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On August 25 2026 00:36 Duplicity85 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2026 23:31 StarcraftHistorian wrote:On August 24 2026 23:04 Duplicity85 wrote:On August 24 2026 22:40 StarcraftHistorian wrote:On August 24 2026 22:22 Duplicity85 wrote:On August 24 2026 21:36 StarcraftHistorian wrote:On August 24 2026 19:37 Duplicity85 wrote:On August 22 2026 19:19 Mizenhauer wrote:On August 22 2026 17:43 Duplicity85 wrote:
I don't understand how nerdstreet or the venue is going to make any money off this event. I don't understand how some people can't enjoy an event with some of the best players of all time because they're too busy being a StarCraft detractor and counting other people's money. Odd to see someone call me(a person who plays starcraft) a starcraft detractor because I had a thought about whether or not an event is profitable. I did some brainstorming. The sunken cost for the event is probably going to be upwards of 20k as half the entry fees are getting added back into the pool + airfares for the invitees + hotel/accomodations + staff etc. Marketing budgets for small businesses(the lan center) are generally used with an expectation of a return of investment. I just don't see how flying over people from outside the country would generate profit, like, they are unlikely to come back to the lan center unless they get the same accomodations. Some quick math and crowd estimations + a full 64 person bracket suggests that the venue is paying about 300 dollars per person(assuming somewhere between 135-150 total) to be there according to sunken cost estimations. The math just doesn't add up for profitability. Like, What exactly is the business model here? A lan center spends around 20grand on a tournament for a maximum of 200 bodies + a stream of a thousand viewers, maybe 1500? That wouldn't make sense from a marketing spend and twitches ad revenue share and/or youtube ad revenue share wouldn't make up the difference either. You don't have to feel threatened for starcraft when others have a thought or attempt to paint them as a detractor. It's just kind crazy from a business perspective to see a local lan center in the us drop this kind of money and pretty much be guaranteed to be in the red. On a side note, Is there going to be "seeding" for this event or will it have competitive integrity? Like are the established names going to be intentionally NOT paired against eachother early on to make it easier for them to advance to the later stages of the bracket to land in the money or will the entire tournament bracket be generated completely at random to ensure competitive integrity and fairness for all participants? Your understanding of almost all of this is incorrect. Lets look at some of the math. 10k base prize pool + 50% of tournament player entrant fees added to the pool. Plus there is the cost of flights for the 8 invites + hotel/accomodation(assuming that's covered, if not then knock of AT LEAST 5k from the initial 20k estimate. 64 players at $65 a piece is just over 4,100 with 50% going back into the prize pool. That's just over 12k in prize that will be paid out with about 2k in-take that isn't being spent out. Just based on this, The host is spending 12k to bring in 2k in earnings. With a full 64 player bracket, the organizer/venue will need over 300 spectators to break even - not including labor costs for staff, flights for the invites, hotel for the invites etc. Now if the organizer/venue is paying for flights/hotel/appearance fees, that's thousands of dollars more that need to be factored in and also recouped. Another thing to take into consideration is the lan center's building firecode, Does the building's firecode permit over 350 people being in the lan center? If the limit is low, this would certainly impact the ability to sell enough spectator tickets just to break even or even become profitable. I didn't factor in the other 2 tournaments that will pay out another 3k or more. I'm seeing a lan venue spend at least 15k in budget to bring in substantially less while reaching a maximum marketing outreach of say 2,500 people(twitch stream viewers + spectators + competitors). Most of that 2,500 person estimate also won't be anywhere local to the Philadelphia location which means chances of them becoming a future patron of the business is also extremely low. So from a marketing perspective and a business perspective, How do you plan on keeping the lights on so to speak, ya know? But yeah, These were some thoughts in my mind about how this is going to be profitable for the lan center/host. Question for the tournament operator - Is there going to be "seeding" for this event or will it have competitive integrity? Like are the established names going to be intentionally NOT paired against eachother early on to make it easier for them to advance to the later stages of the bracket to land in the money or will the entire tournament bracket be generated completely at random using a random bracket generator to ensure competitive integrity and fairness for all participants? The “LAN Center” is not the host. The “LAN Center” isn’t spending anything. Excuse me, "Local host - Philadelphia Location". Multiple companies all under the same umbrella. I suppose it would technically mean that nerdstreet IS paying around 15k to run the tournament at their venue. It's all coming from the same place - VC raised by nerdstreet from the series c round in 2024. All the prize pay outs and cost to run the event are still indeed considered an expense. My previous statements from my other posts are still valid here. Are you involved in running the tournament? Would you be able to answer my question about seeding? Nerd St operates the venue that I am renting. I am the sole proprietor of SC4ALL. So no, any and all points related to Nerd St. are not valid. The invited players will be seeded into group stage 2 based on Aligulac rankings. Is there a reason why you are giving some players an unfair tournament advantage over the other participants? You are choosing to make it so a select few players(8?) have an easier time landing prize. It's a competitive game based on skill, shouldn't they have to earn their wins like everyone else? Are you trying to make friends with them by giving them free wins or an easier time at winning money or something? Did someone else put you up to it? You do realize that rigging a paid tournament bracket via "seeding" to favor certain individuals is the opposite of competitive integrity right?
You're exactly correct, I've been found out! I was worried Maru would be eliminated by local NA talent, so I conspired to rig the tournament so he could pull off the miracle of making it to group stage 2 at my event.
I hate competitive integrity, just ruins my day to even think about it.
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Why would you need to give players who shouldn't have any problem making it out of stage 1 free walk overs into the second group stage? It's a game of skill.
IT'S A PAID TOURNAMENT LOL
You are using something other than skill to determine who advances to a certain point in a paid tournament for a game based entirely on skill. Are you telling me you don't see anything wrong with that? The whole point of is to win the match so you can advance. Not give away free wins. That's not competitive gaming. That's rigging a tournament to make it easier for certain folks to land in the cash. But like you implied with maru, it shouldn't be an issue for him to win right? So then why give them free walk overs into the next group stage? It's clear bracket rigging to create an advantage for certain players.
Also, You don't mention at all in the tournament registration that at least 8 players(invites) get a walkover directly into the second group stage. How do you think your other participants are going to react when they find out pro players are being given a tournament bracket advantage over them for no reason at all other than to make it easier for them to win money? What about the people that were going to sign up as an attendee whether it be as a player or spectator? Have you thought any of this through? Or did someone else put you up to doing this?
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ANYWAYS, sounds like if I wanna get pictures and interact with the legendary players, the time to do that will be at the very beginning of the tournament since they are seeded further in. Good planning, in my opinion. It's nice to have a distinct window of time for that.
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On August 25 2026 02:08 zelevin wrote:
ANYWAYS, sounds like if I wanna get pictures and interact with the legendary players, the time to do that will be at the very beginning of the tournament since they are seeded further in. Good planning, in my opinion. It's nice to have a distinct window of time for that.
Stuff like this is absolutely a part of the consideration! Look forward to meeting you pal.
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On August 19 2026 03:00 Mizenhauer wrote:He's not the goat, but he's my goat. 
LOVE this. Well said.
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@StarcraftHistorian My group of friends and myself aren't comfortable playing in a tournament where advancing isn't determined entirely by skill.
You are the TO, Is it going to be a problem for the 5 of us to get refunds for our entry fees Or are we going to have to go through our bank/card companies?
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On August 25 2026 03:03 Duplicity85 wrote:
@StarcraftHistorian My group of friends and myself aren't comfortable playing in a tournament where advancing isn't determined entirely by skill.
You are the TO, Is it going to be a problem for the 5 of us to get refunds for our entry fees Or are we going to have to go through our bank/card companies?
The ticket page clearly states that refunds will not be issued. The sale of the tickets was final. Contacting your bank to attempt to cancel the purchase would be your best bet. Cheers!
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On August 25 2026 03:03 Duplicity85 wrote:
@StarcraftHistorian My group of friends and myself aren't comfortable playing in a tournament where advancing isn't determined entirely by skill.
I feel you. It is just such a scam when some players get seeded deeper into the tournament than others. Can you even imagine a Dreamhack and like 16 players would get seeded straight into Group Stage 3? That would be SO wild and unfair and uncompetitive. What next? Top 4 gets direct invites to the next GSL?
In other news: I have no idea how this is financed, so this is more of a general idea...why is it so weird for people to understand that maybe some things are not "business viable"? Back in the day, Esports was run mostly on this. Enthusiasts would pay out of pocket money for the game they love and organise tournaments and fund prizepools. You can't run stuff like LoL on this model of course, but SC2 is SO far off of this.
I remember a few years ago when Happy (I think) won a big online tournament for WC3 and he gave the prizemoney back, so the TO had enough money to fund a second tournament. And I can't count the amount of cups and leagues I casted back in the day that were essentially born out of a guy sponsoring 100€ for the love of the game...
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On August 25 2026 03:11 StarcraftHistorian wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2026 03:03 Duplicity85 wrote:
@StarcraftHistorian My group of friends and myself aren't comfortable playing in a tournament where advancing isn't determined entirely by skill.
You are the TO, Is it going to be a problem for the 5 of us to get refunds for our entry fees Or are we going to have to go through our bank/card companies? The ticket page clearly states that refunds will not be issued. The sale of the tickets was final. Contacting your bank to attempt to cancel the purchase would be your best bet. Cheers!
Ya we'll just go through our bank/card companies.
Best of Luck!
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On August 25 2026 03:43 Duplicity85 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2026 03:11 StarcraftHistorian wrote:On August 25 2026 03:03 Duplicity85 wrote:
@StarcraftHistorian My group of friends and myself aren't comfortable playing in a tournament where advancing isn't determined entirely by skill.
You are the TO, Is it going to be a problem for the 5 of us to get refunds for our entry fees Or are we going to have to go through our bank/card companies? The ticket page clearly states that refunds will not be issued. The sale of the tickets was final. Contacting your bank to attempt to cancel the purchase would be your best bet. Cheers! Ya we'll just go through our bank/card companies. Best of Luck!
👍
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On August 25 2026 03:31 Balnazza wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2026 03:03 Duplicity85 wrote:
@StarcraftHistorian My group of friends and myself aren't comfortable playing in a tournament where advancing isn't determined entirely by skill. I feel you. It is just such a scam when some players get seeded deeper into the tournament than others. Can you even imagine a Dreamhack and like 16 players would get seeded straight into Group Stage 3? That would be SO wild and unfair and uncompetitive. What next? Top 4 gets direct invites to the next GSL?.
NOW YOURE GETTING CRAZY!!
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France13023 Posts
On August 25 2026 00:36 Duplicity85 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2026 23:31 StarcraftHistorian wrote:On August 24 2026 23:04 Duplicity85 wrote:On August 24 2026 22:40 StarcraftHistorian wrote:On August 24 2026 22:22 Duplicity85 wrote:On August 24 2026 21:36 StarcraftHistorian wrote:On August 24 2026 19:37 Duplicity85 wrote:On August 22 2026 19:19 Mizenhauer wrote:On August 22 2026 17:43 Duplicity85 wrote:
I don't understand how nerdstreet or the venue is going to make any money off this event. I don't understand how some people can't enjoy an event with some of the best players of all time because they're too busy being a StarCraft detractor and counting other people's money. Odd to see someone call me(a person who plays starcraft) a starcraft detractor because I had a thought about whether or not an event is profitable. I did some brainstorming. The sunken cost for the event is probably going to be upwards of 20k as half the entry fees are getting added back into the pool + airfares for the invitees + hotel/accomodations + staff etc. Marketing budgets for small businesses(the lan center) are generally used with an expectation of a return of investment. I just don't see how flying over people from outside the country would generate profit, like, they are unlikely to come back to the lan center unless they get the same accomodations. Some quick math and crowd estimations + a full 64 person bracket suggests that the venue is paying about 300 dollars per person(assuming somewhere between 135-150 total) to be there according to sunken cost estimations. The math just doesn't add up for profitability. Like, What exactly is the business model here? A lan center spends around 20grand on a tournament for a maximum of 200 bodies + a stream of a thousand viewers, maybe 1500? That wouldn't make sense from a marketing spend and twitches ad revenue share and/or youtube ad revenue share wouldn't make up the difference either. You don't have to feel threatened for starcraft when others have a thought or attempt to paint them as a detractor. It's just kind crazy from a business perspective to see a local lan center in the us drop this kind of money and pretty much be guaranteed to be in the red. On a side note, Is there going to be "seeding" for this event or will it have competitive integrity? Like are the established names going to be intentionally NOT paired against eachother early on to make it easier for them to advance to the later stages of the bracket to land in the money or will the entire tournament bracket be generated completely at random to ensure competitive integrity and fairness for all participants? Your understanding of almost all of this is incorrect. Lets look at some of the math. 10k base prize pool + 50% of tournament player entrant fees added to the pool. Plus there is the cost of flights for the 8 invites + hotel/accomodation(assuming that's covered, if not then knock of AT LEAST 5k from the initial 20k estimate. 64 players at $65 a piece is just over 4,100 with 50% going back into the prize pool. That's just over 12k in prize that will be paid out with about 2k in-take that isn't being spent out. Just based on this, The host is spending 12k to bring in 2k in earnings. With a full 64 player bracket, the organizer/venue will need over 300 spectators to break even - not including labor costs for staff, flights for the invites, hotel for the invites etc. Now if the organizer/venue is paying for flights/hotel/appearance fees, that's thousands of dollars more that need to be factored in and also recouped. Another thing to take into consideration is the lan center's building firecode, Does the building's firecode permit over 350 people being in the lan center? If the limit is low, this would certainly impact the ability to sell enough spectator tickets just to break even or even become profitable. I didn't factor in the other 2 tournaments that will pay out another 3k or more. I'm seeing a lan venue spend at least 15k in budget to bring in substantially less while reaching a maximum marketing outreach of say 2,500 people(twitch stream viewers + spectators + competitors). Most of that 2,500 person estimate also won't be anywhere local to the Philadelphia location which means chances of them becoming a future patron of the business is also extremely low. So from a marketing perspective and a business perspective, How do you plan on keeping the lights on so to speak, ya know? But yeah, These were some thoughts in my mind about how this is going to be profitable for the lan center/host. Question for the tournament operator - Is there going to be "seeding" for this event or will it have competitive integrity? Like are the established names going to be intentionally NOT paired against eachother early on to make it easier for them to advance to the later stages of the bracket to land in the money or will the entire tournament bracket be generated completely at random using a random bracket generator to ensure competitive integrity and fairness for all participants? The “LAN Center” is not the host. The “LAN Center” isn’t spending anything. Excuse me, "Local host - Philadelphia Location". Multiple companies all under the same umbrella. I suppose it would technically mean that nerdstreet IS paying around 15k to run the tournament at their venue. It's all coming from the same place - VC raised by nerdstreet from the series c round in 2024. All the prize pay outs and cost to run the event are still indeed considered an expense. My previous statements from my other posts are still valid here. Are you involved in running the tournament? Would you be able to answer my question about seeding? Nerd St operates the venue that I am renting. I am the sole proprietor of SC4ALL. So no, any and all points related to Nerd St. are not valid. The invited players will be seeded into group stage 2 based on Aligulac rankings. Is there a reason why you are giving some players an unfair tournament advantage over the other participants? You are choosing to make it so a select few players(8?) have an easier time landing prize. It's a competitive game based on skill, shouldn't they have to earn their wins like everyone else? Are you trying to make friends with them by giving them free wins or an easier time at winning money or something? Did someone else put you up to it? You do realize that rigging a paid tournament bracket via "seeding" to favor certain individuals is the opposite of competitive integrity right?
At some point when trolling is not subtle enough it just becomes stupid
Seeding competitors is done in every sport / esport
Do #523 tennis players complain about competitive integrity when they have to play against Grand Chelem winners in the first rounds?
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It's pretty different that you pay to play, so for fairness sake you should know beforehand if there are gonna be invites and that they are advantaged.
Seeding, imo also should be based on some score, previous results, else it becomes who the organizers prefer. It's not something new, hsc does this, but it's something that discredits integrity of competition, for sure.
Serral's 4 hsc wins in a row, are not at all the same as taeja's 3 hsc wins in a row. Serral and others were invited, whereas taeja's were qualifier based, meaning there's a potential gsl caliber qualifier going into it, and from many regions.
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On August 25 2026 19:08 ejozl wrote:
It's pretty different that you pay to play, so for fairness sake you should know beforehand if there are gonna be invites and that they are advantaged.
Seeding, imo also should be based on some score, previous results, else it becomes who the organizers prefer. It's not something new, hsc does this, but it's something that discredits integrity of competition, for sure.
Serral's 4 hsc wins in a row, are not at all the same as taeja's 3 hsc wins in a row. Serral and others were invited, whereas taeja's were qualifier based, meaning there's a potential gsl caliber qualifier going into it, and from many regions.
Eerm, no. The vast majority of HSCs participants have always been invited, including Tae, who was invited to all three tournaments that he won.
EDIT: So further looking back at the participants... I'd value Serral's 4 wins in a row higher than TaeJa's 3.
On August 25 2026 01:59 Duplicity85 wrote:
Why would you need to give players who shouldn't have any problem making it out of stage 1 free walk overs into the second group stage? It's a game of skill.
IT'S A PAID TOURNAMENT LOL
You are using something other than skill to determine who advances to a certain point in a paid tournament for a game based entirely on skill. Are you telling me you don't see anything wrong with that? The whole point of is to win the match so you can advance. Not give away free wins. That's not competitive gaming. That's rigging a tournament to make it easier for certain folks to land in the cash. But like you implied with maru, it shouldn't be an issue for him to win right? So then why give them free walk overs into the next group stage? It's clear bracket rigging to create an advantage for certain players.
Also, You don't mention at all in the tournament registration that at least 8 players(invites) get a walkover directly into the second group stage. How do you think your other participants are going to react when they find out pro players are being given a tournament bracket advantage over them for no reason at all other than to make it easier for them to win money? What about the people that were going to sign up as an attendee whether it be as a player or spectator? Have you thought any of this through? Or did someone else put you up to doing this?
Just to be sure: Wasn't this known to you guys from the beginning?
I get that there are several advantages and reasonings for laying out the tournament like that but to be honest, I understand that you would know in advance. Nevertheless, if you start in the Ro128 and prize money gets you your entry fee back at Ro32, your chances to make money are better off if the Pros are seeded directly into the Ro16, for example. It protects you, rather than hurts you.
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On August 26 2026 00:29 PremoBeats wrote:Show nested quote +On August 25 2026 19:08 ejozl wrote:
It's pretty different that you pay to play, so for fairness sake you should know beforehand if there are gonna be invites and that they are advantaged.
Seeding, imo also should be based on some score, previous results, else it becomes who the organizers prefer. It's not something new, hsc does this, but it's something that discredits integrity of competition, for sure.
Serral's 4 hsc wins in a row, are not at all the same as taeja's 3 hsc wins in a row. Serral and others were invited, whereas taeja's were qualifier based, meaning there's a potential gsl caliber qualifier going into it, and from many regions. Eerm, no. The vast majority of HSCs participants have always been invited, including Tae, who was invited to all three tournaments that he won. Show nested quote +On August 25 2026 01:59 Duplicity85 wrote:
Why would you need to give players who shouldn't have any problem making it out of stage 1 free walk overs into the second group stage? It's a game of skill.
IT'S A PAID TOURNAMENT LOL
You are using something other than skill to determine who advances to a certain point in a paid tournament for a game based entirely on skill. Are you telling me you don't see anything wrong with that? The whole point of is to win the match so you can advance. Not give away free wins. That's not competitive gaming. That's rigging a tournament to make it easier for certain folks to land in the cash. But like you implied with maru, it shouldn't be an issue for him to win right? So then why give them free walk overs into the next group stage? It's clear bracket rigging to create an advantage for certain players.
Also, You don't mention at all in the tournament registration that at least 8 players(invites) get a walkover directly into the second group stage. How do you think your other participants are going to react when they find out pro players are being given a tournament bracket advantage over them for no reason at all other than to make it easier for them to win money? What about the people that were going to sign up as an attendee whether it be as a player or spectator? Have you thought any of this through? Or did someone else put you up to doing this?
Just to be sure: Wasn't this known to you guys from the beginning? I get that there are several advantages and reasonings for laying out the tournament like that but to be honest, I understand that you would know in advance. Nevertheless, if you start in the Ro128 and prize money gets you your entry fee back at Ro32, your chances to make money are better off if the Pros are seeded directly into the Ro16, for example. It protects you, rather than hurts you.
So it’s not stated on the ticket page, but it’s how the first event was run, and had been communicated publicly many times that that’s how the second event would be organized as well.
And yes, obviously it makes very little sense to have Maru and herO play against relative novices. Not to mention it allows us to do things like shoot content with the pros, get them to cast some entry level matches, etc.
Unfortunately delusional people gonna be delusional.
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Yeah, I get that... but I think it wouldn't hurt if a small disclaimer how seedings work could be incorporated for ticket sales 
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On August 26 2026 01:29 PremoBeats wrote:Yeah, I get that... but I think it wouldn't hurt if a small disclaimer how seedings work could be incorporated for ticket sales
Definitely fair!
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the amount of trolling in this thread is scary. SH, this is a fantastic initiative, thank you for organizing this. all the crybabies should go to mommies.
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On August 26 2026 01:49 fLyiNgDroNe wrote:
the amount of trolling in this thread is scary. SH, this is a fantastic initiative, thank you for organizing this. all the crybabies should go to mommies.
Lmao, appreciate you buddy!
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EPT
