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United States47024 Posts
On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid?
The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one.
On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem.
Also, this.
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I enjoyed the Legacy cinematic. Archon so good.
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On September 14 2015 01:51 Slayer91 wrote:
reminds of that game what was it GGPlay vs Stork?
I think stork closed it out in the end but shit was so close to a draw.
Therock vs Chalrenge, one true shitfest to rule all shitfests
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just want to say that positive and negative reinforcement refers to adding or taking something away as a consequence.). Not sure if that's what you meant or if your using it to mean something different but that's the official definition.
maybe I'm getting too technical but I'm confused about what your trying to say
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On September 14 2015 02:58 Ansibled wrote:
I enjoyed the Legacy cinematic. Archon so good.
Probe MVP. Taking back Aiur by a proxy pylon, OPOP.
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On September 14 2015 02:57 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid? The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one. Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem. Also, this.
Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here.
@Slayer91
But why do you think they don't know? It's because no one tells them. We're too afraid to hurt their feelings and "fat shame." I think both scenarios you present come out with the a similar solution.
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On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 02:57 TheYango wrote:On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid? The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one. On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem. Also, this. Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here. @Slayer91 But why do you think they don't know? It's because no one tells them. We're too afraid to hurt their feelings and "fat shame." I think both scenarios you present come out with the a similar solution.
I mean, weight alone is a pretty poor indicator. You get super skinny people who never exercise and are unhealthy as fk, and you get pretty heavy people who are pretty active and are much healhtier then people who are just thin but never move.
Weight isn't the one true measurement of health at all
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United States47024 Posts
On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:
Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here.
And absolutely nobody has problems saying these things.
What people have a problem with is calling fat people lazy, lol. That's not the same as presenting strongly supported scientific literature illustrating the health risks of long-term obesity, complete with rigorous definitions of what obesity is.
Telling a parent that fat kids are lazy doesn't even give them any information to make the judgment on whether their child is fat.
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On September 14 2015 03:07 killerdog wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:On September 14 2015 02:57 TheYango wrote:On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid? The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one. On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem. Also, this. Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here. @Slayer91 But why do you think they don't know? It's because no one tells them. We're too afraid to hurt their feelings and "fat shame." I think both scenarios you present come out with the a similar solution. I mean, weight alone is a pretty poor indicator. You get super skinny people who never exercise and are unhealthy as fk, and you get pretty heavy people who are pretty active and are much healhtier then people who are just thin but never move. Weight isn't the one true measurement of health at all
We're talking about people who are fat, not people who have a lot of weight like body builders or athletes. There's no way you can be obese and healthy. There's no way you can be happy about being fat. It's always more preferable to be thin. You can accept defeat that you're fat, and you're not going to do anything about it. But if you could lose weight, you would.
There are thin people with poor diets, but the vast majority of weight problems are from people being overweight.
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On September 14 2015 03:09 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:
Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here.
And absolutely nobody has problems saying these things. What people have a problem with is calling fat people lazy, lol. That's not the same as presenting strongly supported scientific literature illustrating the health risks of long-term obesity, complete with rigorous definitions of what obesity is. Telling a parent that fat kids are lazy doesn't even give them any information to make the judgment on whether their child is fat.
Actually people do have a problem with that. Again, we have this culture that suggests "fat shaming" is wrong. That fat is acceptable and ok. That fat is actually beautiful. I think you just haven't seen enough of what this movement is doing or you're being willfully ignorant. People clearly have a problem telling others they're fat. Why do you think parents can't tell their children are fat? Like I said before, the term 'fat shaming' is too ambiguous.
Shame: a painful feeling of humiliation or distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior.
That means anything that makes someone feel bad about being fat or good about being thin is fat shaming. No one is arguing for malicious cruelness.
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United States15536 Posts
It seems like we're getting to the point where this conversation is between two people (for the most part) and neither mind is changing. Perhaps now would be a good time to continue this discussion in PMs.
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of course there is a way to be both obese and healthy, %es, thats how they work
of course you can be fat and happy, people can be happy about the dumbest shit, and here they dont even have to be happy about being fat, they just have to be happy about their life in general which is totes achievable
it's not always preferable to be thin, what if you enter a contest where the more voluminous person wins cash money? clearly the other way around then.
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United States47024 Posts
On September 14 2015 03:17 Sonnington wrote:
Actually people do have a problem with that. Again, we have this culture that suggests "fat shaming" is wrong. That fat is acceptable and ok. That fat is actually beautiful. I think you just haven't seen enough of what this movement is doing or you're being willfully ignorant. People clearly have a problem telling others they're fat. Why do you think parents can't tell their children are fat? Like I said before, the term 'fat shaming' is too ambiguous.
Shame: a painful feeling of humiliation or distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior.
That means anything that makes someone feel bad about being fat or good about being thin is fat shaming. No one is arguing for malicious cruelness.
Except this entire discussion started with you linking a video of a woman who calls fat people lazy and nothing to do with defining or framing obesity.
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On September 14 2015 03:12 Sonnington wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 03:07 killerdog wrote:On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:On September 14 2015 02:57 TheYango wrote:On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid? The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one. On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem. Also, this. Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here. @Slayer91 But why do you think they don't know? It's because no one tells them. We're too afraid to hurt their feelings and "fat shame." I think both scenarios you present come out with the a similar solution. I mean, weight alone is a pretty poor indicator. You get super skinny people who never exercise and are unhealthy as fk, and you get pretty heavy people who are pretty active and are much healhtier then people who are just thin but never move. Weight isn't the one true measurement of health at all We're talking about people who are fat, not people who have a lot of weight like body builders or athletes. There's no way you can be obese and healthy. There's no way you can be happy about being fat. It's always more preferable to be thin. You can accept defeat that you're fat, and you're not going to do anything about it. But if you could lose weight, you would. There are thin people with poor diets, but the vast majority of weight problems are from people being overweight.
It's more a matter of being sedentary then being on a poor diet, while pure weight is a health factor, it's intrinsically tied to a lot of other factors as well. You can lose a lot of weight by just eating less, but if you could choose between losing 10kg by eating less, or eating the same but exercising a little more (which has very little impact on weight), the exercising gives a MUCH larger "health gain" then just losing the weight but not changing anything else.
It's not as black and white as "heavy = bad," it's actually pretty complicated.
On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
> but the vast majority of weight problems are from people being overweight.
What a thought provoking, infallible, and not at all self proving statement...
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United States47024 Posts
Also, I would argue that the "fat is beautiful" movement only exists as a backlash to the obsession with thin-ness that led to the rise of psychological eating disorders from poor body image.
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On September 14 2015 03:18 AsmodeusXI wrote:
It seems like we're getting to the point where this conversation is between two people (for the most part) and neither mind is changing. Perhaps now would be a good time to continue this discussion in PMs.
I count at least 5 people?
On September 14 2015 03:20 Dandel Ion wrote:
of course there is a way to be both obese and healthy, %es, thats how they work
of course you can be fat and happy, people can be happy about the dumbest shit, and here they dont even have to be happy about being fat, they just have to be happy about their life in general which is totes achievable
it's not always preferable to be thin, what if you enter a contest where the more voluminous person wins cash money? clearly the other way around then.
if you wanna swim the english channel you gotta be pretty fat but you'll lose like 30 lbs just in that swim.
On September 14 2015 03:21 killerdog wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 03:12 Sonnington wrote:On September 14 2015 03:07 killerdog wrote:On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:On September 14 2015 02:57 TheYango wrote:On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid? The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one. On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem. Also, this. Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here. @Slayer91 But why do you think they don't know? It's because no one tells them. We're too afraid to hurt their feelings and "fat shame." I think both scenarios you present come out with the a similar solution. I mean, weight alone is a pretty poor indicator. You get super skinny people who never exercise and are unhealthy as fk, and you get pretty heavy people who are pretty active and are much healhtier then people who are just thin but never move. Weight isn't the one true measurement of health at all We're talking about people who are fat, not people who have a lot of weight like body builders or athletes. There's no way you can be obese and healthy. There's no way you can be happy about being fat. It's always more preferable to be thin. You can accept defeat that you're fat, and you're not going to do anything about it. But if you could lose weight, you would. There are thin people with poor diets, but the vast majority of weight problems are from people being overweight. It's more a matter of being sedentary then being on a poor diet, while pure weight is a health factor, it's intrinsically tied to a lot of other factors as well. You can lose a lot of weight by just eating less, but if you could choose between losing 10kg by eating less, or eating the same but exercising a little more (which has very little impact on weight), the exercising gives a MUCH larger "health gain" then just losing the weight but not changing anything else. It's not as black and white as "heavy = bad," it's actually pretty complicated. Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
> but the vast majority of weight problems are from people being overweight.
What a thought provoking, infallible, and not at all self proving statement...
black and white is quite a complex issue nowadays killerdoge you'd best mind your metaphors
On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 02:57 TheYango wrote:On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid? The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one. On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem. Also, this. Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here. @Slayer91 But why do you think they don't know? It's because no one tells them. We're too afraid to hurt their feelings and "fat shame." I think both scenarios you present come out with the a similar solution.
People don't tell people a lot of things they disapprove of, this is because if you do you'd get antagonized and targeted, and it doesn't really help you in any way so why risk getting yelled at and blamed for being a dick/hurting their feelings etc.
people like to project blame on people who point out their problems instead of their problems so you don't want to be in that crosshairs
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United States15536 Posts
On September 14 2015 03:29 Slayer91 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 03:18 AsmodeusXI wrote:
It seems like we're getting to the point where this conversation is between two people (for the most part) and neither mind is changing. Perhaps now would be a good time to continue this discussion in PMs. I count at least 5 people?
At the time I posted it was mostly Yango and Sonnington.
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On September 14 2015 03:21 killerdog wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 03:12 Sonnington wrote:On September 14 2015 03:07 killerdog wrote:On September 14 2015 03:04 Sonnington wrote:On September 14 2015 02:57 TheYango wrote:On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
And by the way, how do you account for the success of antismoking campaigns that go to great lengths to make smokers look stupid? The rhetoric of the anti-smoking campaign is also heavily based in good science and hard statistics, and not pointlessly antagonizing the smoking population. Again reinforcing the idea that approaching the problem with the intent to teach rather than to antagonize is the correct one. On September 14 2015 02:56 Slayer91 wrote:
if parents don't know their children are overweight that's different from parents thinking their children are overweight and they don't think its a problem. Also, this. Are you trying to infer that the overweight and obese aren't at risk of heart disease, diabetes, and generally have less energy? Those are all facts. I also edit my last post again to state that I agree people should be better educated by people not feeling it's taboo to tell each other being obese is bad. This isn't some secret or ethereal concept here. @Slayer91 But why do you think they don't know? It's because no one tells them. We're too afraid to hurt their feelings and "fat shame." I think both scenarios you present come out with the a similar solution. I mean, weight alone is a pretty poor indicator. You get super skinny people who never exercise and are unhealthy as fk, and you get pretty heavy people who are pretty active and are much healhtier then people who are just thin but never move. Weight isn't the one true measurement of health at all We're talking about people who are fat, not people who have a lot of weight like body builders or athletes. There's no way you can be obese and healthy. There's no way you can be happy about being fat. It's always more preferable to be thin. You can accept defeat that you're fat, and you're not going to do anything about it. But if you could lose weight, you would. There are thin people with poor diets, but the vast majority of weight problems are from people being overweight. It's more a matter of being sedentary then being on a poor diet, while pure weight is a health factor, it's intrinsically tied to a lot of other factors as well. You can lose a lot of weight by just eating less, but if you could choose between losing 10kg by eating less, or eating the same but exercising a little more (which has very little impact on weight), the exercising gives a MUCH larger "health gain" then just losing the weight but not changing anything else. It's not as black and white as "heavy = bad," it's actually pretty complicated. Show nested quote +On September 14 2015 02:55 Sonnington wrote:
> but the vast majority of weight problems are from people being overweight.
What a thought provoking, infallible, and not at all self proving statement...
Right, and thin people live less sedentary lifestyles than fat people. That's why they're on average healthier. I'm not sure what you're getting at with the bold comment. I know it's not a mind blowing comment. It's simply a counter point to your assertion, "You can be thin and have health problems or health problems because you're thin." I'm sorry mate, but the vast majority of weight related health problems come from obesity. Just to clarify for you, we're not talking about bodybuilders or athletes being "heavy." We're talking about fat people with obesity vs thin people. Are there outliers? Sure, you can over complicate any issue.
You can make smoking look good as it lowers your risk of Alzheimer's and Parkinson's. If you quit smoking by the time you're 30 it's statistically proven that you'll have an equal life expectancy as someone who's never smoked before. Some smokers are healthier than nonsmokers. Just because you smoke doesn't mean your body is unfit. Yeah, you can make a bunch of outlier statements to over-complicate a simple issue.
Katie Hopkins actually said it's -seen- that fat people are lazy, not that they actually are. While Hopkins might have made the general statement that you can't be happy and fat. I'm elaborating as I see the statement that you can't be happy -because- you're fat. You can have a fulfilling life otherwise. It's always more preferable to be skinny.
And by the way, the whole 'fat is beautiful and acceptable' reason for existing is irrelevant. It's still wrong. Studies have shown people are more attracted to thin and fit people than fat or overweight individuals. Studies have also shown you put yourself at health risks by being obese. It's not something that's ok or acceptable.
User was warned for this post
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people who double post are lazy and taking up too much space in the forum and are seen as messy and uncareful and I wouldn't hire them as a moderator
they know they'd all prefer not to double post but the policy of not warning or temping double posters makes people not even realize that they double posted sometimes
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EPT
