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On September 03 2013 22:35 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... $26.2 BILLION profit FY2012, $470B in assets EOY 2012. 2013 has been an amazing year for the company as well- they're poised to do literally whatever they want, as they eat more and more mobile market share and Apple becomes passe. Once they finish adding graphene into battery technology to sell to car manufacturers (which they are currently doing), the company is poised to literally throw money at whatever they want. A gaming sponsorship program program would be less than pennies to a company both of their market capitalization and growth rate- however, generating buzz in the 18-35 year old crowd is golden. Samsung has always been one of the better companies as far as physical hardware is concerned (their TV's, monitors, and phones at least), and now all they need to do is get that Google/2002Apple image with the young crowd. The Galaxy tablets and S3/S4 phone are doing just that, and anything they can do to become the "hip tech company" they will. eSports is a very, very cheap investment for a company with $270+B in revenue annually.
Its should also be pointed out that the 18-35 year old crowd are almost impossible(from a marketing standpoint) to deliver ads to. We are very good at dodging ads. Sundance, in one of his more interesting tweets, liked to a study they did comparing Esports fans and watching ads and normal people watching youtube videos and other media. The number of ads watched and hours watched that like 3-5 times higher(or more, I can't remember, it was a year ago or more). Its super compelling for people selling ads, since it is almost impossible to get ads to us normally(because we are very good at avoiding them).
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On September 03 2013 21:44 lolfail9001 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 21:36 riyanme wrote:On September 02 2013 23:01 shaftofpleasure wrote:On September 02 2013 22:39 Shikyo wrote:On September 02 2013 22:26 Boonbag wrote:On September 02 2013 22:24 Shikyo wrote:On September 02 2013 21:07 Boonbag wrote:
You just do not profane the sacred shrine of the rts by hiring the lead designer of c&c to make the sequel.
Bw gods have no mercy for such arrogance. And rightfully so in this case. This is slightly inaccurate. It's just the newer C&Cs that are awful. Some of the older ones were incredible, some of the best RTS's ever made. oh well i always thought they were kinda shitty Really? I loved C&C, Red Alert and Red Alert 2 :/ I guess people do have different tastes but I find it difficult to objectively say those games are bad even though they aren't SCBW level. Though well, their design direction still might not have been the best for competitive gaming those games weren't made for e-sports .. it's like Skyrim, or Civ or Sims or Surgeon Simulator or Total War .. fun games for the sake of having fun. SC2 was made solely for a competitive scene. Most SC2 fans tends to forget that Blizzard is poor in balancing games without removing the fun in them. Maps were the ones that truly innovated the BW scene. If People kept on playing LT Vanilla, Terran would've roflstomp the competition like it did back then. Warcraft III was so balanced that it became a rock-paper-scissor game with Heroes becoming the wildcard of every matchup. On September 02 2013 22:40 Gravesong wrote:On September 02 2013 13:54 XXXSmOke wrote:
What this all comes down to is the casual player. I don't think we can stress this enough and why Sc2 is in the position it is in.
fuck the pro scene, what this game really comes down to is do you enjoy it or not?
This is the first RTS where ive truly seen an overwhelming amount of people from day 1 just bitch and bitch(and for good reason) about how horribly boring the game is.
The casual players are the true cataclysm of sc2.
Millions and Millions of people are viewing the fuck out of pro scene moba??
Why you ask?
Because they actually enjoy the game they play, the pro league is a nice plus to playing the game.
I wish I could say this about Sc2 but we obviously cant, theres hundreds of people here who cant even pull up the urge to play 1 game of sc2.
And then you get all these people that go "Oh Jeez why is everyone so negative! I dont get it" Its not to hard to figure out.
I would trade every moment of watching sc2 for an actual game that I enjoyed in a heartbeat.
After all in anything competitive it always starts with a fun casual game that attracts many people to the sport THEN it becomes competitive.... Not "We design this game to be a sport"
How do you guys think basketball got to a professional level? Do you think some random guy said "hmmm let me make a sport that will have professional athletes that get paid to play? No the guy fucking thought it would be cool to put a ball through a hoop.
Another example would be crossfit. What started out as a popular workout method for casual people to get slightly competitive with.. is now becoming a a major force all around the world with a competitive scene that is growing massively.
TL:DR Let the sport create itself like BW did in the early days, worry about the casuals and that people ENJOY it. dont make a game that is a sport or you will fail miserably like blizz. Wow. This is really well put, and I haven't really thought of it from this perspective. BW became popular because it was a cheap game and cheap entertainment in PC bangs, which led to a lot of people playing and the scene growing organically. With a single copy of BW, 4 players can play on b.net with them playing in different servers and if talking about LAN, it non-unique serial numbers won't hinder you from playing multiplayer with 7 friends. very true indeed... to be fare, i think blizz is doing their best... its just it isn't enough or simply incompentent (haha!). when can we see a 2v2 SC2 just like in BW Proleague before? so we can see TEAM plays.... @WAXANGEL WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can someone remind me the reason Proleague dropped 2v2 anyone? As for 2v2 SC2.... it would be worse than worst MOBA ever made.
There was 2v2 for a while but they said that there was a drop in viewership when they aired the 2v2 matches unless they were all "star" players. So they dropped the format and went back strictly to seven 1v1 matches.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On September 03 2013 22:41 FromShouri wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 21:44 lolfail9001 wrote:On September 03 2013 21:36 riyanme wrote:On September 02 2013 23:01 shaftofpleasure wrote:On September 02 2013 22:39 Shikyo wrote:On September 02 2013 22:26 Boonbag wrote:On September 02 2013 22:24 Shikyo wrote:On September 02 2013 21:07 Boonbag wrote:
You just do not profane the sacred shrine of the rts by hiring the lead designer of c&c to make the sequel.
Bw gods have no mercy for such arrogance. And rightfully so in this case. This is slightly inaccurate. It's just the newer C&Cs that are awful. Some of the older ones were incredible, some of the best RTS's ever made. oh well i always thought they were kinda shitty Really? I loved C&C, Red Alert and Red Alert 2 :/ I guess people do have different tastes but I find it difficult to objectively say those games are bad even though they aren't SCBW level. Though well, their design direction still might not have been the best for competitive gaming those games weren't made for e-sports .. it's like Skyrim, or Civ or Sims or Surgeon Simulator or Total War .. fun games for the sake of having fun. SC2 was made solely for a competitive scene. Most SC2 fans tends to forget that Blizzard is poor in balancing games without removing the fun in them. Maps were the ones that truly innovated the BW scene. If People kept on playing LT Vanilla, Terran would've roflstomp the competition like it did back then. Warcraft III was so balanced that it became a rock-paper-scissor game with Heroes becoming the wildcard of every matchup. On September 02 2013 22:40 Gravesong wrote:On September 02 2013 13:54 XXXSmOke wrote:
What this all comes down to is the casual player. I don't think we can stress this enough and why Sc2 is in the position it is in.
fuck the pro scene, what this game really comes down to is do you enjoy it or not?
This is the first RTS where ive truly seen an overwhelming amount of people from day 1 just bitch and bitch(and for good reason) about how horribly boring the game is.
The casual players are the true cataclysm of sc2.
Millions and Millions of people are viewing the fuck out of pro scene moba??
Why you ask?
Because they actually enjoy the game they play, the pro league is a nice plus to playing the game.
I wish I could say this about Sc2 but we obviously cant, theres hundreds of people here who cant even pull up the urge to play 1 game of sc2.
And then you get all these people that go "Oh Jeez why is everyone so negative! I dont get it" Its not to hard to figure out.
I would trade every moment of watching sc2 for an actual game that I enjoyed in a heartbeat.
After all in anything competitive it always starts with a fun casual game that attracts many people to the sport THEN it becomes competitive.... Not "We design this game to be a sport"
How do you guys think basketball got to a professional level? Do you think some random guy said "hmmm let me make a sport that will have professional athletes that get paid to play? No the guy fucking thought it would be cool to put a ball through a hoop.
Another example would be crossfit. What started out as a popular workout method for casual people to get slightly competitive with.. is now becoming a a major force all around the world with a competitive scene that is growing massively.
TL:DR Let the sport create itself like BW did in the early days, worry about the casuals and that people ENJOY it. dont make a game that is a sport or you will fail miserably like blizz. Wow. This is really well put, and I haven't really thought of it from this perspective. BW became popular because it was a cheap game and cheap entertainment in PC bangs, which led to a lot of people playing and the scene growing organically. With a single copy of BW, 4 players can play on b.net with them playing in different servers and if talking about LAN, it non-unique serial numbers won't hinder you from playing multiplayer with 7 friends. very true indeed... to be fare, i think blizz is doing their best... its just it isn't enough or simply incompentent (haha!). when can we see a 2v2 SC2 just like in BW Proleague before? so we can see TEAM plays.... @WAXANGEL WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can someone remind me the reason Proleague dropped 2v2 anyone? As for 2v2 SC2.... it would be worse than worst MOBA ever made. There was 2v2 for a while but they said that there was a drop in viewership when they aired the 2v2 matches unless they were all "star" players. So they dropped the format and went back strictly to seven 1v1 matches.
Hah, makes sense. So essentially Koreans preferred having fun themselves and watch pros not have any of it :D
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On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here.
Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come.
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Crazy how quickly the game changes.
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On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come.
Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs.
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On September 03 2013 22:41 zettai wrote:Show nested quote +On September 02 2013 13:54 XXXSmOke wrote:
What this all comes down to is the casual player. I don't think we can stress this enough and why Sc2 is in the position it is in.
fuck the pro scene, what this game really comes down to is do you enjoy it or not?
This is the first RTS where ive truly seen an overwhelming amount of people from day 1 just bitch and bitch(and for good reason) about how horribly boring the game is.
The casual players are the true cataclysm of sc2.
Millions and Millions of people are viewing the fuck out of pro scene moba??
Why you ask?
Because they actually enjoy the game they play, the pro league is a nice plus to playing the game.
I wish I could say this about Sc2 but we obviously cant, theres hundreds of people here who cant even pull up the urge to play 1 game of sc2.
And then you get all these people that go "Oh Jeez why is everyone so negative! I dont get it" Its not to hard to figure out.
I would trade every moment of watching sc2 for an actual game that I enjoyed in a heartbeat.
After all in anything competitive it always starts with a fun casual game that attracts many people to the sport THEN it becomes competitive.... Not "We design this game to be a sport"
How do you guys think basketball got to a professional level? Do you think some random guy said "hmmm let me make a sport that will have professional athletes that get paid to play? No the guy fucking thought it would be cool to put a ball through a hoop.
Another example would be crossfit. What started out as a popular workout method for casual people to get slightly competitive with.. is now becoming a a major force all around the world with a competitive scene that is growing massively.
TL:DR Let the sport create itself like BW did in the early days, worry about the casuals and that people ENJOY it. dont make a game that is a sport or you will fail miserably like blizz. Fucking spot on, people play games because they are fun. And that's the most important thing.
The most annoying thing to me, is seeing people talking about how game X is bad because its casual.
Please read again... game - casual
I will write again... game - casual
In what world this people think a game (in a non pro perspective) shouldn't be casual?
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On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs.
Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places.
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On September 03 2013 23:11 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs. Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places.
Exactly my point. My first experience with MLG in person was "Holy crap, more than half this crowd is over 21. Why is all the advertising aimed at 15 year olds?". That first MLG (DC, 2011 I think) was a real eye-opener for me. Yes, it had cool lighting and stages. But there was no alcohol sales, no food sales, and all advertising was aimed at energy drinks and hot pockets. What marketer really believes that the gaming culture has stayed the same since 1997? Gamers as a whole have grown up- the products have only been out for 20 years anyway.
Want to cater to my lifestyle? Have a full bar with craft beers, and decent food. Make it a place I can bring my other adult friends that doesn't completely alienate non-gamers. Make watching WCS in person with friends a viable option to going to Champps to watch the NFL. Bam, there's your industry right there. Sportsbars have carried mainstream sports for years, and eSports needs that merchandising to sustain the industry.
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On September 02 2013 16:13 kasumimi wrote:
Finally, SC2's poor design is starting to have some serious impact on the scene.
It's a pain to play, unforgiving, volatile and frustrating.
It's also boring to watch because you can tell who is going to win 10 minutes (or more...) before "gg" is typed, this after watching the same builds for the millionth time. And these are just pointers for the dozens of problems that plague the entire game.
Blizzard really needs to step up their staff choice, DB and DK had do idea that they were burdened with: creating the successor of the game that gave birth to e-sports. That's is why they delivered a badly designed game for competitive multi-player.
Colossus, roaches, healer-dropships, forcefields, marauders, infestors, warpgates, death-blobs and all the other stuff they added are fun to play through the campaign for sure. But giving overpowered units like it's candy will create an OP vs OP environment, the exact opposite of what a competitive game needs.
This problematic situation has been masked by the growing scene and by the very supportive community that is behind Starcraft. When those essential things are not enough to make a game into and solid esport one must be in denial to believe that SC2 is a beautiful and great game.
This post reflect my thought exactly. I hardly even watch SC2 anymore, let alone play it. And I used watch and play it daily. I think the game starting going downhill (for me at least) when they nerfed ghosts in WoL . Before that TvZ was a pleasure to watch and a battle between two highly skilled players was very impressive. After than (and the Queen range buff) things became much more predictable with BL+infestor dominating everything.
I think the problem with SC2 as opposed to LoL is that in LoL introducing new champions changes the game completely and not making it stale at all. In an RTS, you can't just do that.
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On September 03 2013 23:30 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 23:11 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs. Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places. Exactly my point. My first experience with MLG in person was "Holy crap, more than half this crowd is over 21. Why is all the advertising aimed at 15 year olds?". That first MLG (DC, 2011 I think) was a real eye-opener for me. Yes, it had cool lighting and stages. But there was no alcohol sales, no food sales, and all advertising was aimed at energy drinks and hot pockets. What marketer really believes that the gaming culture has stayed the same since 1997? Gamers as a whole have grown up- the products have only been out for 20 years anyway. Want to cater to my lifestyle? Have a full bar with craft beers, and decent food. Make it a place I can bring my other adult friends that doesn't completely alienate non-gamers. Make watching WCS in person with friends a viable option to going to Champps to watch the NFL. Bam, there's your industry right there. Sportsbars have carried mainstream sports for years, and eSports needs that merchandising to sustain the industry.
It is one of the growing pains of Esports is getting people to understand that the people who love these games are not 17 year old kids who love hot pockets and NOS. I cannot eat that crap, my stomic will revolt against me and punish me for my transgression. Redbull getting into the scene is nice, but I want sponsored Barcrafts in each city. Boston’s barcraft scene sucks right now and there is nothing to watch at local bars(we have one that is run every 2 months or so for large events). SC2 should have ads aimed at me. I am their prime demographic, a professional who is over 30 with stable income. My demographic is the most desirable of all demographics. Some local beer company needs to sponsor a barcraft in my area and get me buying their beer.
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On September 03 2013 23:50 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 23:30 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:11 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs. Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places. Exactly my point. My first experience with MLG in person was "Holy crap, more than half this crowd is over 21. Why is all the advertising aimed at 15 year olds?". That first MLG (DC, 2011 I think) was a real eye-opener for me. Yes, it had cool lighting and stages. But there was no alcohol sales, no food sales, and all advertising was aimed at energy drinks and hot pockets. What marketer really believes that the gaming culture has stayed the same since 1997? Gamers as a whole have grown up- the products have only been out for 20 years anyway. Want to cater to my lifestyle? Have a full bar with craft beers, and decent food. Make it a place I can bring my other adult friends that doesn't completely alienate non-gamers. Make watching WCS in person with friends a viable option to going to Champps to watch the NFL. Bam, there's your industry right there. Sportsbars have carried mainstream sports for years, and eSports needs that merchandising to sustain the industry. It is one of the growing pains of Esports is getting people to understand that the people who love these games are not 17 year old kids who love hot pockets and NOS. I cannot eat that crap, my stomic will revolt against me and punish me for my transgression. Redbull getting into the scene is nice, but I want sponsored Barcrafts in each city. Boston’s barcraft scene sucks right now and there is nothing to watch at local bars(we have one that is run every 2 months or so for large events). SC2 should have ads aimed at me. I am their prime demographic, a professional who is over 30 with stable income. My demographic is the most desirable of all demographics. Some local beer company needs to sponsor a barcraft in my area and get me buying their beer.
We could keep complaning, or do something to help- I smell an opportunity. My current circle of friends is 25-31 years old, 70%-30% split male to female. We have 3 PhD's, 1 MD, 2 JD's, 1 MBA, 1 PMP... and an admitted one or two brokeass nerds. We enjoy a range of traditionally "nerdy" activities, such as SC2, LoL, MTG, Settlers of Cataan, Dominion, etc. We have stable incomes, solid careers, plenty of disposable income. We do *not* want the "ultimate gaming experience" when we go out- why isn't there an adult gaming experience (as a note, Dave and Busters is still quite successful)? We need some champions among the aging community to pitch business partnerships and ventures with possible vendors and sponsors.
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On September 04 2013 00:09 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2013 23:50 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:30 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:11 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs. Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places. Exactly my point. My first experience with MLG in person was "Holy crap, more than half this crowd is over 21. Why is all the advertising aimed at 15 year olds?". That first MLG (DC, 2011 I think) was a real eye-opener for me. Yes, it had cool lighting and stages. But there was no alcohol sales, no food sales, and all advertising was aimed at energy drinks and hot pockets. What marketer really believes that the gaming culture has stayed the same since 1997? Gamers as a whole have grown up- the products have only been out for 20 years anyway. Want to cater to my lifestyle? Have a full bar with craft beers, and decent food. Make it a place I can bring my other adult friends that doesn't completely alienate non-gamers. Make watching WCS in person with friends a viable option to going to Champps to watch the NFL. Bam, there's your industry right there. Sportsbars have carried mainstream sports for years, and eSports needs that merchandising to sustain the industry. It is one of the growing pains of Esports is getting people to understand that the people who love these games are not 17 year old kids who love hot pockets and NOS. I cannot eat that crap, my stomic will revolt against me and punish me for my transgression. Redbull getting into the scene is nice, but I want sponsored Barcrafts in each city. Boston’s barcraft scene sucks right now and there is nothing to watch at local bars(we have one that is run every 2 months or so for large events). SC2 should have ads aimed at me. I am their prime demographic, a professional who is over 30 with stable income. My demographic is the most desirable of all demographics. Some local beer company needs to sponsor a barcraft in my area and get me buying their beer. We could keep complaning, or do something to help- I smell an opportunity. My current circle of friends is 25-31 years old, 70%-30% split male to female. We have 3 PhD's, 1 MD, 2 JD's, 1 MBA, 1 PMP... and an admitted one or two brokeass nerds. We enjoy a range of traditionally "nerdy" activities, such as SC2, LoL, MTG, Settlers of Cataan, Dominion, etc. We have stable incomes, solid careers, plenty of disposable income. We do *not* want the "ultimate gaming experience" when we go out- why isn't there an adult gaming experience (as a note, Dave and Busters is still quite successful)? We need some champions among the aging community to pitch business partnerships and ventures with possible vendors and sponsors.
OMG, the ultimate gaming house that is filled with bad chairs and tables bought at Target and is all primary colors. Every time one of those came on, my girlfriend and would mock them endlessly for how terrible the rooms looked afterwards. There was one where they removed the bed from a couples room. The bed! Where did they sleep afterwards?
This is the problem with the scene right now is that everyone can’t figure out how to market Esports. The Papa Johns push was good for a national chain food, but we need more. I want PBR to sponsor a team(I keep saying PBR because they are the most likely beer to do it, they market to crazy shit). I want my Esports to focus on adults, since we have way less time for internet outrage. Seriously, if supporting a team also lets me buy beer, its like win/win/win. The team gets support and I win twice because I bought beer. Also, I am sure the company making the beer is happy.
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On September 04 2013 00:20 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 04 2013 00:09 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:50 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:30 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:11 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:On September 03 2013 15:37 digmouse wrote:
Samsung might also purchase the entire MVP team including their SC2 squad. Also Stork definitely not retiring. Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs. Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places. Exactly my point. My first experience with MLG in person was "Holy crap, more than half this crowd is over 21. Why is all the advertising aimed at 15 year olds?". That first MLG (DC, 2011 I think) was a real eye-opener for me. Yes, it had cool lighting and stages. But there was no alcohol sales, no food sales, and all advertising was aimed at energy drinks and hot pockets. What marketer really believes that the gaming culture has stayed the same since 1997? Gamers as a whole have grown up- the products have only been out for 20 years anyway. Want to cater to my lifestyle? Have a full bar with craft beers, and decent food. Make it a place I can bring my other adult friends that doesn't completely alienate non-gamers. Make watching WCS in person with friends a viable option to going to Champps to watch the NFL. Bam, there's your industry right there. Sportsbars have carried mainstream sports for years, and eSports needs that merchandising to sustain the industry. It is one of the growing pains of Esports is getting people to understand that the people who love these games are not 17 year old kids who love hot pockets and NOS. I cannot eat that crap, my stomic will revolt against me and punish me for my transgression. Redbull getting into the scene is nice, but I want sponsored Barcrafts in each city. Boston’s barcraft scene sucks right now and there is nothing to watch at local bars(we have one that is run every 2 months or so for large events). SC2 should have ads aimed at me. I am their prime demographic, a professional who is over 30 with stable income. My demographic is the most desirable of all demographics. Some local beer company needs to sponsor a barcraft in my area and get me buying their beer. We could keep complaning, or do something to help- I smell an opportunity. My current circle of friends is 25-31 years old, 70%-30% split male to female. We have 3 PhD's, 1 MD, 2 JD's, 1 MBA, 1 PMP... and an admitted one or two brokeass nerds. We enjoy a range of traditionally "nerdy" activities, such as SC2, LoL, MTG, Settlers of Cataan, Dominion, etc. We have stable incomes, solid careers, plenty of disposable income. We do *not* want the "ultimate gaming experience" when we go out- why isn't there an adult gaming experience (as a note, Dave and Busters is still quite successful)? We need some champions among the aging community to pitch business partnerships and ventures with possible vendors and sponsors. OMG, the ultimate gaming house that is filled with bad chairs and tables bought at Target and is all primary colors. Every time one of those came on, my girlfriend and would mock them endlessly for how terrible the rooms looked afterwards. There was one where they removed the bed from a couples room. The bed! Where did they sleep afterwards? This is the problem with the scene right now is that everyone can’t figure out how to market Esports. The Papa Johns push was good for a national chain food, but we need more. I want PBR to sponsor a team(I keep saying PBR because they are the most likely beer to do it, they market to crazy shit). I want my Esports to focus on adults, since we have way less time for internet outrage. Seriously, if supporting a team also lets me buy beer, its like win/win/win. The team gets support and I win twice because I bought beer. Also, I am sure the company making the beer is happy.
You both know that Meltdown is looking for people willing to invest time and money into franchise operations, right?
I have to admit, even in Podunkacola, Florida, has a bar called "Play". It's theoretically a game bar, but it's aimed at an even older or more casual demographic. (Sports games, air hockey tables, darts, arcade style machines.) It's a good attempt, even if it comes out somewhat off-center and not quite on target - not to mention it's pretty small, you couldn't set up a decent LAN party there without trying to work around the required bar pool table.
I don't know about PBR, though... I mean, don't get me wrong, cheap hipster beer is sometimes necessary, but I would rather swill something with a touch more quality to their product. At least Sam Adams or Yeungling.
The problem with alcoholic beverage sponsorship, though, is the same as the mythical Brazzers sponsorship. Companies firmly aiming at an adult audience behind games which are still marketed largely to a younger audience. (As a note, swing by the TL census thread - the demographic is aging but it still trends young outside of outliers like myself and big outliers like Bill Amend when compared to the general population.) I'm thinking we may be moving, in general for all eSports, towards that kind of shift, but it's still a bit off in the future.
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On September 04 2013 12:25 felisconcolori wrote:Show nested quote +On September 04 2013 00:20 Plansix wrote:On September 04 2013 00:09 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:50 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:30 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:11 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:On September 03 2013 15:44 Thrillz wrote:
[quote]
Samsung doesn't have THAT much free money to throw away... Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs. Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places. Exactly my point. My first experience with MLG in person was "Holy crap, more than half this crowd is over 21. Why is all the advertising aimed at 15 year olds?". That first MLG (DC, 2011 I think) was a real eye-opener for me. Yes, it had cool lighting and stages. But there was no alcohol sales, no food sales, and all advertising was aimed at energy drinks and hot pockets. What marketer really believes that the gaming culture has stayed the same since 1997? Gamers as a whole have grown up- the products have only been out for 20 years anyway. Want to cater to my lifestyle? Have a full bar with craft beers, and decent food. Make it a place I can bring my other adult friends that doesn't completely alienate non-gamers. Make watching WCS in person with friends a viable option to going to Champps to watch the NFL. Bam, there's your industry right there. Sportsbars have carried mainstream sports for years, and eSports needs that merchandising to sustain the industry. It is one of the growing pains of Esports is getting people to understand that the people who love these games are not 17 year old kids who love hot pockets and NOS. I cannot eat that crap, my stomic will revolt against me and punish me for my transgression. Redbull getting into the scene is nice, but I want sponsored Barcrafts in each city. Boston’s barcraft scene sucks right now and there is nothing to watch at local bars(we have one that is run every 2 months or so for large events). SC2 should have ads aimed at me. I am their prime demographic, a professional who is over 30 with stable income. My demographic is the most desirable of all demographics. Some local beer company needs to sponsor a barcraft in my area and get me buying their beer. We could keep complaning, or do something to help- I smell an opportunity. My current circle of friends is 25-31 years old, 70%-30% split male to female. We have 3 PhD's, 1 MD, 2 JD's, 1 MBA, 1 PMP... and an admitted one or two brokeass nerds. We enjoy a range of traditionally "nerdy" activities, such as SC2, LoL, MTG, Settlers of Cataan, Dominion, etc. We have stable incomes, solid careers, plenty of disposable income. We do *not* want the "ultimate gaming experience" when we go out- why isn't there an adult gaming experience (as a note, Dave and Busters is still quite successful)? We need some champions among the aging community to pitch business partnerships and ventures with possible vendors and sponsors. OMG, the ultimate gaming house that is filled with bad chairs and tables bought at Target and is all primary colors. Every time one of those came on, my girlfriend and would mock them endlessly for how terrible the rooms looked afterwards. There was one where they removed the bed from a couples room. The bed! Where did they sleep afterwards? This is the problem with the scene right now is that everyone can’t figure out how to market Esports. The Papa Johns push was good for a national chain food, but we need more. I want PBR to sponsor a team(I keep saying PBR because they are the most likely beer to do it, they market to crazy shit). I want my Esports to focus on adults, since we have way less time for internet outrage. Seriously, if supporting a team also lets me buy beer, its like win/win/win. The team gets support and I win twice because I bought beer. Also, I am sure the company making the beer is happy. You both know that Meltdown is looking for people willing to invest time and money into franchise operations, right? I have to admit, even in Podunkacola, Florida, has a bar called "Play". It's theoretically a game bar, but it's aimed at an even older or more casual demographic. (Sports games, air hockey tables, darts, arcade style machines.) It's a good attempt, even if it comes out somewhat off-center and not quite on target - not to mention it's pretty small, you couldn't set up a decent LAN party there without trying to work around the required bar pool table. I don't know about PBR, though... I mean, don't get me wrong, cheap hipster beer is sometimes necessary, but I would rather swill something with a touch more quality to their product. At least Sam Adams or Yeungling. The problem with alcoholic beverage sponsorship, though, is the same as the mythical Brazzers sponsorship. Companies firmly aiming at an adult audience behind games which are still marketed largely to a younger audience. (As a note, swing by the TL census thread - the demographic is aging but it still trends young outside of outliers like myself and big outliers like Bill Amend when compared to the general population.) I'm thinking we may be moving, in general for all eSports, towards that kind of shift, but it's still a bit off in the future.
PBR was not cheap hipster beer before hipsters ruined it by all drinking it ironically. Some of us drank it before because it was good cheap beer that you could drink on a hot day. Hipsters ruin things that you enjoy by making you associated with hipsters. And they sponsor NPR, so I assume they are willing to throw money anywhere.
And the Brazzers thing was just a bad idea and no one would touch that with a 10 foot pole. When the FGC won't accept a sponsor and says its a bad idea, its a bad idea. That is a metric we should all live by. PBR could sponsor a team and it would be fine and I would say "All America" in the best way possible.
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On September 04 2013 12:33 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 04 2013 12:25 felisconcolori wrote:On September 04 2013 00:20 Plansix wrote:On September 04 2013 00:09 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:50 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:30 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 23:11 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 23:01 Crownlol wrote:On September 03 2013 22:43 Plansix wrote:On September 03 2013 22:39 Shiori wrote:
[quote]
Samsung could literally buy the entire eSports scene for every game without feeling it. We're talking about one of the most powerful and prosperous tech companies in the world, here. Which is why we need to convince them to build the Samsung Esports studio in California. If you build it, they will come. Samsung eSports Arena, bro. With beer and hotdogs. Exactly. We a LAN outside where I can buy both beer and hotdogs and play with friend. Really, they just need a bunch of beer. Lets bring Esports to grown up land, where it should have started in the first place. I want PBR to sponsor a team, they are already on NPR, so they clearly like throwing money weird places. Exactly my point. My first experience with MLG in person was "Holy crap, more than half this crowd is over 21. Why is all the advertising aimed at 15 year olds?". That first MLG (DC, 2011 I think) was a real eye-opener for me. Yes, it had cool lighting and stages. But there was no alcohol sales, no food sales, and all advertising was aimed at energy drinks and hot pockets. What marketer really believes that the gaming culture has stayed the same since 1997? Gamers as a whole have grown up- the products have only been out for 20 years anyway. Want to cater to my lifestyle? Have a full bar with craft beers, and decent food. Make it a place I can bring my other adult friends that doesn't completely alienate non-gamers. Make watching WCS in person with friends a viable option to going to Champps to watch the NFL. Bam, there's your industry right there. Sportsbars have carried mainstream sports for years, and eSports needs that merchandising to sustain the industry. It is one of the growing pains of Esports is getting people to understand that the people who love these games are not 17 year old kids who love hot pockets and NOS. I cannot eat that crap, my stomic will revolt against me and punish me for my transgression. Redbull getting into the scene is nice, but I want sponsored Barcrafts in each city. Boston’s barcraft scene sucks right now and there is nothing to watch at local bars(we have one that is run every 2 months or so for large events). SC2 should have ads aimed at me. I am their prime demographic, a professional who is over 30 with stable income. My demographic is the most desirable of all demographics. Some local beer company needs to sponsor a barcraft in my area and get me buying their beer. We could keep complaning, or do something to help- I smell an opportunity. My current circle of friends is 25-31 years old, 70%-30% split male to female. We have 3 PhD's, 1 MD, 2 JD's, 1 MBA, 1 PMP... and an admitted one or two brokeass nerds. We enjoy a range of traditionally "nerdy" activities, such as SC2, LoL, MTG, Settlers of Cataan, Dominion, etc. We have stable incomes, solid careers, plenty of disposable income. We do *not* want the "ultimate gaming experience" when we go out- why isn't there an adult gaming experience (as a note, Dave and Busters is still quite successful)? We need some champions among the aging community to pitch business partnerships and ventures with possible vendors and sponsors. OMG, the ultimate gaming house that is filled with bad chairs and tables bought at Target and is all primary colors. Every time one of those came on, my girlfriend and would mock them endlessly for how terrible the rooms looked afterwards. There was one where they removed the bed from a couples room. The bed! Where did they sleep afterwards? This is the problem with the scene right now is that everyone can’t figure out how to market Esports. The Papa Johns push was good for a national chain food, but we need more. I want PBR to sponsor a team(I keep saying PBR because they are the most likely beer to do it, they market to crazy shit). I want my Esports to focus on adults, since we have way less time for internet outrage. Seriously, if supporting a team also lets me buy beer, its like win/win/win. The team gets support and I win twice because I bought beer. Also, I am sure the company making the beer is happy. You both know that Meltdown is looking for people willing to invest time and money into franchise operations, right? I have to admit, even in Podunkacola, Florida, has a bar called "Play". It's theoretically a game bar, but it's aimed at an even older or more casual demographic. (Sports games, air hockey tables, darts, arcade style machines.) It's a good attempt, even if it comes out somewhat off-center and not quite on target - not to mention it's pretty small, you couldn't set up a decent LAN party there without trying to work around the required bar pool table. I don't know about PBR, though... I mean, don't get me wrong, cheap hipster beer is sometimes necessary, but I would rather swill something with a touch more quality to their product. At least Sam Adams or Yeungling. The problem with alcoholic beverage sponsorship, though, is the same as the mythical Brazzers sponsorship. Companies firmly aiming at an adult audience behind games which are still marketed largely to a younger audience. (As a note, swing by the TL census thread - the demographic is aging but it still trends young outside of outliers like myself and big outliers like Bill Amend when compared to the general population.) I'm thinking we may be moving, in general for all eSports, towards that kind of shift, but it's still a bit off in the future. PBR was not cheap hipster beer before hipsters ruined it by all drinking it ironically. Some of us drank it before because it was good cheap beer that you could drink on a hot day. Hipsters ruin things that you enjoy by making you associated with hipsters. And they sponsor NPR, so I assume they are willing to throw money anywhere. And the Brazzers thing was just a bad idea and no one would touch that with a 10 foot pole. When the FGC won't accept a sponsor and says its a bad idea, its a bad idea. That is a metric we should all live by. PBR could sponsor a team and it would be fine and I would say "All America" in the best way possible.
I've had PBR, and I have to say that I think it's a bit overrated in general. Even before the hipster factor shows up. The issue that comes up with Brazzers is that it's extremely adult content - and you have to worry about the (generally not entirely accurate) aura around pornography winding up becoming a negative factor. With alcoholic beverages, it might be less, but you're still going to have a bunch of madd people screaming "Think of the children!" Because, as much as it's getting better, there is still a strong association in minds that games are for kids. Even when the evidence is suggesting that adults enjoy games just as much, and that the trend is increasing.
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China6330 Posts
Bisu's contract ends at the end of September, that's why his new contract negotiation hasn't started.
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United States23455 Posts
Well they hired Coach Park and seem to be the only KeSPA team who is producing strong new blood into the scene like Bunny, Shark, Sora, etc.
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On September 04 2013 16:09 Fionn wrote:
Well they hired Coach Park and seem to be the only KeSPA team who is producing strong new blood into the scene like Bunny, Shark, Sora, etc.
I hope they get Bear
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EPT
