly about it.
You were just accusing people as soon as possible, and it seemed to me you were just trying to create chaos and having people fling shit towards you.
That kind of behaviour is not really what I remember when you play town (at least in these past few games I've Obs'ed), were you are more calm and composed.
..hmm, however your later unvote of S&B, and your later seemingly genuine interaction with people and lack of fear in your posts made me change my mind.
I like you being more active in discussion later, and I don't think I'd see you do that as scum
However you are all over the place man, like with these posts:
On July 13 2012 00:57 marvellosity wrote:
Having a quick flick through a few filters, Keirathi comes across as sounding incredibly neutral.
I agree with this....but it just seems like you post whatever you want and then ignore it.
Keep it cool man, don't do weird shit like that because it scares me
About Matt:
No Vivax, I don't agree with your FoS either. Matt seems very apparent town to me right now.
On July 12 2012 10:44 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 10:38 Risen wrote:On July 12 2012 10:34 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 10:00 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 09:49 Risen wrote:
Any particular reason you're trying to push something on people with a low post count in thread so early? Didn't even know lurking was possible at this point. So you're either an extremely eager townie or scum looking for easy targets to push early. Thank you captain obvious. Instead of posting tautologies, do you have an opinion on said subject? (i.e do you think I'm extremely eager townie or do you think I'm scum looking for easy targets to push?) In hindsight this came out more aggressive than I meant it :/ It's cool. It's nothing compared to what I handled from igrok my last game. Anywho, I was just pointing out I found it odd you would try and push people onto "lurkers" so early on. I don't think anything about you. There's nothing to go on right now. I don't think that post was in your favor, though. He wasn't pushing lurkers he was pushing people that posted that sounded excited to participate and post and then didn't.
Here he acts very non-chalant to me calling him out, and he agrees with my criteria for accusing him. Yet he doesn't seem to care or be bothered by it.
If he was scum I think he'd either:
-ignore it
-say that my accusations are shit
-say that my accusations are right but trying to defend himself so I don't accuse him and accuse S&B+Risen instead
Him acting like this give me town vibes.
He also made very concise and helpful posts like these:
On July 12 2012 10:46 Mattchew wrote:
Also, talis has the worst plan ever with his 3 people thing. That just allows people to half ass push some stupid reads and then connections theories run wild and everything turns to shit
On July 12 2012 22:39 Mattchew wrote:
Strong I feel like the entirety of your posts could easily be made by either town or scum, if this is you trying to establish your alignment you have done a poor job with me. Your post is longwinded and looks to explain your thought process, but we both know that 95% of your posts content has nothing to do with this game at all. Not only that but your early attempt at a read on marv does not even account for his other posts in the thread. And your reasoning for voting him from this game is too, extremely weak.
On July 12 2012 22:43 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 22:41 marvellosity wrote:
Matt, while you're here - what do you make of gonzaw? He seems to be making stuff out of nothing, but it could just be provoking conversation.
I guess normally at the start of day 1 he has setup shit to ramble on about, which he does not here. he is trying really really hard, and once again he is explaining his entire thought process. I dont think i have ever seen him as scum, but this is the exactly how he plays as town
And I agree with his approach to the Vivax wagon (check my Vivax read above).
If he was scum I don't see why he wouldn't either:
-Fuel the Vivax wagon
-Ignore it
...hoping that its wagon increases to create a D1 misslynch
All his actions make me think he's town, and so do his style of posting (absolutely NOTHING AT ALL like either MTG or LIII).
So yeah, no Vivax or Mattchew misslynch today please
I'll get to my "scum" reads (or dudes I find suspicious) in the next post (most of them are based on process of elimination basically, but their posting and shit make me more comfortable as well)
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On July 13 2012 05:00 marvellosity wrote:
hmmm. scib looks ok to me at the moment.
This.
I have 2 other walls of text coming, so prepare
(hmm, I don't know if that will be one of those "gonzaw walls of text that harm town more than they help him", so I don't know if posting all my thoughts about the "scummy" people would be good...but hey at least I'm not having 10 pages of filter by now)
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Disclamer: This is the "list" of scummy guys I'm not that comfortable lynching and I'd like people's opinions on them (I think it's likely there is at least 1 scum in here...hell maybe all are scum >_>)
About DropBear:
I already posted what I think of him:
+ Show Spoiler [Thoughts on DropBear] +On July 13 2012 04:27 gonzaw wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 23:35 strongandbig wrote:On July 12 2012 22:39 Mattchew wrote:
Strong I feel like the entirety of your posts could easily be made by either town or scum, if this is you trying to establish your alignment you have done a poor job with me. Your post is longwinded and looks to explain your thought process, but we both know that 95% of your posts content has nothing to do with this game at all. Not only that but your early attempt at a read on marv does not even account for his other posts in the thread. And your reasoning for voting him from this game is too, extremely weak.
Sorry bro, but that's kind of the nature of the game I guess - any post could be made either by scum or by town? Do you have any suggestions as to how to be more townie? Meanwhile, I feel like there's something to be read in Gonzaw's post about Derpbear - I'm just not sure what. Dropbera accuses Gonzaw of tryharding overmuch, when he's just Gonzawing - then Gonzaw attacks him in a way that I'm pretty sure either exaggerates or straight up mischaracterizes dropper's tiny filter. hmmmmmmmmmmm...... I'll think some more about this later tonight. Gonzaw, have you and DropBurp ever played together before? The thing is his behaviour struck me as odd, and I wanted to "get the ball rolling" to see what happened.. Apparently nobody even commented on it, which was what I was expecting to. I was not confident in Dropbear being scum, but I got a feeling he could. Him later just discrediting my FoS, and general aggressiveness doesn't make me very comfortable FoSing him, since it's always more likely townies that do such thing; although I'm still wary of him buddying up to marv there and jumping on the Vivax bandwagon. *sigh* However that's not decisive evidence, yet he's still one of my candidates for scum. I'll reread some stuff and respond to other stuff later (just want to have the unvote right now so I don't have a vote and another one later, and so this post isn't huge) ##Unvote: DropBear
About Risen:
On July 12 2012 09:49 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 09:36 gonzaw wrote:So, if the lynch was right now I'd want to kill one of these 3 guys: On July 12 2012 07:56 Risen wrote:
Welcome to ICBINTMM in which Risen does not post in caps or call anyone an idiot THE ENTIRE GAME. Stay tuned to see if this actually happens...... On July 12 2012 07:33 strongandbig wrote:
sup bros
i am currently watching Le Closer in french in my hotel room.
Scum y'all best get ready to get motherfucking interrogated On July 12 2012 06:33 Mattchew wrote:
alight lets do this.
no zentor means no policy lynch based on names for me. You can see the recurring theme in all 3 (just 1 post, promising something/appearing they are eager to start but not doing anything else later). marv, talismania, anybody active, what do you think about these guys? If you had to kill one of them which one would you choose and why? (if you don't want to kill anyone then say so). Also this guy could die too: On July 12 2012 08:05 austinmcc wrote:
Screw the number and size of posts. I'm not a scientist, but it looks like talismania's been town --> scum --> town --> scum --> town. Therefore, he's scum this game.
I know that millers are supposed to claim D1, but I don't see why we'd want claims on other roles right now. Except from marv, who needs to let us know whether he's a vigi or scum this game, since those are the only roles that he rolls. But at least he put a little bit more effort (although that's not town-telling) Dropbear and Milton haven't even posted, but well we can't do anything about it. Any particular reason you're trying to push something on people with a low post count in thread so early? Didn't even know lurking was possible at this point. So you're either an extremely eager townie or scum looking for easy targets to push early.
I already posted why this was weird. He came out of nowhere just to defend himself against me, but doesn't say anything at all about it, just posted a very apparent tautology without saying anything.
Another thing I found weird was:
On July 12 2012 16:38 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 16:29 Vivax wrote:
There's no link to a voting thread in the OP methinks.Add pls?
##Vote active lurk strongandbig Yes, this is going places. I like your thinking. I just like your style, my dude. You have my vote! ##vote: Vivax
On July 13 2012 02:55 Risen wrote:
I've had experience with Mattchew being scum, as we were both godfathers who flipped vigis in some other game I can't remember the name of. I think he's WAY, WAY, WAY more active and useful this game ALREADY than he was that game.
He voted Vivax (I assume) because he didn't state why he voted S&B all of a sudden.
However, in that 2nd post of his, Vivax already had 2 votes (marv+Dropbear) and Vivax already explained why he voted/unvoted S&B.....yet he doesn't comment anything about it.
If he's town, he knows his vote is the most important thing he has (unless he's Awesome Vigilante with Homing Heat-seeking missiles that 100% target scum), so one would think he'd pay attention to things regarding the guy he's voting.
Him softly-accusing Dropbear without actually taking a stance in the subject here:
On July 12 2012 15:22 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 15:18 DropBear wrote:This is silly. On July 12 2012 08:50 talismania wrote:
pardon me for some half-assed musing:
since we've got majority lynch to deal with, what about some sort of nomination system? I don't like how majority allows townies and scum alike to save their opinions on people, especially day one and just hop on whatever bandwagon is happening near the end of the day. It would be nice if, say, 24 hours in everyone puts up a list of three players they want to see in consideration for the lynch and reasons why. Then all that gets tallied up or something and we decide between the popular choices. Actually you wouldn't even need to tally or enforce that. Just having everyone put up three names with reasons should be good enough to move discussion towards a consensus lynch candidate or two (hush s&b yes I am and always will try to get people to post their impressions of others). This isn't going to happen and would just waste time.
On the majority lynch, day 1 this tends to be a right kerfuffle. I can't think of any system that has ever worked on day 1 in games I have been part of. So fuck a system, we deal with it when the time comes. There should be solid candidates by then anyway. For example: this could be DropBear bussing/giving his teammate a way to backtrack on his plan or it could be scum calling out a townie. I'm not saying I even have a scumread on drop as he seems to want a pro-town environment, which is something I'm all for, but this is something that could be used to confirm a connection in my mind at a later point in time.
And his seemingly apologetic post here (that again is just an excuse for him not to do anything)
On July 12 2012 15:18 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 15:14 sciberbia wrote:
@keirathi, @Dropbear, @Risen
Do you guys have any suspicions yet? Maybe you could comment on my post about risen/marv or about gonzaw's accusations of risen/strongandbig/Mattchew? This thread is too quiet for my liking -- please share some of your thoughts. I think it's too early for anything. I don't really like to make reads without any connections (this might be a bad thing to do). I just think it's easier for me to make cases when I consider people as members of a team, not as individual scum members.
Make me suspicious of him
However, his "kind" attitude and way he's posting make me wary. Like, the way he posts is very weird and would certainly call people's attention....but isn't it too obvious perhaps? Like, it seems he doesn't really care how people see him, which doesn't make me that confident in thinking he's scum.
But meh, I'd appreciate people's thoughts on him
About Milkton:
On July 12 2012 17:39 Miltonkram wrote:Hey everybody I'm finally able to get in the thread. I'll make this my quick introductory post and then get to scumhunting. I find that policy talk naturally transitions into a scumhunt over the course of D1. I think we all know the major points of policy that get talked about, and I tend to take each policy on a case by case basis anyway, so I won't waste much time on policy talk other than to say that talismania's proposal is pretty obviously a bad idea. First things first, here is a list of games I've played in as well as links to my filters from those games. I think I'll be starting all my games with a list like this because it helps me improve. If I'm scum, I have to avoid playing closely to my scum meta. If I'm town, I put pressure on myself to make good reads. The list is spoilered so as not to take up too much space. + Show Spoiler +
This post seems fluffy as fuck, specially the 1st part.
The "list of game I've played" is filler as well, it doesn't add anything else to the game
Even after posting that he doesn't do anything later (is he still "busy" or something?)
However it's his first fucking post so it's not like we can get a meaningful read out of it
Well fuck, another wall of text
So....I'll try to keep things a little bit separate and post my actual "scum reads" in the next post (it's just S&B+austin+Keirathi anyways....yeah SPOILERS whatever).
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EPT
