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On March 01 2013 11:21 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2013 11:18 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 01 2013 11:16 Chezinu wrote:On March 01 2013 11:14 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 01 2013 11:12 Chezinu wrote:On March 01 2013 11:10 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 01 2013 11:07 Chezinu wrote:On March 01 2013 11:06 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 01 2013 11:04 Chezinu wrote:On March 01 2013 11:00 Vivax wrote:
Do you mean you just called me scum for shits and giggles?
Chez, do you have any proper reads besides some blabbering about third party paranoia? Dude, I'm a sheriff. I can't just go on and revealing my investigations publicly... except for those that are erroneously solved. Sheriff: As the Sheriff of this fine(ish) city, you spend each and every day keeping the peace and making sure nothing gets too out of hand. You may inspect a player each night and determine if they are Innocent or Guilty.So where does bartender fit into this? PSH.. that's no sheriff! Real sheriff got... welll... I cannot say atm.. I will just say that that sounds more like a weak detective. Well if you the "sheriff" who can check bartenders.. I am happy to go all Warren G on u You should have seen me when I rolled a bank.. oh and I wasn't making money... I was literally the bank! Chez.. if you were forced to nominate 1 of the 3 players for mayoral lynch.. who would you pick Geript... Jungle Jorge...MilkSuckler ITS A TRAP!! Remain calm.... Please sir, put down the weapon! Good.. my answer is + Show Spoiler + Now I can really go Warren G on ya ass KK.. lets do it properly Jungle Jorge... Toadesstern... Milkman which 1 for instant lynch OK, you good guy! As of now, I never really liked that Toad guy. He always put the wrong guys in jail.
I was expecting you to choose the bartender.
The exam has progressed from multiple choice to short answer.
Q - 10 points
Please outline in dot points why Toad is selected over Milkman
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(10)
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Mocsta what's making you so sure that milkman is town? You're shrugging off whatever points I brought against him with little reasoning, and he was dead set on making my claim look bad.
I also don't see whatever fallacy you just mentioned about me. My points against him are clear, although I left a few out:
- He immediately attacked my claim with little reasoning.
- saved up this point cause it's strong: He didn't inquire at all whether my shot is refunded or not. That means he doesn't have an actual interest into knowing if I'm really vig or not. He had a primary interest into painting me scummy
- He sounded extremely sure about VE getting doublestacked and justified it with weak reasoning about it when asked afterwards. What is just this reasoning? Why do you argue about someone (me) being scum based on scum doublestacking someone when there could be a multitude of other options? Why doesn't he rule them out with logic if he's so sure about exactly that version happening?
- Not believing that there could not be medics. I call bullshit, he has no base whatsoever to think that.
- Saying that if there ever was a medic he would have protected VE for sure.
- Not all people posted yet, he doesn't even know if others were roleblocked besides Toad. Yet he proceeds to doubt my claim with (maybe) incomplete info.
- His early play regarding Prom is scummy, as pointed out with three important posts.
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So...nobody has had a look at MilkSuckler/Mocsta in a little while, and as much as I'd like to, people tend to ignore my shit.
Vivax, Geript, Aquanim and DrH.
Any thoughts regarding him at all before I dive in at some point in the near future?
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Q - 10 points
Please outline in dot points why Toad is selected over Milkman
--The Milkman gives me bottles. Toad gives jail.---
--The Milkman is for me to handle. He gave me---
--the bottle and not the town. Justice is for Sheriff.
(10)
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I am completely convinced Chezinu is scum, and he should be lynched today ahead of any other considerations. He's scummy as hell and we cannot suffer a scum Chezinu to live. He must die.
"But BH, aren't you just being moody? Chezinu is ALWAYS like this"
Really? Let me tell you how he's been
1) during D1 he offered no reads or thoughts of substance, just blathering
2) he ninja voted me for an initially unexplained reason, and as it has been said, it is highly likely at least one scum was voting for me
3) his reason for voting me, that I have off a "Town vibe" with no other explanation, is suspect (link) because Chezinu as town loves trolling with his votes
Now, poeple will say "But Chezinu always trolls" but this is wrong, example: Chezinu in LVIII explains (in his chezinu-like fashion) his votes. (link) when he is a townie. He trolls (link) but he also pushes a townie agenda (link) trying to prevent mislynches and he writes posts explaining reads, even if they STILL TROLL at the same time (link). Chezinu is not a worthless townie.
Contrast his play as a townie to his play this game (link). Straight-up trolling without contributing, or even his super high level massive troll/analysis paragraphs. He (?)claims sheriff at the start of D2 and he's not sharing his thoughts, even in a trolling fashion.
This is scum Chezinu. I know this in my heart, I know this from having played with him, and I know this from how he's playing this game.
Lynch him.
##vote Chezinu
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YES, even ahead of JJ! YES!
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Sure. I think he's playing the same game. What'd you think of my points on toad?
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Alright 22, Restraining order,
Overall, another really short one, but the conclusion is different though. I don't like his posting. Mostly lurkerish and minimal analysis (focused on JJ). His tone also really bugs me like:
On February 27 2013 01:09 Restraining Order wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2013 00:35 The Milkman wrote:
Why are people of low thread presence trying to defend Promethelax and swing the lynch somewhere else? This is the dumbest thing I have read all game, and let me tell you, there are plenty dumb things around.
I hate comments like that which really shouldn't be a part of team liquid. His most redeeming post is:
On February 27 2013 11:34 Restraining Order wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2013 11:12 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Prom layabout jj geript testsubject vivax Yes Maybe Yes Yes No Yes
Which is basically a scum list with no justification. In other words, it's pretty pointless/bad. And that's his most redeeming. So he's super suspicious to me.
Not quite as strong as jcarl because jcarls filter just as shitty, but as I posted earlier jcarl backtracked his reads with almost no explanation which to me is worse than lurking.
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On March 01 2013 11:24 Vivax wrote:Mocsta what's making you so sure that milkman is town? You're shrugging off whatever points I brought against him with little reasoning, and he was dead set on making my claim look bad. I also don't see whatever fallacy you just mentioned about me. My points against him are clear, although I left a few out: - He immediately attacked my claim with little reasoning.
- saved up this point cause it's strong: He didn't inquire at all whether my shot is refunded or not. That means he doesn't have an actual interest into knowing if I'm really vig or not. He had a primary interest into painting me scummy
- He sounded extremely sure about VE getting doublestacked and justified it with weak reasoning about it when asked afterwards. What is just this reasoning? Why do you argue about someone (me) being scum based on scum doublestacking someone when there could be a multitude of other options? Why doesn't he rule them out with logic if he's so sure about exactly that version happening?
- Not believing that there could not be medics. I call bullshit, he has no base whatsoever to think that.
- Saying that if there ever was a medic he would have protected VE for sure.
- Not all people posted yet, he doesn't even know if others were roleblocked besides Toad. Yet he proceeds to doubt my claim with (maybe) incomplete info.
- His early play regarding Prom is scummy, as pointed out with three important posts.
Just wanted to say, I liked the way you presented ya thoughts with this post.. was clear to read (I would prefer if you kept producing content that way)
Look, you're right, I am just saying he is town..
Let me read his filter and confirm where I stand with milkman.. THEN I will comment to whether I agree with your case or not.
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On March 01 2013 11:27 Wade Fell wrote:I am completely convinced Chezinu is scum, and he should be lynched today ahead of any other considerations. He's scummy as hell and we cannot suffer a scum Chezinu to live. He must die. "But BH, aren't you just being moody? Chezinu is ALWAYS like this" Really? Let me tell you how he's been 1) during D1 he offered no reads or thoughts of substance, just blathering 2) he ninja voted me for an initially unexplained reason, and as it has been said, it is highly likely at least one scum was voting for me 3) his reason for voting me, that I have off a "Town vibe" with no other explanation, is suspect (link) because Chezinu as town loves trolling with his votes Now, poeple will say "But Chezinu always trolls" but this is wrong, example: Chezinu in LVIII explains (in his chezinu-like fashion) his votes. (link) when he is a townie. He trolls (link) but he also pushes a townie agenda (link) trying to prevent mislynches and he writes posts explaining reads, even if they STILL TROLL at the same time (link). Chezinu is not a worthless townie. Contrast his play as a townie to his play this game (link). Straight-up trolling without contributing, or even his super high level massive troll/analysis paragraphs. He (?)claims sheriff at the start of D2 and he's not sharing his thoughts, even in a trolling fashion. This is scum Chezinu. I know this in my heart, I know this from having played with him, and I know this from how he's playing this game. Lynch him. ##vote Chezinu
Wait, your BH?? I thought you were Palmer!
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On March 01 2013 09:15 MilkSuckler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2013 09:14 jcarlsoniv wrote:On March 01 2013 09:12 The Milkman wrote:On March 01 2013 09:03 jcarlsoniv wrote:
So...either we had a doc save someone, or there is no SK. Would be lovely not to have to worry about that extra kill.
My sentiments from D1 on JJ still stand. I have to drive back to school, but I'd like to hear from him, and I'm gonna reread his filter when I get a sec. If you want to wifom here's a thought for you: Mafia doublestacked VE. That means we have one kill too much. Oh yeah, I always forget you can double stack kills. Getting in the car for realsies now Why do u feel the need to keep telling me u going to the car, or airport or whatever it has been.... Reads to me as over compensating.
On March 01 2013 10:16 randombum wrote:So I'm looking to sheep somebody to victory here, my original case against OO is weakened greatly by his new play since his posting has clearly improved since I pointed it out. Suckler asked me to look at jcarl recently and I did and posted what I thought was suspicious and I still do. Furthermore his few posts after have not helped him very much. I actually liked: + Show Spoiler +On March 01 2013 07:25 jcarlsoniv wrote:
You guys ever have Jury Duty? Here's some advice: don't, it sucks.
Been doing my best to stay updated.
I'm noticing that geript, you're harping on DrH and VE and their possible motivations for wanting (or not wanting) to be elected into their respective roles. I'd like to point out that Wade Fell was trying INCREDIBLY hard at the end of D1 to get his name into that pool for one of the spots. Generally, keeping elections so close is an anti-town thing to do as it gives scum the leverage they need to get who they want into the right spot. Why are you not also pressuring Wade Fell along with VE and DrH, as he was also apparently motivated for the positions. It starts a with a crappy reason to lurk, but then he actually gets into analysis. That's redeeming, but then. + Show Spoiler +On March 01 2013 09:14 jcarlsoniv wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2013 09:12 The Milkman wrote:On March 01 2013 09:03 jcarlsoniv wrote:
So...either we had a doc save someone, or there is no SK. Would be lovely not to have to worry about that extra kill.
My sentiments from D1 on JJ still stand. I have to drive back to school, but I'd like to hear from him, and I'm gonna reread his filter when I get a sec. If you want to wifom here's a thought for you: Mafia doublestacked VE. That means we have one kill too much. Oh yeah, I always forget you can double stack kills. Getting in the car for realsies now He ends on a reason to lurk. So for now my main lynch target is jcarl.
Not overcompensating, and I'm sorry that my RL time has been busy? I was only extending the courtesy of keeping you guys informed. I also haven't really done it more or less than any of the other players who have been busy.
On March 01 2013 09:36 WaveofShadow wrote:
##Vote: jcarlsoniv
Way too much lurk and uselessness from a player who is definitely able to provide more.
I know you're disappointed with my play, and I acknowledge that my activity has been...sporadic (and even that's being generous). C'est la vie. + Show Spoiler +
But while you waste your time tossing your vote on me, I'm going to try to look for someone who's actually scum.
##vote JungleJorge
This case is easy enough started off with his defense and then waffling on the topic of the Prom lynch. I will post them again for easy reference:
+ Show Spoiler +On February 26 2013 18:25 JungleJorge wrote:
I believe promethelax is innocent and I may expand on that if necessary, but it should be painfully obvious to anyone reading this thread how much traction this wagon got based on very poor reasoning by most of you. Much of the "scummy" behavior you have been pointing out is exactly the opposite of what scum normally tries to accomplish when they post. I suggest you revisit prom's filter and think about why he would post some of the stuff he has posted if he was indeed scum. I plan on being more specific later, but I'll give you guys some time to figure it out by yourselves.
I would also like you to take a look on The Macho Man, as he is my best guess for scum amongst the "active" posters. Again, I'll come back to expand on this as well. See you guys in a few hours. On February 27 2013 03:41 JungleJorge wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2013 22:00 Promethelax wrote:Hey all, catching a jetplane outta here in a few minutes but I'm here right now. I'm still uncomfortable with Wade though knowing it is bh makes him less likely to be scum in my eyes. His weird d1 behaviour is weird in a blazing way, which I usually find scummy. Things I still find scummy in him: his omgus attack already mentioned, attacking me for having a changed read after I reread the thread (I get that everyone wants to get on my wagon now, its the in thing to do but assuming you do lynch me when I flip look for shoddy reasoning like Wade's), his obsession with the vet/newbie dichotomy (he is focusing on it to the exclusion of actual scum hunting) Things I find townie: his confidence and casual tone ("for all you know I'm warbaby" and "so no real opinions then") conclusion: keep an eye on, not a good day one lynch JJ on the other hand is looking scummier (again this only works for me but once I flip go back and look at my reads k thx) I am under a lot of pressure now and most/all of the vets and smurfs (i.e. probable vets want to lynch me) and yet JJ comes in and says I am town for no reason. He has a reason. He just won't share it. It looks to me like a scummer trying to gain a little cred on a mislynch while also not actually derail the lynch. This is his whole interaction with me/comment on me before his sudden defense On February 26 2013 10:11 JungleJorge wrote:On February 26 2013 09:39 WaveofShadow wrote:On February 26 2013 09:37 MilkSuckler wrote:On February 26 2013 09:35 geript wrote:
As of yet, no. The question is why do you feel my newbie status is important? Actually its the opposite. You become non-existent. 'pretty much how I feel right now. See you D2 everybody! Promethelax, how do you feel about this post? conclusion: probably scum, would lynch. I'm heading out of town and will have limited internet access. I will post when I can. Good luck town! Promethelax is likely scum. I made that post specifically to see how he would react (as you noticed I didn't provide any reasons). Mostly my concerns were that too many people were pushing for his lynch and there was no opposition to it. Also the main reasons for the suspicion on him was some sudden change of mind or some controversial behavior, and those are normally townie traits. Now onto his reaction to my post: as town he would never come to the conclusion that I'm scum in that spot. What would be my interest as scum in defending a player everybody else thinks is scum? For town cred? As you can all tell that very often has the opposite effect and town cred is overrated anyway. People had not even mentioned my name prior to this so I had no reason to risk my neck over this. If you know you are townie your first reaction in this situation certainly is to think the people that are defending you are town! Now as scum what would you do? First you have inherent guilt, you think you look bad, so it's plausible that the claim that the guy defending you must have extra information should fly. Secondly you want to divert attention from your lynch, so it's a terrific opportunity to throw suspicion on someone that is on the other side of the issue. People that want to lynch prome certainly won't like the defense one bit, and are more easily willing to jump on the person defending it. As you can see Promethelax post makes very little sense if taken form a townie perspective, but makes a lot of sense given a scum mentality. I'll refrain from expanding my thoughts on macho man from now as to not derail this lynch.
First post: he defends Prom, but also says "I'll let you guys figure out why"
~5 hours later, he realizes that all the candidates are going to kill Prom, and he's been caught with his ass hanging out in defense of the man who will ultimately flip red. He switches to all "hey guys, i was kidding, i was testing him." In the same vein, he, ONCE AGAIN, refrains from expanding upon his thoughts on Macho Man.
About 6 hours later, another soft defense of Prome:
+ Show Spoiler +On February 27 2013 09:48 JungleJorge wrote:
DocH and Wade Fell, you both seem to believe scum Prome wouldn't behave in the way I described, yet you believe Prome is scum. What gives?
If you believe it is a null tell and I have reached the correct conclusion, by your own standards, what exactly is the problem here? Wouldn't you be better off taking in the information in regards to the reactions of many players, including the one set to be lynched, and ultimately have a better picture of the situation prior to the lynch so you could make a more informed decision and even after if we end up lynching him? If you believe it produced no meaningful content you can safely ignore it. It's funny how you accuse me of being anti-town when I'm trying to produce information by my own means, yet you both share my conclusion.
Also how exactly my withholding information for some amount of time to observe the reactions to my post damages the town in any regard? I've said I'd share the concerns I had with prome's lynch and I did. As it stands right now I believe the best lynch is prome and I'd be foolish to try to persuade town that The Macho Man is a better lynch, if even I don't share that point of view. Yes I do have problems with TMM, but I'll discuss those when the time is appropriate. It's a common mistake by many players to say every single thought that comes to their minds, instead of keeping the focus on what needs to be done.
Most of you so far seem to believe I'm some sort of idiot who ought to be dismissed. It's actually a barrier that I'm trying to overcome by making long quality over explanatory posts. I assure you I'm pretty good at this game, you would be surprised to know who you are dealing with. I assure you that if I had my name attached to my posts I would need to right a third as much and would have three times the influence.
The rest of his filter is responding to a bunch of posts in order to defend himself. He mentions a few people he think could be scum (Restraining Order, Myself), and the last we heard from him, he's dead set on Aquanim dying. I would love to hear his point of view at this point.
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On March 01 2013 11:28 geript wrote:
Sure. I think he's playing the same game. What'd you think of my points on toad?
Lol
please dot point 3 things that are similar
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On March 01 2013 11:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
So...nobody has had a look at MilkSuckler/Mocsta in a little while, and as much as I'd like to, people tend to ignore my shit.
Vivax, Geript, Aquanim and DrH.
Any thoughts regarding him at all before I dive in at some point in the near future?
Is there something in particular u want to address to me?
If you feel confident I am scum.. why do you need bandwagon support?
You had no problem stepping up to ask for the pardoner role.. why should this be any different?
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On March 01 2013 11:28 geript wrote:
Sure. I think he's playing the same game. What'd you think of my points on toad?
irrelevant to my chezinu case
On March 01 2013 11:30 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2013 11:27 Wade Fell wrote:I am completely convinced Chezinu is scum, and he should be lynched today ahead of any other considerations. He's scummy as hell and we cannot suffer a scum Chezinu to live. He must die. "But BH, aren't you just being moody? Chezinu is ALWAYS like this" Really? Let me tell you how he's been 1) during D1 he offered no reads or thoughts of substance, just blathering 2) he ninja voted me for an initially unexplained reason, and as it has been said, it is highly likely at least one scum was voting for me 3) his reason for voting me, that I have off a "Town vibe" with no other explanation, is suspect (link) because Chezinu as town loves trolling with his votes Now, poeple will say "But Chezinu always trolls" but this is wrong, example: Chezinu in LVIII explains (in his chezinu-like fashion) his votes. (link) when he is a townie. He trolls (link) but he also pushes a townie agenda (link) trying to prevent mislynches and he writes posts explaining reads, even if they STILL TROLL at the same time (link). Chezinu is not a worthless townie. Contrast his play as a townie to his play this game (link). Straight-up trolling without contributing, or even his super high level massive troll/analysis paragraphs. He (?)claims sheriff at the start of D2 and he's not sharing his thoughts, even in a trolling fashion. This is scum Chezinu. I know this in my heart, I know this from having played with him, and I know this from how he's playing this game. Lynch him. ##vote Chezinu Wait, your BH?? I thought you were Palmer!
>:| if you want you can think about it more from the observer QT in 44 hours.
On March 01 2013 11:30 jcarlsoniv wrote:
##vote JungleJorge
Look, I get that JJ is scummy as shit, and we should lynch him soon, but Chezinu needs to die NOW. I like that other people are picking up on JJ being scummy though. Chezinu is #1 scum we lynch him today. If we lynch JJ I find that acceptable, but CHEZINU, according to his meta AND given how he's played this game independent of meta, has confirmed himself as scum. Read my case. Read his filter. Read the filter from his town game.
This is scum chezinu
chezinu must die
lynch him
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On March 01 2013 11:31 MilkSuckler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2013 11:28 geript wrote:
Sure. I think he's playing the same game. What'd you think of my points on toad? Lol please dot point 3 things that are similar
No
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On March 01 2013 11:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
So...nobody has had a look at MilkSuckler/Mocsta in a little while, and as much as I'd like to, people tend to ignore my shit.
Vivax, Geript, Aquanim and DrH.
Any thoughts regarding him at all before I dive in at some point in the near future?
The thing about jcarl is that he's in the same category as a few other people like hassy, Chezinu, JJ and the like, so we might as well RNG one of them and shoot the fish in the barrel cause we will never know for sure if they're scum if we don't get them to post more.
Chezinu is currently here so if you want to catch the opportunity to contribute on that line it would be now by trying to get something useful from him, we can also all vote jcarl and lay back while Chezinu still doesn't get asked anything, but even though you might be happy that everyone agrees with you on jcarl I don't think that letting the other lurkers slip like that when they are here is what you really want.
I'll take a better look at the rest of what you wrote tomorrow going to sleep now.
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On March 01 2013 11:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
So...nobody has had a look at MilkSuckler/Mocsta in a little while, and as much as I'd like to, people tend to ignore my shit.
Vivax, Geript, Aquanim and DrH.
Any thoughts regarding him at all before I dive in at some point in the near future?
His case on me felt a lot like town Mocsta. My only reservation is that he's generally more obnoxious as town than scum and I wouldn't describe his play so far as obnoxious (check nomination mafia for a comparison). That's pretty paranoid though and maybe he's trying to change it up with his smurf.
Leaving for a while see you later.
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jcarl since you here please respond to: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=399294¤tpage=99#1977
which was the original reason I disliked you. The lurkyness alone like you said is not damning but what's in the link is far more so. You posted a read early on in the day (turned out wrong which is a slight negative) on vayesh and a minor on vivax, and then you backed off them with almost no explanation. So explain.
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On March 01 2013 11:34 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2013 11:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
So...nobody has had a look at MilkSuckler/Mocsta in a little while, and as much as I'd like to, people tend to ignore my shit.
Vivax, Geript, Aquanim and DrH.
Any thoughts regarding him at all before I dive in at some point in the near future? The thing about jcarl is that he's in the same category as a few other people like hassy, Chezinu, JJ and the like, so we might as well RNG one of them and shoot the fish in the barrel cause we will never know for sure if they're scum if we don't get them to post more.
NO. My case on Chezinu is ABSOLUTE. He _is_ scum, and he will flip scum this game or I will literally eat my hat with A-1 Steak Sauce and upload a video on youtube. You think (or you're scum and you're trying to deflect) that a Chezinu lynch is an RNG, but it's NOT. Chezinu is scum. He's playing like scum, and he's also playing like scum chezinu. Read the god-forsaken case.
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On March 01 2013 11:29 randombum wrote:Alright 22, Restraining order, Overall, another really short one, but the conclusion is different though. I don't like his posting. Mostly lurkerish and minimal analysis (focused on JJ). His tone also really bugs me like: Show nested quote +On February 27 2013 01:09 Restraining Order wrote:On February 27 2013 00:35 The Milkman wrote:
Why are people of low thread presence trying to defend Promethelax and swing the lynch somewhere else? This is the dumbest thing I have read all game, and let me tell you, there are plenty dumb things around. I hate comments like that which really shouldn't be a part of team liquid. His most redeeming post is: Show nested quote +On February 27 2013 11:34 Restraining Order wrote:On February 27 2013 11:12 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Prom layabout jj geript testsubject vivax Yes Maybe Yes Yes No Yes Which is basically a scum list with no justification. In other words, it's pretty pointless/bad. And that's his most redeeming. So he's super suspicious to me. Not quite as strong as jcarl because jcarls filter just as shitty, but as I posted earlier jcarl backtracked his reads with almost no explanation which to me is worse than lurking.
Randombum.. thanks for going through the filters.
you have identified two people you are suspicious of.
What do you intend to do with them?
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EPT
