EPTCommunity Power Rank v5: Blizzcon with Foreigners! - Page 13
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On October 26 2016 05:01 Hider wrote: No you actually directly saying to ignore online performances: So recent online performances has no impact on how well we can expect the players to do in the next offline tournament. It seems like you don't even understand the implications of what you are actually writing. What? Obvivously he can. What the hell are you on? HAHAHA what are you on about. I never said you ignore online performance 100%, I said you cannot use it to say a player is good offline against the kespa players who, with the exception of Byun, almost never play many online cups. So saying "Nerchio has an XX% winrate" means very little, when performs badly in half the real tournaments he's in (against players no where near the level of the Starleague guys). Wait wait hold up...you admit Nerchio can outright LOSE to FOREIGNERS (lost bo5s to scarlett, lilbow, Mlord, and snute) yet he can magically BEAT the best starleague players? You are saying that beating top foreigners is as hard than facing the top Koreans? No offense man but that's laughable. Blimey the salt sure is strong today, can't wait to see the fanboys it when the foreigners all get eliminated. Reminds me of Lilbow 2015 :D | ||
Poopi
France12911 Posts
SC2 is a game with enough variance so that players from the top can lose to other top players in Bo5, especially if you add the form factor and random conditions (Snute being sick in China against Harstem for example). Losing a bo5 to a master (real master, not GM leaving and stuff) while being yourself a top foreigner, is not in the expected variance so you could argue that if you lose to such players, there is no hope for you to win BoX against Koreans since the skill difference is larger than the gap between you and the master. However, losing Bo5 (offline or online) to top foreigners from time to time is expected. If your win rate is otherwise positive versus them you kinda are on the top of the foreign food chain. Plus, if you have a decent win rate against Koreans, even top starleagues players aren't better enough for a loss against you being outside the expected variance. Thus there is a decent chance for you to win, and arguing that you can't win versus a superior player because you lost against an inferior player, is a pure fallacy when the skill differential is low. In fact it happens all the time, even to top Koreans. | ||
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Ej_
47656 Posts
On October 26 2016 07:09 Fango wrote: HAHAHA what are you on about. I never said you ignore online performance 100%, I said you cannot use it to say a player is good offline against the kespa players who, with the exception of Byun, almost never play many online cups. So saying "Nerchio has an XX% winrate" means very little, when performs badly in half the real tournaments he's in (against players no where near the level of the Starleague guys). Wait wait hold up...you admit Nerchio can outright LOSE to FOREIGNERS (lost bo5s to scarlett, lilbow, Mlord, and snute) yet he can magically BEAT the best starleague players? You are saying that beating top foreigners is as hard than facing the top Koreans? No offense man but that's laughable. Blimey the salt sure is strong today, can't wait to see the fanboys it when the foreigners all get eliminated. Reminds me of Lilbow 2015 :D http://aligulac.com/players/26/results/?after=&before=&event=&race=ptzr&country=KR&bestof=all&offline=offline&game=LotV&wcs_season=&wcs_tier=&op= rocket science 2-0 vs TY, 2-0 vs Classic, 1-2 vs Maru fucking scrub can't even beat the retired overwatch player lilbow tho | ||
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Elliot_LuNa1
2 Posts
2. Byun 3. Stats 4. TY 5. Solar 6. Neeb 7. Dear 8. Patience 9. TRUE 10. Nerchio 11. Zest 12. Snute 13. Showtime 14. Ptitdrogo 15. Violet 16. Elazer | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
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Elentos
55566 Posts
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Musicus
Germany23576 Posts
Nerchio should be closer to Neeb though imo. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On October 26 2016 07:31 Ej_ wrote: http://aligulac.com/players/26/results/?after=&before=&event=&race=ptzr&country=KR&bestof=all&offline=offline&game=LotV&wcs_season=&wcs_tier=&op= rocket science 2-0 vs TY, 2-0 vs Classic, 1-2 vs Maru fucking scrub can't even beat the retired overwatch player lilbow tho Just proves the point that the europeans don't play enough games against Koreans to get a viable picture. Nerchio vs TY was last year. The only relevant series he's played are 1-2 Maru, 0-2 classic, and 2-0 patience. Not enough matches to get a viable idea of if he can do well. The only thing we know is that he's "more or less" equal in skill to the fellow top foreigners (scarlett snute Mlord Neeb etc). Which in my opinion puts him a clear rank below the top Koreans (you have to at the very least dominate the foreign scene to be consdered a rival for the starleages champs). Edit: this list a thousands times better than the TL and aligulac ones I'm just gonna put it out there | ||
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Elentos
55566 Posts
On October 27 2016 01:45 Musicus wrote: Very solid list I think! Neeb can be argued I guess, but 6 seems just fine since some would put him higher and some lower. Nerchio should be closer to Neeb though imo. They should be closer by points yeah, although I don't really think it matters if Nerchio is 8, 9 or 10. | ||
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Poopi
France12911 Posts
 , even though Neeb is a bit overrated (depends on the people as said before so it's fine) and Nerchio a bit underrated.Other than that everyone has a reasonable placing! | ||
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Ej_
47656 Posts
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ArtyK
France3143 Posts
On October 27 2016 02:39 Ej_ wrote: Gonna compare the OP to TL PR at every point to confirm that the writers are literally worse than an opinion of an average Joe Such noble work :D | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On October 27 2016 01:36 Elentos wrote: I think ours is better :D Do we know how the TL one was done? Probably an average of x writers? | ||
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On October 27 2016 05:11 The_Red_Viper wrote: :D Do we know how the TL one was done? Probably an average of x writers? I doubt it. Look at the KeSPA cup power rank--the writers as a group don't like foreigners (and Neeb) that much. My guess is that Soularion wrote it alone. The list wasn't too different from his power rank he posted in this thread either. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On October 27 2016 05:16 ZigguratOfUr wrote: I doubt it. Look at the KeSPA cup power rank--the writers as a group don't like foreigners (and Neeb) that much. My guess is that Soularion wrote it alone. The list wasn't too different from his power rank he posted in this thread either. But it was different And the Kespa Cup power rank was written BEFORE Neeb won it, so it's reasonable to assume that some changed their opinions. | ||
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On October 27 2016 05:19 The_Red_Viper wrote: But it was different And the Kespa Cup power rank was written BEFORE Neeb won it, so it's reasonable to assume that some changed their opinions. Maybe Soularion changed his mind a bit after he wrote the power rank. I don't see any of the other writers rating Neeb higher than 5th or 6th despite KeSPA cup. And Destructicon would have ranked him 9th behind all the players from the Korean region. | ||
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Cricketer12
United States13991 Posts
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