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Here's another set of interesting rankings that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else: the Afreeca rankings. (Google Translate says they're from "March week 2", so I guess that ended right around the HoTS launch.
1. League of Legends
2. Minecraft
3. SimCity (up 4)
4. Starcraft (down 2)
5. Sudden Attack (down 1)
6. Starcraft 2 (up 3)
7. Lineage (down 2)
8. World of Warcraft (up 8)
9. Kart Rider (down 2)
10. Warcraft (down 1) [WC3, I assume?]
http://gametv.afreeca.com/
Getting close to BW and passing Kart Rider is pretty impressive, IMO, and once SimCity inevitably takes a dive SC2 should be in the top 5 (especially because most of Week 2 probably included the days right before the HoTS launch, which were pretty dead). Also, World of Tanks is 18th and DOTA2 is AWOL... good luck to GOM with those, they'll need it...
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From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG...
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On March 20 2013 05:23 iky43210 wrote:
pcbang used to be huge in Taiwan, then it all got wiped out except a very few after computers become cheap and labor becomes more expensive. Most pcbangs (from taiwan experience) are dirty and taiwa/Korea have cheap high end internet in the range of 25Mb/sec that you can get for $10 a month, there is no reason why you would ever go to pcbang unless you have very restricted parents.
I am willing to bet if the korea government doesn't subsidize pcbang so heavily in Korea, they would all go out of business too. Then again this is probably true for alot of their companies as Korea pretty much subsidize just about everything. That's how they are able to complete globally easily when samsung are being fed with government money
Name a country that doesn't subsidize everything.
PC bangs are a cultural thing in Korea, very few go out of 'necessity'.
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On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG...
There is just a lot more action all around.
Reapers are much better and produce some action early game.
Oracles are good and provide some more harassment options which are fun to watch.
Mothership core or whatever it is called allows for some more harassment options for protoss early on
Vipers allow zerg to have interesting ways to try and break a Terran mech so those games aren't as often just boring turtles
Widow mines can allow for some cute micro trying to pull mines into the terrans own army
Medivac buff seems to be leading to more multipronged drops which once again, are fun to watch.
Between infestor nerf/viper introduction/hydra and ultra buff zerg games aren't just 100% turtle until maxed on brood infestor
Protoss air buffs gives them more options so that games aren't all the same for them either...
IMO almost every change they've made makes the game more fun to watch.
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Interesting, thanks for everyone's thoughts
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On March 20 2013 05:50 Chewbacca. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... There is just a lot more action all around. Reapers are much better and produce some action early game. Oracles are good and provide some more harassment options which are fun to watch. Mothership core or whatever it is called allows for some more harassment options for protoss early on Vipers allow zerg to have interesting ways to try and break a Terran mech so those games aren't as often just boring turtles Widow mines can allow for some cute micro trying to pull mines into the terrans own army Medivac buff seems to be leading to more multipronged drops which once again, are fun to watch. Between infestor nerf/viper introduction/hydra and ultra buff zerg games aren't just 100% turtle until maxed on brood infestor Protoss air buffs gives them more options so that games aren't all the same for them either... IMO almost every change they've made makes the game more fun to watch.
Yeah but people like my won't return because units are somewhat different.
The thing the game lacks is consistency. I didn't follow the game for half a year and after returning it feels like 50% of players that matter are new/nonames I couldn't really care about.
The other 50% are 40% faceless koreans and the 10% foreigners/koreans with a character can't make up for the boredom that is 90% of the players.
I'm really sad that the game of my dreams, which it was after release of WoL, didn't manage to keep that aura of epicness
I always felt ;(
Back then, when I used to watch all of Husky's / Day9's / Psy's casts, every player had a distinct style of play everyone knew about. You could literally see their progress week after week. Fun times.
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On March 20 2013 06:06 Xiron wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:50 Chewbacca. wrote:On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... There is just a lot more action all around. Reapers are much better and produce some action early game. Oracles are good and provide some more harassment options which are fun to watch. Mothership core or whatever it is called allows for some more harassment options for protoss early on Vipers allow zerg to have interesting ways to try and break a Terran mech so those games aren't as often just boring turtles Widow mines can allow for some cute micro trying to pull mines into the terrans own army Medivac buff seems to be leading to more multipronged drops which once again, are fun to watch. Between infestor nerf/viper introduction/hydra and ultra buff zerg games aren't just 100% turtle until maxed on brood infestor Protoss air buffs gives them more options so that games aren't all the same for them either... IMO almost every change they've made makes the game more fun to watch. Yeah but people like my won't return because units are somewhat different. The thing the game lacks is consistency. I didn't follow the game for half a year and after returning it feels like 50% of players that matter are new/nonames I couldn't really care about. The other 50% are 40% faceless koreans and the 10% foreigners/koreans with a character can't make up for the boredom that is 90% of the players. I'm really sad that the game of my dreams, which it was after release of WoL, didn't manage to keep that aura of epicness I always felt ;( Back then, when I used to watch all of Husky's / Day9's / Psy's casts, every player had a distinct style of play everyone knew about. You could literally see their progress week after week. Fun times.
The consistency you are thinking of just isn't possible with a dynamic game like Starcraft that will be constantly evolving and changing because of metagame shifts, patches, and expansions for the next half-decade or so at least.
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On March 20 2013 05:40 bduddy wrote:Here's another set of interesting rankings that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else: the Afreeca rankings. (Google Translate says they're from "March week 2", so I guess that ended right around the HoTS launch. 1. League of Legends 2. Minecraft 3. SimCity (up 4) 4. Starcraft (down 2) 5. Sudden Attack (down 1) 6. Starcraft 2 (up 3) 7. Lineage (down 2) 8. World of Warcraft (up 8) 9. Kart Rider (down 2) 10. Warcraft (down 1) [WC3, I assume?] http://gametv.afreeca.com/Getting close to BW and passing Kart Rider is pretty impressive, IMO, and once SimCity inevitably takes a dive SC2 should be in the top 5 (especially because most of Week 2 probably included the days right before the HoTS launch, which were pretty dead). Also, World of Tanks is 18th and DOTA2 is AWOL... good luck to GOM with those, they'll need it...
Hmm, that's quite surprising. Are there any big names that stream SC2 on Afreeca (and not on, say, Twitch)?
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On March 20 2013 06:10 Conti wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:40 bduddy wrote:Here's another set of interesting rankings that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else: the Afreeca rankings. (Google Translate says they're from "March week 2", so I guess that ended right around the HoTS launch. 1. League of Legends 2. Minecraft 3. SimCity (up 4) 4. Starcraft (down 2) 5. Sudden Attack (down 1) 6. Starcraft 2 (up 3) 7. Lineage (down 2) 8. World of Warcraft (up 8) 9. Kart Rider (down 2) 10. Warcraft (down 1) [WC3, I assume?] http://gametv.afreeca.com/Getting close to BW and passing Kart Rider is pretty impressive, IMO, and once SimCity inevitably takes a dive SC2 should be in the top 5 (especially because most of Week 2 probably included the days right before the HoTS launch, which were pretty dead). Also, World of Tanks is 18th and DOTA2 is AWOL... good luck to GOM with those, they'll need it... Hmm, that's quite surprising. Are there any big names that stream SC2 on Afreeca (and not on, say, Twitch)?
There are a lot of VoDs at least that area being shown, so dunno if those numbers are calculated.
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On March 20 2013 06:06 Xiron wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:50 Chewbacca. wrote:On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... There is just a lot more action all around. Reapers are much better and produce some action early game. Oracles are good and provide some more harassment options which are fun to watch. Mothership core or whatever it is called allows for some more harassment options for protoss early on Vipers allow zerg to have interesting ways to try and break a Terran mech so those games aren't as often just boring turtles Widow mines can allow for some cute micro trying to pull mines into the terrans own army Medivac buff seems to be leading to more multipronged drops which once again, are fun to watch. Between infestor nerf/viper introduction/hydra and ultra buff zerg games aren't just 100% turtle until maxed on brood infestor Protoss air buffs gives them more options so that games aren't all the same for them either... IMO almost every change they've made makes the game more fun to watch. Yeah but people like my won't return because units are somewhat different. The thing the game lacks is consistency. I didn't follow the game for half a year and after returning it feels like 50% of players that matter are new/nonames I couldn't really care about. The other 50% are 40% faceless koreans and the 10% foreigners/koreans with a character can't make up for the boredom that is 90% of the players. I'm really sad that the game of my dreams, which it was after release of WoL, didn't manage to keep that aura of epicness I always felt ;( Back then, when I used to watch all of Husky's / Day9's / Psy's casts, every player had a distinct style of play everyone knew about. You could literally see their progress week after week. Fun times.
I don't understand, how it can be the game of your dreams, if you don't like to watch "faceless" koreans who actually show the best possible starcraft.
Then, 3 years in e-sport is quite long, you can't expect to have the same names 2 years ago still at the top. And still MC, MKP, MVP etc... are still some of the best players in the world; this is definitely consistency. There are new names which is a really great thing, new blood, new style. The scene keeps evolving, especially with the Kespa arrival, which means it's healthy.
I'm not agressive I just don't understand how those points can keep you away for sc2.
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On March 20 2013 06:40 Gevna wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 06:06 Xiron wrote:On March 20 2013 05:50 Chewbacca. wrote:On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... There is just a lot more action all around. Reapers are much better and produce some action early game. Oracles are good and provide some more harassment options which are fun to watch. Mothership core or whatever it is called allows for some more harassment options for protoss early on Vipers allow zerg to have interesting ways to try and break a Terran mech so those games aren't as often just boring turtles Widow mines can allow for some cute micro trying to pull mines into the terrans own army Medivac buff seems to be leading to more multipronged drops which once again, are fun to watch. Between infestor nerf/viper introduction/hydra and ultra buff zerg games aren't just 100% turtle until maxed on brood infestor Protoss air buffs gives them more options so that games aren't all the same for them either... IMO almost every change they've made makes the game more fun to watch. Yeah but people like my won't return because units are somewhat different. Hd The thing the game lacks is consistency. I didn't follow the game for half a year and after returning it feels like 50% of players that matter are new/nonames I couldn't really care about. The other 50% are 40% faceless koreans and the 10% foreigners/koreans with a character can't make up for the boredom that is 90% of the players. I'm really sad that the game of my dreams, which it was after release of WoL, didn't manage to keep that aura of epicness I always felt ;( Back then, when I used to watch all of Husky's / Day9's / Psy's casts, every player had a distinct style of play everyone knew about. You could literally see their progress week after week. Fun times. I don't understand, how it can be the game of your dreams, if you don't like to watch "faceless" koreans who actually show the best possible starcraft. Then, 3 years in e-sport is quite long, you can't expect to have the same names 2 years ago still at the top. And still MC, MKP, MVP etc... are still some of the best players in the world; this is definitely consistency. There are new names which is a really great thing, new blood, new style. The scene keeps evolving, especially with the Kespa arrival, which means it's healthy. I'm not agressive I just don't understand how those points can keep you away for sc2.
Because people like this aren't actually leaving the game for the reasons they state. This is the game of my dreams and I can say that I love those "faceless" Koreans because they aren't faceless in reality, it's just a generic anti-sc2 message. I seriously don't know why people say they don't like the game but are here anyways.
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If you really cared about SC you would be excited as I am when new guys break through with a bang. Think jjakji leenock where ppl said "no way leenock is in form jjakji is a lucky joke" and he showed one of the smartest, most well planned series in SC history. It doesn't matter if he wasn't huge before if you are really passionate for the game andnotvjust a fairweather fanboy.
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On March 20 2013 05:44 zefreak wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:23 iky43210 wrote:
pcbang used to be huge in Taiwan, then it all got wiped out except a very few after computers become cheap and labor becomes more expensive. Most pcbangs (from taiwan experience) are dirty and taiwa/Korea have cheap high end internet in the range of 25Mb/sec that you can get for $10 a month, there is no reason why you would ever go to pcbang unless you have very restricted parents.
I am willing to bet if the korea government doesn't subsidize pcbang so heavily in Korea, they would all go out of business too. Then again this is probably true for alot of their companies as Korea pretty much subsidize just about everything. That's how they are able to complete globally easily when samsung are being fed with government money Name a country that doesn't subsidize everything. PC bangs are a cultural thing in Korea, very few go out of 'necessity'.
Most countries don't subsidize everything... I don't think you understand how easy it is to get grants in Korea. The government would literally pay 50% of R&D if you request for it. Its stupidly easy to make money when you barely have to invest anything and just export all your products.
They can keep up this practice because they are competing with foreign companies and not among themselves, but it really undermines spirit of free trades when your private company is up against another that is sponsored by the government.
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On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG...
It's official guys, we've found someone that has more shallow analysis than me.
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On March 20 2013 06:13 Grettin wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 06:10 Conti wrote:On March 20 2013 05:40 bduddy wrote:Here's another set of interesting rankings that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else: the Afreeca rankings. (Google Translate says they're from "March week 2", so I guess that ended right around the HoTS launch. 1. League of Legends 2. Minecraft 3. SimCity (up 4) 4. Starcraft (down 2) 5. Sudden Attack (down 1) 6. Starcraft 2 (up 3) 7. Lineage (down 2) 8. World of Warcraft (up 8) 9. Kart Rider (down 2) 10. Warcraft (down 1) [WC3, I assume?] http://gametv.afreeca.com/Getting close to BW and passing Kart Rider is pretty impressive, IMO, and once SimCity inevitably takes a dive SC2 should be in the top 5 (especially because most of Week 2 probably included the days right before the HoTS launch, which were pretty dead). Also, World of Tanks is 18th and DOTA2 is AWOL... good luck to GOM with those, they'll need it... Hmm, that's quite surprising. Are there any big names that stream SC2 on Afreeca (and not on, say, Twitch)? There are a lot of VoDs at least that area being shown, so dunno if those numbers are calculated. If you mouse over the ? next to the rankings, it shows some stuff that I think says how the numbers are calculated... I couldn't paste that into Google Translate, though, so I don't know what it actually says.
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On March 20 2013 07:13 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... It's official guys, we've found someone that has more shallow analysis than me.
well that was the funniest thing i've read today
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On March 20 2013 07:13 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... It's official guys, we've found someone that has more shallow analysis than me.
Don't sell yourself short.
Obvious joke aside, you were a pleasure to listen to at MLG.
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On March 20 2013 06:06 Xiron wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:50 Chewbacca. wrote:On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... There is just a lot more action all around. Reapers are much better and produce some action early game. Oracles are good and provide some more harassment options which are fun to watch. Mothership core or whatever it is called allows for some more harassment options for protoss early on Vipers allow zerg to have interesting ways to try and break a Terran mech so those games aren't as often just boring turtles Widow mines can allow for some cute micro trying to pull mines into the terrans own army Medivac buff seems to be leading to more multipronged drops which once again, are fun to watch. Between infestor nerf/viper introduction/hydra and ultra buff zerg games aren't just 100% turtle until maxed on brood infestor Protoss air buffs gives them more options so that games aren't all the same for them either... IMO almost every change they've made makes the game more fun to watch. Yeah but people like my won't return because units are somewhat different. The thing the game lacks is consistency. I didn't follow the game for half a year and after returning it feels like 50% of players that matter are new/nonames I couldn't really care about. The other 50% are 40% faceless koreans and the 10% foreigners/koreans with a character can't make up for the boredom that is 90% of the players. I'm really sad that the game of my dreams, which it was after release of WoL, didn't manage to keep that aura of epicness I always felt ;( Back then, when I used to watch all of Husky's / Day9's / Psy's casts, every player had a distinct style of play everyone knew about. You could literally see their progress week after week. Fun times.
Sounds like now would be the perfect time to watch. HotS changes almost everything.
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On March 20 2013 06:06 Xiron wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:50 Chewbacca. wrote:On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... There is just a lot more action all around. Reapers are much better and produce some action early game. Oracles are good and provide some more harassment options which are fun to watch. Mothership core or whatever it is called allows for some more harassment options for protoss early on Vipers allow zerg to have interesting ways to try and break a Terran mech so those games aren't as often just boring turtles Widow mines can allow for some cute micro trying to pull mines into the terrans own army Medivac buff seems to be leading to more multipronged drops which once again, are fun to watch. Between infestor nerf/viper introduction/hydra and ultra buff zerg games aren't just 100% turtle until maxed on brood infestor Protoss air buffs gives them more options so that games aren't all the same for them either... IMO almost every change they've made makes the game more fun to watch. Yeah but people like my won't return because units are somewhat different. The thing the game lacks is consistency. I didn't follow the game for half a year and after returning it feels like 50% of players that matter are new/nonames I couldn't really care about. The other 50% are 40% faceless koreans and the 10% foreigners/koreans with a character can't make up for the boredom that is 90% of the players.
See this is simply not true and whenever i read this i feel like people are just looking for something to bag out. How many championships do MVP, MC, nestea, life etc have to win before people stop saying stuff like this?
If anything the top players have remained extremely similar and the only reason that there would be so many unfamiliar faces is because of the huge influx of kespa players.
Let's just look at MLG (which btw is a whole new game so you should expect different faces) and i'm assuming that's what you're basing your comment off. Life, polt, creator, MC, hero, MVP, taeja, bomber, parting, jjakji, marineking, seed and leenock were the ESF players and they have all been around for AGES. So i don't see how they can be used to prove anything. The rest are kespa players and they only just switched over so of course that was going to bring in a temporary change at the top. Other than that it's a bunch of foreigners who have also mostly been around since the beginning.
There is no truth to what you're posting. Further i don't even see how it is a complaint. Isn't it a good thing to see different people winning? Like i know we don't want it to be random and requiring no skill but we also want to see different players succeeding. I thought WOL struck a really good balance. We saw plenty of different winners but we also had the likes of nestea, MVP, MC, life and DRG who saw consistent success.
If you don't want to watch SC2 then more power to you but try and come up with a better reason than that.
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On March 20 2013 07:13 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 05:41 Velr wrote:
From a viewer perspective... Why should Hots be better recieved than Wol? The only thing that makes it more fun are fast medivacs and thats about it. Z/P still seem Ball vs Ball boredom... At least thats what i got from watching a bit of MLG... It's official guys, we've found someone that has more shallow analysis than me.
Made my day TB, ty.
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EPT
