On September 20 2017 16:17 FrkFrJss wrote: But, to call the ro16 "Blizzcon Welfare," well first, the ro16 is played out in groups, so there are Koreans versus Koreans, but secondly, a number of Koreans actually lost in this round. It was a surprising result, but from this logic the winner of SSL season 2 and a two-time ro4 GSL player weren't the "real competition in last year's Blizzcon. Arguments can be made about that "ro4 GSL player," but I seriously doubt that the second highest WCS Korea points earner was not thought to be the "real competition."
To be fair, last year was a shitshow in terms of the korean elite anyway. In my opinion, Dark, Stats, Zest, TY, and ByuN were the only players that looked like real contenders. Solar, Patience, and Dear seemed to just play decent most of the time. I wasn't suprised in the slightest that they lost at blizzcon.
I don't even know what was going on in 2016 tbh. Maybe the proleague cancellation, LoTV issues or whatever. But so many guys that showed up in 2015 and 2017 just had no results. I mean myungsik was almost one match of qualifying for blizzcon ffs
For sure, I think the quality was much worse. I mean you look at Zest, and he had a pretty poor last half of 2016, and he was in there...and made it through mainly on the back of PvP (which so did Neeb, but then neither did especially well at Blizzcon last year).
I don't know if the argument can really be made for Solar, who beat a number of the players that were mentioned as being "good" last year. But I do agree that this year, the competition is definitely better (both with regards to the Korean and the foreign side)
The funny thing is, even against TY and Byun, foreigners did not do so badly, with Showtime doing well against Byun and Nerchio go a tight 1-2 against TY.
On September 20 2017 16:17 FrkFrJss wrote: But, to call the ro16 "Blizzcon Welfare," well first, the ro16 is played out in groups, so there are Koreans versus Koreans, but secondly, a number of Koreans actually lost in this round. It was a surprising result, but from this logic the winner of SSL season 2 and a two-time ro4 GSL player weren't the "real competition in last year's Blizzcon. Arguments can be made about that "ro4 GSL player," but I seriously doubt that the second highest WCS Korea points earner was not thought to be the "real competition."
To be fair, last year was a shitshow in terms of the korean elite anyway. In my opinion, Dark, Stats, Zest, TY, and ByuN were the only players that looked like real contenders. Solar, Patience, and Dear seemed to just play decent most of the time. I wasn't suprised in the slightest that they lost at blizzcon.
I don't even know what was going on in 2016 tbh. Maybe the proleague cancellation, LoTV issues or whatever. But so many guys that showed up in 2015 and 2017 just had no results. I mean myungsik was almost one match of qualifying for blizzcon ffs
For sure, I think the quality was much worse. I mean you look at Zest, and he had a pretty poor last half of 2016, and he was in there...and made it through mainly on the back of PvP (which so did Neeb, but then neither did especially well at Blizzcon last year).
I don't know if the argument can really be made for Solar, who beat a number of the players that were mentioned as being "good" last year. But I do agree that this year, the competition is definitely better (both with regards to the Korean and the foreign side)
The funny thing is, even against TY and Byun, foreigners did not do so badly, with Showtime doing well against Byun and Nerchio go a tight 1-2 against TY.
Indeed that ByuN fail against Showtime was hilarious. And that epic throw in TY vs Nerchio g2 gave us a really good series. Nerchio looked like top 3 zerg in the world at that point. It's sad that zest had to lose to stats, he could've put up a really good fight against ByuN considering how much better his PvT was (he 4-1'd byun in kespa cup a few weeks before)
On September 20 2017 16:17 FrkFrJss wrote: But, to call the ro16 "Blizzcon Welfare," well first, the ro16 is played out in groups, so there are Koreans versus Koreans, but secondly, a number of Koreans actually lost in this round. It was a surprising result, but from this logic the winner of SSL season 2 and a two-time ro4 GSL player weren't the "real competition in last year's Blizzcon. Arguments can be made about that "ro4 GSL player," but I seriously doubt that the second highest WCS Korea points earner was not thought to be the "real competition."
To be fair, last year was a shitshow in terms of the korean elite anyway. In my opinion, Dark, Stats, Zest, TY, and ByuN were the only players that looked like real contenders. Solar, Patience, and Dear seemed to just play decent most of the time. I wasn't suprised in the slightest that they lost at blizzcon.
I don't even know what was going on in 2016 tbh. Maybe the proleague cancellation, LoTV issues or whatever. But so many guys that showed up in 2015 and 2017 just had no results. I mean myungsik was almost one match of qualifying for blizzcon ffs
For sure, I think the quality was much worse. I mean you look at Zest, and he had a pretty poor last half of 2016, and he was in there...and made it through mainly on the back of PvP (which so did Neeb, but then neither did especially well at Blizzcon last year).
I don't know if the argument can really be made for Solar, who beat a number of the players that were mentioned as being "good" last year. But I do agree that this year, the competition is definitely better (both with regards to the Korean and the foreign side)
The funny thing is, even against TY and Byun, foreigners did not do so badly, with Showtime doing well against Byun and Nerchio go a tight 1-2 against TY.
I disagree on this point, foreign scene was the worst, not because of Neeb, but because of their level drop, Nerchio, Showtime are nowhere near of last year, uthermal too, Polt isnt there hydra too, TRUE got worse etc, yes we got Serral but it's not enough
On September 20 2017 16:17 FrkFrJss wrote: But, to call the ro16 "Blizzcon Welfare," well first, the ro16 is played out in groups, so there are Koreans versus Koreans, but secondly, a number of Koreans actually lost in this round. It was a surprising result, but from this logic the winner of SSL season 2 and a two-time ro4 GSL player weren't the "real competition in last year's Blizzcon. Arguments can be made about that "ro4 GSL player," but I seriously doubt that the second highest WCS Korea points earner was not thought to be the "real competition."
To be fair, last year was a shitshow in terms of the korean elite anyway. In my opinion, Dark, Stats, Zest, TY, and ByuN were the only players that looked like real contenders. Solar, Patience, and Dear seemed to just play decent most of the time. I wasn't suprised in the slightest that they lost at blizzcon.
I don't even know what was going on in 2016 tbh. Maybe the proleague cancellation, LoTV issues or whatever. But so many guys that showed up in 2015 and 2017 just had no results. I mean myungsik was almost one match of qualifying for blizzcon ffs
For sure, I think the quality was much worse. I mean you look at Zest, and he had a pretty poor last half of 2016, and he was in there...and made it through mainly on the back of PvP (which so did Neeb, but then neither did especially well at Blizzcon last year).
I don't know if the argument can really be made for Solar, who beat a number of the players that were mentioned as being "good" last year. But I do agree that this year, the competition is definitely better (both with regards to the Korean and the foreign side)
The funny thing is, even against TY and Byun, foreigners did not do so badly, with Showtime doing well against Byun and Nerchio go a tight 1-2 against TY.
I disagree on this point, foreign scene was the worst, not because of Neeb, but because of their level drop, Nerchio, Showtime are nowhere near of last year, uthermal too, Polt isnt there hydra too, TRUE got worse etc, yes we got Serral but it's not enough
But you look at who we have: Neeb - Best foreigner right now Serral, Elazer, Snute, and Nerchio: the four best zergs in Europe right now who can take games or even series off of Koreans. TRUE - I mean...he's Korean, so that's got to count for something Kelazhur - He'll probably get destroyed, but I will not forget that he played quite well versus TY. He has the potential to do well in the vT matchup. Special/Major - He had two strong series against TY and Stats. He has the potential to do well against the Koreans as well as the foreigners.
Perhaps the foreign may not be as good as it was last year, but I'm not sure I even entirely agree on this point. Yes, we don't have Hydra and Polt, and TRUE hasn't done as well. But on the other hand, we have a number of other foreigners stepping up. Neeb and Serral have done better this year than last year, Special has definitely stepped it up, and last year, we didn't have consistency.
We had uThermal, Showtime, among others, but we had fewer people who would consistently do well. uThermal dropped off after his win against Neeb (in part because Neeb kept destroying him), and we had MarineLord who dropped off after his loss to Nerchio, and we had Drogo who did well for a couple months and then actually defeated Snute, which was surprising.
And so just with regard to the top 8 foreigners of this year versus last year, I think it's definitely stronger. Whether or not Polt and Hydra would have performed well is rather moot, because they didn't play in the Grand Finals.
I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are sucks right now. So much sucks against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still sucks. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
On September 21 2017 11:37 engesser1 wrote: I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are sucks right now. So much sucks against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still sucks. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
On September 21 2017 11:37 engesser1 wrote: I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are sucks right now. So much sucks against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still sucks. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
On September 21 2017 11:37 engesser1 wrote: I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are sucks right now. So much sucks against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still sucks. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
What
Just replace "sucks" with awesome, and it makes more sense.
On September 21 2017 11:37 engesser1 wrote: I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are sucks right now. So much sucks against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still sucks. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
What
Just replace "sucks" with awesome, and it makes more sense.
On September 21 2017 11:37 engesser1 wrote: I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are sucks right now. So much sucks against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still sucks. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
What
Just replace "sucks" with awesome, and it makes more sense.
Well, it would be difficult to make less sense.
If you change "sucks" with Neeb it's even better :D
On September 21 2017 11:37 engesser1 wrote: I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are sucks right now. So much sucks against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still sucks. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
What
Just replace "sucks" with awesome, and it makes more sense.
Well, it would be difficult to make less sense.
If you change "sucks" with Neeb it's even better :D
I don't know what are you talking about, but all foreigners are Neeb right now. So much Neeb against KR pros dudes. Seriously. Even when scene in Korea is very small, they are all still Neeb. No new builds from them. No metas, no action. Only confused (lame) macro games.
Neeb seriously needs to permanently move to S.Korea if he wants to maximize his skill. It'll be a bit burdensome to fly to international competitions 5x a year to pick up the $100k salary he needs to live on while in Korea, but the real skill increase will come from getting past Ro32 in the GSL.
On September 22 2017 08:19 Arghmyliver wrote: What was the qualifier for this? Zerg is underpowered?
I would say Z is a little bit behind T and P right now. Although Dark is probably the second best player in the world behind Inno
I would agree with this, with the added stipulation that the balance at the very pinnacle of Korean Starcraft is subject to volatile changes depending on individual form. Inno > Dark > Stats, but only by some very slim margins. On a good day, any one of them could beat any one of the others.
EPT
