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Please clean up the quality of your posting. This thread has definitely taken a turn for the worse. |
On June 16 2014 09:34 dsousa wrote:
The problem I have with this is that there is no measure to what "words" are hurtful enough to warrant punishment.
This person hurt another persons feelings, but he didn't swear, he didn't break any rules, he just attacked a popular player. If what he said was 50% as offensive would he be banned? 80%? Where is the threshhold? Its an arbitrary punishment for an arbitrary crime.
So while I love Minigun, and never heard of Ruff, I'm overall against the idea of a witch hunt over words conveyed via the internet.
Its just words.
Keystrokes cannot hurt me, and IMHO you're wasting your energy if you let them effect you.
SC2 is wasting its energy with this nonsense.
My fucking god, if your dog just died and someone in an sc2 game knew this and said "haha im glad your dog died", it would obviously make you think about your dog who just died and it would fucking hurt, whether you would want to let it hurt or not. Sometimes I wonder if people actually think about what they're posting before they post it. That example is far worse than calling someone a cunt or a fucker or whatever because it's not venting and you know you're hurting the person if you say it. In the OP case Minigun was in a life threatening situation, not his dog, not his friend, HIM. So ya, he only posted words, the words weren't the issue, the intent behind the words is the issue.
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On June 16 2014 08:33 Peters821 wrote:
I agree what Ruff said was wrong, but one must look at the context of everything. I have watched Ruff's stream for about 2 years now. I probably watch his stream more than anyone.
Root players have been sniping him in the last 2 months. Not only sniping, but they have came into his chat and bm him. They have said things that have crossed the line. Was anything done? This is why I don't respect Root players. I have seen Root players like fayth, drewbie, caliber all guilty of that. There are probably more Root players but I can't recall the names at this time. They made it obvious they were sniping him as they were in the chat while playing Ruff. In addition, if you look at caliber's match history, 60-70% of his games were against Ruff.
I don't agree with IVD's punishment. I am assuming they watch Ruff's stream. If they did, they would understand the events that pushed Ruff to lash out. The punishment is way too severe. I think a 30 day suspension would be more appropriate. I hope IVD will reconsider. Root players should be punished as well for their actions.
Yeah, Root players are known to harass known North Americans online such as personalities such as Ruff or cyber bully Avilo on a weekly basis. Still does not give Ruff the right. I mean we have multiple people on TL and in the scene with cancer and other terrible diseases that Ruff knows fully about, he deserved to be kicked.
If Ruff was being harassed, there are more mature ways to handle it.
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China6329 Posts
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On June 16 2014 10:00 knOxStarcraft wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 09:34 dsousa wrote:
The problem I have with this is that there is no measure to what "words" are hurtful enough to warrant punishment.
This person hurt another persons feelings, but he didn't swear, he didn't break any rules, he just attacked a popular player. If what he said was 50% as offensive would he be banned? 80%? Where is the threshhold? Its an arbitrary punishment for an arbitrary crime.
So while I love Minigun, and never heard of Ruff, I'm overall against the idea of a witch hunt over words conveyed via the internet.
Its just words.
Keystrokes cannot hurt me, and IMHO you're wasting your energy if you let them effect you.
SC2 is wasting its energy with this nonsense. My fucking god, if your dog just died and someone in an sc2 game knew this and said "haha im glad your dog died", it would obviously make you think about your dog who just died and it would fucking hurt, whether you would want to let it hurt or not. Sometimes I wonder if people actually think about what they're posting before they post it. That example is far worse than calling someone a cunt or a fucker or whatever because it's not venting and you know you're hurting the person if you say it. In the OP case Minigun was in a life threatening situation, not his dog, not his friend, HIM. So ya, he only posted words, the words weren't the issue, the intent behind the words is the issue.
No no you don't understand. See, feelings no real. Also everyone is immune to anything said on the internet, it is literally impossible for someone to hurt you emotionally online.
Oh to have the invincible adamantium armour that these people supposedly have when it comes to their emotions. I guess the mistaken idea that words can't hurt someone comes from either a place of ignorance or insincerity. I wonder if these people have ever been bullied before. Most bullying isn't physical, it's emotional and it's very real. Feel free to tell the millions of bullied children that their feelings aren't real and that words can't hurt them. It's a fucking myth buried in obsolete understanding and societal norms.
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HEY! Santa Claus is too real! A real marketing tool for the Coca Cola Corporation
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On June 16 2014 09:44 Circumstance wrote:
On a (hopefully) lighter note: What the hell kind of an insult is "sick boy"? How is that even supposed to be used in any kind of context other than stating a fact? Yes, Chad is male, and he recently dealt with a medical issue. You wouldn't use the phrase "sick boy" for insulting a stranger, you wouldn't use it while ribbing someone you know. It's just a weird choice of wording in the first place.
Well the thing is abusing facts to hurt people is the most effective way and is actually worse than curse words. You can't shrug off sick boy if you are sick and suffering. It's just an extremely mean thing to say even though the words itself arent per se. And then he also added the part about begging for money which is totally untrue.
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On June 16 2014 08:33 Doodsmack wrote:
Team ROOT isn't exactly putting its best foot forward itself when Minigun goes to Twitter to address the situation, and his teammate iaguz comments "What a cunt".
Oh come on, that's like the weakest attempt at changing direction I have ever read..
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On June 16 2014 10:01 LingBlingBling wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 08:33 Peters821 wrote:
I agree what Ruff said was wrong, but one must look at the context of everything. I have watched Ruff's stream for about 2 years now. I probably watch his stream more than anyone.
Root players have been sniping him in the last 2 months. Not only sniping, but they have came into his chat and bm him. They have said things that have crossed the line. Was anything done? This is why I don't respect Root players. I have seen Root players like fayth, drewbie, caliber all guilty of that. There are probably more Root players but I can't recall the names at this time. They made it obvious they were sniping him as they were in the chat while playing Ruff. In addition, if you look at caliber's match history, 60-70% of his games were against Ruff.
I don't agree with IVD's punishment. I am assuming they watch Ruff's stream. If they did, they would understand the events that pushed Ruff to lash out. The punishment is way too severe. I think a 30 day suspension would be more appropriate. I hope IVD will reconsider. Root players should be punished as well for their actions. Yeah, Root players are known to harass known North Americans online such as personalities such as Ruff or cyber bully Avilo on a weekly basis. Still does not give Ruff the right. I mean we have multiple people on TL and in the scene with cancer and other terrible diseases that Ruff knows fully about, he deserved to be kicked.
Dude seriously you are wrong in the statement - Root are known to harass ..."online personalities" I disagree with this. Most root members in general are cool to anyone who is nice.
The verbal harassment done by avilo and ruff to the root players is ridiculous. Why do you expect root to be nice back to trolls? #TwitchChatCancer They say as much as they can just to try and get a response and a little attention. The fact that they lie and are aggressive doesn't legitimize their actions. You are just wrong in making a general statement like that.
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On June 16 2014 09:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 09:27 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:06 Swagasaurus wrote:On June 16 2014 08:23 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
You heard it here first guys, "Narcissism" = knowing more than somebody else.
All those narcissistic doctors, lawyers, plumbers, car mechanics... how dare they be more knowledgeable in a field than someone else and how dare their opinion carry more weight.
Narcissism = comparing urself to doctors and lawyers while you're bashing random people on the internet. Can you stop having flame wars in every single TL thread u post in? In your expert opinion, is it really appropriate to keep doing that? Was going to say this but he beat me to it. TB no one with a brain is going to dispute that you know what you're talking about when it comes to video games. It's just the way you go about attacking anyone who disagrees with you that comes across as really nasty/arrogant. Just because you've had a successful career in the field of video games that doesn't mean your opinion on non-game related subjects is any more or less 'valuable'. But we are talking about game related subjects, so that's irrelevant. Maybe if people didn't want flamewars they shouldn't be hurling insults at me whenever they get the chance *shrug*. You mistake attacking people for defense, I don't go out of my way to attack people, they start shit with me and then they complain that I respond in kind. "Oh, I called that guy an arrogant hypocritical narcissist and now he doesn't seem to want to treat me with respect, I wonder how that happened?". Well gee I dunno, maybe some of the armchair psychologists in this thread could tell you. Not sure if lying or delusional. What a wannabe martyr. Took about 2 seconds to find something worth discrediting your claim here. On December 19 2013 12:48 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 19 2013 11:54 GraFx wrote:
this is the first piece youve written that didnt make me hate you. kudos. If it makes you feel any better about that I think you're a little shit :x On December 17 2013 09:09 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 17 2013 08:55 IcedBacon wrote:
Yeah... can't wait for bitcoins to crash :p "Can't wait for this prizepool and event to be ruined, presumably because I'm a terrible person" Nice *defense* Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples. Is this not obvious, oh wise one? Nice job linking quotes that supposedly debunk my argument when both of them were attacks. One wished ill on the event, the players and myself by gloating over the possibility of bitcoins crashing, the other said "oh grats, this is the first time I don't hate you", a completely unnecessary and unprovoked insult. You might wanna try harder if you're looking for evidence that what I say is unprovoked. You might wanna dig even deeper to find a response that is actually offensive and not tongue-in-cheek. The little kissy face not give it away that I wasn't being particularly serious? Do I have to spell it out? Unsurprisingly you are also attacking me, including such choice phrases as "lying" "delusional" and "wannabe martyr". Next time, try coming into a discussion with clean hands. Show nested quote +
The problem I have with this is that there is no measure to what "words" are hurtful enough to warrant punishment.
This person hurt another persons feelings, but he didn't swear, he didn't break any rules, he just attacked a popular player. If what he said was 50% as offensive would he be banned? 80%? Where is the threshhold? Its an arbitrary punishment for an arbitrary crime.
So while I love Minigun, and never heard of Ruff, I'm overall against the idea of a witch hunt over words conveyed via the internet.
Its just words.
Keystrokes cannot hurt me, and IMHO you're wasting your energy if you let them effect you.
Nobody in their right mind actually believes this. Of course words hurt. Keystrokes can't hurt you? Pretty sure they can, you are simply fortunate enough not to have had to suffer someone going after you in a really personal way. I hope you never do.
If you are the authority on what is "attacking" and what is "defending," then I have no doubt that you will always be 100% right in your own mind. You embellished your perspective so hard in saying "One wished ill on the event, the players and myself by gloating over the possibility of bitcoins crashing, the other said "oh grats, this is the first time I don't hate you", a completely unnecessary and unprovoked insult." So I guess the answer was delusional.
Nice job dodging this part "Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples." Did it seem irrelevant in this context to you?
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Can we all just focus on the game instead of being this drama-centric?
People said some shit, consequence happened. Move the fuck on.
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On June 16 2014 10:12 Xiphos wrote:
Can we all just focus on the game instead of being this drama-centric?
People said some shit, consequence happened. Move the fuck on.
The Internet never moves on. It waits and then brings up the same things again at the appropriate moment
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On June 16 2014 10:10 VasHeR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 09:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:27 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:06 Swagasaurus wrote:On June 16 2014 08:23 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
You heard it here first guys, "Narcissism" = knowing more than somebody else.
All those narcissistic doctors, lawyers, plumbers, car mechanics... how dare they be more knowledgeable in a field than someone else and how dare their opinion carry more weight.
Narcissism = comparing urself to doctors and lawyers while you're bashing random people on the internet. Can you stop having flame wars in every single TL thread u post in? In your expert opinion, is it really appropriate to keep doing that? Was going to say this but he beat me to it. TB no one with a brain is going to dispute that you know what you're talking about when it comes to video games. It's just the way you go about attacking anyone who disagrees with you that comes across as really nasty/arrogant. Just because you've had a successful career in the field of video games that doesn't mean your opinion on non-game related subjects is any more or less 'valuable'. But we are talking about game related subjects, so that's irrelevant. Maybe if people didn't want flamewars they shouldn't be hurling insults at me whenever they get the chance *shrug*. You mistake attacking people for defense, I don't go out of my way to attack people, they start shit with me and then they complain that I respond in kind. "Oh, I called that guy an arrogant hypocritical narcissist and now he doesn't seem to want to treat me with respect, I wonder how that happened?". Well gee I dunno, maybe some of the armchair psychologists in this thread could tell you. Not sure if lying or delusional. What a wannabe martyr. Took about 2 seconds to find something worth discrediting your claim here. On December 19 2013 12:48 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 19 2013 11:54 GraFx wrote:
this is the first piece youve written that didnt make me hate you. kudos. If it makes you feel any better about that I think you're a little shit :x On December 17 2013 09:09 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 17 2013 08:55 IcedBacon wrote:
Yeah... can't wait for bitcoins to crash :p "Can't wait for this prizepool and event to be ruined, presumably because I'm a terrible person" Nice *defense* Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples. Is this not obvious, oh wise one? Nice job linking quotes that supposedly debunk my argument when both of them were attacks. One wished ill on the event, the players and myself by gloating over the possibility of bitcoins crashing, the other said "oh grats, this is the first time I don't hate you", a completely unnecessary and unprovoked insult. You might wanna try harder if you're looking for evidence that what I say is unprovoked. You might wanna dig even deeper to find a response that is actually offensive and not tongue-in-cheek. The little kissy face not give it away that I wasn't being particularly serious? Do I have to spell it out? Unsurprisingly you are also attacking me, including such choice phrases as "lying" "delusional" and "wannabe martyr". Next time, try coming into a discussion with clean hands.
The problem I have with this is that there is no measure to what "words" are hurtful enough to warrant punishment.
This person hurt another persons feelings, but he didn't swear, he didn't break any rules, he just attacked a popular player. If what he said was 50% as offensive would he be banned? 80%? Where is the threshhold? Its an arbitrary punishment for an arbitrary crime.
So while I love Minigun, and never heard of Ruff, I'm overall against the idea of a witch hunt over words conveyed via the internet.
Its just words.
Keystrokes cannot hurt me, and IMHO you're wasting your energy if you let them effect you.
Nobody in their right mind actually believes this. Of course words hurt. Keystrokes can't hurt you? Pretty sure they can, you are simply fortunate enough not to have had to suffer someone going after you in a really personal way. I hope you never do. If you are the judge on what is "attacking" and what is "defending," then I have no doubt that you will always be 100% right in your own mind. So I guess the answer was delusional. Nice job dodging this part "Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples." Did it seem irrelevant in this context to you?
Nice attempt to dodge the debunk of your supposed "evidence". Glad to see you bailed on it quickly though, trying to argue that you somehow proved that I go around attacking people with those quotes would have been a waste of everyones time.
See, I already get held to a higher standard of conduct, which is demonstrated by the fact that I can't post in a thread without someone trying to hold me to account for something or other. Literally everything I say online has some sort of consequence, I'm still getting shit on for dumb things I said 7 years ago. I've quite literally received death-threats for confusing an 8-bit pixel art characters gender. So don't talk to me about higher standard of conduct. My higher standard of conduct is trying to bring some common sense into the discussion, sharing my experience when it's relevant and not mocking people who have chronic diseases. That and not attacking people unprovoked. Higher standards does not give you carte blanche to go after me with your insults and attacks and then have you retreat to some imagined refuge when you get bitten back for doing so. You will not get a "Thank you for your feedback" message from me, I'm not customer service and you're not a customer, I don't have to put up with your shit, thank god.
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On June 16 2014 10:16 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 10:10 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:27 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:06 Swagasaurus wrote:On June 16 2014 08:23 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
You heard it here first guys, "Narcissism" = knowing more than somebody else.
All those narcissistic doctors, lawyers, plumbers, car mechanics... how dare they be more knowledgeable in a field than someone else and how dare their opinion carry more weight.
Narcissism = comparing urself to doctors and lawyers while you're bashing random people on the internet. Can you stop having flame wars in every single TL thread u post in? In your expert opinion, is it really appropriate to keep doing that? Was going to say this but he beat me to it. TB no one with a brain is going to dispute that you know what you're talking about when it comes to video games. It's just the way you go about attacking anyone who disagrees with you that comes across as really nasty/arrogant. Just because you've had a successful career in the field of video games that doesn't mean your opinion on non-game related subjects is any more or less 'valuable'. But we are talking about game related subjects, so that's irrelevant. Maybe if people didn't want flamewars they shouldn't be hurling insults at me whenever they get the chance *shrug*. You mistake attacking people for defense, I don't go out of my way to attack people, they start shit with me and then they complain that I respond in kind. "Oh, I called that guy an arrogant hypocritical narcissist and now he doesn't seem to want to treat me with respect, I wonder how that happened?". Well gee I dunno, maybe some of the armchair psychologists in this thread could tell you. Not sure if lying or delusional. What a wannabe martyr. Took about 2 seconds to find something worth discrediting your claim here. On December 19 2013 12:48 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 19 2013 11:54 GraFx wrote:
this is the first piece youve written that didnt make me hate you. kudos. If it makes you feel any better about that I think you're a little shit :x On December 17 2013 09:09 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 17 2013 08:55 IcedBacon wrote:
Yeah... can't wait for bitcoins to crash :p "Can't wait for this prizepool and event to be ruined, presumably because I'm a terrible person" Nice *defense* Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples. Is this not obvious, oh wise one? Nice job linking quotes that supposedly debunk my argument when both of them were attacks. One wished ill on the event, the players and myself by gloating over the possibility of bitcoins crashing, the other said "oh grats, this is the first time I don't hate you", a completely unnecessary and unprovoked insult. You might wanna try harder if you're looking for evidence that what I say is unprovoked. You might wanna dig even deeper to find a response that is actually offensive and not tongue-in-cheek. The little kissy face not give it away that I wasn't being particularly serious? Do I have to spell it out? Unsurprisingly you are also attacking me, including such choice phrases as "lying" "delusional" and "wannabe martyr". Next time, try coming into a discussion with clean hands.
The problem I have with this is that there is no measure to what "words" are hurtful enough to warrant punishment.
This person hurt another persons feelings, but he didn't swear, he didn't break any rules, he just attacked a popular player. If what he said was 50% as offensive would he be banned? 80%? Where is the threshhold? Its an arbitrary punishment for an arbitrary crime.
So while I love Minigun, and never heard of Ruff, I'm overall against the idea of a witch hunt over words conveyed via the internet.
Its just words.
Keystrokes cannot hurt me, and IMHO you're wasting your energy if you let them effect you.
Nobody in their right mind actually believes this. Of course words hurt. Keystrokes can't hurt you? Pretty sure they can, you are simply fortunate enough not to have had to suffer someone going after you in a really personal way. I hope you never do. If you are the judge on what is "attacking" and what is "defending," then I have no doubt that you will always be 100% right in your own mind. So I guess the answer was delusional. Nice job dodging this part "Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples." Did it seem irrelevant in this context to you? Nice attempt to dodge the debunk of your supposed "evidence". Glad to see you bailed on it quickly though, trying to argue that you somehow proved that I go around attacking people with those quotes would have been a waste of everyones time. See, I already get held to a higher standard of conduct, which is demonstrated by the fact that I can't post in a thread without someone trying to hold me to account for something or other. Literally everything I say online has some sort of consequence, I'm still getting shit on for dumb things I said 7 years ago. I've quite literally received death-threats for confusing an 8-bit pixel art characters gender. So don't talk to me about higher standard of conduct. My higher standard of conduct is trying to bring some common sense into the discussion, sharing my experience when it's relevant and not mocking people who have chronic diseases. That and not attacking people unprovoked. Higher standards does not give you carte blanche to go after me with your insults and attacks and then have you retreat to some imagined refuge when you get bitten back for doing so. You will not get a "Thank you for your feedback" message from me, I'm not customer service and you're not a customer, I don't have to put up with your shit, thank god.
What dodge? I said you embellished. That seemed pretty direct.
More delusions
P.S. "See, I already get held to a higher standard of conduct, which is demonstrated by the fact that I can't post in a thread without someone trying to hold me to account for something or other." You misunderstand this concept.
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On June 16 2014 10:19 VasHeR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 10:16 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 10:10 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:27 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:06 Swagasaurus wrote:On June 16 2014 08:23 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
You heard it here first guys, "Narcissism" = knowing more than somebody else.
All those narcissistic doctors, lawyers, plumbers, car mechanics... how dare they be more knowledgeable in a field than someone else and how dare their opinion carry more weight.
Narcissism = comparing urself to doctors and lawyers while you're bashing random people on the internet. Can you stop having flame wars in every single TL thread u post in? In your expert opinion, is it really appropriate to keep doing that? Was going to say this but he beat me to it. TB no one with a brain is going to dispute that you know what you're talking about when it comes to video games. It's just the way you go about attacking anyone who disagrees with you that comes across as really nasty/arrogant. Just because you've had a successful career in the field of video games that doesn't mean your opinion on non-game related subjects is any more or less 'valuable'. But we are talking about game related subjects, so that's irrelevant. Maybe if people didn't want flamewars they shouldn't be hurling insults at me whenever they get the chance *shrug*. You mistake attacking people for defense, I don't go out of my way to attack people, they start shit with me and then they complain that I respond in kind. "Oh, I called that guy an arrogant hypocritical narcissist and now he doesn't seem to want to treat me with respect, I wonder how that happened?". Well gee I dunno, maybe some of the armchair psychologists in this thread could tell you. Not sure if lying or delusional. What a wannabe martyr. Took about 2 seconds to find something worth discrediting your claim here. On December 19 2013 12:48 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 19 2013 11:54 GraFx wrote:
this is the first piece youve written that didnt make me hate you. kudos. If it makes you feel any better about that I think you're a little shit :x On December 17 2013 09:09 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 17 2013 08:55 IcedBacon wrote:
Yeah... can't wait for bitcoins to crash :p "Can't wait for this prizepool and event to be ruined, presumably because I'm a terrible person" Nice *defense* Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples. Is this not obvious, oh wise one? Nice job linking quotes that supposedly debunk my argument when both of them were attacks. One wished ill on the event, the players and myself by gloating over the possibility of bitcoins crashing, the other said "oh grats, this is the first time I don't hate you", a completely unnecessary and unprovoked insult. You might wanna try harder if you're looking for evidence that what I say is unprovoked. You might wanna dig even deeper to find a response that is actually offensive and not tongue-in-cheek. The little kissy face not give it away that I wasn't being particularly serious? Do I have to spell it out? Unsurprisingly you are also attacking me, including such choice phrases as "lying" "delusional" and "wannabe martyr". Next time, try coming into a discussion with clean hands.
The problem I have with this is that there is no measure to what "words" are hurtful enough to warrant punishment.
This person hurt another persons feelings, but he didn't swear, he didn't break any rules, he just attacked a popular player. If what he said was 50% as offensive would he be banned? 80%? Where is the threshhold? Its an arbitrary punishment for an arbitrary crime.
So while I love Minigun, and never heard of Ruff, I'm overall against the idea of a witch hunt over words conveyed via the internet.
Its just words.
Keystrokes cannot hurt me, and IMHO you're wasting your energy if you let them effect you.
Nobody in their right mind actually believes this. Of course words hurt. Keystrokes can't hurt you? Pretty sure they can, you are simply fortunate enough not to have had to suffer someone going after you in a really personal way. I hope you never do. If you are the judge on what is "attacking" and what is "defending," then I have no doubt that you will always be 100% right in your own mind. So I guess the answer was delusional. Nice job dodging this part "Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples." Did it seem irrelevant in this context to you? Nice attempt to dodge the debunk of your supposed "evidence". Glad to see you bailed on it quickly though, trying to argue that you somehow proved that I go around attacking people with those quotes would have been a waste of everyones time. See, I already get held to a higher standard of conduct, which is demonstrated by the fact that I can't post in a thread without someone trying to hold me to account for something or other. Literally everything I say online has some sort of consequence, I'm still getting shit on for dumb things I said 7 years ago. I've quite literally received death-threats for confusing an 8-bit pixel art characters gender. So don't talk to me about higher standard of conduct. My higher standard of conduct is trying to bring some common sense into the discussion, sharing my experience when it's relevant and not mocking people who have chronic diseases. That and not attacking people unprovoked. Higher standards does not give you carte blanche to go after me with your insults and attacks and then have you retreat to some imagined refuge when you get bitten back for doing so. You will not get a "Thank you for your feedback" message from me, I'm not customer service and you're not a customer, I don't have to put up with your shit, thank god. What dodge? I said you embellished. That seemed pretty direct. More delusions
And now you dodge the rest of the post.
I said you embellished.
Well that and you called me a lying, delusional wannabe martyr, or had you forgotten that? I didn't embellish anything, I gave my perspective on things I said (how dare I know my own intent, shameful!).
You misunderstand this concept.
I understand the concept quite clearly. I also understand it's extremely easy to try and lecture from a place of no consequence. How easy it is to tell someone they should act to a higher standard when you don't have to do it yourself. Armchair morality at its finest. You have misunderstood the concept of the moral highground, something you cease to hold when you decide to call people lying, delusional wannabe martyrs while simultaneously trying to lecture them on how they should treat others. You've done a fantastic job of proving my point that my posts are in response to attacks.
I think we're about done here. There's little value to be extracted from this discussion anymore, or at least none that's worth the effort.
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I fail to see what's there to misunderstand. People still bring up that tweet every time TB has a post in a thread like this, hell everyone except TB look at the SC reddit, there's about 100 comments about the same damn thing because of his tweet earlier today banning Ruff from Clan Wars
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On June 16 2014 10:26 showstealer1829 wrote:
I fail to see what's there to misunderstand. People still bring up that tweet every time TB has a post in a thread like this, hell everyone except TB look at the SC reddit, there's about 100 comments about the same damn thing because of his tweet earlier today banning Ruff from Clan Wars
The community as a whole gets exactly what it deserves. It wants to be hyper-critical towards its pros/personalities, live and breath drama? Take great delight in tearing people down? Well then the only people that leaves are players and personalities who have had to adapt to that and harden against peoples constant negativity. The number of pros and personalities still posting here and on Reddit is a tiny fraction of the guys who are still around, most gave up because it wasn't worth it anymore. I wish I could quit them too, I'd be a lot happier.
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On June 16 2014 10:10 tokinho wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 10:01 LingBlingBling wrote:On June 16 2014 08:33 Peters821 wrote:
I agree what Ruff said was wrong, but one must look at the context of everything. I have watched Ruff's stream for about 2 years now. I probably watch his stream more than anyone.
Root players have been sniping him in the last 2 months. Not only sniping, but they have came into his chat and bm him. They have said things that have crossed the line. Was anything done? This is why I don't respect Root players. I have seen Root players like fayth, drewbie, caliber all guilty of that. There are probably more Root players but I can't recall the names at this time. They made it obvious they were sniping him as they were in the chat while playing Ruff. In addition, if you look at caliber's match history, 60-70% of his games were against Ruff.
I don't agree with IVD's punishment. I am assuming they watch Ruff's stream. If they did, they would understand the events that pushed Ruff to lash out. The punishment is way too severe. I think a 30 day suspension would be more appropriate. I hope IVD will reconsider. Root players should be punished as well for their actions. Yeah, Root players are known to harass known North Americans online such as personalities such as Ruff or cyber bully Avilo on a weekly basis. Still does not give Ruff the right. I mean we have multiple people on TL and in the scene with cancer and other terrible diseases that Ruff knows fully about, he deserved to be kicked. Dude seriously you are wrong in the statement - Root are known to harass ..."online personalities" I disagree with this. Most root members in general are cool to anyone who is nice. The verbal harassment done by avilo and ruff to the root players is ridiculous. Why do you expect root to be nice back to trolls? #TwitchChatCancer They say as much as they can just to try and get a response and a little attention. The fact that they lie and are aggressive doesn't legitimize their actions. You are just wrong in making a general statement like that.
Avilo does not harass people, snipe people. He balances whines about a game big deal, it hurts no one. Root takes things to far, they enjoy harassing these types of people. It's wrong. They will sit there harass him on twitter, snipe him for his entire stream session, and harass his chat on a almost weekly basis.
Root been known to do this since back in 2011 vs tons of players on NA. It's not exactly a secret. Still does not give ruff the right to say what he said though.
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On June 16 2014 10:31 LingBlingBling wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 10:10 tokinho wrote:On June 16 2014 10:01 LingBlingBling wrote:On June 16 2014 08:33 Peters821 wrote:
I agree what Ruff said was wrong, but one must look at the context of everything. I have watched Ruff's stream for about 2 years now. I probably watch his stream more than anyone.
Root players have been sniping him in the last 2 months. Not only sniping, but they have came into his chat and bm him. They have said things that have crossed the line. Was anything done? This is why I don't respect Root players. I have seen Root players like fayth, drewbie, caliber all guilty of that. There are probably more Root players but I can't recall the names at this time. They made it obvious they were sniping him as they were in the chat while playing Ruff. In addition, if you look at caliber's match history, 60-70% of his games were against Ruff.
I don't agree with IVD's punishment. I am assuming they watch Ruff's stream. If they did, they would understand the events that pushed Ruff to lash out. The punishment is way too severe. I think a 30 day suspension would be more appropriate. I hope IVD will reconsider. Root players should be punished as well for their actions. Yeah, Root players are known to harass known North Americans online such as personalities such as Ruff or cyber bully Avilo on a weekly basis. Still does not give Ruff the right. I mean we have multiple people on TL and in the scene with cancer and other terrible diseases that Ruff knows fully about, he deserved to be kicked. Dude seriously you are wrong in the statement - Root are known to harass ..."online personalities" I disagree with this. Most root members in general are cool to anyone who is nice. The verbal harassment done by avilo and ruff to the root players is ridiculous. Why do you expect root to be nice back to trolls? #TwitchChatCancer They say as much as they can just to try and get a response and a little attention. The fact that they lie and are aggressive doesn't legitimize their actions. You are just wrong in making a general statement like that. Avilo does not harass people, snipe people. He balances whines about a game big deal, it hurts no one. Root takes things to far, they enjoy harassing these types of people. It's wrong. They will sit there harass him on twitter, snipe him for his entire stream session, and harass his chat on a almost weekly basis. Root been known to do this since back in 2011 vs tons of players on NA. It's not exactly a secret. Still does not give ruff the right to say what he said though.
Avilo is a constant torrent of public negativity towards SC2 and none of it is constructive. I guess it is fortunate that he isn't known for publicly BMing people otherwise he'd be the perfect little ball of angst. If I actually followed Avilo I'd probably believe that SC2 was the most unbalanced shitty game in existence and not want to be involved in it. If you need any proof of that, you can have a look at his Twitter feed, where he is currently trying to get people to stop watching Dreamhack so that Blizzard will fix the game. It's fortunate that he doesn't have much influence, since he is at the moment the literal embodiment of "killing ESPORTS"
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On June 16 2014 10:29 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 10:26 showstealer1829 wrote:
I fail to see what's there to misunderstand. People still bring up that tweet every time TB has a post in a thread like this, hell everyone except TB look at the SC reddit, there's about 100 comments about the same damn thing because of his tweet earlier today banning Ruff from Clan Wars The community as a whole gets exactly what it deserves. It wants to be hyper-critical towards its pros/personalities, live and breath drama? Take great delight in tearing people down? Well then the only people that leaves are players and personalities who have had to adapt to that and harden against peoples constant negativity. The number of pros and personalities still posting here and on Reddit is a tiny fraction of the guys who are still around, most gave up because it wasn't worth it anymore. I wish I could quit them too, I'd be a lot happier.
It's true of any community though, I believe the phase I'm looking for is "Tall Poppy Syndrome", the vocal minority who can't help wanting to tear the same people they built up because suddenly they're "mainstream" and thus not "cool" any more.
And yet if you ask them, they'll still say they "like" the person, but he's just an asshole now. Happened with Metallica, happened with Nigel Mansell, is happening with Lewis Hamilton, hell Gary Lineker took off to Japan cause he couldn't take it any more (I am aware I'm showing my age here). Because "it should've been me. oh don't worry that I neither have the talent, determination or drive to actually bring myself up to that level. It still should've been me".
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On June 16 2014 10:23 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2014 10:19 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 10:16 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 10:10 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:27 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 09:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On June 16 2014 09:06 Swagasaurus wrote:On June 16 2014 08:23 VasHeR wrote:On June 16 2014 05:47 TotalBiscuit wrote:
You heard it here first guys, "Narcissism" = knowing more than somebody else.
All those narcissistic doctors, lawyers, plumbers, car mechanics... how dare they be more knowledgeable in a field than someone else and how dare their opinion carry more weight.
Narcissism = comparing urself to doctors and lawyers while you're bashing random people on the internet. Can you stop having flame wars in every single TL thread u post in? In your expert opinion, is it really appropriate to keep doing that? Was going to say this but he beat me to it. TB no one with a brain is going to dispute that you know what you're talking about when it comes to video games. It's just the way you go about attacking anyone who disagrees with you that comes across as really nasty/arrogant. Just because you've had a successful career in the field of video games that doesn't mean your opinion on non-game related subjects is any more or less 'valuable'. But we are talking about game related subjects, so that's irrelevant. Maybe if people didn't want flamewars they shouldn't be hurling insults at me whenever they get the chance *shrug*. You mistake attacking people for defense, I don't go out of my way to attack people, they start shit with me and then they complain that I respond in kind. "Oh, I called that guy an arrogant hypocritical narcissist and now he doesn't seem to want to treat me with respect, I wonder how that happened?". Well gee I dunno, maybe some of the armchair psychologists in this thread could tell you. Not sure if lying or delusional. What a wannabe martyr. Took about 2 seconds to find something worth discrediting your claim here. On December 19 2013 12:48 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 19 2013 11:54 GraFx wrote:
this is the first piece youve written that didnt make me hate you. kudos. If it makes you feel any better about that I think you're a little shit :x On December 17 2013 09:09 TotalBiscuit wrote:On December 17 2013 08:55 IcedBacon wrote:
Yeah... can't wait for bitcoins to crash :p "Can't wait for this prizepool and event to be ruined, presumably because I'm a terrible person" Nice *defense* Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples. Is this not obvious, oh wise one? Nice job linking quotes that supposedly debunk my argument when both of them were attacks. One wished ill on the event, the players and myself by gloating over the possibility of bitcoins crashing, the other said "oh grats, this is the first time I don't hate you", a completely unnecessary and unprovoked insult. You might wanna try harder if you're looking for evidence that what I say is unprovoked. You might wanna dig even deeper to find a response that is actually offensive and not tongue-in-cheek. The little kissy face not give it away that I wasn't being particularly serious? Do I have to spell it out? Unsurprisingly you are also attacking me, including such choice phrases as "lying" "delusional" and "wannabe martyr". Next time, try coming into a discussion with clean hands.
The problem I have with this is that there is no measure to what "words" are hurtful enough to warrant punishment.
This person hurt another persons feelings, but he didn't swear, he didn't break any rules, he just attacked a popular player. If what he said was 50% as offensive would he be banned? 80%? Where is the threshhold? Its an arbitrary punishment for an arbitrary crime.
So while I love Minigun, and never heard of Ruff, I'm overall against the idea of a witch hunt over words conveyed via the internet.
Its just words.
Keystrokes cannot hurt me, and IMHO you're wasting your energy if you let them effect you.
Nobody in their right mind actually believes this. Of course words hurt. Keystrokes can't hurt you? Pretty sure they can, you are simply fortunate enough not to have had to suffer someone going after you in a really personal way. I hope you never do. If you are the judge on what is "attacking" and what is "defending," then I have no doubt that you will always be 100% right in your own mind. So I guess the answer was delusional. Nice job dodging this part "Also, if you want your opinion to count more because of your position, then you also get held to a higher standard of conduct than random internet peoples." Did it seem irrelevant in this context to you? Nice attempt to dodge the debunk of your supposed "evidence". Glad to see you bailed on it quickly though, trying to argue that you somehow proved that I go around attacking people with those quotes would have been a waste of everyones time. See, I already get held to a higher standard of conduct, which is demonstrated by the fact that I can't post in a thread without someone trying to hold me to account for something or other. Literally everything I say online has some sort of consequence, I'm still getting shit on for dumb things I said 7 years ago. I've quite literally received death-threats for confusing an 8-bit pixel art characters gender. So don't talk to me about higher standard of conduct. My higher standard of conduct is trying to bring some common sense into the discussion, sharing my experience when it's relevant and not mocking people who have chronic diseases. That and not attacking people unprovoked. Higher standards does not give you carte blanche to go after me with your insults and attacks and then have you retreat to some imagined refuge when you get bitten back for doing so. You will not get a "Thank you for your feedback" message from me, I'm not customer service and you're not a customer, I don't have to put up with your shit, thank god. What dodge? I said you embellished. That seemed pretty direct. More delusions And now you dodge the rest of the post. Well that and you called me a lying, delusional wannabe martyr, or had you forgotten that? I didn't embellish anything, I gave my perspective on things I said (how dare I know my own intent, shameful!). I understand the concept quite clearly. I also understand it's extremely easy to try and lecture from a place of no consequence. How easy it is to tell someone they should act to a higher standard when you don't have to do it yourself. Armchair morality at its finest. You have misunderstood the concept of the moral highground, something you cease to hold when you decide to call people lying, delusional wannabe martyrs while simultaneously trying to lecture them on how they should treat others. You've done a fantastic job of proving my point that my posts are in response to attacks. I think we're about done here. There's little value to be extracted from this discussion anymore, or at least none that's worth the effort.
You accuse me of dodging again... but then say "we're done here." Neat trick.
You want to talk about dodging? Read your own statement.. "I understand the concept quite clearly. I also understand it's extremely easy to try and lecture from a place of no consequence......................." Nice change topic.
"I didn't embellish anything, I gave my perspective on things I said (how dare I know my own intent, shameful!). "
My argument is that your perspective is unnecessarily combative. You jump at the first opportunity to start flame wars with people. The last few pages of this thread should be evidence enough of that, but I'm sure you'll say it was everyone's fault except yours.
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EPT
