EPTSC:Legacy Macro Contest - Page 4
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SUSUGAM
United States177 Posts
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Liquid`Jinro
Sweden33719 Posts
Kinda forgot toss has flying pylons =p | ||
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Too_MuchZerg
Finland2818 Posts
1) After period of time amount of gas per trip by worker (let say its 8 gas) is reduced to 7 after 1 minute of mining gas (time is adjustable) 2) Gas has certain button (hotkey or not if want to raise macro) that enables gas mining to go maximun amount, no cost (or can be adjusted if needed) 3) game would give voice "Gas is depleting" (depends race voices) every time 1 gas drops down 4) you cant go below certain gas per trip, let say 5 gas per trip. That to be balanced who tends to go more micro than macro. 5) depleted gas doesn't effect this. 6) But after certain time (5 minutes, adjustable) gas goes back to maximun to help less macro players to catch up little bit. | ||
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Archerofaiur
United States4101 Posts
On December 18 2008 18:18 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Simple mechanic system that is flexible: 1) After period of time amount of gas per trip by worker (let say its 8 gas) is reduced to 7 after 1 minute of mining gas (time is adjustable) 2) Gas has certain button (hotkey or not if want to raise macro) that enables gas mining to go maximun amount, no cost (or can be adjusted if needed) 3) game would give voice "Gas is depleting" (depends race voices) every time 1 gas drops down 4) you cant go below certain gas per trip, let say 5 gas per trip. That to be balanced who tends to go more micro than macro. 5) depleted gas doesn't effect this. 6) But after certain time (5 minutes, adjustable) gas goes back to maximun to help less macro players to catch up little bit. Nice start. Now make it fun. Try and make the player really feel rewarded when he does this task. However, this has to be done in a way that someone who doesn't do the task does not feel slighted. Have you considered making the reward (gas output upon completion of task) above the baseline output (8 gas) rather than below? | ||
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InRaged
1047 Posts
[TLDR] Before Pylon can be used for Warp-in it should be tied up with a Probe (think of Night Elf Wisps from Warcraft 3 and how they harvest lumber) [/TLDR] The problem with Warp-in as I see it right now is that it's very easy to setup and adamant to any sort of enemy activity. Once you build Pylons at all of your expands (and that's something you will always do anyway, so it costs nothing), you can warp your units everywhere and opponent can't do anything with it. With this suggestion I've tried to address this and make Warp-in vulnerable to the harassment. With this idea, before you can use Warp-in you'd need to build a Pylon and once it's ready bring a probe and use it on the Pylon, and as long as this probe stays there you can use this Pylon for Warp-in. Activating ability isn't instant and takes second or two, but you can always cancel it without any delay and run with Probe away. Since Probe is very fragile, that will make zones of Warp-in vulnerable to just couple Stalkers and therefore a player would need to be very conscious about that when he plays someone who's very harass-happy. On December 18 2008 17:37 FrozenArbiter wrote: @IdrA, Kinda forgot toss has flying pylons =p That's not a problem, isn't it? Just add ~5 sec delay when it turns into "Pylon" (turning back into Warp Prism could be instant) and make it lose shields in this mode or take double damage from enemy attacks. | ||
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Quanticfograw
United States2053 Posts
I think you would have to allow this to only be activated 2 minutes into the game because if you could do this instantly, four pool would be insanely problematic. I think this by choosing either amped gas or amped mins would allow for some neat fast expansion strategies, maybe cool proxies, or some gas intensive builds off 1base to counter fe's, or cool mid game timing by first amping up your minerals to give the ability to lay gates and make zealots then amp up your gas so you can roll out with templars and archons pvz. | ||
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
On December 19 2008 01:06 InRaged wrote: That's not a problem, isn't it? Just add ~5 sec delay when it turns into "Pylon" (turning back into Warp Prism could be instant) and make it lose shields in this mode or take double damage from enemy attacks. you mean to make warp in a viable alternative to macro? if so that wouldnt really change anything, obviously make it a bit slower/more dangerous, but you still dont have to move your screen to do it. you're focusing on your army the entire time, you just have to deploy the prism 5 seconds before your warpgate cooldown finishes. | ||
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InRaged
1047 Posts
On December 19 2008 02:34 IdrA wrote: you mean to make warp in a viable alternative to macro? if so that wouldnt really change anything, obviously make it a bit slower/more dangerous, but you still dont have to move your screen to do it. you're focusing on your army the entire time, you just have to deploy the prism 5 seconds before your warpgate cooldown finishes. I mean rebalancing the Prism so it's risky to use this way. It should be suitable for creating back doors, but not for carrying around your army as a flying Pylon. As I see it, Prism is just like shuttle - it's fast but fragile and kind of hard to mass, so each one of them counts. If it's weak as shuttle than double damage from any unit would be devastating. The delay is here not just to slow down your army, but to increase the time the Prism is exposed to the attack. With the delay you obviously can't just fly in, warp stuff and flee from the battlefield in couple seconds - you have to leave the Prism deploying. And now, what if it was extra vulnerable in this exposed Pylon state? This way it's very easy to lose it completely fruitlessly, and to bid farewell with it to all the units that were in state of Warping in. Of course I'm assuming that units don't Warp in instantly and there's at least 2 seconds delay, right? Edit: well, in the end, we can just give the Prism an energy and make deploying cost 75 mana if nothing else works. That one will work for sure. | ||
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SlickR12345
Macedonia408 Posts
First of all, the current stupid gas mechanic needs to go in order for this to be any good, gayzers should be only 1 per mineral line just as in original starcraft. Now add yellow gayzers, in addition to normal gas OR make all gayzers work like this(depending what people like more): Yellow gas is built normally, has total of 5000 gas in it, but it gives 12 gas per trip. The catch is that you need to manually set the gas flow. There would be 3 options: min, med and max. (Numbers prone to balance changes)Setting it to max gives 12 gas per trip, but takes away 15 gas from the gayzer, seting it at med gives 10 gas per trip but takes 12 from the gayzer and setting it to min gives 8 gas per trip but takes 6 from the gayzer. So you need to balance it fairly regulary depending on your strategy and tactics. So as you can see this mechanic also has meaningful actions that relate to strategy and tactics. The different settings will have a visual cue in the form of red circles at the bottom of the gas, 1 red circle means its set to min, 2 red circles means its set to med and 3 red circles means it is set to max. Post your feedback! | ||
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LonelyMargarita
1845 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + The obvious solution to any problem is to remove what is causing the problem. And yes, this is the only solution that will work | ||
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Liquid`Jinro
Sweden33719 Posts
On December 19 2008 05:34 LonelyMargarita wrote: I have a great solution that will make macro great in sc2. First you remove the gas mechanic. In its place, you make it so only 1 building can be selected at any time, and that rallied workers merely move to their rally point without any other orders. + Show Spoiler + The obvious solution to any problem is to remove what is causing the problem. And yes, this is the only solution that will work You are too late, from the first page: On December 17 2008 15:42 IdrA wrote: oh hell yes im gonna win easy how about this: you make it so that whenever someone wants to make a unit, they have to click on one of their production buildings and tell it to produce that unit. genius? | ||
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Caller
Poland8075 Posts
Pros: slightly faster income as gathering lines are closer to the drop-off can potentially help to block some units like ultralisks Cons: Workers get trapped more easily Have to spend money on extensions, maybe make them 100/25 each? | ||
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exeprime
United Kingdom643 Posts
What if they removed the "Your base is under attack" warning and replace it with a generic message (something like... "combat is underway") that "fires" each time two units engage in combat or a unit attacks a structure? That could make harass a lot more "stealth" if timed right... you send a few units to engage the opponent's army while also doing a drop in his base. This would encourage players to pay closer attention to the minimap, but also to check the base after each little melee, to make sure there are no units dropped there perparing to attack. After "firing" once when damage is first done, the message wouldn't "fire again" for something like 2-3 minutes or something, giving a window of time where "stealth" harass could happen, which could be further prolonged by timing another attack for the next warning. Extra balancing would be required though - maybe things such as... You can't see a single unit (one that doesn't have any other "friendly" units in its sight range or something) of your opponent on the minimap. Or maybe individual "dots" on the minimap being very small, so you could only clearly see bigger groups. Or units having a "stealth value" - e.g. you can have 4 zerglings next to each other that don't show up on the minimap, but only 2 zealots, one tank and no "capital" units such as a carrier, battlecruiser or ultralisk. This would make bases a lot more vulnerable, thereby making it more important to take care of them, moving screens to make sure they're nothing dodgy going on, etc. On the downside, it *could* encourage building lots of defensive structures, and it could be a imba when it comes to races - a single "stealth" tank could probably deal a lot more damage than any of the other races' single units, due to range and damage. Opinions? edit: i know it's not exactly macro, but it would encourage moving screens, paying more attention to your bases (and generally to the whole map), and it would also add quite a lot of new stategic and tactical options to the players. | ||
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FREEloss_ca
Canada603 Posts
-Keep MBS the way it's currently in SC2 (Can have 5 rax hotkeyed, but have to press M 5 times) -Keep gas mining the same as it was in SC1/BW -Remove Automine There we go, all is saved. | ||
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WoodenSpider
United States85 Posts
On December 19 2008 05:44 exeprime wrote: Uhm. Just had an idea which probably sucks, but hell, here it goes. What if they removed the "Your base is under attack" warning and replace it with a generic message (something like... "combat is underway") that "fires" each time two units engage in combat or a unit attacks a structure? That could make harass a lot more "stealth" if timed right... you send a few units to engage the opponent's army while also doing a drop in his base. This would encourage players to pay closer attention to the minimap, but also to check the base after each little melee, to make sure there are no units dropped there perparing to attack. After "firing" once when damage is first done, the message wouldn't "fire again" for something like 2-3 minutes or something, giving a window of time where "stealth" harass could happen, which could be further prolonged by timing another attack for the next warning. Extra balancing would be required though - maybe things such as... You can't see a single unit (one that doesn't have any other "friendly" units in its sight range or something) of your opponent on the minimap. Or maybe individual "dots" on the minimap being very small, so you could only clearly see bigger groups. Or units having a "stealth value" - e.g. you can have 4 zerglings next to each other that don't show up on the minimap, but only 2 zealots, one tank and no "capital" units such as a carrier, battlecruiser or ultralisk. This would make bases a lot more vulnerable, thereby making it more important to take care of them, moving screens to make sure they're nothing dodgy going on, etc. On the downside, it *could* encourage building lots of defensive structures, and it could be a imba when it comes to races - a single "stealth" tank could probably deal a lot more damage than any of the other races' single units, due to range and damage. Opinions? edit: i know it's not exactly macro, but it would encourage moving screens, paying more attention to your bases (and generally to the whole map), and it would also add quite a lot of new stategic and tactical options to the players. I like it! simple yet effective, rewards offensive playes and those who check their base a lot. Don't know if I would make the interval 2-3 min long, 25 sec would probably be better. But all in all Its a great new direction. Taking away original sc automation instead of adding new stuff. | ||
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CharlieMurphy
United States22895 Posts
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SWPIGWANG
Canada482 Posts
 Simple and easy to balance  PPP | ||
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SayaSP
Laos5494 Posts
On December 19 2008 07:40 CharlieMurphy wrote: I was just using the MBS in wc3 yesterday and had 2 crypts selected and building ghouls and gargs. Then I go back to my base and check and its only 1 crypt with liek 4 units queued. MBS sucks for a number of reasons, and this is just one. Use tab? | ||
pachi
Melbourne5338 Posts
On December 19 2008 07:40 CharlieMurphy wrote: I was just using the MBS in wc3 yesterday and had 2 crypts selected and building ghouls and gargs. Then I go back to my base and check and its only 1 crypt with liek 4 units queued. MBS sucks for a number of reasons, and this is just one. WC3 will build from all selected buildings provided you have the resources for it. One click should queue a ghoul at each crypt. AOK does this though and its highly annoying and misleading. | ||
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
On December 19 2008 03:58 InRaged wrote: I mean rebalancing the Prism so it's risky to use this way. It should be suitable for creating back doors, but not for carrying around your army as a flying Pylon. As I see it, Prism is just like shuttle - it's fast but fragile and kind of hard to mass, so each one of them counts. If it's weak as shuttle than double damage from any unit would be devastating. The delay is here not just to slow down your army, but to increase the time the Prism is exposed to the attack. With the delay you obviously can't just fly in, warp stuff and flee from the battlefield in couple seconds - you have to leave the Prism deploying. And now, what if it was extra vulnerable in this exposed Pylon state? This way it's very easy to lose it completely fruitlessly, and to bid farewell with it to all the units that were in state of Warping in. Of course I'm assuming that units don't Warp in instantly and there's at least 2 seconds delay, right? Edit: well, in the end, we can just give the Prism an energy and make deploying cost 75 mana if nothing else works. That one will work for sure. doesnt exactly seem relevant to the thread theres not really any reason to think that the prism is even imbalanced at this point. its certainly far less powerful than nydus worms. and its not like we can expect terran to be as good as the other races anyway. and units do warp in essentially instantly. actually come to think of it your solution wouldnt even fix your problem. making it weaker or more vulnerable means it would be more likely used just to reinforce your army quickly, since youd have your army right there to defend it while its vulnerable. | ||
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