EPTTL Mafia XL - Page 20
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
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omgCRAZY
Canada551 Posts
What I find interesting is... On June 06 2011 03:44 gtrsrs wrote: - dude who keeps posting haikus, please stop, that's thread derailment and very scummy. i can't even read your posts. i do not think there are any posting restrictions so only post what you HAVE to - that being said, i'm going to vote for you because i don't want to jump on the freeloader bandwagon (nor do i want to try and counterbandwagon onto aprudds for calling him out) Why did you need to vote so hastily? You say you don't want to jump on the bandwagon or counterbandwagon but you accuse iGrok of being scum and then vote to lynch him without much evidence. You essentially did the same thing aprudds did which is not pro-town at all. On June 06 2011 15:31 gtrsrs wrote: for the record, fishing for blues is scummy you're still my prime FoS, iGrok, no matter how long your post is This post seems like you have a personal vendetta against iGrok and want people to disregard his entire analysis. Again not very pro-town. NOTE: I do not believe he was fishing for blues with his initial analysis of how the powers were distributed, I found it very helpful and interesting and I am sure all of the other players will as well. iGrok actually responded to this and I believe his statement says it very well. | ||
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AnxiousHippo
Australia1451 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On June 05 2011 13:47 Treadmill wrote: It is a good spot, aprudds. We should keep an eye on freeloader625. Jimbooo, we do have to lynch somebody. Being "hasty" isn't really a concern. And somebody with next to no evidence against them is a better lynch than everyone else with no evidence against them at all. Still, 48 hours yet. On June 05 2011 15:15 Treadmill wrote: As I said earlier, "we should keep an eye on Freeloader". But that's it. There will certainly be much more conversation before the end of the first day. A few thoughts: There are 8 mafia but do we know how much killing power they have? If 6 normally get 3 kills/night would it be sensible to extrapolate that 8 get 4? On June 05 2011 15:40 Treadmill wrote: Either this should be linked in the first few posts or people should start saying what their acronyms mean when they first use them. They only make things faster if they're understood. And yeah - freeloader's first post was only mildly suspicious (although it was mildly suspicious) but his subsequent ones were rather more so. Also, he's probably still online and they're currently the best we have to go on. So I'm gonna vote but change in the next 24 hours or so if someone more suspicious comes up. I suspect that most of the mafia are gonna be trying to lay low, post only "check-in" posts and whatnot. So keep your eyes peeled for that sort of thing - although, early on, that kinda posting might just mean its midnight and people want to go to bed (so gtsrs and 35spike1 are off the hook for now). Treadmill is rather relaxed about voting at first, but within 2 hours he's all ready to go and vote against FreeLoader. After seeing several people agree, he eagerly jumps on the bandwagon. + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2011 14:56 Treadmill wrote: I was about to EBWOP that I think that grush57 was our best lynch. But then freeloader625 posted again. I waited a bit to see if he had any more to say. He didn't, and I'm even more convinced that we should lynch him. First off, its a big long post showing he's been paying attention to the thread. But he doesn't address anything except the arguments against him. That, in my mind, is the biggest strike against him - if he was town, he'd be concerned with more than just his own survival, he'd want to find out who the mafia are. If he was a good town player he'd talk about some of the other accusations, some of the other discussions - especially since he's indicated that he's been following the thread. And also because, if you look at the last few pages, he hasn't been suspect number one for a while. Second, freeloader625 sounds like he's trying really hard to sound unconcerned about the allegations against him. That doesn't jive with writing a big post that has no purpose other than defending himself. He's trying to defend himself without sounding like he's defending himself (mostly by jumping on DeMorcerf's and CjrNinja's explanations without really providing his own) - a scummy play for sure. I take it as meaning: freeloader625, you are scum. So I'm gonna put that vote I just took off of you back on. Treadmill's jumping at whatever reason he can to revote against Freeloader. With 7 votes up against him, I'm not surprised his main concern was getting lynched day1. | ||
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omgCRAZY
Canada551 Posts
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Drazerk
United Kingdom31255 Posts
Ill follow this up later just wanted to post my thoughts at the moment | ||
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omgCRAZY
Canada551 Posts
On June 06 2011 17:38 35spike1 wrote: I had a quick read-through of the early posts and Treadmill grabbed my attention. + Show Spoiler + On June 05 2011 13:47 Treadmill wrote: It is a good spot, aprudds. We should keep an eye on freeloader625. Jimbooo, we do have to lynch somebody. Being "hasty" isn't really a concern. And somebody with next to no evidence against them is a better lynch than everyone else with no evidence against them at all. Still, 48 hours yet. On June 05 2011 15:15 Treadmill wrote: As I said earlier, "we should keep an eye on Freeloader". But that's it. There will certainly be much more conversation before the end of the first day. A few thoughts: There are 8 mafia but do we know how much killing power they have? If 6 normally get 3 kills/night would it be sensible to extrapolate that 8 get 4? On June 05 2011 15:40 Treadmill wrote: Either this should be linked in the first few posts or people should start saying what their acronyms mean when they first use them. They only make things faster if they're understood. And yeah - freeloader's first post was only mildly suspicious (although it was mildly suspicious) but his subsequent ones were rather more so. Also, he's probably still online and they're currently the best we have to go on. So I'm gonna vote but change in the next 24 hours or so if someone more suspicious comes up. I suspect that most of the mafia are gonna be trying to lay low, post only "check-in" posts and whatnot. So keep your eyes peeled for that sort of thing - although, early on, that kinda posting might just mean its midnight and people want to go to bed (so gtsrs and 35spike1 are off the hook for now). Treadmill is rather relaxed about voting at first, but within 2 hours he's all ready to go and vote against FreeLoader. After seeing several people agree, he eagerly jumps on the bandwagon. + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2011 14:56 Treadmill wrote: I was about to EBWOP that I think that grush57 was our best lynch. But then freeloader625 posted again. I waited a bit to see if he had any more to say. He didn't, and I'm even more convinced that we should lynch him. First off, its a big long post showing he's been paying attention to the thread. But he doesn't address anything except the arguments against him. That, in my mind, is the biggest strike against him - if he was town, he'd be concerned with more than just his own survival, he'd want to find out who the mafia are. If he was a good town player he'd talk about some of the other accusations, some of the other discussions - especially since he's indicated that he's been following the thread. And also because, if you look at the last few pages, he hasn't been suspect number one for a while. Second, freeloader625 sounds like he's trying really hard to sound unconcerned about the allegations against him. That doesn't jive with writing a big post that has no purpose other than defending himself. He's trying to defend himself without sounding like he's defending himself (mostly by jumping on DeMorcerf's and CjrNinja's explanations without really providing his own) - a scummy play for sure. I take it as meaning: freeloader625, you are scum. So I'm gonna put that vote I just took off of you back on. Treadmill's jumping at whatever reason he can to revote against Freeloader. With 7 votes up against him, I'm not surprised his main concern was getting lynched day1. Ya I am not liking how Treadmill is trying to keep everyones attention on freeloader625 when we had started to move away from that and get some real discussion going. | ||
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
but everyone is bandwagoning on him we need to get some votes on other people. it's a psychological thing. if you see that everyone has voted for freeloader you're going to vote for him too so you don't look fishy. if there are some votes spread around you're more likely to vote for someone you think is actually mafia i initially FoS'd iGrok because of the haiku thing and his horribly pretentious posts. i felt like they were derailing the thread and i didn't have a good read on anyone else after he tried to incriminate kurumi who is being extremely pro-town, i double my suspicions that iGrok is the mafia we want. he's trying to use pretty formatting to make it look like his wild guess is better than anyone else's wild guess - he's intentionally trying to mislead the town. i got a lucky guess and FoS'd the right guy, it's quite clear. don't believe me? help me pressure him and watch him crack fishing for blues is scummy, he's setting a bad example. i don't see how public knowledge of how many blues there (could be) are could ever help the town. he's doing the mafia's job for them, right in front of our eyes. i don't have a personal vendetta by any means. in fact, you'll notice it's he who is trying to minimize me in the eyes of the other townies by pointing out that i'm not "experienced" on TL mafia, and blatantly calling my posts bad. | ||
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CjrNinja
Australia223 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On June 05 2011 13:57 35spike1 wrote: Good luck have fun! Cherubael's right, I'm not liking freeloader625 at the moment... + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2011 16:41 35spike1 wrote: FreeLoader had barely done anything, yet they were both happy to destroy him. Freeloader will probably now die if you look at the Voting Thread. If he turns up town, I'd be very suspicious of those two. Can you please explain to me what it was that made you change your mind in the time between you making those two posts? | ||
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Treadmill
Canada2833 Posts
I'd tend to agree with the points that omgCrazy made with regards to gtsrs - iGrok. Laying out how many possible blues there are isn't fishing for blues by any stretch of the imagination. gtsrs looks a little scummy - though he could just be dumb. They could both be town, or it could be iGrok town and gtsrs mafia, I don't see it the other way around. The one little worry I have is that BOTH might be mafia and pulling a total mental mindfuck on us. Lastly: + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2011 17:45 gtrsrs wrote: freeloader is obvious town but everyone is bandwagoning on him we need to get some votes on other people. it's a psychological thing. if you see that everyone has voted for freeloader you're going to vote for him too so you don't look fishy. if there are some votes spread around you're more likely to vote for someone you think is actually mafia i initially FoS'd iGrok because of the haiku thing and his horribly pretentious posts. i felt like they were derailing the thread and i didn't have a good read on anyone else after he tried to incriminate kurumi who is being extremely pro-town, i double my suspicions that iGrok is the mafia we want. he's trying to use pretty formatting to make it look like his wild guess is better than anyone else's wild guess - he's intentionally trying to mislead the town. i got a lucky guess and FoS'd the right guy, it's quite clear. don't believe me? help me pressure him and watch him crack fishing for blues is scummy, he's setting a bad example. i don't see how public knowledge of how many blues there (could be) are could ever help the town. he's doing the mafia's job for them, right in front of our eyes. i don't have a personal vendetta by any means. in fact, you'll notice it's he who is trying to minimize me in the eyes of the other townies by pointing out that i'm not "experienced" on TL mafia, and blatantly calling my posts bad. A. Why is freeloader obviously town? You throw that out there without any back-up. I admit (and have admitted) that myself and a few others were very hasty and did bandwagon him early on - because of inexperience. But there's been nothing since to exonerate him. B. Your argument against iGrok is "vote for him and he'll drop scumtells". Which is stupid - he's an experienced player, that's not gonna happen. C. You haven't actually addressed any of his arguments about Kurumi, you've just said "he's a good guy, trust me I know, and since iGrok fingered him iGrok must be scum!" | ||
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Pyo
United States738 Posts
The players that I find annoying are by far Haiku boy and Kurumi. So if ever I'm undecided about who to vote for it'll probably be one of them. I think it is interesting to note all the little 1v1 bickering going on, the most recent example of which is between iGrok and gtrsrs. I think it is reasonable to assume that two mafia wouldn't orchestrate a mini feud this early on, which means that either both are town or only one is town. So combining my last 2 paragraphs, I think I'm gonna have to change my vote to iGrok. | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
On June 06 2011 18:06 Pyo wrote: After reading the posts up to now, I am reasonably confident that freeloader is probably a townie and the ambiguity of early accusers and their motivations means that there's not much to be learned from lynching him, although it might be inevitable at this point. Since his post in his defense haven't really been all that constructive anyway it isn't really a big loss, so I'm not gonna fight it. The players that I find annoying are by far Haiku boy and Kurumi. So if ever I'm undecided about who to vote for it'll probably be one of them. I think it is interesting to note all the little 1v1 bickering going on, the most recent example of which is between iGrok and gtrsrs. I think it is reasonable to assume that two mafia wouldn't orchestrate a mini feud this early on, which means that either both are town or only one is town. So combining my last 2 paragraphs, I think I'm gonna have to change my vote to iGrok. Please note that its a triangle, not 1v1. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/8e2nZ.png) (The black line is I'm not accusing him of being scum). Sorry for the bad drawing ^^ + Show Spoiler + And don't call me Haiku boy again. Just curious, why do you find me annoying? Aside from the haikus, which I stopped when I realized some people don't appreciate having a little fun. | ||
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AnxiousHippo
Australia1451 Posts
On June 06 2011 17:49 CjrNinja wrote: 35spike1 + Show Spoiler + On June 05 2011 13:57 35spike1 wrote: Good luck have fun! Cherubael's right, I'm not liking freeloader625 at the moment... + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2011 16:41 35spike1 wrote: FreeLoader had barely done anything, yet they were both happy to destroy him. Freeloader will probably now die if you look at the Voting Thread. If he turns up town, I'd be very suspicious of those two. Can you please explain to me what it was that made you change your mind in the time between you making those two posts? I was really excited at the start of the game so I kinda jumped in lol, later I realized something like what Freeloader did would just be too obvious to be Mafia. | ||
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AnxiousHippo
Australia1451 Posts
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Pyo
United States738 Posts
On June 06 2011 18:30 iGrok wrote: And don't call me Haiku boy again. Just curious, why do you find me annoying? Aside from the haikus, which I stopped when I realized some people don't appreciate having a little fun. Well haiku girl, In no particular order: 1. Your haikus 2. Your heroic let me break down the game for you all post, which is clearly an attempt to make it seem like you know what you're doing, yet you still did #1, revealing that you're just a self-important douche (note that gtrsrs interprets this as you being scum) 3. Your passive-aggressiveness ("don't call me Haiku boy again") 4. Your not-so-passive aggressiveness (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=10#187) 5. You like to think that you are a pro chastising others for not reading the thread (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=12#232), but haven't even read the rules yourself (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=10#196) 6. Red hurts my eyes (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=18#342) 7. "For science" - Athene is a douche, and so are you for quoting him (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=19#365) 8. Your triangle picture. 9. And then there's your whole exchange with gtrsrs, which needs no real explanation I suppose that there might be a little overlap in that list. I don't really know whether you're scum or not, but as I said in a previous post I'm picking one of a random bickering between two players (you and gtrsrs) and he's a lot less grating and - for now at least - appears more emotionally stable (less likely to give a tell after prodding). I'll leave it everyone else to judge your response to a more pressure/attention on you. | ||
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omgCRAZY
Canada551 Posts
A few more frequent updates on votes with a countdown to how much longer we have would be greatly appreciated if mods have the time. Though I am sure after day/night 1 I will get used to the times. I won't be able to get my vote in before am if that is the case so I am voting for gtrsrs at the moment. For the reasons stated above. here | ||
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heist
United States720 Posts
On June 06 2011 18:06 Pyo wrote: After reading the posts up to now, I am reasonably confident that freeloader is probably a townie and the ambiguity of early accusers and their motivations means that there's not much to be learned from lynching him, although it might be inevitable at this point. Since his post in his defense haven't really been all that constructive anyway it isn't really a big loss, so I'm not gonna fight it. The players that I find annoying are by far Haiku boy and Kurumi. So if ever I'm undecided about who to vote for it'll probably be one of them. I think it is interesting to note all the little 1v1 bickering going on, the most recent example of which is between iGrok and gtrsrs. I think it is reasonable to assume that two mafia wouldn't orchestrate a mini feud this early on, which means that either both are town or only one is town. So combining my last 2 paragraphs, I think I'm gonna have to change my vote to iGrok. If I am to understand correctly, the two people who you find MOST suspicious and in need of lynching are basically the talkers, the ones generating discussion, if a bit rash on Kurumi's end. Im trying to shift through the arguments against iGrok and the number one reason i can come up with is his haikus which you find personally annoying. This is probably one of the most flimsy excuses to lynch someone i have ever read. Your post does not outline any reasonable level of analysis to claim iGrok or Kurumi as scum. Basing your vote on who annoys you the most is by far one the most detrimental ways to approach your vote. Your personal decisions on who to lynch mean little to the rest of the town if you dont back it up well. You should be using your posts to try to persuade the town with logical claims and observations about these players. Bickering though unfortunate is bound to happen with wounded egos. This early I think it's a little premature to call anyone mafia if they are arguing with someone else. And while we are talking about Kurumi or iGrok, people like grush57 are remaining largely ignored. This is the extent of his posts: On June 06 2011 04:21 grush57 wrote: Yea true, I stupidly joined the bandwagon to lynch freeloader from his posts. On June 06 2011 04:12 grush57 wrote: Im not inactive, I just dont feel like anybody can accuse this early. On June 06 2011 09:10 grush57 wrote: Oh, sorry, only checked back a couple pages. Easy one-liner responses. He claims that bandwagoning Freeloader was a stupid decision but has yet to revert his vote. He claims he isn't inactive yet does not post. To me he warrants far more suspicion. | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
On June 06 2011 19:20 Pyo wrote: Well haiku girl, In no particular order: 1. Your haikus 2. Your heroic let me break down the game for you all post, which is clearly an attempt to make it seem like you know what you're doing, yet you still did #1, revealing that you're just a self-important douche (note that gtrsrs interprets this as you being scum) 3. Your passive-aggressiveness ("don't call me Haiku boy again") 4. Your not-so-passive aggressiveness (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=10#187) 5. You like to think that you are a pro chastising others for not reading the thread (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=12#232), but haven't even read the rules yourself (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=10#196) 6. Red hurts my eyes (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=18#342) 7. "For science" - Athene is a douche, and so are you for quoting him (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=227500¤tpage=19#365) 8. Your triangle picture. 9. And then there's your whole exchange with gtrsrs, which needs no real explanation I suppose that there might be a little overlap in that list. I don't really know whether you're scum or not, but as I said in a previous post I'm picking one of a random bickering between two players (you and gtrsrs) and he's a lot less grating and - for now at least - appears more emotionally stable (less likely to give a tell after prodding). I'll leave it everyone else to judge your response to a more pressure/attention on you. 1. Lol. + Show Spoiler + Excuse me for wanting to have a little fun. Get over it. 2. Which post? The huge analysis post? The first real, in-depth analysis anyone has done this game? 3. That wasn't passive aggressive. + Show Spoiler + Don't copy gtrsrs's terms if you don't know how to use them. But if you'd prefer less passive, fine. Quit nit-picking and calling names like a little bitch and start doing some serious thinking. 4. Justified. + Show Spoiler + Town could have fractured really early this game, and someone needed to lay down a hard stance to keep us together. 5. Silent Voters are very bad. And yeah, I was drunk and posted in blue not green. Problem? 6. Suck it up. + Show Spoiler + That was not a game related post. That was a FORUM related post, and needed to be made -very- clear. As multiple mods and vets backed me up on. 7. Oh no, I played Portal today. + Show Spoiler + Again, this is flavor I (and many other people in other games do too - I'm happy to provide examples) to make the game more fun. You know, since its a game. That we play for enjoyment. 8. MSPaint FTW! 9. Which part of that do you disprove of the most? And finally, use the "Links" button when posting. Copy&Pasting is annoying. | ||
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rookie44
12 Posts
So I am seeing this a more defensive position from them. If we agree that kurumi is suspicious then they are defending him. Perhaps after the analysis was shown then kunami reached out to his mafia buddies and asked them to help. (note kunami has not defended himself - which is odd for such a previously active player (real world job maybe)) Its kinda silly but if we had to vote now gtrsrs would get my vote, for a little of the reasons above and also becasue in his posts he always talks about, x misleading town, and never x is misleading us. If he is town then he is continually refering to himself in the third person, which is quite an unnatural thing to do. Pyo is funny becasue he initially voted for kurumi and then switched his vote to aprudds. That could be analysed either as a town move or a mafia move, and just considering the switched vote is tricky. | ||
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
i'll draw a mindmap of all this when i am at home. when does the night beginn? (typing this from my iphone) | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
On June 06 2011 21:31 supersoft wrote: guys this is getting really complicated with these XXL posts :D i'll draw a mindmap of all this when i am at home. when does the night beginn? (typing this from my iphone) I assume in 16.5 more hours, just basing it off the D1 post. And yeah I don't really sleep xD | ||
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