Just announced Group A and B

https://twitter.com/ESLSC2/status/1666142964509179906?cxt=HHwWhICwiduMqp8uAAAA

"Welcome to the Winners Stage🏆 Can’t wait to get this going🔥 How about starting the Summer Finals Day 1 broadcast with Maru vs Reynor? You know, just to get that Friday rolling"

Schedule has been released aswell

https://twitter.com/ESLSC2/status/1666901686017744912?cxt=HHwWoICz6Y6Qg6IuAAAA

Talents

Open Stage Brackets

https://twitter.com/ESLSC2/status/1669049612307423244?cxt=HHwWmICz4fDx06kuAAAA

Kreuger

Sweden894 Posts

June 06 2023 18:10 GMT

Clems side is all Terran, easy to prepare atleast

lechatnoir

392 Posts

June 06 2023 20:58 GMT

Serral gets a warm-up! :D

dysenterymd

1250 Posts

June 06 2023 21:02 GMT

Don't love the current format (if I understand it correctly), I feel like seeded players have way more of an advantage than they did in the past. Anyone who didn't get one of the seeds has to go through an insane gauntlet of single-elim if they make it past the open stage.

JJH777

United States4418 Posts

June 06 2023 21:28 GMT

How does Serral almost always get the easiest possible opponent in the first round?

MrBrown

8 Posts

June 07 2023 08:33 GMT

On June 07 2023 06:28 JJH777 wrote:
How does Serral almost always get the easiest possible opponent in the first round?

Seeding. Winners get easy opponents.

tigera6

3495 Posts

June 07 2023 08:44 GMT

I am surprised we end up with all 8 KRs here. I thought the criteria was Combined Standing, aka the EPT points before ESL Summer (not including the one from future tournament like GSL S2), so it should be either NA or EU players who got those 2 spots beside Asia.

Philippe

354 Posts

June 07 2023 10:33 GMT

On June 07 2023 06:28 JJH777 wrote:
How does Serral almost always get the easiest possible opponent in the first round?

Taking the problem from another angle, anything else would be unfair to him given how the standings are. #1 vs a player at the bottom of the directly seeded players ?

datastuff

31 Posts

June 07 2023 12:03 GMT

Maru is #1 seed. KR points are worth more rn bc they're through less of the season. Also the reason solar/gumi are invited over lambo/kela

dysenterymd

1250 Posts

June 07 2023 12:30 GMT

#10

On June 07 2023 21:03 datastuff wrote:
Maru is #1 seed. KR points are worth more rn bc they're through less of the season. Also the reason solar/gumi are invited over lambo/kela

Reynor has fewer EU points (427) than Coffee has Asia points (455), so Reynor is a lower seed than Coffee I think and that's why #1 seed Maru was matched against him. Which doesn't actually reflect skill of course, but outcomes like this are inevitable when you have three non-KR regions with very different skill levels. Giving fewer EPT for winning Americas/Asia than Europe sort of addresses this issue, but clearly not entirely.

datastuff

31 Posts

June 07 2023 13:14 GMT

#11

Yeah it follows the rulebook (it's 267 vs 300 points tho). ESL just didn't account for maxpax when coming up with the rules.

Gina

241 Posts

June 07 2023 14:08 GMT

#12

There's just too few events to have the standings reflect the players' level accurately until the end of the season. They work reasonably for the championship at the end but don't really get to a sufficient sample earlier.

JJH777

United States4418 Posts

June 07 2023 14:09 GMT

#13

On June 07 2023 17:33 MrBrown wrote:

Show nested quote +

Seeding. Winners get easy opponents.

He's not always the first seed. In IEMs 2022 and 2021, he was only the 3rd and 4th seed and most would agree he got the weakest group in both those years. In Serral's first ever win in an event with Koreans he got the weakest foreigner in the first round.

BelethielQT

90 Posts

June 07 2023 14:41 GMT

#14

On June 07 2023 23:09 JJH777 wrote:

Show nested quote +

But he won the Event with the koreans so the first round doesnt matter

TossHeroes

281 Posts

June 07 2023 17:59 GMT

#15

Lots of butthurt Serral haters on this thread lol

The bracket is due to seeding and points. It’s not that complicated.

Why are Maru fans complaining lol? He is on the easier side of the bracket than Serral

Philippe

354 Posts

June 07 2023 18:31 GMT

#16

On June 08 2023 02:59 TossHeroes wrote:
Lots of butthurt Serral haters on this thread lol

The bracket is due to seeding and points. It’s not that complicated.

Why are Maru fans complaining lol? He is on the easier side of the bracket than Serral

Or they are preaching for their own favourite region (whether Asia, Europe, Korea, NA), which is making the bias bound to happen ah.

Kafka777

361 Posts

June 07 2023 19:20 GMT

#17

This is just about the lamest tournament format I have ever seen, however it does fit in with the pseudo swiss format earlier. Only the Swiss format should be used if there were 800 competitors and 1-2 days to play, now this winners stage appears equally adequate and completly unfair and unexciting.

JJH777

United States4418 Posts

June 07 2023 19:50 GMT

#18

On June 07 2023 23:41 BelethielQT wrote:

Show nested quote +

But he won the Event with the koreans so the first round doesnt matter

Every round of an event matters. Advancing over top players 5 times in a row is a lot more impressive than 3 times.

ShowTheLights

Korea (South)1715 Posts

June 07 2023 21:39 GMT

#19

I just never fucking understand ESL brackets

I UNDERSTAND you dont want to RIG brackets

But we get Koreans vs Foreigners in legit tournaments maybe 2-3x a year

And yet more than half of the bracket are FvF or KvK

Like I hate it so much

its EVERY time

Balnazza

Germany1298 Posts

June 07 2023 22:14 GMT

#20

On June 08 2023 04:50 JJH777 wrote:

Show nested quote +

Every round of an event matters. Advancing over top players 5 times in a row is a lot more impressive than 3 times.

Please tell me you are not talking about GSL vs. the World '18, where Serral won 3-0 over Kelazhur and immediately after that destroyed Inno with the same score...
But just to be sure: Do we have to check for every player how they advanced through a tournament, just to check if their wins are "impressive" enough?