On November 15 2017 12:37 JimmyJRaynor wrote: it is a "mystery" to both the TSN and SPortsnet broadcasting teams.... which is why i brought it up. of course, they're both owned by the guys that own the Raptors so i guess we shouldn't expect too much.
OG needs to start at SF. I'd like to see Powell start at shooting guard and Derozan come off the bench... but i don't ever see that happening.
It's not really a mystery to them either. It's their job to talk about bullshit all day long to give tradesmen/women driving around in their cars all day something to listen to. All you need to do is spend 10 minutes listening to a Jays Talk or a Mcowan call-in Monday/Friday to get a grasp for the type of person that treats these networks with any type of analytical respect.
Fuck, Jeff Blair keeps harping on DeRozan taking more 3's, which shows the extent to which he actually understands a damn thing he talks about when he discusses basketball. DeRozan's main improvement will come from defense and ball-distribution. Nothing more.
On November 15 2017 12:37 JimmyJRaynor wrote: it is a "mystery" to both the TSN and SPortsnet broadcasting teams.... which is why i brought it up. of course, they're both owned by the guys that own the Raptors so i guess we shouldn't expect too much.
OG needs to start at SF. I'd like to see Powell start at shooting guard and Derozan come off the bench... but i don't ever see that happening.
It's not really a mystery to them either. It's their job to talk about bullshit all day long to give tradesmen/women driving around in their cars all day something to listen to. All you need to do is spend 10 minutes listening to a Jays Talk or a Mcowan call-in Monday/Friday to get a grasp for the type of person that treats these networks with any type of analytical respect.
Fuck, Jeff Blair keeps harping on DeRozan taking more 3's, which shows the extent to which he actually understands a damn thing he talks about when he discusses basketball. DeRozan's main improvement will come from defense and ball-distribution. Nothing more.
Before Rogers owned both the Fan590 and the Blue Jays at the same time Bob McCown provided excellent baseball analysis. McCown's "Vegas Line" returned 20% on your $20,000 bet investment each year with MLB bets being the foundation of his betting column. the 1990s Bob McCown Jays Talk was superb.
They just refuse to hire guys similar to what McCown was in his prime. Both TSN and Sportsnet basketball coverage teams are filled with "token Canadians".
I've seen Blair on the early morning subway a couple of times... man, he is as ugly as he is miserable
On November 15 2017 13:23 JimmiC wrote: Advanced stats people would have hated Iverson, but brown built a team that went to the finals around the one thing he did great, better then almost everyone who played the game. When you have elite talents you build a system to fit their strengths, if everyone ran the SG system they would not be great because they wouldn't have the talent matched the system.
It's funny you mention Iverson, because that's EXACTLY the type of player I compare DeRozan to. An overrated, elite offensive talent that doesn't play D and will never win a championship.
Don't get me wrong, I love DeRozan, just wish we had a Durant/Butler/Leonard/LeBron ahead of him on the depth chart. (A guy can dream, anyway.)
On November 15 2017 13:23 JimmiC wrote: The issue most "basketball people" have with "analytics people"
i'm neither an "analytics" person nor a "basketball" person. yep, The dichotomy of opinion between both groups is there.
On November 15 2017 13:23 JimmiC wrote: when they say shit like Derozn should come of the bench because person B is producing better numbers. It is just wrong, I don't have the time or willingness to put in all effort to fully explain. Person B is putting up said numbers in a small sample size, against worst competition, in less crucial moments. And so on and so forth. Also, not getting the defense designed or shifted against them.
this is the view i'd have taken 15 years ago when no metrics existed that took into account the quality of one's team mates and opposition. Now, APM or Adjusted Plus Minus creates 60,000 "time slices" with every 5v5 match up in the entire NBA. A giant matrix is created containing 60,000 rows and is "solved for". All 9 people on the court with the player are accounted for.
RAPM is even more accurate than APM and RAPM is even better at accounting for team mates. That said, if Popovich surgically employs Kyle Anderson for 15 minutes a game it will appear statistically, based on RAPM, that Anderson is a slightly better defender than Leonard. When, in fact, Leonard is somewhat better than Anderson. But, that's not what is going on in this case. We're talking about a massive difference in defensive ability.
Even if you sweep aside the "fancy math" and take a simple look. Derozan makes the defensive rating of every single Toronto Raptor worse. His defense is horrible. Raptors defensive rating is 94 with him on the bench and 110 with him in hte game. No other Raptor even comes close to having this negative an impact on the defensive end.
I am not proposing Powell replace Derozan. Powell is already a starter. The line up I propose of JV/Ibaka/OG/Powell/Lowry is a better line up than JV/Ibaka/Powell/Derozan/Lowry on BOTH offense and defense.
On November 15 2017 13:23 JimmiC wrote: Advanced stats people would have hated Iverson, but brown built a team that went to the finals around the one thing he did great, better then almost everyone who played the game. When you have elite talents you build a system to fit their strengths, if everyone ran the SG system they would not be great because they wouldn't have the talent matched the system.
It's funny you mention Iverson, because that's EXACTLY the type of player I compare DeRozan to. An overrated, elite offensive talent that doesn't play D and will never win a championship.
Don't get me wrong, I love DeRozan, just wish we had a Durant/Butler/Leonard/LeBron ahead of him on the depth chart. (A guy can dream, anyway.)
No doubt that Derozan is not in the league of those super elite players because of defense and so on. Im just saying it makes no sense to put him off the bench when he is your best player. The best thing you can do is try to accentuate his strengths and hide his weaknesses. If the comment was we should swap him for any of the players you memtioned i would say hell ya. But swaping deronzn for a much worse (at this stage) overall player necause he does one part better, in a smaller roll and sample size makes no sense.
It's not just defense that plagues him. I think Lebron beats him in a 3-pt contest easy. Unfortunately, he plays a 90s style of offensive basketball (iso, mid-range, holds ball too long, one-on-one) that is currently frowned upon. It's to his credit that he does really well on a type of basketball that is less efficient than what is in vogue.
On November 16 2017 06:52 JimmiC wrote:Im just saying that saying you should cut his minutes on the raptors because OG is a better option is dumb. There will be no "proof" on this because they will never do it to show the negative effect. People who completely discount analytics are crazy, but their case is made for them by the uneducated people who make stupid claims based on them.
without getting into the details of why it is dumb you don't have a case. you've just labelled it dumb.
On November 16 2017 06:52 JimmiC wrote: Im just saying that saying you should cut his minutes on the raptors because OG is a better option is dumb.
On November 16 2017 10:50 JimmiC wrote: Turn down the narcissism, not only was I not talking to you, but I'm activity trying to avoid conversation with you.
how many others have proposed an increase in OG's minutes in exchange for a decrease in Derozan's minutes? so far , only me.
The line up I propose of JV/Ibaka/OG/Powell/Lowry is a better line up than JV/Ibaka/Powell/Derozan/Lowry on BOTH offense and defense. The JV/Ibaka/Powell/Derozan/Lowry lineup has had 146 minutes of court time this year. And it ain't good. http://www.82games.com/1718/1718TOR2.HTM
you've presented nothing that defends your position. you've just stated you don't have time to explain yourself.
the last few games Casey's strategy for dealing with any player under 6'10" that the Raptors can't stop is: Stick OG on him.
so i think we're going to see OG's minutes rise above the current 18.7 minutes a game. if that means Derozan gets less than his usual 36 minutes a game then that's great.
About Tonight's Game: I'm surprised Lowry still has most of this teeth LOL.. holy fuck he is gettin' beat up tonight.
Just don't respond. We've all been guilty of going on side arguments with various people. You don't have to totally ignore him. Just make a conscious effort not to get into a back and forth.
here is a look at all players averaging 20+ points a game and their efficiency as scorers i think the horizontal line in the middle of the graph is the average true shooting percentage of the average NBA player
Good couple of games from CJ Miles these past two nights. Haven't been able to watch the games but just looking at the stats I would venture a guess that the Raptors are starting to figure out this new style of offense.
Also just watched BBallBreakDown's video on Ben Simmons. Good God that kid has great vision on the court already.
After several years of very poor defense Kyrie Irving is suddenly playing solid defense. One theory is: Irving is putting forth a lot more effort and Brad Stevens is creating better situations for him to succeed.
EPT
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