EPTApocalypse eSports disbands - Page 8
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ploguidice
United States225 Posts
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Wuster
1974 Posts
On January 28 2016 15:47 Zailyn wrote: I suppose you have to weigh in potential upside compared to potential downside for the players. If they do actually get sent to a few events or get any money out of it, it is totally worth it. Ah well... Another venture down the drain. Well the thing is, the potential downside isn't get stiffed a salary, it's actually footing the bill. But if the players wanted to attend these things anyways, then the potential downside is very low as you say. It sounds like altogether you guys are out $600 dollars for travel. If you were planning to do it anyways, no big deal I suppose. But back to this situation, you can't buy a car without a credit check and you can get a new one for 15 grand. This guy is promising over 10 times that. There has to be some vetting involved and I'm wondering if people involved in the scene are doing that. For instance, I'm in the start-up world and you've never heard of half the companies out there or half the people running them. But they all have to file documents to register a new company. Did you guys even have a license for your team (it's supposed to be a business venture after all)? That would go a long way towards establishing some sort of trust that this isn't just some fly-by-night operation. Lastly, let's be real. I really doubt this guy is in a psych ward. I think he's just moving from con to con and the GF/Wife/Whatever is sick of dealing with the blowback while he hides out. The 'quotes' sound more like what dramatic college kids say than an honest accounting of the situation. I mean, maybe it's possible, just like Quantum's owner magically being cured of cancer once everyone forgot about him. Edit: On January 29 2016 00:52 Kofuku wrote: Also, this contract here (http://sc2online.com/forum/forum/news/general-news/506-new-team-apocalypse-esports-to-disband-%E2%80%8Bmanagement-considering-legal-action-against-the-teams-financier) is not so well done at all to protect the players  I hope this isn't suggestive of what the standard is in western SC2 teams...Now that you mention it, you are right. Premier tournaments, peripherals, among other things are undefined, making those clauses way too vague to enforce. It's a short document and I see a bunch of other fuzzy words too, like pertaining and similar. Also... there's a company name there! Where's it licensed? What's the tax id? Where's the proof that the company actually exists before signing this contract? | ||
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royalroadweed
United States8301 Posts
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Hathrow
Canada18 Posts
On January 28 2016 18:18 Pyloss wrote: I feel sad for Welmu, he now has to pay his travel to DH himself...he really deserves a good and stable team, finally.. I will be personally reimbursing welmu for DH it's not his fault our CEO went off the deep end. | ||
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The_Masked_Shrimp
425 Posts
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RoomOfMush
1296 Posts
On January 29 2016 03:41 The_Masked_Shrimp wrote: What will legal pursuit accomplish exactly since the owner is in a psychiatric hospital and obviously broke; it won't magically bring them their money back even if they will obviously win. For the off-chance he is lying about that too and is just trying to scam people. (Although I dont really see how he could have scammed anyone with this) | ||
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Phredxor
New Zealand15076 Posts
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
On January 29 2016 03:41 The_Masked_Shrimp wrote: What will legal pursuit accomplish exactly since the owner is in a psychiatric hospital and obviously broke; it won't magically bring them their money back even if they will obviously win. Yeah, lol. Owner pretty much has an insanity defense unless he's lying about that too. | ||
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Tenks
United States3104 Posts
On January 29 2016 03:41 The_Masked_Shrimp wrote: What will legal pursuit accomplish exactly since the owner is in a psychiatric hospital and obviously broke; it won't magically bring them their money back even if they will obviously win. It would probably cost 100x more in legal fees than the probably fairly insignificant (obviously not to all parties involved but in the grand scheme of things) money involved | ||
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Wuster
1974 Posts
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TRaFFiC
Canada1448 Posts
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desRow
Canada2654 Posts
On January 28 2016 22:06 SmykuToronto wrote: I don't find owner's situation funny if it's true that he has a mental problems. However, how can I have respect for players who had shown such high level of delusion and incompetence? Internet is full of crazy people and frauds with retarded projects and Starcraft scene had experienced this type of situations before. Players concerned did not became pros this year and they must have heard about some of those fiascos. If you have a person contacting you and saying "I want to have a team. We have no sponsors and I pay out of my pocket." and you do not raise any relevant questions, you are laugh-worthy. From Desrow video, it seems that they had no idea where exactly would money come from before they learned about whole mental ward thing. This is a level of wishful thinking comparable only with clicking those "earn 10000000$ without leaving house" ads. And it's not even like anyone's laughing at someone's great tragedy. According to Desrow players were owed 2000 which is not that much given there were 7 players on Apocalypse roster. It sucks but it is manageable. That's the thing tho, the management running the team below the "crazy" owner were running a tight ship and the plans and ambitions and our salaries made sense. Nothing was "too good to be true" There has been Venture Capital before in the scene. I personally spoke to the "CEO" on skype and he was 8/10 or 9/10 at lying. Never hesitated to my questions, was smooth as a cat. I don't see why it's that big of a deal and you lose respect for us. We all wasted 12 days but no one was hurt. Welmu was gonna send himself to dreamhack anyway and he's the only one that "loss" something but I think the management will try to help him with that cost. On January 28 2016 23:24 Kaizor wrote: Firstly, i feel bad for all the pro gamers concerned. Major, Welmu, Desrow... But i feel like all Pro Gamers should learn something from all this short-lived team's incidents by now. SC2 is not going to be the ideal scene to throw money in. It just doesn't make sense from a business point of view. It's a relatively small scene especially when you compare it to the other hugely popular games in Esports like CS:GO and DOTA2 or LOL. If i had the money and think Esports has a bright future, why shouldn't i be throwing money into the more popular games? So if somebody comes forward with an idea of starting a new SC2 team, check the freaking finances first. Is the money guaranteed. You cannot just trust the person just because he seems or sounds trustworthy ( as stated by desrow in his vlog) Look i have seen children who can lie with a totally innocent look and be oscar-worthy. So don't talk about adults. I disagree. Breaking into Dota2 or CSGO is insanely expensive. Like 6 figures for a year expensive, unless you go for Tier 3 or Tier 2 teams and then good luck finding a sponsor. This team had around a 1500$/salary cost per month for players and we had 3 potential players for Blizzcon (Welmu, Soul and Major) This investment would be able to break ROI much faster than investing in Tier 2 or 3 DotA and CSGO teams imho | ||
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OveRtheStarS
Canada69 Posts
I don't see why it's that big of a deal and you lose respect for us. We all wasted 12 days but no one was hurt. Welmu was gonna send himself to dreamhack anyway and he's the only one that "loss" something but I think the management will try to help him with that cost. This is a good point. Shady owner and lack of due diligence aside, at least there wasn't much harm and it folded early. It could have been worse. | ||
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SuperHofmann
Italy1741 Posts
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TelecoM
United States10646 Posts
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TelecoM
United States10646 Posts
On January 29 2016 06:48 desRow wrote: This team had around a 1500$/salary cost per month So how much was actually paid out? If there was 1500 a month allotted, then the team seemingly shouldn't have to have disbanded in less than 2 weeks time. Also, 1500$ a month for NA player? Mmmhmmmm..... | ||
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Orr
United States168 Posts
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RhYS3311
1 Post
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Wuster
1974 Posts
On February 01 2016 01:12 RhYS3311 wrote: This is what happens when we don't have a regulations committee. We are becoming large enough (esports as a whole) to have things like this in place. This will keep happening as long as something like this isn't in place What exactly do you think Kespa is? Edit: Nm I thought you were writing in the Life thread. I'll leave my non-sequitur up for posterity I guess =x | ||
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