e-Sport's first Grand Slam title holder, the Genius Terran NaDa, also called the "Living Legend" announced that he will be moving onto Starcraft 2. NaDa is the only one to win six individual leagues while winning 3 contests in each league, succeeding in a "Grand Slam".
NaDa was active under WeMade Fox until August, but chose not to re-contract in August so that he can transition to Starcraft 2. Representatives from WeMade have tried to re-contract with NaDa, but NaDa's will was so strong that WeMade gave up trying to re-contract with the player.
WeMade's Kim Yong Hwa said that "While we tried to recontract, there was nothing we could do because NaDa was so certain about what he wanted to do", adding that "While the void left behind by the team's Franchise star NaDa is regrettable, because he is so confident and he has a strong will, we believe that he will revive as an even bigger star. We will continue to cheer for him"
He currently lives outside the dorms, and he is practicing so that he can enter the GSL this upcoming October. He has also announced that he will be active as an individual in Starcraft 2, without belonging to a progame team. TSL and STARTALE and other Starcraft 2 teams have tried to recruit NaDa, but they have not been able to convince him.
Meanwhile, WeMade set Midas as the team's captain, and in order to lessen the void left by NaDa, they are looking to recruit players in order to prepare for the next season.
So good to see some Korean pros that have they're own opinions of how well Starcraft II will grow and we can see that there is at least some Korean hope and support for SC2 to do well.
This is great news indead, looking forward to see Lee reap (yes reap, as in, cut off their heads with a scythe and take them home) some noobs in GSL season 2, it's gonna be GREAT!
Oh man... I bet a lot more bw progamers might dip into sc2 if kespa gives in. Someone send jaedong and flash a copy of SC2 so they can start practicing when bored.
Nada is one of the few progamers along with Reach and YellOw that withstood the test of time and is able to still play at a high level after all these years.
This is pretty good news for GOMtv since with these big names joining up, a lot more people would be willing to subscribe and a lot more sponsors would be interested as well.
On September 17 2010 10:53 FortuneSyn wrote: That's it. All hope is lost for foreigners.
not yet, the original foriegner, the blued eyed viking, the man, the legend, GIYOM is also playing starcraft two. Do not give up hope!
Yeah, and didn't qualify for the GSL My hopes are on TL making the most out of their time in Korea, actually keeping up with the Koreans in practice and mechanics.
On September 17 2010 10:56 zerious wrote: Nada is one of the few progamers along with Reach and YellOw that withstood the test of time and is able to still play at a high level after all these years.
By this time next year sc2 is going to have taken off... a bunch of people are converting.. seeing these names come over is only enticing other players more.
i really hope that we can find a good balance in korea between sc2 and sc:bw. i still love watching sc:bw games, and they can teach you a lot still. BW might also benefit from some sc2 strategy some day.
Some good bw pro's comming over is good news though, because it gives a lot of legitimacy to the leagues (gsl). i really hope kespa can resolve the dispute with gom/gretch.
Alright guys, get ready for the protoss to become OP.
Seriously, this is seriously amazing news, even possibly better than Boxer switching to sc2, since Nada could beat Boxer. Nada will help the future of SC2 incrediably. OMG I CANT WAIT!!!!
On September 17 2010 11:01 Pandain wrote: Alright guys, get ready for the protoss to become OP.
Seriously, this is seriously amazing news, even possibly better than Boxer switching to sc2, since Nada could beat Boxer. Nada will help the future of SC2 incrediably. OMG I CANT WAIT!!!!
Best of luck to Nada. Count me amongst those that will cheer for him. I remember being a young lad watching fan vids of him in the infancy of youtube. It's taking everything I have not to go into full blown fanboy mode....SC2 delivers such awesome news.
On September 17 2010 11:05 leakingpear wrote: So how long until Reach's military service is up? It must be close to over soon.
He's going back to KT. Service is over.
Oh tits, well that's great too, hopefully he doesn't become a coach and is never heard of again Or the PL breaks down and he's contractually obliged not to play SC2 or something stupid.
Seriously though, I don't blame him. I was very frustrated and he was probably too when WeMade refused to play him in the playoffs. Yeah he started to really slow down in early 2009, but WeMade is basically Terran and you can hardly get better than a living legend.
NaDa still has the most Broodwar OSL/MSL medals. I dream of him winning the second and third GSL and owning both games for all time success. Hopefully before Flash or JD tie him in January in BW in the OSL (surely one of them will win, well hopefully Stork of course).
On September 17 2010 11:16 Caphe wrote: Now imagine how awesome it is if Nada join TL :D. He's individual now right? Come on TeamLiquid, can you somehow, recruit Nada
I doubt it's gonna happen. Not saying that TL is poor, but Nada requires a HUGE salary.
On September 17 2010 11:12 t3tsubo wrote: TLAF-Liquid'NaDa is possible the sexiest combination of syllables that I've heard for a long time. Any chance?
well, if he's unwilling to join Korean teams he's probably unwilling to join TL. Someone mentioned something about military service coming up.
On September 17 2010 11:01 Pandain wrote: Alright guys, get ready for the protoss to become OP.
Seriously, this is seriously amazing news, even possibly better than Boxer switching to sc2, since Nada could beat Boxer. Nada will help the future of SC2 incrediably. OMG I CANT WAIT!!!!
Nada Hwaiting! I want replays ASAP! =D =D =D =D
Doesn't NaDa play Terran? Not Protoss
Ahahahahah epic fail. The worst thing is i I know that. Don't know why I was thinking he was toss for that weird time... Protoss Bonjwa... I wish.
can't stand the "it has begun" comments though, I'd like to see at least 2-3 A-teamers switch out before even starting to think about that (and thats not happening anytime soon)
I like that he's remaining as an independent player (at least for now). I'm imagining a tournament roster with a bunch of players that belong to teams, and then right in the middle of the list "NaDa."
Kid doesn't give a fuck about teams he'll beat them all anyway.
On September 17 2010 11:17 Sl4ktarN wrote: I wouldnt be surprised at all if Nal_Ra switches to SC2 too. I would however nerdgasm.
Someone posted/said that Nal_Ra really likes SC2 but I'm having trouble finding it again. It may have even been a video interview with someone. Maybe once he's done with military service he'll jump on board .
YES! Now we shall see the strength of a real progamer. Hope to see a Nada vs TLO match again. However, I really think he should still join a team since hes not gonna be getting salary or any money as a matter of fact unless he wins tournaments.
At first, I had mixed feelings; July wasn't very active, and didn't even come off the bench/come out for ace matches like NaDa did. However, his willingness to play at the ESL Cologne definitely makes me feel that he wanted to do this, and thinking of that, My wishes are completely smashed by what he wants to do. I honestly can't see anyone logically feeling any different.
I have a theory on why Nada isn't on a team. What if Blizzard paid him to move over to sc2 and ask him to sign an NDA? WeMade have offered him a re-contract and he said no. TSL and other SC2 teams have offered him contracts and he said no. Now, why would you say no to getting paid to play SC2. Unless, you are already getting paid by someone else...
Even if Nada isn't getting paid by Blizzard to switch over, I think Blizzard may try this tactic to some other well known and popular BW progamers. If they do this successfully, I think BW will be on its last legs in terms of PL and they won't have to deal with the Kespa issue directly.
On September 17 2010 11:36 wongi wrote: I have a theory on why Nada isn't on a team. What if Blizzard paid him to move over to sc2 and ask him to sign an NDA? WeMade have offered him a re-contract and he said no. TSL and other SC2 teams have offered him contracts and he said no. Now, why would you say no to getting paid to play SC2. Unless, you are already getting paid by someone else...
Even if Nada isn't getting paid by Blizzard to switch over, I think Blizzard may try this tactic to some other well known and popular BW progamers. If they do this successfully, I think BW will be on its last legs in terms of PL and they won't have to deal with the Kespa issue directly.
is posible, but i think SC2 is a good move for players like Nada, July, Savior, Luxury, Hwasin...
On September 17 2010 11:36 wongi wrote: I have a theory on why Nada isn't on a team. What if Blizzard paid him to move over to sc2 and ask him to sign an NDA? WeMade have offered him a re-contract and he said no. TSL and other SC2 teams have offered him contracts and he said no. Now, why would you say no to getting paid to play SC2. Unless, you are already getting paid by someone else...
Even if Nada isn't getting paid by Blizzard to switch over, I think Blizzard may try this tactic to some other well known and popular BW progamers. If they do this successfully, I think BW will be on its last legs in terms of PL and they won't have to deal with the Kespa issue directly.
is posible, but i think SC2 is a good move for players like Nada, July, Savior, Luxury, Hwasin...
NaDa's not on a team so he can keep all the earnings himself and have more freedom on his self-paced schedule, like any confident player would decide. No contracts holding players down yet with SC2, and pros like NaDa who know they can take first place in the GSL will take advantage of that. Who needs a team to pay you a crap salary when one month can bring you -- and only you -- a kajillion WON?
edit: I'm fairly certain that Nada will become the best player on Earth. Sc1 pros have been doing very well in sc2, and now it's time for a real champion to show everyone how it's done. Once a Bonjwa, always a Bonjwa.
wow awesome news im hopeing ST will convince NaDa to join them, so both July and him will be on the same team =p next month's gsl looks like its going to be fantastic.
On September 17 2010 11:44 Cedstick wrote: NaDa's not on a team so he can keep all the earnings himself and have more freedom on his self-paced schedule, like any confident player would decide. No contracts holding players down yet with SC2, and pros like NaDa who know they can take first place in the GSL will take advantage of that. Who needs a team to pay you a crap salary when one month can bring you -- and only you -- a kajillion WON?
And everybody else what, back to eating ramen until the next season?
Oh yes, very healthy for e-sports.
NaDa moved on. Big deal. He is not in the SCBW peak anymore, and he wanted to remain active. This is a good decision for him, and for SCII as a spectacle. But for eSports? We have yet to see.
And how exactly is this sticking it to KeSPA (referring to a page 1-2 post).
lol he's looking to get in on that huge prize pool. i think a lot of the brood war players are.
i'm really interested in how these brood war players are going to change sc2. i feel that because macro is easier in sc2, we're going to see micro become even more important that it was in brood war, and what separates a great player from a pro.
On September 17 2010 11:36 wongi wrote: I have a theory on why Nada isn't on a team. What if Blizzard paid him to move over to sc2 and ask him to sign an NDA? WeMade have offered him a re-contract and he said no. TSL and other SC2 teams have offered him contracts and he said no. Now, why would you say no to getting paid to play SC2. Unless, you are already getting paid by someone else...
Even if Nada isn't getting paid by Blizzard to switch over, I think Blizzard may try this tactic to some other well known and popular BW progamers. If they do this successfully, I think BW will be on its last legs in terms of PL and they won't have to deal with the Kespa issue directly.
is posible, but i think SC2 is a good move for players like Nada, July, Savior, Luxury, Hwasin...
Hello, Blizzard? we need balance patch ASAP, it's about to get heavy! GSL season 2 will be EXTREME. Hopefully more foreigners will participate, but they need to step their game up if they want to compete with bonjwa players.
Damn, this is a really gutsy decision by Nada. He is the highest paid BW player in Korea, and the fact that he would turn that down, well that's just huge.
I'm really interested to see what team he plays for, or if he starts his own team. I already can't wait for the next GSL. Oh man!!
is it true that Holy Check terran is indeed Nada? i read somewhere that some one with no name used id HolyCheck and beat some highly ranked players like Tester in afreeka gisado show.
On September 17 2010 12:35 lubu42 wrote: this is the beginning.....of a new era. The day Boxer switches i will give everyone on the planet 1000 dollars
On September 17 2010 12:35 lubu42 wrote: this is the beginning.....of a new era. The day Boxer switches i will give everyone on the planet 1000 dollars
On September 17 2010 12:35 lubu42 wrote: this is the beginning.....of a New era. The Day BoxeR switches i will give everyone on the planet 1000 dollars
Paypal.That is all
Anyhow , NaDa switches.OMG that"s huge.Zergs all over the World are going to Rage so hard after playing him.Massive Terran Imba incoming
And plus he"s one of the Highest paid BW player on the Scene.Shows it"s more than just about money.
On September 17 2010 12:33 KiLL_ORdeR wrote: Damn, this is a really gutsy decision by Nada. He is the highest paid BW player in Korea, and the fact that he would turn that down, well that's just huge.
I'm really interested to see what team he plays for, or if he starts his own team. I already can't wait for the next GSL. Oh man!!
and u really think he was still the highest paid BW player in korea? he didnt let his 3 year 600k contract or whatever down. he got way less...
Well well well, the next GSL is going to be pretty interesting I guess. I'm kind of glad TL and the other foreigners like TorcH got a chance to get experience in the first one before all the ultramen hit.
Appart from anything else, I'll be fascinated to see what BW progamers actually do with SC2. One of the most interesting things for me anyway is watching how WC3 graduates have a different approach to aspects of the game compared to SC/BW warriors.
On September 17 2010 12:35 lubu42 wrote: this is the beginning.....of a new era. The day Boxer switches i will give everyone on the planet 1000 dollars
Nada casually turning down StarTale and TSL, because even though they're the biggest players in SC II so far, he knows that by himself he's already bigger than them and the entire Korean SC II scene combined. Why go to work with small fries operating like BW teams in 2001, when he could just go out and grab a bigger sponsorship than anyone combined through his reputation alone?
Hell, other teams better make sure to tie their players under contract before Nada and his sponsored team raid the shit out of them -_-
On September 17 2010 11:44 Cedstick wrote: NaDa's not on a team so he can keep all the earnings himself and have more freedom on his self-paced schedule, like any confident player would decide. No contracts holding players down yet with SC2, and pros like NaDa who know they can take first place in the GSL will take advantage of that. Who needs a team to pay you a crap salary when one month can bring you -- and only you -- a kajillion WON?
And everybody else what, back to eating ramen until the next season?
Oh yes, very healthy for e-sports.
NaDa moved on. Big deal. He is not in the SCBW peak anymore, and he wanted to remain active. This is a good decision for him, and for SCII as a spectacle. But for eSports? We have yet to see.
And how exactly is this sticking it to KeSPA (referring to a page 1-2 post).
When did I ever say anything about eSports and independency of players being healthy for it? What you sniffin', boy? I said he's confident he can win, so he's not bothering with the clutter that comes with contracts.
*EDIT* Waxangel said it nicely. He's bigger than teams right now, so why bother with 'em?
OUBLE EDIT* Does anyone have a good scene they can post from a movie, where some character or army sees an impossible-to-beat foe and just drops everything and gives up? No Kerrigan, please. That's the easy response. We need an army just collectively dropping their swords or guns or something.
I think it makes sense that he doesn't want to join a team. He's got money, and he's really got to be sick of practicing all day in a team house with teenagers by now. Plus no one can bench him, or make him GG out of a showmatch. I bet at some point he joins a team like oGs or STARTALE though, if only to make some cash with sponsorships. Plus, it must suck to go to a tournament all alone.
Damn, he gave TLO all he could handle with just 10 days of casual practice. I'm super pumped to see what he can do for real.
well ill be the first in the thread to say this, im sure there are tons of others thinking it ^_^_^_^
not to sound like a hater to all the nada/july fanboys, but I'll personally be a lot more excited when some good current BW players switch over and not hasbeens
On September 17 2010 13:08 Gentso wrote: Nada took a game off of TLO only playing for 10 days. Can't wait to see what he does with practice.
This is exaggerated NaDa has been playing SC2 almost as long as David Kim. The progamers from korean that attended blizzcon got to try it out before anyone and He already knew what was up when I saw my playing with SaviOr last year. He had 10 days of Practicing post launch maybe but I guarantee you he'd played several hundred games before that show match. This being said Liquid`NaDa must happen. Nazgul think of the TL Children. and TLAF THINK OF THE MONIESSSSSS
On September 17 2010 12:33 KiLL_ORdeR wrote: Damn, this is a really gutsy decision by Nada. He is the highest paid BW player in Korea, and the fact that he would turn that down, well that's just huge.
I'm really interested to see what team he plays for, or if he starts his own team. I already can't wait for the next GSL. Oh man!!
and u really think he was still the highest paid BW player in korea? he didnt let his 3 year 600k contract or whatever down. he got way less...
Well in Korea they are very tight lipped about salaries, but based on Wemade's response, I would assume that they were prepared to pay that same amount to him again. Maybe Korea is different, but in America it is extremely rare that a company will even consider bringing up the idea of a pay cut, they will fire an employee first.
Either way, he must be confident in his ability at SC2, since there still is no proffesional teams where players recieve a salary, it's not very stable atm.
On September 17 2010 13:14 Waxangel wrote: Nada casually turning down StarTale and TSL, because even though they're the biggest players in SC II so far, he knows that by himself he's already bigger than them and the entire Korean SC II scene combined. Why go to work with small fries operating like BW teams in 2001, when he could just go out and grab a bigger sponsorship than anyone combined through his reputation alone?
Hell, other teams better make sure to tie their players under contract before Nada and his sponsored team raid the shit out of them -_-
That would be pretty awesome, Nada forming his own team, then recruiting Boxer and other former big-names to join.
Can't wait to see NaDa action in SC2 his creativity is about to change meta-game With some practice NaDa will most likely transition quickly and move to the top in SC2! I mean after little practice he could hang with TLO. Welcome NaDa!
I sure hope the Koreans won't swarm together and use their practically already existing infrastructure to create amazing SC2 pro teams that will be able to stomp any sort of USA proteam we have at the moment.
On September 17 2010 13:08 Gentso wrote: Nada took a game off of TLO only playing for 10 days. Can't wait to see what he does with practice.
This is exaggerated NaDa has been playing SC2 almost as long as David Kim. The progamers from korean that attended blizzcon got to try it out before anyone and He already knew what was up when I saw my playing with SaviOr last year. He had 10 days of Practicing post launch maybe but I guarantee you he'd played several hundred games before that show match. This being said Liquid`NaDa must happen. Nazgul think of the TL Children. and TLAF THINK OF THE MONIESSSSSS
Uhmm, no. You are so misinformed.
Nada was paid to practice BW. You don't practice SC2 in house because you aren't paid to do it. Idra received permission from CJ to practice SC2.
As for Nada playing hundreds of game ... LMAO. If you watched Nada's Build Order against TLO and unit usage, Nada had no clue what he was doing. The only thing Nada had going for him was superior micro and macro against TLO, which helped Nada take a game off of TLO.
In other words, against TLO:
Nada's APM, micro, macro = Top Diamond
but Nada's Build Order, Unit Useage, understanding of SC2 = copper level
On September 17 2010 13:08 Gentso wrote: Nada took a game off of TLO only playing for 10 days. Can't wait to see what he does with practice.
This is exaggerated NaDa has been playing SC2 almost as long as David Kim. The progamers from korean that attended blizzcon got to try it out before anyone and He already knew what was up when I saw my playing with SaviOr last year. He had 10 days of Practicing post launch maybe but I guarantee you he'd played several hundred games before that show match. This being said Liquid`NaDa must happen. Nazgul think of the TL Children. and TLAF THINK OF THE MONIESSSSSS
Uhmm, no. You are so misinformed.
Nada was paid to practice BW. You don't practice SC2 in house because you aren't paid to do it. Idra received permission from CJ to practice SC2.
As for Nada playing hundreds of game ... LMAO. If you watched Nada's Build Order against TLO and unit usage, Nada had no clue what he was doing. The only thing Nada had going for him was superior micro and macro against TLO, which helped Nada take a game off of TLO.
In other words, against TLO:
Nada's APM, micro, macro = Top Diamond
but Nada's Build Order, Unit Useage, understanding of SC2 = copper level
That does not mean that he did not play it every once and awhile when he got the chance. Nada's Build Order, Unit Useage, understanding of SC2 was far above copper level lol. Yes Nada is good but people need to give TLO some more credit, even when Nada gets great at SC2 I will bet TLO can still take games off of him.
Nada leaves BW while he is still the greatest BW player (possibly Flash and even Jaedong could reach higher status in the future). I guess his motive is the bigger money/perspective he sees in SC2. edit: rethinking that image, Nada on a horse (well, pony) - he joins the TLAF riders? :D
Oh finally its official. He told me after our showmatch that he wants to play SC2 soon, maybe in GSL. Was really hard to not go out there and shout it out loud :D
On September 17 2010 14:02 Liquid`TLO wrote: Oh finally its official. He told me after our showmatch that he wants to play SC2 soon, maybe in GSL. Was really hard to not go out there and shout it out loud :D
looking forward to playing him again!
Interesting. Can you scoop things out and find out what other big names are planning to switch ? :d
On September 17 2010 14:02 Liquid`TLO wrote: Oh finally its official. He told me after our showmatch that he wants to play SC2 soon, maybe in GSL. Was really hard to not go out there and shout it out loud :D
looking forward to playing him again!
and we look forward to watching you play him again.
On September 17 2010 13:08 Gentso wrote: Nada took a game off of TLO only playing for 10 days. Can't wait to see what he does with practice.
This is exaggerated NaDa has been playing SC2 almost as long as David Kim. The progamers from korean that attended blizzcon got to try it out before anyone and He already knew what was up when I saw my playing with SaviOr last year. He had 10 days of Practicing post launch maybe but I guarantee you he'd played several hundred games before that show match. This being said Liquid`NaDa must happen. Nazgul think of the TL Children. and TLAF THINK OF THE MONIESSSSSS
Uhmm, no. You are so misinformed.
Nada was paid to practice BW. You don't practice SC2 in house because you aren't paid to do it. Idra received permission from CJ to practice SC2.
As for Nada playing hundreds of game ... LMAO. If you watched Nada's Build Order against TLO and unit usage, Nada had no clue what he was doing. The only thing Nada had going for him was superior micro and macro against TLO, which helped Nada take a game off of TLO.
In other words, against TLO:
Nada's APM, micro, macro = Top Diamond
but Nada's Build Order, Unit Useage, understanding of SC2 = copper level
Oh thats right you were in my head and just tricked me into seeing NaDa and SaviOr playing SC2 for HOURS at blizzcon. Think what you want NaDa played a lot more than "10 days casually". Also you ignored the most important part of my post He had 10 days of Practicing post launch maybe. The game is WAY different now than it was in Alpha and Beta just remember that.
edit: Also TLO coax him to Team Liquid with german beer and Korean Barbecue...damnit he can already get that.
This might be the tipping point for me to get a gsl season pass after all these bw pros switching. I wanna see what they can do especially since sc2 is my first serious rts and have realyl only known about the bw scene within the last year.
On September 17 2010 14:02 Liquid`TLO wrote: Oh finally its official. He told me after our showmatch that he wants to play SC2 soon, maybe in GSL. Was really hard to not go out there and shout it out loud :D
looking forward to playing him again!
thats just awesome man :D
greatest bw player ever! Lee Yun Yeol fighting ^_^
On September 17 2010 10:48 Milkis wrote: He currently lives outside the dorms, and he is practicing so that he can enter the GSL this upcoming October. He has also announced that he will be active as an individual in Starcraft 2, without belonging to a progame team. TSL and STARTALE and other Starcraft 2 teams have tried to recruit NaDa, but they have not been able to convince him.
xHydrax said that an unknown protoss played in gisado KoTH. He mentioned that they think it may have been boxer. So there, protoss now have a big BW pro.
Nada is one of the greatest players ever, but can anyone tell me what tournaments he's won since 2008? Isn't he a bit over the hill and getting old? I haven't followed the bw pros for a while..
On September 17 2010 15:27 Kaptein[konijn] wrote: Nada is one of the greatest players ever, but can anyone tell me what tournaments he's won since 2008? Isn't he a bit over the hill and getting old? I haven't followed the bw pros for a while..
He hasn't won any major tourneys since 2008 but did lose a very close series to Jangbi in MSL.
omg finally its official !!! screw the rumors ... time to party . NaDa owning Sc2. too bad I play Zerg . If I were a programmer in the Kespa top 10 I would show this news to my team and demand a 100% Raise. If I were Flash/JD I would demand a 500% raise .
I guess we will see more players switch.. whats the point sitting the whole season on a bench despite practicing 10hrs a day ?... None.
I hope the team structure and a PL will still be kept in Sc2
Holy shit its for real now! He made the right choice, better chance for him to win lots of money in SC2 than in SC1, he has to start worrying about joining the military soon anyway and might as well make as much as he can.
On September 17 2010 15:42 smileyyy wrote: I guess we will see more players switch.. whats the point sitting the whole season on a bench despite practicing 10hrs a day ?... None.
ummm, they get fed, paid and have somewhere to sleep. SC2 has almost 0 job security atm for progamers.
On September 17 2010 11:00 Kage wrote: Reach, Nal_rA, Draco where are you guys? Protoss needs a saviour.
Draco actually started playing sc2 ~month ago... Have played against him twice in ladder :b http://sc2ranks.com/eu/265539/Draco Anyways this is awesome! NaDa fightning!!!
On September 17 2010 15:42 smileyyy wrote: I guess we will see more players switch.. whats the point sitting the whole season on a bench despite practicing 10hrs a day ?... None.
ummm, they get fed, paid and have somewhere to sleep. SC2 has almost 0 job security atm for progamers.
I mean for players with the mindset like NaDa who actually want to play on a stage and win .. I do understand your point that the way the gsl is run it will attract "money hunters" poor guys who will live on ramen only. :o
On September 17 2010 14:02 Liquid`TLO wrote: Oh finally its official. He told me after our showmatch that he wants to play SC2 soon, maybe in GSL. Was really hard to not go out there and shout it out loud :D
looking forward to playing him again!
NaDa might be one of the biggest legends in starcraft of ALL time, but i will still cheer for you if you play against him again <3
On September 17 2010 14:02 Liquid`TLO wrote: Oh finally its official. He told me after our showmatch that he wants to play SC2 soon, maybe in GSL. Was really hard to not go out there and shout it out loud :D
looking forward to playing him again!
Lol, omg. If I talked to NaDa I´d piss my pants! ^^
Poster boys like July and Nada switching over is the boost SC2 needs for Korean fans to recognize it as BW's successor. If this helps SC2 e-sports take off, I'm all for it. But why doesn't Nada want to join a team? Wouldn't it help his training?
July, now Nada... Insane, also I find it funny how none of the progamers want to be with eachother (fuck if tester nada july teamed up they could be powerhousing the sc2 scene no problem). Also, I think nada will be a super monster in sc2, his handspeed was so amazing for sc1 but he lost desire to do well in the game. So with his new interest I hope he will succeed
Yeh great news, and I bet people still says BW isnt dying...
As soon as contracts are up even more players will defect over. Looking for some top Protosses and Zerg's to come over to put terran finally in their place!!! probably not great that nada came over anyway then lol
Well just from watching tester and cool play, you know July and Nada will be beastly once they get into their groove, it will be sick to watch, and hopefully our non-koreans can still keep up :D
On September 17 2010 15:27 Kaptein[konijn] wrote: Nada is one of the greatest players ever, but can anyone tell me what tournaments he's won since 2008? Isn't he a bit over the hill and getting old? I haven't followed the bw pros for a while..
Hey man, how about we wait until you are in your middle to late 20s and ill ask you if you are feeling old and over the hill? I have a strange mysterious magical feeling that suddenly late 20s wont seem so old to you. But thats just CRAZY talk, i know...
Cant wait to see Nada play. Whether he does really well or not everyone will always be glued to his games and he will always draw a crowd. I dont know if alot of TLers are just 15 or what but if you are like anything over 22 and not number 1 uncontested in your field or career they call you over the hill or a has been. Its really odd how people hold celebrities to an insane standard and extreme scrutiny of their lives/careers, no matter how average their own accomplishments and lives are. Must be human instinct or something.
Either way, cant wait for more BW players to come over so SC2 can become a wild west town of all kinds of players from all kinds of backgrounds. I waited a really long time for SC2 so that i could play it, but i waited just as long for the player base to mix and come together as it slowly is. Awesome news.
On September 17 2010 16:24 Tommylew wrote: Yeh great news, and I bet people still says BW isnt dying...
As soon as contracts are up even more players will defect over. Looking for some top Protosses and Zerg's to come over to put terran finally in their place!!! probably not great that nada came over anyway then lol
well just tell me why is it dying? because old players that didnt evne play anymore in PL and shit are switching over? if stork bisu flash jd or someone like that is switching u can think about saying its dying.
Damn if Boxer came to sc2 it would be very hard for us Protoss players >< He'd find every trick there is each patch and everyone would see the Terran Dominion again
This is really exciting and the transition is going faster than I had expected. It's kind of sad to see because I am still a huge fan of BW and so many BW players. My life would be complete if Samsung KHAN randomly switched over and I got to see some Firebathero, damn that would be insane. NaDa and July though, this is going to get insane. I hope it's not GG for foreigners.
Wow more and more people switching to Sc2 and not just some nobodys, but really famous guys. The transition is going faster than anybody could have predicted. Kind of sad for people who still love Broodwar, but great news for SC2.
On September 17 2010 17:18 shrinkmaster wrote: Wow more and more people switching to Sc2 and not just some nobodys, but really famous guys. The transition is going faster than anybody could have predicted. Kind of sad for people who still love Broodwar, but great news for SC2.
well BW only had like 1 year MAX left if that...
A lot will retire or switch over in the next 6 months.
On September 17 2010 16:58 MindRush wrote: man with Nada and Boxer playing as terran, i can't wait for the "OMG IMBA TERRAN" comments to start pouring down the teamliquid forums
you sound like no one have said it so far ? the fuck
Really looking forward to following Nada in the GSL. I just watched the showmatch Bo3 vs TLO and man does Nada's playstyle feel so different from any current top SC2 player. His tank control, his way of microing every little thing... Of course a lot of it has to do with him not having played SC2 fully yet, but still so refreshing to see. All that BW experience working through his hands....damn.
omg @_@ this is awesome, I've gone back and watched dozens of VoD's of NaDa because he was such an influence in the game of starcraft I am so happy to see this. E-SPORTS FITINGGG
Also: I cant wait for big teams to move over to sc2 and continue the salary life for players making sc2 a job with a secure future.
On September 17 2010 17:18 shrinkmaster wrote: Wow more and more people switching to Sc2 and not just some nobodys, but really famous guys. The transition is going faster than anybody could have predicted. Kind of sad for people who still love Broodwar, but great news for SC2.
well BW only had like 1 year MAX left if that...
A lot will retire or switch over in the next 6 months.
Hmm, i don't think it will happen that fast. The korean scene is really big and will fight for sc1. There's just so much money on the line for so many individuals and companys to go down without a fight.
Nada could probably afford to switch because he earned a lot of money in Sc1 and is ok without a team to support him. Many other players may not have the financial power to support themselves while training sc2. They need a team to support them. And even though we heard about a few new teams which focus on sc2 in korea there currently just aren't enough spots in pro teams for so many broodwar players.
Starcraft 2 needs a teamleague so the scene can get bigger than sc1 and support many more pro players.
Even though I love BW and still think it's the best game ever (yet! SC2 _might_ have the potential to be even better), this is good news to hear. I'd love to see SC2 becoming even bigger than BW (especially outside of Korea), so it's great to see players with charisma join the scene. Nada's time in BW was more or less over anyways.
On September 17 2010 19:30 T0fuuu wrote: wait guys. so if nada was wemade and couldnt play sc2, does this mean moon cant play sc2 unless he leaves wemade as well ?
anyways gl to nada. he doesnt need a team. he can singlehandedly win GSL (:
I wonder why wemade doesn't have an SC2-team, they have scbw, cs, wc3 - why no sc2-team?
And what happened to moon anyways? Is he playing wc3 or sc2?
On September 17 2010 19:30 T0fuuu wrote: wait guys. so if nada was wemade and couldnt play sc2, does this mean moon cant play sc2 unless he leaves wemade as well ?
anyways gl to nada. he doesnt need a team. he can singlehandedly win GSL (:
I wonder why wemade doesn't have an SC2-team, they have scbw, cs, wc3 - why no sc2-team?
And what happened to moon anyways? Is he playing wc3 or sc2?
Kespa doesn't like SC2 (or rather, they don't like Blizzard and the current situation), the teams are controlled by kespa, thus the teams "don't like" SC2.
On September 17 2010 19:30 T0fuuu wrote: wait guys. so if nada was wemade and couldnt play sc2, does this mean moon cant play sc2 unless he leaves wemade as well ?
anyways gl to nada. he doesnt need a team. he can singlehandedly win GSL (:
I wonder why wemade doesn't have an SC2-team, they have scbw, cs, wc3 - why no sc2-team?
And what happened to moon anyways? Is he playing wc3 or sc2?
Kespa doesn't like SC2 (or rather, they don't like Blizzard and the current situation), the teams are controlled by kespa, thus the teams "don't like" SC2.
On September 17 2010 20:51 Han Solo wrote: Any idea if he's going to join TSL or ST?
He currently lives outside the dorms, and he is practicing so that he can enter the GSL this upcoming October. He has also announced that he will be active as an individual in Starcraft 2, without belonging to a progame team. TSL and STARTALE and other Starcraft 2 teams have tried to recruit NaDa, but they have not been able to convince him.
On September 17 2010 21:09 Razyel wrote: At the showmatch in Cologne TLO kicked his ass really bad, hope he has improved a lot since then cause he didnt make an impresion at all.
It's Nada....
If he actually puts time into the game he'll be leaps and bounds above everyone else that's currently playing...
On September 17 2010 21:09 Razyel wrote: At the showmatch in Cologne TLO kicked his ass really bad, hope he has improved a lot since then cause he didnt make an impresion at all.
On September 17 2010 21:09 Razyel wrote: At the showmatch in Cologne TLO kicked his ass really bad, hope he has improved a lot since then cause he didnt make an impresion at all.
Except when he creamed TLO with insane macro in game 2 with only 10 days practice.
He currently lives outside the dorms, and he is practicing so that he can enter the GSL this upcoming October. He has also announced that he will be active as an individual in Starcraft 2, without belonging to a progame team. TSL and STARTALE and other Starcraft 2 teams have tried to recruit NaDa, but they have not been able to convince him.
On September 17 2010 21:09 Razyel wrote: At the showmatch in Cologne TLO kicked his ass really bad, hope he has improved a lot since then cause he didnt make an impresion at all.
Loltroll
It was pretty close actually especially when Nada didn't put too much time practicing
On September 17 2010 21:09 Razyel wrote: At the showmatch in Cologne TLO kicked his ass really bad, hope he has improved a lot since then cause he didnt make an impresion at all.
Except when he creamed TLO with insane macro in game 2 with only 10 days practice.
I bet he played longer than 10 days. They just didn't want to admit that he's deeply into SC2.
OMG if this keeps up next GSL season will be epic beyond measure. Nada fighting! He apparently didn't have much practice when he played TLO in the showmatch and that was already awesome =]
PROTOSSS needs a savior. Hmm let me re-phrase that. Let's hope Boxer transitions to sc2 and SWITCHES to Protoss NaDa and Boxer playing Terran to maximum capabilities is scary VERY scary.
I'm pretty sure NaDa and Boxer will both play Terran, they seemed to be very fond of spells and micro which is one of Terran's specialties. I'm so looking forward to seeing their reincarnation into SC2 :D
On September 17 2010 22:29 shannn wrote: PROTOSSS needs a savior. Hmm let me re-phrase that. Let's hope Boxer transitions to sc2 and SWITCHES to Protoss NaDa and Boxer playing Terran to maximum capabilities is scary VERY scary.
On September 17 2010 22:32 SilverPotato wrote: I'm pretty sure NaDa and Boxer will both play Terran, they seemed to be very fond of spells and micro which is one of Terran's specialties. I'm so looking forward to seeing their reincarnation into SC2 :D
On September 17 2010 22:29 shannn wrote: PROTOSSS needs a savior. Hmm let me re-phrase that. Let's hope Boxer transitions to sc2 and SWITCHES to Protoss NaDa and Boxer playing Terran to maximum capabilities is scary VERY scary.
On September 17 2010 22:32 SilverPotato wrote: I'm pretty sure NaDa and Boxer will both play Terran, they seemed to be very fond of spells and micro which is one of Terran's specialties. I'm so looking forward to seeing their reincarnation into SC2 :D
On September 17 2010 22:29 shannn wrote: PROTOSSS needs a savior. Hmm let me re-phrase that. Let's hope Boxer transitions to sc2 and SWITCHES to Protoss NaDa and Boxer playing Terran to maximum capabilities is scary VERY scary.
Are Adel and HuK not good enough for you?
Who?
No protoss that goes Stalker immortal colossus sentry is fun to watch. Prob the most boring combo ever, along with MMM.
Socke on the other hand mixes it up alot, and is alot more entertaining.
Remember his fast high temps for feedback + zealot speed rush. Every Protoss vs Z/T that involves high temps is alot more fun to watch then the COLLOSSUs/stalker/forcefield shit.
On September 17 2010 22:32 SilverPotato wrote: I'm pretty sure NaDa and Boxer will both play Terran, they seemed to be very fond of spells and micro which is one of Terran's specialties. I'm so looking forward to seeing their reincarnation into SC2 :D
On September 17 2010 22:29 shannn wrote: PROTOSSS needs a savior. Hmm let me re-phrase that. Let's hope Boxer transitions to sc2 and SWITCHES to Protoss NaDa and Boxer playing Terran to maximum capabilities is scary VERY scary.
Are Adel and HuK not good enough for you?
Who?
No protoss that goes Stalker immortal colossus sentry is fun to watch. Prob the most boring combo ever, along with MMM.
Socke on the other hand mixes it up alot, and is alot more entertaining.
Remember his fast high temps for feedback + zealot speed rush. Every Protoss vs Z/T that involves high temps is alot more fun to watch then the COLLOSSUs/stalker/forcefield shit.
templars are way better collossus vs terran if you spread them so they wont all be hit by 1 emp imo
How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
On September 17 2010 22:32 SilverPotato wrote: I'm pretty sure NaDa and Boxer will both play Terran, they seemed to be very fond of spells and micro which is one of Terran's specialties. I'm so looking forward to seeing their reincarnation into SC2 :D
On September 17 2010 22:29 shannn wrote: PROTOSSS needs a savior. Hmm let me re-phrase that. Let's hope Boxer transitions to sc2 and SWITCHES to Protoss NaDa and Boxer playing Terran to maximum capabilities is scary VERY scary.
Are Adel and HuK not good enough for you?
Who?
No protoss that goes Stalker immortal colossus sentry is fun to watch. Prob the most boring combo ever, along with MMM.
Socke on the other hand mixes it up alot, and is alot more entertaining.
Remember his fast high temps for feedback + zealot speed rush. Every Protoss vs Z/T that involves high temps is alot more fun to watch then the COLLOSSUs/stalker/forcefield shit.
So guess whats NaDa gonna play, lol. But I guess entertainment is just up to P and Z.
On September 17 2010 22:32 SilverPotato wrote: I'm pretty sure NaDa and Boxer will both play Terran, they seemed to be very fond of spells and micro which is one of Terran's specialties. I'm so looking forward to seeing their reincarnation into SC2 :D
On September 17 2010 22:29 shannn wrote: PROTOSSS needs a savior. Hmm let me re-phrase that. Let's hope Boxer transitions to sc2 and SWITCHES to Protoss NaDa and Boxer playing Terran to maximum capabilities is scary VERY scary.
Are Adel and HuK not good enough for you?
They are good enough for me but not legendary like NaDa and Boxer so in that case I'm just being greedy
And besides I remember from the Hyunjoong show that Boxer used to be Protoss long ago so he might go Protoss in sc2
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
On September 17 2010 21:09 Razyel wrote: At the showmatch in Cologne TLO kicked his ass really bad, hope he has improved a lot since then cause he didnt make an impresion at all.
Except when he creamed TLO with insane macro in game 2 with only 10 days practice.
I bet he played longer than 10 days. They just didn't want to admit that he's deeply into SC2.
Yeah...the greatest BW player of all time, the guy with 6 MSL/OSL titles practiced SC2 extensively yet had no idea how to do proper builds. Totally makes sense. Anyway it should be interesting how many foreigners actually sign up for season 2 now. With Nada and Julyzerg already in the running and Idra going out in Ro32 the chances of more foreigners participating than S1 seems slim to none now.
On September 17 2010 21:09 Razyel wrote: At the showmatch in Cologne TLO kicked his ass really bad, hope he has improved a lot since then cause he didnt make an impresion at all.
Except when he creamed TLO with insane macro in game 2 with only 10 days practice.
I bet he played longer than 10 days. They just didn't want to admit that he's deeply into SC2.
Yeah...the greatest BW player of all time, the guy with 6 MSL/OSL titles practiced SC2 extensively yet had no idea how to do proper builds. Totally makes sense. Anyway it should be interesting how many foreigners actually sign up for season 2 now. With Nada and Julyzerg already in the running and Idra going out in Ro32 the chances of more foreigners participating than S1 seems slim to none now.
The Western pros are just gonna practice like Korean pros do. Or else, they won't have a chance.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
LOL, nice comparison.
As much as I believe that KR pros will eventually dominate the pro SC2 scene, the game is really young, so foreigners still have a great opportunity to do well imo.
The skill ceiling isn't completely out of reach for some of the top foreigners playing right now.
On September 17 2010 23:49 Strajder wrote: Boxer and Flash should be the next to switch IMHO.
Wouldn't be surprised if Boxer switched over because like NaDa and July he has nothing to gain in BW, like them he's washed up and isn't good enough to compete there. But in SC2 he could potentially be a powerhouse and at the very least he has nothing to really lose other than a spot on SKT that he isn't doing anything with.
Flash won't go over anytime soon though. He makes a very comfortable salary and there's still more money for him to win in BW. I don't think the BW scene will be dying anytime soon so you can hold your breath if you think any significant A-teamers are going to SC2 anytime in the next few years. Although, I guess if BW completely falls apart and dies then those players would be forced to switch over. At which point everyone we thought was good at SC2 will instantly become terrible.
I'd love to see Bisu or Stork switch. Those guys are boss and could really inspire Toss players, and while they are still excellent BW players, neither is good enough to unseat Flash. Its a choice between being good, but not the best, in BW, or switching and having a chance to carve out a legend as SC2 champions.
Flash should stay in BW at least until he wins more titles than anyone. Let him makes history and becomes the undisputable king of Brood War. Then maybe Blizzard will change Jim Raynor's name to Lee Young Ho.
Plus SC2 is not yet balanced. There's really no hope to other race when he plays SC2 Terran.
None of the currently at least midly-successful (A-teamers) will switch any time soon imo. They have no reason to. They are good at bw, they have a salary (the whole MBC team just recontracted like a couple of days ago), and they probably still will have a televised league to play in. They have absolutely no reason to switch to a new game where they wouldn't be paid regularly, and that isn't as popular (in korea of course) than bw.
That being said, I'm not surprised to see Nada switch to sc2. He doesn't need the money and was rarely used anymore by WeMade. I feel like it's his way to try to come back and shine again. He did great things in bw and even though I personally never really was a fan of him I'm glad for him if that's what he wants to do, I'm glad for him and I'm sure he'll be successful
On September 18 2010 00:25 CanadianSC wrote: This is the most brilliant thing. NaDa Hwaiting!!!
and has anyone thought about a global proleague, or well a non-korean proleague. Root. Prime. EG. Liquid. ToT (if they are still kicking)
Gretech already said they don't want to have a proleague or pro teams for SC2. So I doubt it'll happen. As for a global one, I doubt that will happen either as the Koreans will just be so dominant that it'll be hard for other teams to find sponsors.
So yeah, unless Gretech/Blizzard lose their court case on IP rights you won't see a proleague in SC2. If KeSPA wins said court case though it's only a matter of time before they form an SC2 proleague.
After re-reading, it might would be cool to see a non-Korean proleague form but the issue again is sponsors. There's no country outside of Korea where it could really get televised and take off so there's no real sponsors with the resources to fly teams to other countries to play one another and honestly matches played over the internet are a lot less exciting. Plus if you're excluding non-Koreans it's basically the equivalent of Minor league sports, which are even more boring than Pro league sports.
Ah, this is truly very exciting. It was never going to transpire that the elite Korean esports community, already comfortably ensconsed and highly successful in BW, were immediately going to drop all their fame and bitches for the different ball game that is SC2. Still, it seems as if the flood is beginning, and while I hope that the Western professional scene's headstart will give them a good go against the Koreans that are jumping ship, I think no matter what happens we are going to see the top level of SC2 gaming rise another notch!
How do you think SC2 compares to SC:BW in skill and as a spectator sport? Will the game make it's metamorphosis with Hots? Like SC did with BW (as is my limited understanding)? Do you think the game has the potential and depth to unseat the original and out of curiosity is the same guys working on SC2 as for the original?
I'm excited to see more Korean players join SC2. Maybe they'll really unlock some strange and brilliantly new strategies that will really start changing this game (unfortunately, in the league I'm in, its just one big rush fest)
On September 18 2010 00:45 HuK wrote: i shook this mans hand in cologne and havnt washed it since... ive played 300x better since that moment. (shook hands with him after group stages)
On September 18 2010 00:45 HuK wrote: i shook this mans hand in cologne and havnt washed it since... ive played 300x better since that moment. (shook hands with him after group stages)
gl my friend <3 ^^;
lol did you get him to sign your forehead too? because that would be awesome. i would totally let nada sign whatever part of me he wanted.
I can't wait to see NaDa play. I will root for him against anyone. I remember scrounging around and downloading as many of his replays as I could find back when I was trying to learn Terran in BW. The man was a force of nature.
I hope he doesn't have trouble succeeding without a team.
Anybody knows which foreigners will participate in gsl's next seasons ? I'm curious to hear what are the plans of huk, select, dimaga, whitera, socke, morrow, anyway all these top foreign players
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Nice to see him back, but this is a bitter pill to swallow for BW. With all the recent news, lots of teams are in a lot of trouble. Flash and JD will have to hold down the fort if BW has any chance of survival.
On September 18 2010 03:38 StarStruck wrote: Nice to see him back, but this is a bitter pill to swallow for BW. With all the recent news, lots of teams are in a lot of trouble. Flash and JD will have to hold down the fort if BW has any chance of survival.
I don't know about you, but Flash and Jaedong actually killed (or are slowly killing) my interest in Brood War. Watching the same 2 players over and over is bad for the press, even OGN admitted it. Without new faces in the scene, any sport becomes stagnant until some new guy reinvigorates interest.
I'd rather stick to Brood War as the game of choice for progamers, to be honest. Then again, real A class pros like NaDa and July hopped the SC2 ship. They could turn SC2 from a seemingly easy, low-skill game, to one that BW has evolved to.
On September 18 2010 04:19 newvsoldschool wrote: I'd rather stick to Brood War as the game of choice for progamers, to be honest. Then again, real A class pros like NaDa and July hopped the SC2 ship. They could turn SC2 from a seemingly easy, low-skill game, to one that BW has evolved to.
Starcraft 2 scene is getting better and better. :D Nada is on my view list.
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Who are you to say their mechanics won't transfer over? Have you spoken directly to them and heard them say that?
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
.......
I lol'd too
Guys.. He is from the Wc3 community, he doesn't know any better.
Hope to see the most successful BW player become the most successful ScII player? :D
On September 18 2010 03:38 StarStruck wrote: Nice to see him back, but this is a bitter pill to swallow for BW. With all the recent news, lots of teams are in a lot of trouble. Flash and JD will have to hold down the fort if BW has any chance of survival.
I don't know about you, but Flash and Jaedong actually killed (or are slowly killing) my interest in Brood War. Watching the same 2 players over and over is bad for the press, even OGN admitted it. Without new faces in the scene, any sport becomes stagnant until some new guy reinvigorates interest.
I'd rather stick to Brood War as the game of choice for progamers, to be honest. Then again, real A class pros like NaDa and July hopped the SC2 ship. They could turn SC2 from a seemingly easy, low-skill game, to one that BW has evolved to.
Well Flash only got signed in 2007. Compared to other sports, I think SC top players change faces way faster. And if you find watching them play boring, watch some low A players.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. Their macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw I'll find it hard to believe they do that much better then people like tester or TLO..demuslim. They're capable to play with the best but do be just way ahead of everyone else? please.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
First of all, the interface is not that much different. Heck, there's an option for old format, IIRC.
Macro is built upon practice - yes. However, if you are going to discount their ability to learn the new macro just because your explanation makes them into robots, then I disagree with that. People who have only the muscle memory for macro do not become top world class players like NaDa. It takes a lot more than that.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
He's arguing it because he doesn't really understand what Macro means. Just because Macro in SC2 is way easier in SC2 doesn't mean their Macro sense won't carry over
On September 18 2010 03:38 StarStruck wrote: Nice to see him back, but this is a bitter pill to swallow for BW. With all the recent news, lots of teams are in a lot of trouble. Flash and JD will have to hold down the fort if BW has any chance of survival.
I don't know about you, but Flash and Jaedong actually killed (or are slowly killing) my interest in Brood War. Watching the same 2 players over and over is bad for the press, even OGN admitted it. Without new faces in the scene, any sport becomes stagnant until some new guy reinvigorates interest.
I'd rather stick to Brood War as the game of choice for progamers, to be honest. Then again, real A class pros like NaDa and July hopped the SC2 ship. They could turn SC2 from a seemingly easy, low-skill game, to one that BW has evolved to.
Well aware. The problem is players like NaDa and July had market appeal hence they were given lucrative contracts. With the downsizing of BW Pro Gaming teams where will we find this new blood when many of oldest big names are moving on? More Koreans will pursue SC2 and BW could be left in the dust if new players don't rise to the top to combat Flash and JD. :/
KeSPA's job got a little harder to find new homes for estro.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
.......
I lol'd too
hehe.... gotta say it was some funny shit right there.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
hahaha nobody said they were "macroing better than most of the top bw players outside of korea"... except YOU. If you want to prove your point, you should play THEM, instead of trying to act all cool and trying to save face and challenging the people laughing at you.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
hahaha nobody said they were "macroing better than most of the top bw players outside of korea"... except YOU. If you want to prove your point, you should play THEM, instead of trying to act all cool and trying to save face and challenging the people laughing at you.
Well I thought people outside of korea who had been playing bw for over 6+ years in the scene have good macro. I mean they have played it alot you would think that it would transfer over from bw rite? I just find it hard to believe you are so ignorant about how good these guys actually are. There is no doubt they were top of the line BW players but its just completely stupid to say oh ye they come in and win all leagues and be years ahead of everyone else. i mean cmon. They don't even dominate the ladder. I just fail to see why you guys are so up thinking there going to be the best player ever because bw players are just naturally better. I mean cmon? TLO wasn't even really a BW player. there are tons of new talent thats going to be > then old talent. It feels like preaching atheism to a group of christians.
well he first played 1999 or 2000 a lots on LAN vs my older brothers and myself, later from 2002 to 2004 via dial-up (couldn't get better internet back then thanks to awesome deutsche telekom). Then he returned to starcraft at end of 2008...
so I'd conclude that your statement that he played "a bit" on ICCUP is "a bit" of an understatement.
On September 17 2010 19:30 T0fuuu wrote: wait guys. so if nada was wemade and couldnt play sc2, does this mean moon cant play sc2 unless he leaves wemade as well ?
anyways gl to nada. he doesnt need a team. he can singlehandedly win GSL (:
I wonder why wemade doesn't have an SC2-team, they have scbw, cs, wc3 - why no sc2-team?
And what happened to moon anyways? Is he playing wc3 or sc2?
Kespa doesn't like SC2 (or rather, they don't like Blizzard and the current situation), the teams are controlled by kespa, thus the teams "don't like" SC2.
Moon is currently a full-time WC3 progamer.
I thought it was about kespa again....
Too bad moon doesn't play SC2 though.
Too bad? Dude, you can demolish our game and you can steal all our pride, but you wont take our one superstar from us! Moon is forever Wc3! <3
In all seriousness though, Wc3 is just as awesome of a game as SC2 is. Why would you want EVERY single one of the pro WC3 players to switch to SC2? I want both games to live, not just one to live like hell and one to just disappear in oblivion.
On September 18 2010 06:07 TBO wrote: well he first played 1999 or 2000 a lots on LAN vs my older brothers and myself, later from 2002 to 2004 via dial-up (couldn't get better internet back then thanks to awesome deutsche telekom). Then he returned to starcraft at end of 2008...
so I'd conclude that your statement that he played "a bit" on ICCUP is "a bit" of an understatement.
TY for your insight on the situation, good to know for sure! =D
On September 18 2010 06:07 TBO wrote: well he first played 1999 or 2000 a lots on LAN vs my older brothers and myself, later from 2002 to 2004 via dial-up (couldn't get better internet back then thanks to awesome deutsche telekom). Then he returned to starcraft at end of 2008...
so I'd conclude that your statement that he played "a bit" on ICCUP is "a bit" of an understatement.
Thanks for clearing that up manbrodude.
I wonder if NaDa improved a bunch since the IEM showmatch tho. I wanna see a rematch at the next GSL finals. heh.
I thought a while back Nada said that he would have to go into the military about the time SC2 came out, how much longer does he have before he has to go into conscription?
On September 17 2010 22:16 rtsAlaran wrote: SC2 finally takes over! Korean Progamers for each race gogo Zerg - check! Terran - check! Protoss - to come next!
*sort of excited*
Protoss - Tester. Nothing to come "next", that guy is sick already, fairly sure any real top scbw progamer wouldn't make him look that bad in sc2, well not before some time at least.
I bet he will join Liquid to make up for quitting vs. TLO in the middle of the show-match game. I know it wasn't his fault, but I bet he still feels pretty bad about it. Gogo Liquid admins, get Nada!
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
hahaha nobody said they were "macroing better than most of the top bw players outside of korea"... except YOU. If you want to prove your point, you should play THEM, instead of trying to act all cool and trying to save face and challenging the people laughing at you.
Well I thought people outside of korea who had been playing bw for over 6+ years in the scene have good macro. I mean they have played it alot you would think that it would transfer over from bw rite? I just find it hard to believe you are so ignorant about how good these guys actually are. There is no doubt they were top of the line BW players but its just completely stupid to say oh ye they come in and win all leagues and be years ahead of everyone else. i mean cmon. They don't even dominate the ladder. I just fail to see why you guys are so up thinking there going to be the best player ever because bw players are just naturally better. I mean cmon? TLO wasn't even really a BW player. there are tons of new talent thats going to be > then old talent. It feels like preaching atheism to a group of christians.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
hahaha nobody said they were "macroing better than most of the top bw players outside of korea"... except YOU. If you want to prove your point, you should play THEM, instead of trying to act all cool and trying to save face and challenging the people laughing at you.
Well I thought people outside of korea who had been playing bw for over 6+ years in the scene have good macro. I mean they have played it alot you would think that it would transfer over from bw rite? I just find it hard to believe you are so ignorant about how good these guys actually are. There is no doubt they were top of the line BW players but its just completely stupid to say oh ye they come in and win all leagues and be years ahead of everyone else. i mean cmon. They don't even dominate the ladder. I just fail to see why you guys are so up thinking there going to be the best player ever because bw players are just naturally better. I mean cmon? TLO wasn't even really a BW player. there are tons of new talent thats going to be > then old talent. It feels like preaching atheism to a group of christians.
your recent string of posts are soo ignorant, its only natural that most people are laughing at you. I mean, how can anyone take what you say seriously, when you didnt even know that TLO played a TON of broodwar.
These korean progamers are obviously going to be a step above in terms of macro/mechanics, because they have specialized in it for the last 12years. The hotkeys can all be learned, the timings can be learned, but the ability to constantly remember everything, and maintaining 400 useful apm is something only koreans have been able to do (otherwise you would see more foreigners winning in bw). Nada has already played TLO and took a game off of him, without much practice at all. Im guessing this is due to his INSANE MACRO/MECHANICS.
Lastly, its very clear you know absolutely nothing about the korean progamers, or even you would think what you just said is retarded. Fruitseller and idra are both already considered the very best of players, yet both of them failed at broodwar due to subpar mechanics. If these subpar broodwar players are cleaning house in sc2, what do you think will happen when someone as accomplished as Nada takes it serious?
All in all, in my opinion, your just clueless and very much inexperienced in the starcraft world.
I think guys.. Really, NaDa to TLO is sort of like... Boxer to Flash?
That may not be the best theory but.. yeah. NaDa's a bit old, whereas TLO is new and fresh. However, NaDa is still better at BW than TLO is at BW... and NaDa's played less of SC2... So in fact, I'm not even sure where I'm going with this.
Well whatever, I think NaDa and July have great potential in SC2. XD
On September 18 2010 08:57 Terrakin wrote: I wonder if TLO sparked NaDa's change to SC2?
I think the $85,000US first place prize of GSL had a little more sway on him than TLO did.
Well I read earlier in this thread (so hearsay) that Nada is the highest paid BW player, so I don't think motivation is a factor. Perhaps he actually finds SC2 fun?! =P
On September 18 2010 08:57 Terrakin wrote: I wonder if TLO sparked NaDa's change to SC2?
I think the $85,000US first place prize of GSL had a little more sway on him than TLO did.
Well I read earlier in this thread (so hearsay) that Nada is the highest paid BW player, so I don't think motivation is a factor. Perhaps he actually finds SC2 fun?! =P
There are many many billionaires in the world who still seek more fortune. Just because someone made money doing 1 thing, doesnt mean they wont work as hard as they can to make money in another. Bills are lifelong, and after reading about progamer lifestyles etc, im pretty sure Nada will run outta money more sooner than later.
On September 18 2010 08:57 Terrakin wrote: I wonder if TLO sparked NaDa's change to SC2?
I think the $85,000US first place prize of GSL had a little more sway on him than TLO did.
Well I read earlier in this thread (so hearsay) that Nada is the highest paid BW player, so I don't think motivation is a factor. Perhaps he actually finds SC2 fun?! =P
There are many many billionaires in the world who still seek more fortune. Just because someone made money doing 1 thing, doesnt mean they wont work as hard as they can to make money in another. Bills are lifelong, and after reading about progamer lifestyles etc, im pretty sure Nada will run outta money more sooner than later.
First off (to Ocedic), NaDa hasn't been the highest paid BW player in years, though even long after his peak he did still make a very high salary for just being an icon and drawing in the fans (like Boxer). That said, your point makes no sense since he isn't making "more fortune" in this move, at least not in the short run. He gave up a salary that would require more than twice the 1st place in GSL per year, not to mention great job security. Now yes, there is a chance he can end up winning several tournaments per year and get high endorsements and come out on top financially in this move, but thats a pretty big gamble. As such, saying he moved to SC2 for the money is kind of dumb. The old generation stars really had no worries after hitting their peaks, as they were more than welcome to stay on lineups and bring the fans, become coaches, casters, etc.
He likely moved because its another chance for him to possibly shine as he once did in BW instead of being on the sidelines. Money-wise I would imagine he's doing quite fine so he won't be living off ramen while following this opportunity, and lets him see if he can possibly rise again.
On September 17 2010 22:49 Zangaxx wrote: How much better are the mechanics of these korean players? Are they far ahead on macro/multitasking? And how is there general sense of strategy compared to the western pros?
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
hahaha nobody said they were "macroing better than most of the top bw players outside of korea"... except YOU. If you want to prove your point, you should play THEM, instead of trying to act all cool and trying to save face and challenging the people laughing at you.
Well I thought people outside of korea who had been playing bw for over 6+ years in the scene have good macro. I mean they have played it alot you would think that it would transfer over from bw rite? I just find it hard to believe you are so ignorant about how good these guys actually are. There is no doubt they were top of the line BW players but its just completely stupid to say oh ye they come in and win all leagues and be years ahead of everyone else. i mean cmon. They don't even dominate the ladder. I just fail to see why you guys are so up thinking there going to be the best player ever because bw players are just naturally better. I mean cmon? TLO wasn't even really a BW player. there are tons of new talent thats going to be > then old talent. It feels like preaching atheism to a group of christians.
Fruitseller and idra are both already considered the very best of players, yet both of them failed at broodwar due to subpar mechanics.
I don't claim to know a lot, but I think there's a lot more to idra's mediocrity as a bw player than just weak mechanics. He got out-thought as well.
On September 18 2010 08:57 Terrakin wrote: I wonder if TLO sparked NaDa's change to SC2?
I think the $85,000US first place prize of GSL had a little more sway on him than TLO did.
NaDa would've made a lot more money just sticking with Brood War...$85K isn't even half of his old salary. Y'know, guaranteed pay.
He switched because he wants to be on top again, because he's washed up in terms of Brood War and can't really compete anymore. Same goes for July. Same goes for the B-teamers who went to SC2. Same goes for people like Tester. If the people jumping ship to SC2 could play Brood War at a high level they'd stick to Brood War, there's more money to be made in the form of a consistent salary (not even counting individual leagues) and the game is more popular and has more fans in South Korea.
On September 17 2010 23:05 Xenocide_Knight wrote: [quote]
We can compare to idra, who made it onto the B team who would lose to shitty A team players like MVP or Hyuk who would get rocked by solid A team players like Kal or Sea who would get stomped on by Jaedong or Flash
there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
hahaha nobody said they were "macroing better than most of the top bw players outside of korea"... except YOU. If you want to prove your point, you should play THEM, instead of trying to act all cool and trying to save face and challenging the people laughing at you.
Well I thought people outside of korea who had been playing bw for over 6+ years in the scene have good macro. I mean they have played it alot you would think that it would transfer over from bw rite? I just find it hard to believe you are so ignorant about how good these guys actually are. There is no doubt they were top of the line BW players but its just completely stupid to say oh ye they come in and win all leagues and be years ahead of everyone else. i mean cmon. They don't even dominate the ladder. I just fail to see why you guys are so up thinking there going to be the best player ever because bw players are just naturally better. I mean cmon? TLO wasn't even really a BW player. there are tons of new talent thats going to be > then old talent. It feels like preaching atheism to a group of christians.
Fruitseller and idra are both already considered the very best of players, yet both of them failed at broodwar due to subpar mechanics.
I don't claim to know a lot, but I think there's a lot more to idra's mediocrity as a bw player than just weak mechanics. He got out-thought as well.
IdrA was only mediocre in the context of contracted Korean progamers on established progaming teams. The fact that he could compete and practice with them evidenced overwhelming skill on the scale of BW's immense skill gradient. Leading up to SC2's release he won slews of international events in BW.
Regardless of transferability of skill, those who succeed at SC2 will be incredibly talented people, in some way or another. Former BW icons have already demonstrated legendary talent; time will tell whether such talent is what it takes to succeed in this new game.
On September 18 2010 02:43 FindingPride wrote: [quote] there mechanics and macro dont transfer over. at all. As a wc3 player i was macroing better then most of the top bw players outside of korea on the ladder if anything they'll just catch up fast but we won't see any large gap in skill. There are new players arising.
Hahahahahaha most unbelievably LOL worthy post I've seen on TL in the recent past.
well I knew this kind of response would happen. Oh well people are just ignorant. sc is not sc2. the interface is much different. the macro mechanics are much different everything about the game is much different. There macro isn't some innate skill but rather a mental tick through lots and lots of training. Building times are much different so plz dont sit here and say they can hit barracks control group and do it much better then anyone else just because they played bw
Because mechanics don't carry over. Macro is an innate skill. The skill to be able to understand and remember hundreds of timings. They have done so in Brood War, after learning every build order, and they can do the same in Starcraft 2. I can't believe you're even arguing this.
really? i can guarantee they wont do as good as u think. I challenge anyone here to outmacro/outplay me. I'll prove to u BW mechanics mean nothing in sc2 pride.726 lets go : )
hahaha nobody said they were "macroing better than most of the top bw players outside of korea"... except YOU. If you want to prove your point, you should play THEM, instead of trying to act all cool and trying to save face and challenging the people laughing at you.
Well I thought people outside of korea who had been playing bw for over 6+ years in the scene have good macro. I mean they have played it alot you would think that it would transfer over from bw rite? I just find it hard to believe you are so ignorant about how good these guys actually are. There is no doubt they were top of the line BW players but its just completely stupid to say oh ye they come in and win all leagues and be years ahead of everyone else. i mean cmon. They don't even dominate the ladder. I just fail to see why you guys are so up thinking there going to be the best player ever because bw players are just naturally better. I mean cmon? TLO wasn't even really a BW player. there are tons of new talent thats going to be > then old talent. It feels like preaching atheism to a group of christians.
Fruitseller and idra are both already considered the very best of players, yet both of them failed at broodwar due to subpar mechanics.
I don't claim to know a lot, but I think there's a lot more to idra's mediocrity as a bw player than just weak mechanics. He got out-thought as well.
IdrA was only mediocre in the context of contracted Korean progamers on established progaming teams. The fact that he could compete and practice with them evidenced overwhelming skill on the scale of BW's immense skill gradient. Leading up to SC2's release he won slews of international events in BW.
Yeah, I know isn't idra 'mediocre' at bw when you compare him to the global average, in the same way tossgirl isn't 'bad' by any standard except that of the male proleagues... doesn't really have anything to do with what we were discussing.
On September 18 2010 08:57 Terrakin wrote: I wonder if TLO sparked NaDa's change to SC2?
I think the $85,000US first place prize of GSL had a little more sway on him than TLO did.
NaDa would've made a lot more money just sticking with Brood War...$85K isn't even half of his old salary. Y'know, guaranteed pay.
He switched because he wants to be on top again, because he's washed up in terms of Brood War and can't really compete anymore. Same goes for July. Same goes for the B-teamers who went to SC2. Same goes for people like Tester. If the people jumping ship to SC2 could play Brood War at a high level they'd stick to Brood War, there's more money to be made in the form of a consistent salary (not even counting individual leagues) and the game is more popular and has more fans in South Korea.
OK, let's do some math. $170k per year vs $85k per tournament.
On September 18 2010 09:00 TheEpicLolz wrote: I think guys.. Really, NaDa to TLO is sort of like... Boxer to Flash?
That may not be the best theory but.. yeah. NaDa's a bit old, whereas TLO is new and fresh. However, NaDa is still better at BW than TLO is at BW... and NaDa's played less of SC2... So in fact, I'm not even sure where I'm going with this.
Well whatever, I think NaDa and July have great potential in SC2. XD
I'm sorry, but that analogy is WAYYYYY off. Boxer = NaDa and Flash = TLO??? O_o
I like TLO as much as the next guy but really... what has he achieved so far in SC2 to even think he's up to the caliber of player as NaDa. That's not to say that TLO doesn't have the potential to be great, but you must realize that NaDa has already proven himself as being able to get to the very top of an esport and stay on top for a very long time.
A much more accurate analogy would be TLO = TLO and NaDa = The motherf@#$ing Genius Terran: NaDa!!!!
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
That is a pretty big blunder, its like when Morrow told BigT he wasn't sorry for not allowing commentators in the game. You have to be careful about that stuff.
I am more excited about Nada than July... while I love July, I keep thinking back to that game Nada played against Jangbi in the MSL ro8 a year or so ago which was about as perfect starcraft as any terran had ever played... he has the most titles, and he still has the ability. Can't wait to see him play SC2!
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
I didn't get it. Is it because boxer is not allowed to play sc2 for now and shouldn't be seen in public? and HopeTorture(IntoTheRainbow) adds boxer to his flist then it becomes public that boxer plays sc2?
On September 18 2010 08:57 Terrakin wrote: I wonder if TLO sparked NaDa's change to SC2?
I think the $85,000US first place prize of GSL had a little more sway on him than TLO did.
NaDa would've made a lot more money just sticking with Brood War...$85K isn't even half of his old salary. Y'know, guaranteed pay.
He switched because he wants to be on top again, because he's washed up in terms of Brood War and can't really compete anymore. Same goes for July. Same goes for the B-teamers who went to SC2. Same goes for people like Tester. If the people jumping ship to SC2 could play Brood War at a high level they'd stick to Brood War, there's more money to be made in the form of a consistent salary (not even counting individual leagues) and the game is more popular and has more fans in South Korea.
OK, let's do some math. $170k per year vs $85k per tournament.
...
Alternatively, 170k+ per year (with paid housing and food) vs 0 per tournament, because he doesn't win anything.
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
I didn't get it. Is it because boxer is not allowed to play sc2 for now and shouldn't be seen in public? and HopeTorture(IntoTheRainbow) adds boxer to his flist then it becomes public that boxer plays sc2?
It becomes public when it is revealed on a public stream like that.
On September 18 2010 20:09 DarkspearTribe wrote: I really doubt Nada's salary was 170k per year. Maybe 1-4 years ago
pretty sure nada had a multi year contract for ~200k a year obviously wasnt going to get that much again with a new contract which was probably why he left
On September 18 2010 20:09 DarkspearTribe wrote: I really doubt Nada's salary was 170k per year. Maybe 1-4 years ago
i think he got around $800.000 for 3 years in his last contract?
something along the lines of that anyway
He still was very good at that point in time. Since then he hasn't done anything major.
whats your point? hes still nada and attracts fans and attention to the team on his fame alone. kind of like how lebron james is projected to stimulate billions of dollars for whichever city (miami) he was going to be playing for in the NBA (and he hasnt won anything ever)
Nada's contract is over, you guys. So he WAS making 200k a year or whatever, but how much do you think he'd make if they renewed his contract? Now is a scary time to renew a contract to KESPA.
On September 18 2010 20:09 DarkspearTribe wrote: I really doubt Nada's salary was 170k per year. Maybe 1-4 years ago
if he had a multi year deal doesnt matter what hes doing now
edit - Oh yea and this is super awesome news. Nada is the most awesomest T player ever. Nada vs Savior series were pretty epic too. Hopefully he crushes sc2 as well.
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
I didn't get it. Is it because boxer is not allowed to play sc2 for now and shouldn't be seen in public? and HopeTorture(IntoTheRainbow) adds boxer to his flist then it becomes public that boxer plays sc2?
S-Class. Gamer 4 Life. This is the best e-sports story of all time. Former giant's comeback to glory. Can he make it happen? No sponsors, no hand-outs... He's gonna train his way into the GSL or fail hard. Can't wait to see what happens.
On September 18 2010 22:43 Utopi wrote: I think its pretty strange that he actually left WeMadeFox to play SC II. I mean couldn't WMF easily make a sc2 team as well?
wow i just lost all my motivation to go to the GSL Lol... not only does it cost foreigners thousands just to get to korea, but to compete against NaDa is like trying to make pigs fly. its NEVER Going to happen! T_T hahah..
On September 19 2010 02:32 zanbo123 wrote: wow i just lost all my motivation to go to the GSL Lol... not only does it cost foreigners thousands just to get to korea, but to compete against NaDa is like trying to make pigs fly. its NEVER Going to happen! T_T hahah..
u got it all wrong u should have huge motivation boost because you could actually play versys Julyzerg or NaDa , think about that...
On September 18 2010 22:43 Utopi wrote: I think its pretty strange that he actually left WeMadeFox to play SC II. I mean couldn't WMF easily make a sc2 team as well?
KeSPA says hi
Actually, KeSPA says "NO WE WILL NOT LET YOU PLAY CAPITALIST GAMES LIKE SC2"
On September 19 2010 06:20 Vz0 wrote: no point arguing with reason.
bw fanboys just gonna yell
LOL Na/Eu are trash compared to Koreans ! Koreans are genetically superior !
The argument that they will crush competition is not in their lineage, but in the fact that they're established progamers. It has already been proven that BW skills translate over well to SC2. Idra showed us that throughout the beta. What, then, happens when BW's best (much better than Idra) make the transition? The answer is obvious. You'll start seeing many of the same old names fighting for top spots in SC2. Disregarding the fact that they're Korean, the best SC progamers are those on teams like SKT1, Fox, Oz, etc (ie not foreign teams).
I do think there's plenty of room for foreigners to work, though. Just like in the beginning of BW, we'll see an influx of impressive foreign players doing just as well as the best Korean players. Whether there will be a shift over to Korean dominance like there was in BW, we have yet to see.
On September 19 2010 06:20 Vz0 wrote: no point arguing with reason.
bw fanboys just gonna yell
LOL Na/Eu are trash compared to Koreans ! Koreans are genetically superior !
The argument that they will crush competition is not in their lineage, but in the fact that they're established progamers. It has already been proven that BW skills translate over well to SC2. Idra showed us that throughout the beta. What, then, happens when BW's best (much better than Idra) make the transition? The answer is obvious. You'll start seeing many of the same old names fighting for top spots in SC2. Disregarding the fact that they're Korean, the best SC progamers are those on teams like SKT1, Fox, Oz, etc (ie not foreign teams).
I do think there's plenty of room for foreigners to work, though. Just like in the beginning of BW, we'll see an influx of impressive foreign players doing just as well as the best Korean players. Whether there will be a shift over to Korean dominance like there was in BW, we have yet to see.
agree with you fully.
but I don't agree wtih the "nada will play 1 month and win the GSL "
Even if the Koreans start dominating, the foreigners still got iem, mlg, and plenty of other tournaments to compete in. It's not like there are tournaments only in Korea.
On September 20 2010 06:16 some_noob wrote: I really really hope this is genuine and not some "paid switch" by bliz :>
I really doubt that they could keep that a secret lol. My rule of thumb is that when in doubt, it's usually not a conspiracy. It really should be yours too.
to be fair, a good number of players in sc2 clans were ex-progamers, but its still really great that a player like nada has come to sc2. when nada starts destroying everyone, will you dare say 'imbalance'? more like imbalance of skill xD
On September 20 2010 06:48 greentea wrote: to be fair, a good number of players in sc2 clans were ex-progamers, but its still really great that a player like nada has come to sc2. when nada starts destroying everyone, will you dare say 'imbalance'? more like imbalance of skill xD
As I like to put it "Blizzard, plz nerf asians" ^^ Personally I feel that the game is pretty much equal right now actually.. definitely the most balanced RTS I've played (no I never really played BW) Sorry for OT
On September 21 2010 21:28 slappy wrote: well congradulations blizzard, now there may be a reason to convince me to actually pay for what i used to get for free (live streams)
Geeze-no one knows how sick this dude is. He's not just some random b-team ex brood war pro gamer, he is NaDa.
*Joined the 100 wins in ProLeague Club *First player to win 3 OSLs *First player to win 3 MSLs *Longest time in the KeSPA top 30 *Longest time to hold first place in the KeSPA ranking (with Boxer) *Received a golden mouse
Thanks Liquipedia, although you had no information on the golden mouse.
On September 18 2010 02:15 Jeremy Reimer wrote: This is pretty exciting! All my favorite old-school players are joining SC2. Hoping for Boxer next, then Reach and Xellos!
tester(sSKS):Bro, did you enroll yohan(Boxer) on the list of friends? HopeTorture:You... HopeTorture: I am on the air. HopeTorture:;; tester:; HopeTorture:Shit.
I didn't get it. Is it because boxer is not allowed to play sc2 for now and shouldn't be seen in public? and HopeTorture(IntoTheRainbow) adds boxer to his flist then it becomes public that boxer plays sc2?
I don't get it.. IntoTheRainbow isn't playing in an airplane is he? How does he fly?
What event was this at? Or was it just a stream?That is pretty crazy stuff O_O. Hope BoxeR doesn't get shot by some BW extremists.
On the air is most likely saying "I'm streaming and people are watching" not on an airlplane :S It's just like the incident with CellaWerra and mym trying to get him while he was streaming.
And that's NaDa transitioning to sc2 that took him maybe tops a month if you include beta practices (if he did practiced beta). Imagine if the current top A-teamers were to transition crazy... :O
On September 22 2010 00:32 Domonic wrote: Geeze-no one knows how sick this dude is. He's not just some random b-team ex brood war pro gamer, he is NaDa.
*Joined the 100 wins in ProLeague Club *First player to win 3 OSLs *First player to win 3 MSLs *Longest time in the KeSPA top 30 *Longest time to hold first place in the KeSPA ranking (with Boxer) *Received a golden mouse
Thanks Liquipedia, although you had no information on the golden mouse.
Some of you are quite oblivious...yes I know nada is great and what not and I' not trying to take anything away from him but...its no guarantee he will start to dominate sc2 right away.
We saw this with cs source and 1.6....when some 1.6 big names switched over they didnt' start crushing right away. While the game is similar, it still is different.
On September 24 2010 18:01 Effen wrote: Some of you are quite oblivious...yes I know nada is great and what not and I' not trying to take anything away from him but...its no guarantee he will start to dominate sc2 right away.
We saw this with cs source and 1.6....when some 1.6 big names switched over they didnt' start crushing right away. While the game is similar, it still is different.
He will start dominating, when he did his unfinished show match against TLO only having played a small amount of time, he had him on his toes.
and that counterstrike comparison is way different
On September 24 2010 18:01 Effen wrote: Some of you are quite oblivious...yes I know nada is great and what not and I' not trying to take anything away from him but...its no guarantee he will start to dominate sc2 right away.
We saw this with cs source and 1.6....when some 1.6 big names switched over they didnt' start crushing right away. While the game is similar, it still is different.
NaDa has one of the best winratios on the Korean server and is already at 1775 points. I think that's pretty good.
On September 24 2010 18:01 Effen wrote: Some of you are quite oblivious...yes I know nada is great and what not and I' not trying to take anything away from him but...its no guarantee he will start to dominate sc2 right away.
We saw this with cs source and 1.6....when some 1.6 big names switched over they didnt' start crushing right away. While the game is similar, it still is different.
Competitive Starcraft is nothing like competitive CS, where in CS everyone has to pull their own weight.
If low tier SC1 progamers like Tester and Cool can do it, then why not Nada?
He's second in his division? Is that really who it is in first place?!
Oh wow.
There's a large part of me that wants all these real BW pros/gosus/bonjwas/gods to switch and show the B- players like tlo how it's done. There's no doubt that NaDa is a much more skilled player than someone like tlo, but I'm wondering if SC2's dumbed down UI/AI will compensate for such a huge skill difference.
Plus, I'm beginning to suspect that all these foreigners who thought they had a shot at becoming SC2 legends are now realizing that the koreans really do have a firm grip on all of starcraft, one and two.
As cool as I think the SC1 pros switching is, I feel like if they start dominating the foreigners it could be bad for esports in the West. It's really hard to keep peoples interest if they know its useless to try to be at the top, just because they aren't Korean.
That's the main reason I root for Idra, because if he can win, then I know, given enough time and practice, I could win too.
You people and koreans. Yes they are the best by far now, but why. It's like the "dream team" in the olympics way back when. America wasn't superior to the world in basketball because they were americans, but because it was a focus within their society. Kids grew up watching basketball, and played it constantly. In Korean Esports is heads above everyone else. SC has been a big deal in Korea for 10+yrs. Will Koreans always be the best progamers? Now that the rest of the world is focusing much more, in a couple years the top pro's will be more diverse through out the world. America isn't genetically superior in basketball etc, and korea isn't genetically superior in SC.
On September 25 2010 09:10 QkDown wrote: You people and koreans. Yes they are the best by far now, but why. It's like the "dream team" in the olympics way back when. America wasn't superior to the world in basketball because they were americans, but because it was a focus within their society. Kids grew up watching basketball, and played it constantly. In Korean Esports is heads above everyone else. SC has been a big deal in Korea for 10+yrs. Will Koreans always be the best progamers? Now that the rest of the world is focusing much more, in a couple years the top pro's will be more diverse through out the world. America isn't genetically superior in basketball etc, and korea isn't genetically superior in SC.
People that think koreans are born with superior sc ability are simply stupid.
Ignore them.
However, I don't think our western society will ever condone gaming as much as korea will (and they are continuously getting more and more serious on it).
Korea will always be in the lead. That however does not mean that our western players cannot be better, but simply there will be less pros altogether.
On September 25 2010 09:10 QkDown wrote: You people and koreans. Yes they are the best by far now, but why. It's like the "dream team" in the olympics way back when. America wasn't superior to the world in basketball because they were americans, but because it was a focus within their society. Kids grew up watching basketball, and played it constantly. In Korean Esports is heads above everyone else. SC has been a big deal in Korea for 10+yrs. Will Koreans always be the best progamers? Now that the rest of the world is focusing much more, in a couple years the top pro's will be more diverse through out the world. America isn't genetically superior in basketball etc, and korea isn't genetically superior in SC.
People that think koreans are born with superior sc ability are simply stupid.
Ignore them.
However, I don't think our western society will ever condone gaming as much as korea will (and they are continuously getting more and more serious on it).
Korea will always be in the lead. That however does not mean that our western players cannot be better, but simply there will be less pros altogether.
In all of your posts, you take the general admiration for korean skill as some kind of personal attack against your race. I've never seen anyone who has claimed there's some starcraft gene that koreans are superior at. You're basically creating a strawman argument for the sake of martyrdom.
Last time in the KBS’s “Science Café,” tests showed that Flash’s brain activity and regions are different from normal people. What do you personally think is most important aspect of being a progamer? -To be able to win games, you need everything to align. A desire for victory, confidence, mental conditioning are all important factors. When a live game begins, a lot of players get nervous. Whether or not you can, at this point, conquer the fears and perform like you do in practice becomes crucial. Because of so many factors affecting it, results would obviously vary. Also, varied strategies is also a strong foundation for winning.
I wouldn't be so sure that there's no "Starcraft gene". South Korea has the highest IQ in the world and I'm pretty sure they're genetically able to focus longer, at least if you believe ADD is genetic, Koreans have the opposite of that.
So awesome I can't wait to see him play, hes going to be pretty unstoppable for a bit. Can you imagine the nerves NaDa's opponents will get facing him in comps, he's going to have such an edge!
On September 25 2010 09:10 QkDown wrote: You people and koreans. Yes they are the best by far now, but why. It's like the "dream team" in the olympics way back when. America wasn't superior to the world in basketball because they were americans, but because it was a focus within their society. Kids grew up watching basketball, and played it constantly. In Korean Esports is heads above everyone else. SC has been a big deal in Korea for 10+yrs. Will Koreans always be the best progamers? Now that the rest of the world is focusing much more, in a couple years the top pro's will be more diverse through out the world. America isn't genetically superior in basketball etc, and korea isn't genetically superior in SC.
People that think koreans are born with superior sc ability are simply stupid.
Ignore them.
However, I don't think our western society will ever condone gaming as much as korea will (and they are continuously getting more and more serious on it).
Korea will always be in the lead. That however does not mean that our western players cannot be better, but simply there will be less pros altogether.
And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football game in over 150 at home, while outside his win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
He's second in his division? Is that really who it is in first place?!
Oh wow.
There's a large part of me that wants all these real BW pros/gosus/bonjwas/gods to switch and show the B- players like tlo how it's done. There's no doubt that NaDa is a much more skilled player than someone like tlo, but I'm wondering if SC2's dumbed down UI/AI will compensate for such a huge skill difference.
Plus, I'm beginning to suspect that all these foreigners who thought they had a shot at becoming SC2 legends are now realizing that the koreans really do have a firm grip on all of starcraft, one and two.
I agree with you. Don't forget about the Warcraft 3 players. At first (before the game came out), I assumed that Warcraft 3 players wont be able to perform as well as the Starcraft players. However, I was wrong. With the new engine/AI, quality units have its strong potential/use, just like Warcraft heros. What worried me is that the new engine/AI would make the game easier and allow a lot more people to play at higher levels. But if Artosis is right is something he mentioned during the GSL... if players begin to find more and more safer builds to play, and react in time, sc2 will become a game of endurance and it might be more of macro games (like we see today, less 1 base strategies). Personally, I like these one base strategies from the warcraft players, sometimes there's a lot of creativity going on. Especially Warcraft 3 players using Terran >_> "Repairion" lololol
I personally wish that NaDa does pull through and becomes one of the better known players. I DO hope that the new easier engine/AI can compensate for the older age of rts and broodwar players.
On the side note: Last week, there was a storm in new york that hit all the powers out. So i got bored and decided to play a little Brood War. I realized what an amazing game Brood War was. Even how a game like that resulted in a growing community like Team Liquid. I remember how much multi tasking there was compared to sc2. It felt like a sin to be playing sc2. (translating this into korean makes more sense, that it felt like a sin" lololol, but yay, im loving how things look right now
On September 25 2010 09:10 QkDown wrote: You people and koreans. Yes they are the best by far now, but why. It's like the "dream team" in the olympics way back when. America wasn't superior to the world in basketball because they were americans, but because it was a focus within their society. Kids grew up watching basketball, and played it constantly. In Korean Esports is heads above everyone else. SC has been a big deal in Korea for 10+yrs. Will Koreans always be the best progamers? Now that the rest of the world is focusing much more, in a couple years the top pro's will be more diverse through out the world. America isn't genetically superior in basketball etc, and korea isn't genetically superior in SC.
People that think koreans are born with superior sc ability are simply stupid.
Ignore them.
However, I don't think our western society will ever condone gaming as much as korea will (and they are continuously getting more and more serious on it).
Korea will always be in the lead. That however does not mean that our western players cannot be better, but simply there will be less pros altogether.
And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football game in over 150 at home, while outside his win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
Get viable e-sports infrastructure and fanbase and then we'll talk.
On September 25 2010 21:08 Apolo wrote: And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football game in over 150 at home, while outside his win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
On September 25 2010 21:08 Apolo wrote: And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football game in over 150 at home, while outside his win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
On September 25 2010 21:08 Apolo wrote: And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football Game in over 150 at home, while outside his Win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
On September 25 2010 21:08 Apolo wrote: And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football Game in over 150 at home, while outside his Win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
but but .. no that ain't right, this dude was a fluke ..
That was also during the earlier stages of progaming, unlike today where the overall skill level in korea has jumped enormously. Silent_Control (although skilled) wouldnt have anything on todays S class progamers.
Also, other than WCG....they also played at Blizzcon and destroyed everyone there as well. Apolo, so far your argument is 100% wrong.
On September 25 2010 21:08 Apolo wrote: And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football Game in over 150 at home, while outside his Win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
but but .. no that ain't right, this dude was a fluke ..
That was also during the earlier stages of progaming, unlike today where the overall skill level in korea has jumped enormously. Silent_Control (although skilled) wouldnt have anything on todays S class progamers.
Also, other than WCG....they also played at Blizzcon and destroyed everyone there as well. Apolo, so far your argument is 100% wrong.
wtf you talking about .. when this happened it didn't matter if it was the past, present or future and the fact that this happened.
but like i said, it was a fluke. im not arguing about your 2nd statement
On September 25 2010 21:08 Apolo wrote: And there's something else no one seems to adress but which has some impact. Big SC tournaments are in Korea, so koreans are playing at home.
Everyone that is familiar with Mourinho knows he hasn't lost a single football Game in over 150 at home, while outside his Win rate is about 60%. Make koreans come to Europe and USA and we will see if they manage to be as cool and nervousless as they are there.
but but .. no that ain't right, this dude was a fluke ..
That was also during the earlier stages of progaming, unlike today where the overall skill level in korea has jumped enormously. Silent_Control (although skilled) wouldnt have anything on todays S class progamers.
Also, other than WCG....they also played at Blizzcon and destroyed everyone there as well. Apolo, so far your argument is 100% wrong.
Well if you compare silent_controls skill back in 2005 to the skill of the top progamers of 2010 its obvious that there is gonna be a difference. But back in 2005 silent_control was a very good progamer and Androide is probably the most successfull non-korean of all time (in terms of WCG) not to mention he's still a fucking monster
EPT
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OUBLE EDIT* Does anyone have a good scene they can post from a movie, where some character or army sees an impossible-to-beat foe and just drops everything and gives up? No Kerrigan, please. That's the easy response. We need an army just collectively dropping their swords or guns or something.
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/TxXUX.jpg)
. NaDa owning Sc2. too bad I play Zerg . If I were a programmer in the Kespa top 10 I would show this news to my team and demand a 100% Raise. If I were Flash/JD I would demand a 500% raise 
<my brain explodes>![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/du9QE.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/2732/nada.gif)
