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On May 23 2008 06:42 oSS-Zarathustra wrote:
My humble opinion is....
Starcraft will grow after the retire of ACE.
Why? Because if Boxer lives the army, ACE will no longer exists. BUT THE EMPEROR WILL BE BACK!!!!!! He will just rejoin SKT and there your have the recepie to an awesome new starcraft chapter.
What I'm thinking is ... the U.S. doesn't need all these soldiers. Will just lend some to S. Korea so they don't need this conscription service anymore! I mean come on, it's not very good for eSports, and eSports are more entertaining to the general masses than mandatory military conscription.
Just an idea, and also one of the best ones ever. Call your senator!
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On May 22 2008 07:08 yangstuh wrote:
SC2 will be a successful esport no doubt, however will it compare to Korean Starcraft esports? Thats a different story.
I will say this, Starcraft 2 will be a more successful esport than WC3 because of a lot of reasons
-cooler, more manlier setting (gritty sci-fi) compared to the more cartoony fantasy warcraft world.
-faster action
-more units
-more death
-no creeping, means more confrontation between the players
-etc.
-Newer
+ Show Spoiler +
WHAT THE FUCK. do you even know what makes starcraft a successful e-sport?
i will make you a list:
1) competitive sport - no one likes a player taking place for all the other progamers
2) fans for specific player - wcg documentary of 2005 go watch it and learn. havent you heard of clubs of fans supporting a specific player
3) boxer - boxer didnt win always but was and is the superstar of starcraft even when having a hard time
4) unique way of win - a progamer wins by its own merits. no luck based referees. no stupid luck based rules like poker. etc.
i could really go on here with reasons that make e-sports as big as it is.
what i am trying to say is that you are just so damn wrong. what do you think progaming is anyways. a place where people gather to see. one fucking and only player dominating others. is that really what you think it is. for gods sake you make me register to answer your idea. geez..
and to the creator of this bad title topic.
i will smile at your title and your idea for this topic. everyday that passes and e-sports is still on tv.
every day e-sports continues to bring tournaments. excellent moments are lived and experience. etc etc. every damn 1 one more day e-sports continues to show osl msl and whatnot tastelessandgsi. every damn day.
i will smile at your "e-sports is dying omfgz lolz!!oneoneon"
every damn day it continues to give us their fans such joy and excitement GO OSL GO MSL GO GOMTV
oh by the way i forgot.. have you ever heard LIVE FOR THE SWARM in zerg? the zerg scourge maybe dont say it but damn it means it. starcraft is full of this kind of things. and thats nice.
You must be unfamiliar with Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods. In sports people love when their is a player who is the absolute best. It gives them someone to embrace or root against and that's why they loved Slayers_Boxer. He would be a nobody if he didn't win anything and it would be silly to think otherwise.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
This article is sensationalist bullshit. Teams have tanked before, and progaming didn't implode
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send free to lecaf and it wont matter if hanbit self implodes
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They need to loosen up the rules, allow chatting again, and everything that used to make starcraft fun.
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seems like e-sports in Korea has just gone downhill eversince Boxer had to join the army.
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I know this was probably already mentioned before. Its been 10 years, thats pretty good. Nothing lives forever. Besides we got sc2 coming up soon and you know they are gonna pick that shit up on the networks.
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Do you know football, tennis, basket ball, car racing etc.... ?
Haven't they been played for decades ? Do the spectators increased each year ?
Obviously starcraft wasn't going to grow forever. Maybe its just mature now.
Due to the fact that computer games evolve, SC and his 640x480 resolution will die one day, being played by a handful of 70 year old fanatics.
However, SC2 will probably kill SC a lot sonner.
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Yeah, I'm really looking forward to Tennis II.
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
On May 23 2008 06:02 PsycHOTemplar wrote:
Every year they say StarCraft is going to die soon, and every year it keeps living.
Necessity is the mother of invention. I believe that whatever obstacle StarCraft may face there will be someone to help overcome it. StarCraft will never die. StarCraft is the Chess of the information technology age. The perfect, inarguably irreplaceable original and favourite in the hearts of all those who played it competitively. I can see StarCraft never dying in my lifetime.
StarCraft 2 will be a fun game, but it won't destroy SC 1. SC 1 and SC 2 are like oranges and apples. 3D games will always be different, even in RTS, than the 2D classics. I mean, just look at SC2 and tell me you could choose one over the other? It'd come down to personal taste, not superiority. Another way to think of it, is ask yourself if the old side scrolling classics on SNES are any less fun than the FPS games on modern consoles? They aren't. They're just new and different.
- nice post, we share the same hopes
- still even though a game may survive, its popularity can decline and its participation in the world of professional e-sports can disappear
- that Korean news article is depressing : ( the decrease in tv viewership is probably the worse sign for Korean SC e-sports
- anyway, It could be worse..
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On May 23 2008 11:33 EvoChamber wrote:
Yeah, I'm really looking forward to Tennis II.
I'm not. MRS (Multiple Racket Selection) is going to kill the macro that most pros who used one racket have mastered.
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I've got to think that decrease in TV viewership is due to the fact that you can watch on GOMTV or Daum or even on youtube with such ease.
I've been watching VODs and following the korean pro scene since cola cola league. Back then, I had to pay a korean friend to pay his relative living in korea to purchase an account for ongamenet via a cellphone so that I could watch VODs that buffered every 3 seconds, but I'd still sit there and watch frame by frame.
Personally I disagree with many of the arguments that people are laying out. Too many games? Perhaps. But I still watch pretty much every single new vod that gets posted on jon's youtube page. Sure as hell beats waiting a whole friggin week for 4 games where perhaps 1 or 2 may be decent.
No personality? I couldn't give a rat's ass if some progamer does some retarded dance or ceremony after a match. All I care about are GG's. Watching Flash come back against TheRock and Yellow recently was just as entertaining for me as any of boxer's old matches. OK, it might not have the wow factor or the "newness" of boxer pulling some crazy new moves, but there really hasn't been anything that revolutionary since I'd say about '04. You can only invent something once, and just because the game has matured doesn't reduce the entertainment value for me.
And what is this bullshit about progamer looks. OK, I'm sure it has a huge effect on the screaming korean teenie girls out there. But as a true fan of the sport, I could care less about the looks of a gamer. And to the guy saying nada is handsome? WTF? If you can look past the glitzy new hairdo, he is fairly ugly. I get excited when watching a vod with flash, mind, or sea. Sure all three of them are kinda ugly, but I'd much rather watch them play than Chrh, Reach or Yellow. Those guys are pretty good looking I'd say, and I respect BW history and their contributions to the game in earlier days, but their games right now are no where near as entertaining as top level players.
While it may be true that some fans may care more about personality, looks, etc., I'm more a fan of the game itself, and the level of play right now is higher than it has ever been. That is why my level of interest is still as strong as ever.
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Yeah, I'm really looking forward to Tennis II Yeah, I like squash too.
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None of the really good players out there are down right ugly. They may not be models or anything but who really cares...
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On May 23 2008 16:34 Tinithor wrote:
None of the really good players out there are down right ugly. They may not be models or anything but who really cares...
The fangirls. Who make up a considerable amount of the fanbase in Korea.
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On May 22 2008 00:26 MultiMarine wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2008 19:57 frankbg wrote:On May 21 2008 19:45 lololol wrote:On May 21 2008 19:10 frankbg wrote:On May 21 2008 18:59 lololol wrote:
Your argument why CS is requires more skill and is more competitive compared to SC isn't even an argument, but pure BS. Popularity among players doesn't have a direct connection to skill(and it's more of a reverse dependancy, because harder games are played by fewer people, an obvious fact), or you want to tell me the Sims requires the most skills of all games, because it is the most popular?
The Sims > CS! I learned a new thing today! Can you not read? Have you not read ANYTHING else but that argument or are you so blinded by your pre-conceived notions that you can't debate any other argument? You basically prove my whole point that you guys don't know enough about CS to judge it. The whole popularity issue wasn't even something I brought up, I was merely replying to something someone else brought up. I never said that this was the reason it required more skills. Don't put words in my mouth. Also, where do you hold stats that show more people play the Sims than CS. Also do you compare the time spent? People playing the Sims once a month aren't really gamers in my book. Seriously, stop making arguments out of your asshole. This is getting really irritating. I would quit the debating because it's offtopic but some of you guys just won't drop it. If you're gonna try to counter-argument, at least don't act like a bigoted retard. What is your SC background to prove you know enough about SC to judge it? Yes, you should quit, because the only bigoted retard here is you. You don't even know what an argument is, and personal attacks are definitely not, they just show you're an idiot. You stated that my argument was Bullshit. You didn't read my other posts/arguments and targeted a single point I made about popularity, twisted it in a way that wasn't intended to try and make it look ridiculous (Sims vs CS argument, cmon, you're being a huge flamebait there). And the fact that my initial polite arguments have been replied to with insulting stuff. I didn't start the personnal attacks, the blind fanboys did. Edit: By the way, I never tried to belittle the skill required in SC but merely tried to correct the shit ton of fallacies that were being spread about CS. You guys are the ones who are trying to belittle a very good game, a game that pioneered esports as much as SC did (probably more, considering CS is worldwide and SC is restricted to a single country). Oh and Skew's last post pretty much /thread. I have played both RTS and FPS at the highest level so i know what takes more skill! I used to play Starcraft 10 hours a day for many years and i got the chance to be apart of the first ever WCG. Before i left i played some Q3 for fun like 1 hour a day maybe. I had no one to practice with so i only played some random 1on1 games. When i got to korea i played Q3 with the people competing in the Q3 competition. This was when Q3 was really big and the CPL focused only on Q3. Let's just say i beat quake legend dOOMER and python who i belive later finished 3rd place in the tournament. I had to devote my entire life to be at the highest level in starcraft and with Q3 all it took was some fun 1on1 games now and then. I have played CS to and it's easier then Q3 but with more teamplay. No way in HELL CS takes more skill then starcraft.
Yeah this debate is over but you're full of sh** and you don't know what you're talking about. You never showed up to any CPL and are the biggest nonamer I've met, beating someone named "doomer" online means jack. Could've been me. And to say CS is easier than Q3..... lol. Yeah wtv. I'm done with this but please don't lie to try and make a point, it's dishonest and retarded. And I thought the mods said to drop it, can you not read? You'd expect a super gosu gamer to atleast be able to read a 3 sentence post that says to STOP IT.
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On May 22 2008 04:45 zimz wrote:
i play fps all my life. and none of them is as hard as starcraft. to me fps is natural. its not stressing etc. u just jump in. starcraft is a unique beast. it is the most unforgiving, challenging game there is. by your post i can tell you are very bias. just because u became high level at CS. u want to make believe (by being delusional to yourself, and the world) that it requires as much skill or even more skill than SC. because you want to make yourself feel more special and superior and that you became so high with a game that is "just as hard as SC if not more" in your eyes. you are on an ego trip and as i can see from ur post, you are very defensive about it because u think it ties in with how l33t u are in CS and how ur CS skills is just as "special" or even more "special" than those SC skills. your very immature. now how dare u come here on this SC forum and try prove how special u r cuz u got in high lvl CS and how its more demanding when it is clearly not. im sorry last romantic but i just had to post this.
mods? everybody is adding insults to this closed debate, it's kinda gay that I can't answer and prove these braindead idiots wrong. so either nuke em or ban em or let me knock their arguments and bring some facts in.
edit: alternatively, could we get a thread on this particular subject? I suppose the fanboys will go nuts and start talking shit and turning it into a flame war but then again it'll just show who the mature, level-headed people with facts are.
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=( What a buncha failures.
I agree with tenbagger. VOD access is so much easier than before that I miss so much more live now. Especially with the awkward times.
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I wonder what will actually happen to the leagues when SC2 comes out.
Will the SC1 leagues fold (unlikely?) and there will be only SC2 leagues, or SC2 will be threated a bit like WC3 (different game with own leagues). I think we will have both SC1 and SC2 leagues for some time - it will depend if SC2 will turn out a game that fits for TV (and if it will fit for the players too, that's the most important thing!).
You must be unfamiliar with Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods. In sports people love when their is a player who is the absolute best. It gives them someone to embrace or root against and that's why they loved Slayers_Boxer. He would be a nobody if he didn't win anything and it would be silly to think otherwise.
For me it's like the worst scenario for any sport. The same person winning all the time. Id rather see dramatic games between players of similar skill (with battles between players of different styles being the best). Do you remember the Ilooveoov vs Boxer finals? Would it be fun, if we knew that Boxer would win for sure? I mean this is an upset when Boxer loses to some unknown zerg (or Mondragon loses to Dreiven), but at least the game is not predictable and not boring. If the same person is always winning, watching the game is pointless, as you know the result.
Not to mention that everyone plays the same now, ok I know that there is not much place for style, but seriously, these new progamers are a bunch of noones for me - I dont see anything ballsy, or stylish in most of their games, they just play like robots.
I think cycling was ruined by that guy who used to win every race. Here in Poland strongmen championships are quite popular (I dont like them) - and there is one guy (Pudzianowski) who wins them EVERY time. It's quite boring for me, I watched it like two or three times and always wondered who will be 2nd or 3rd, because there was no competition for the first spot.
I work at a company that is endorsed by Tiger Woods, which made me hate him lol
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On May 23 2008 15:57 L wrote: Yeah, I like squash too.
Well, thought it does feel that we are in Rugby ver. 45.3b
And there are still bugs unfixed...
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EPT
