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Dustin Browder, David Kim Interviews - Page 25

Forum Index > SC2 General
494 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 23 24 25 All
sertas
Profile Joined April 2012
Sweden886 Posts
June 21 2012 06:45 GMT
#481
On June 18 2012 16:58 INeedSpoons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 13 2012 12:17 destian wrote:
i've never seen neural parasite on a mothership. can someone please link a pro game where this happened?


This game is of Snute, a pro Norwegian Zerg, and arguably the best Norwegian.
http://postimage.org/image/7c131wjjr/




GSL the latest up and downs last game with ACE vs some zerg i forgot who, sick long game with a neural to the mothership and the mothership gets feedbacked immediatly i think.
Fragile51
Profile Joined October 2011
Netherlands15767 Posts
June 21 2012 06:49 GMT
#482
On June 21 2012 15:45 sertas wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 18 2012 16:58 INeedSpoons wrote:
On June 13 2012 12:17 destian wrote:
i've never seen neural parasite on a mothership. can someone please link a pro game where this happened?


This game is of Snute, a pro Norwegian Zerg, and arguably the best Norwegian.
http://postimage.org/image/7c131wjjr/




GSL the latest up and downs last game with ACE vs some zerg i forgot who, sick long game with a neural to the mothership and the mothership gets feedbacked immediatly i think.


BboongBboong, Last day of UnD.
LastWish
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
2013 Posts
June 21 2012 11:03 GMT
#483
Each time I watch a Dustin Browder interview I feel this guy is fine.
I mean he does not use a lot of political speech and the general feeling from him is very good.
Just one thing Dustin, try not to make things too cool, because too much is just too much.

Well David Kim is a problem.. I can sense this guy has limited experience and too much power. He needs now to experiment a lot and I feel he is doing it wrong.

General ideas for you Blizzard guys:
- try not to focus on low level balance
- what should be important on lower levels(brodze - diamond) is race play distribution: that means that zerg, protoss and terran should all be played around 30% of all games(random excluded).
- brondze/silver/gold/platinum should be at least judged together whatever statistics you take into account, because there are 4 levels of low players and only 2 levels of high play(masters/gm) so It does not sum up accordingly
- on high levels(masters/grand masters) balanced should be the important number -
However goal should not be 50%:50% ratio in each matchup as we have experience from BW where 55%:45% was a managable balance ratio and still you could find players who would dominate in the unfavored situaltion(Flash, Bisu, Jaedong).
- more intuitive units = I look at this unit/I see what he is doing and I understand what it does without unnecessary introduction - the units you give into HOTS lack this attribute and instead thrive on coolness
- not every unit should be designed to be used in every matchup:
Consider if you have a unit that is designed for TvZ and give it a ability for TvP - you are making a over complex unit that does not have intuitive usage also it is harder to balance because of it. Rather design a new unit for TvP that would fill the required role. This unit I'm refering to is obviosly the new transformer hellion which will in my opinion become a disaster for balancing(also I don't like it pesonally).
- I think a single new unit for each race(maybe 2 for zerg) will be just enough. You can put more into campaign I don't care but don't destroy the game by making too many changes -
Personal preference:
- don't change thors completely, warhound is not such a good idea
- swarmhost should be slow but powerful - so to introduce a push dynamic into zerg play
- ultralisk burrow stike I don't like(it's just charge with different visuals) - ultralisk should be more of a tanky unit - more armor or reduced damage from high damages?
- tempest is a good idea - however to keep it simple I would make it splash ground and air too(the same attack as it has for air) - it would be then another choice of splash damage instead of colossi or high templars; balancing would not be easy though

Good luck
- It's all just treason - They bring me down with their lies - Don't know the reason - My life is fire and ice -
[F_]aths
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany3947 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-21 13:12:21
June 21 2012 13:10 GMT
#484
On June 21 2012 20:03 LastWish wrote:
General ideas for you Blizzard guys:
- try not to focus on low level balance

If it's not hurting higher-level balance, I don't see a problem with balancing for lower levels, too. The focus of the balance team is obvioulsy on esports level balance.
You don't choose to play zerg. The zerg choose you.
LastWish
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
2013 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-21 14:43:58
June 21 2012 14:43 GMT
#485
On June 21 2012 22:10 [F_]aths wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2012 20:03 LastWish wrote:
General ideas for you Blizzard guys:
- try not to focus on low level balance

If it's not hurting higher-level balance, I don't see a problem with balancing for lower levels, too. The focus of the balance team is obvioulsy on esports level balance.

Well it's hard to judge whether the balance changes on low levels don't have any impact on high levels.
I'd say the high level balance changes(because they need to be more delicate) have lesser impact on low level play than the other way around.
- It's all just treason - They bring me down with their lies - Don't know the reason - My life is fire and ice -
DarKcS
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Australia1237 Posts
June 21 2012 15:10 GMT
#486
Was rocks at the 3rd their excuse based on lower leagues? At least 90% of the maps don't have rocks at the 3rd anymore, but some have retardly difficult to defend layouts. I mean why make the 3rd on that new desert map have such a wonky 3rd, with a high-ground perfect for Terran/Toss to use pylons and dropships? We saw this stuff phased out after relase, so why bring stupid map design back? ZZz...
The worst part about rocks is it pigeon holes strats in to 2 base timings which is a bad thing. But I'm arguing with thin air here because there aren't many maps left with 3rd besides Tal'Darim and .. who plays that any more, honestly?


And why did they nerf neural parasite when it was our best defense against kiting from colssus, tank, thor balls etc then go and add the viper with 2x the range in HOTS to do the same job? I just want to punch my own face in.
Die tomorrow - Live today
Danger-dog
Profile Joined April 2006
United States50 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-21 19:14:45
June 21 2012 19:11 GMT
#487
I love the way Kim explains this idea;

when you add A-move units to the game, you encourage strategies that involve action-intensive macro and multi-pronged attacks. On their own, these two playstyles might not be effective because they increase the likelihood that a player won't be looking at the right units when the critical moment in the fight occurs. With A-move friendly units, your units are gonna deal pretty much the same amout of damage whether you're looking or not, meaning that the player can only prevail by macroing, composing, and positioning more skillyfully than his opponent—reading his opponent's intentions in the long term rather than in the short term. This doesn't mean mutas and hellions are obsolete now—as always, these units have the potential to be much more cost-effective than A-move units if they are used properly. That is, provided we are measuring "cost" as just a gas-mineral-supply cost and not as a time-oppertunity cost as well.
Here Lies The Zerg Lurker, R.I.P. 1998-2010.
LastWish
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
2013 Posts
June 21 2012 23:47 GMT
#488
On June 22 2012 04:11 Danger-dog wrote:
I love the way Kim explains this idea;

when you add A-move units to the game, you encourage strategies that involve action-intensive macro and multi-pronged attacks. On their own, these two playstyles might not be effective because they increase the likelihood that a player won't be looking at the right units when the critical moment in the fight occurs. With A-move friendly units, your units are gonna deal pretty much the same amout of damage whether you're looking or not, meaning that the player can only prevail by macroing, composing, and positioning more skillyfully than his opponent—reading his opponent's intentions in the long term rather than in the short term. This doesn't mean mutas and hellions are obsolete now—as always, these units have the potential to be much more cost-effective than A-move units if they are used properly. That is, provided we are measuring "cost" as just a gas-mineral-supply cost and not as a time-oppertunity cost as well.

Is this some kind of bot response because I can't see where this response is going...
- It's all just treason - They bring me down with their lies - Don't know the reason - My life is fire and ice -
Roarer
Profile Joined December 2011
Hong Kong124 Posts
June 24 2012 01:24 GMT
#489
On June 22 2012 08:47 LastWish wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2012 04:11 Danger-dog wrote:
I love the way Kim explains this idea;

when you add A-move units to the game, you encourage strategies that involve action-intensive macro and multi-pronged attacks. On their own, these two playstyles might not be effective because they increase the likelihood that a player won't be looking at the right units when the critical moment in the fight occurs. With A-move friendly units, your units are gonna deal pretty much the same amout of damage whether you're looking or not, meaning that the player can only prevail by macroing, composing, and positioning more skillyfully than his opponent—reading his opponent's intentions in the long term rather than in the short term. This doesn't mean mutas and hellions are obsolete now—as always, these units have the potential to be much more cost-effective than A-move units if they are used properly. That is, provided we are measuring "cost" as just a gas-mineral-supply cost and not as a time-oppertunity cost as well.

Is this some kind of bot response because I can't see where this response is going...


I think what he means is a player who can multitask well but not micro can go toe to toe with a player who can micro well but not multitask. This just put the 2 skill at a more even ground and we can have games which a player outmicro someone's multitasking or he out multitask someone's micro.

In his second half, it is more about pure macro vs pure micro, and players who is only good at one of the two can go toe to toe to each other.

And the last sentence, I am not sure. In SC2, the value of a win have nothing to do with the game time, so I do not think time cost sohuld come into play in any ways.
Never argue with an idiot, cause they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience =﹏=
sluggaslamoo
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Australia4494 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-25 04:03:43
June 25 2012 03:56 GMT
#490
On June 24 2012 10:24 Roarer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2012 08:47 LastWish wrote:
On June 22 2012 04:11 Danger-dog wrote:
I love the way Kim explains this idea;

when you add A-move units to the game, you encourage strategies that involve action-intensive macro and multi-pronged attacks. On their own, these two playstyles might not be effective because they increase the likelihood that a player won't be looking at the right units when the critical moment in the fight occurs. With A-move friendly units, your units are gonna deal pretty much the same amout of damage whether you're looking or not, meaning that the player can only prevail by macroing, composing, and positioning more skillyfully than his opponent—reading his opponent's intentions in the long term rather than in the short term. This doesn't mean mutas and hellions are obsolete now—as always, these units have the potential to be much more cost-effective than A-move units if they are used properly. That is, provided we are measuring "cost" as just a gas-mineral-supply cost and not as a time-oppertunity cost as well.

Is this some kind of bot response because I can't see where this response is going...


I think what he means is a player who can multitask well but not micro can go toe to toe with a player who can micro well but not multitask. This just put the 2 skill at a more even ground and we can have games which a player outmicro someone's multitasking or he out multitask someone's micro.

In his second half, it is more about pure macro vs pure micro, and players who is only good at one of the two can go toe to toe to each other.

And the last sentence, I am not sure. In SC2, the value of a win have nothing to do with the game time, so I do not think time cost sohuld come into play in any ways.


Yeah but that view is kinda impractical. No pro has just one skill. And tbh I hate to make a BW reference, but honing any of sort of skill is not as effective as it was in BW.

In BW (in comparison to SC2) honing micro, strategy, macro, tactics alone can make a big difference to your game. The top BW players are much more specialised than the top SC2 players and have their own very unique traits. I've seen DRG/MC/MVP/MMA/MKP's games, they do have some special traits (good forcefields/marine splitting/drops/etc), but when compared to top BW players we are looking at a completely different level.

Jaedong's mutas are 9x more effective than other players, Boxer's marines never died, 1 of Snows reavers could hold off an entire all in, Stork's strategies have given him a winning record against the top BW players and remain extremely consistent even though hes one of the slowest players, Savior's tactics allowed him to be the first Bonjwa with very low apm also, Flash's macro/mindgames allowed him to A-move any unit to victory, Bisu's multitask allows him to macro/tech really hard while utilising small guerilla forces to its maximum potential.

In SC2 you need to be much more all rounded because of these A-move units and weird discrepancies in macro. So if this is really Blizzards goal, then they have kinda missed the mark.
Come play Android Netrunner - http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=409008
Sabre
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United Kingdom1086 Posts
August 04 2012 02:02 GMT
#491
Guys I found David Kim:
http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/ROOTKoReYa-

didn't know he plays dota2 so much o_O
UK TrackMania Champion | Former SC2 player | http://www.twitter.com/Sabre_CS
Chriscras
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Korea (South)2812 Posts
August 04 2012 02:07 GMT
#492
On August 04 2012 11:02 SabreUK wrote:
Guys I found David Kim:
http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/ROOTKoReYa-

didn't know he plays dota2 so much o_O


Fake David Kim LOL
"En taro adun, Executor."
Sabre
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United Kingdom1086 Posts
August 04 2012 02:08 GMT
#493
On August 04 2012 11:07 Chriscras wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2012 11:02 SabreUK wrote:
Guys I found David Kim:
http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/ROOTKoReYa-

didn't know he plays dota2 so much o_O


Fake David Kim LOL


no, it's real ofc, he lives with his dad in nyc playing dota2. ofc he was picked for blizz balance dont be silly
UK TrackMania Champion | Former SC2 player | http://www.twitter.com/Sabre_CS
Picklebread
Profile Joined June 2011
808 Posts
August 04 2012 02:23 GMT
#494
On August 04 2012 11:02 SabreUK wrote:
Guys I found David Kim:
http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/ROOTKoReYa-

didn't know he plays dota2 so much o_O

What this is a fake man
AceDSS
Profile Joined September 2011
Canada33 Posts
August 04 2012 02:53 GMT
#495
blizz balance is terrible i can't believe some of the problems they haven't addressed. browder shouldn't even be on the damn team he doesn't seem to even acknowledge or understand the games problems
DiSc0
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