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On December 17 2012 22:22 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:20 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:18 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:17 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:15 DrPandaPhD wrote:
If Leenock wins this, compared to DRG:
Both got a MLG victory
Both got a GSL victory
Both got a MLG 2nd place
Leenock got an WEM victory and DRG got an MLG arena victory (both were basically the same difficult, prizepool etc)
Leenock got an IPL victory whereas DRG got a MLG arena 2nd place, OSL 2nd place
Leenock won Ritmix and DRG won FXOIS5
So they are basically on the same page, however Leenocks team got 2 GSTL victories mainly thanks to him and gumiho + as a star in the corner he dethroned HyuN
So I'd say Leenock achieved more than DRG 2012 IF he wins this. However if DRG wins this he is without a doubt the best player 2012 this is probably the best answer imo Blizzard Cup does not = Code S, MMA isn't even officially recognized as a 2 time GSL champion on Liquipedia. He's recognized as a 2 time GSL champion by GOM we should probably fix liquipedia then even still I can't count a 5 day tournament the same as we would a 3 month GSL season. What about GSL5 that was shortened and had semi/finals at IPL5. How about the one at Blizzcon? Seasons will be longer next year as well. We can't just start putting asterisks beside every tournament.
Just add in the fact that Code S is a blizzard cup with 22 more players, some may be weaker or stronger than the ones in Blizzard cup, only 2 Blizzard Cup players qualified for the Code S Ro8 last season, Leenock and Sniper.
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Oh man, Mvp is a damn shame. Had he made a decent run, he might have had a case for being top of the world, this way, he'll have to settle for "the best terran".
I'm pretty sure the title will have to go to DRG, Life, Parting or Leenock. Life made his breaktrough only fairly late in the year, though. Leenock and Parting are not GSL champions. If DRG wins this, the title has to go to him - the other three can really be considered only if they take this title.
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On December 17 2012 22:23 Kiyo. wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:22 vthree wrote:On December 17 2012 22:20 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:18 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:17 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:15 DrPandaPhD wrote:
If Leenock wins this, compared to DRG:
Both got a MLG victory
Both got a GSL victory
Both got a MLG 2nd place
Leenock got an WEM victory and DRG got an MLG arena victory (both were basically the same difficult, prizepool etc)
Leenock got an IPL victory whereas DRG got a MLG arena 2nd place, OSL 2nd place
Leenock won Ritmix and DRG won FXOIS5
So they are basically on the same page, however Leenocks team got 2 GSTL victories mainly thanks to him and gumiho + as a star in the corner he dethroned HyuN
So I'd say Leenock achieved more than DRG 2012 IF he wins this. However if DRG wins this he is without a doubt the best player 2012 this is probably the best answer imo Blizzard Cup does not = Code S, MMA isn't even officially recognized as a 2 time GSL champion on Liquipedia. He's recognized as a 2 time GSL champion by GOM we should probably fix liquipedia then even still I can't count a 5 day tournament the same as we would a 3 month GSL season. What about GSL5 that was shortened and had semi/finals at IPL5. How about the one at Blizzcon? Seasons will be longer next year as well. We can't just start putting asterisks beside every tournament. Or the first GSL World Championships. Does Mvp not deserve to be called a 4 time GSL champion?
hmm that's a good point I guess, I don't remember off the top of my head how long the WC lasted but it was probably just as short as blizzard cup.
It counts in the way that It's a GSL title but it doesn't hold the same weight when discussing achievements just like we wouldn't say winning one of the smaller dreamhacks is the same as winning IPL5 or a big MLG championship.
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On December 17 2012 22:26 THF wrote:
Oh man, Mvp is a damn shame. Had he made a decent run, he might have had a case for being top of the world, this way, he'll have to settle for "the best terran".
I'm pretty sure the title will have to go to DRG, Life, Parting or Leenock. Life made his breaktrough only fairly late in the year, though. Leenock and Parting are not GSL champions. If DRG wins this, the title has to go to him - the other three can really be considered only if they take this title.
I would say that if MKP wins HSC6, then he should recieve the title "best terran of 2012".
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On December 17 2012 22:25 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:20 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:18 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:17 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:15 DrPandaPhD wrote:
If Leenock wins this, compared to DRG:
Both got a MLG victory
Both got a GSL victory
Both got a MLG 2nd place
Leenock got an WEM victory and DRG got an MLG arena victory (both were basically the same difficult, prizepool etc)
Leenock got an IPL victory whereas DRG got a MLG arena 2nd place, OSL 2nd place
Leenock won Ritmix and DRG won FXOIS5
So they are basically on the same page, however Leenocks team got 2 GSTL victories mainly thanks to him and gumiho + as a star in the corner he dethroned HyuN
So I'd say Leenock achieved more than DRG 2012 IF he wins this. However if DRG wins this he is without a doubt the best player 2012 this is probably the best answer imo Blizzard Cup does not = Code S, MMA isn't even officially recognized as a 2 time GSL champion on Liquipedia. He's recognized as a 2 time GSL champion by GOM we should probably fix liquipedia then even still I can't count a 5 day tournament the same as we would a 3 month GSL season. I agree, it's a completely different thing. GSL is so much more preparation based, this tournament is more about how well these guys are performing in a very short period of time. Doing well in GSL means more to me. Gotta be more consistent to do well.
I agree. But we still need to recognize it as a GSL. Because GSL's format has been changing (and will keep on changing). Actually, you could argue all GSL are different. Maybe a new map was introduced which favored a certain race. Or a patch just hit which affected the Ro32/Ro16.
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United States97277 Posts
On December 17 2012 22:26 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:23 Kiyo. wrote:On December 17 2012 22:22 vthree wrote:On December 17 2012 22:20 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:18 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:17 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:15 DrPandaPhD wrote:
If Leenock wins this, compared to DRG:
Both got a MLG victory
Both got a GSL victory
Both got a MLG 2nd place
Leenock got an WEM victory and DRG got an MLG arena victory (both were basically the same difficult, prizepool etc)
Leenock got an IPL victory whereas DRG got a MLG arena 2nd place, OSL 2nd place
Leenock won Ritmix and DRG won FXOIS5
So they are basically on the same page, however Leenocks team got 2 GSTL victories mainly thanks to him and gumiho + as a star in the corner he dethroned HyuN
So I'd say Leenock achieved more than DRG 2012 IF he wins this. However if DRG wins this he is without a doubt the best player 2012 this is probably the best answer imo Blizzard Cup does not = Code S, MMA isn't even officially recognized as a 2 time GSL champion on Liquipedia. He's recognized as a 2 time GSL champion by GOM we should probably fix liquipedia then even still I can't count a 5 day tournament the same as we would a 3 month GSL season. What about GSL5 that was shortened and had semi/finals at IPL5. How about the one at Blizzcon? Seasons will be longer next year as well. We can't just start putting asterisks beside every tournament. Or the first GSL World Championships. Does Mvp not deserve to be called a 4 time GSL champion? hmm that's a good point I guess, I don't remember off the top of my head how long the WC lasted but it was probably just as short as blizzard cup. It counts in the way that It's a GSL title but it doesn't hold the same weight when discussing achievements just like we wouldn't say winning one of the smaller dreamhacks is the same as winning IPL5 or a big MLG championship.
It was a 16 player single elim bracket with foreigners. 9 code S players (since jinro was code S on the foreign side) and 7 others
March 30 - April 9
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On December 17 2012 22:27 Hiea wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:26 THF wrote:
Oh man, Mvp is a damn shame. Had he made a decent run, he might have had a case for being top of the world, this way, he'll have to settle for "the best terran".
I'm pretty sure the title will have to go to DRG, Life, Parting or Leenock. Life made his breaktrough only fairly late in the year, though. Leenock and Parting are not GSL champions. If DRG wins this, the title has to go to him - the other three can really be considered only if they take this title. I would say that if MKP wins HSC6, then he should recieve the title "best terran of 2012".
MKP is 14th in GSL points and didn't make it past the ro8 in the whole year, unless you're trying to say that GSL doesn't matter as much as homestory cup ( I love homestory cup...but come on now ) I don't see how that would be possible.
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On December 17 2012 22:26 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:23 Kiyo. wrote:On December 17 2012 22:22 vthree wrote:On December 17 2012 22:20 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:18 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:17 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:15 DrPandaPhD wrote:
If Leenock wins this, compared to DRG:
Both got a MLG victory
Both got a GSL victory
Both got a MLG 2nd place
Leenock got an WEM victory and DRG got an MLG arena victory (both were basically the same difficult, prizepool etc)
Leenock got an IPL victory whereas DRG got a MLG arena 2nd place, OSL 2nd place
Leenock won Ritmix and DRG won FXOIS5
So they are basically on the same page, however Leenocks team got 2 GSTL victories mainly thanks to him and gumiho + as a star in the corner he dethroned HyuN
So I'd say Leenock achieved more than DRG 2012 IF he wins this. However if DRG wins this he is without a doubt the best player 2012 this is probably the best answer imo Blizzard Cup does not = Code S, MMA isn't even officially recognized as a 2 time GSL champion on Liquipedia. He's recognized as a 2 time GSL champion by GOM we should probably fix liquipedia then even still I can't count a 5 day tournament the same as we would a 3 month GSL season. What about GSL5 that was shortened and had semi/finals at IPL5. How about the one at Blizzcon? Seasons will be longer next year as well. We can't just start putting asterisks beside every tournament. Or the first GSL World Championships. Does Mvp not deserve to be called a 4 time GSL champion? hmm that's a good point I guess, I don't remember off the top of my head how long the WC lasted but it was probably just as short as blizzard cup. It counts in the way that It's a GSL title but it doesn't hold the same weight when discussing achievements just like we wouldn't say winning one of the smaller dreamhacks is the same as winning IPL5 or a big MLG championship.
I agree tbh, but I'd still rate it just as high as an IPL or MLG win, possibly even higher as the competition here is the best in the world.
My vote for player of the year will probably go to the winner of this most likely, unless someone like Violet or Seed pulls it out. I think Parting, DRG, Leenock, and Life all have a claim to player of the year.
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opterown
Australia54784 Posts
you know violet has actually done really well this year haha
best foreigner for sure
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On December 17 2012 22:30 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:27 Hiea wrote:On December 17 2012 22:26 THF wrote:
Oh man, Mvp is a damn shame. Had he made a decent run, he might have had a case for being top of the world, this way, he'll have to settle for "the best terran".
I'm pretty sure the title will have to go to DRG, Life, Parting or Leenock. Life made his breaktrough only fairly late in the year, though. Leenock and Parting are not GSL champions. If DRG wins this, the title has to go to him - the other three can really be considered only if they take this title. I would say that if MKP wins HSC6, then he should recieve the title "best terran of 2012". MKP is 14th in GSL points and didn't make it past the ro8 in the whole year, unless you're trying to say that GSL doesn't matter as much as homestory cup ( I love homestory cup...but come on now ) I don't see how that would be possible.
It would only make sense if you rank GSL = MLG which I don't think most people would.
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On December 17 2012 22:30 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:27 Hiea wrote:On December 17 2012 22:26 THF wrote:
Oh man, Mvp is a damn shame. Had he made a decent run, he might have had a case for being top of the world, this way, he'll have to settle for "the best terran".
I'm pretty sure the title will have to go to DRG, Life, Parting or Leenock. Life made his breaktrough only fairly late in the year, though. Leenock and Parting are not GSL champions. If DRG wins this, the title has to go to him - the other three can really be considered only if they take this title. I would say that if MKP wins HSC6, then he should recieve the title "best terran of 2012". MKP is 14th in GSL points and didn't make it past the ro8 in the whole year, unless you're trying to say that GSL doesn't matter as much as homestory cup ( I love homestory cup...but come on now ) I don't see how that would be possible.
MKP crushed a lot of people in other tournaments, MLG, IPL, teamleagues.
Mvp has GSL 1st / 2nd and IEM, I wouldn't say IEM is any harder than HSC, and the GSL is rivaled by MKPs 1st /1st / 2nd / 3rd in MLG + teamleagues + IPL (He got 5-6th at IPL 4) and crushed the IPL 5 korean qualifier, beating 3 zergs in a row just after the patch (Curious, Symbol and HyuN), and ontop of that he did okay in GSL. MKP also qualified for OSL, Mvp got a seed.
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Tooo sad that MVP lost. But still im happy cause parting won
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so much bickering....search your hearts and discover there is only one answer to this question: MVP, and if you think otherwise you are kidding yourself, and I'm an MKP fanboy.
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On December 17 2012 22:36 Irre wrote:
so much bickering....search your hearts and discover there is only one answer to this question: MVP, and if you think otherwise you are kidding yourself, and I'm an MKP fanboy.
I was just trying to justify my feeling, but F*** YEAH KABOOM Mvp!
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On December 17 2012 22:28 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:25 DarkLordOlli wrote:On December 17 2012 22:20 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:18 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:17 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:15 DrPandaPhD wrote:
If Leenock wins this, compared to DRG:
Both got a MLG victory
Both got a GSL victory
Both got a MLG 2nd place
Leenock got an WEM victory and DRG got an MLG arena victory (both were basically the same difficult, prizepool etc)
Leenock got an IPL victory whereas DRG got a MLG arena 2nd place, OSL 2nd place
Leenock won Ritmix and DRG won FXOIS5
So they are basically on the same page, however Leenocks team got 2 GSTL victories mainly thanks to him and gumiho + as a star in the corner he dethroned HyuN
So I'd say Leenock achieved more than DRG 2012 IF he wins this. However if DRG wins this he is without a doubt the best player 2012 this is probably the best answer imo Blizzard Cup does not = Code S, MMA isn't even officially recognized as a 2 time GSL champion on Liquipedia. He's recognized as a 2 time GSL champion by GOM we should probably fix liquipedia then even still I can't count a 5 day tournament the same as we would a 3 month GSL season. I agree, it's a completely different thing. GSL is so much more preparation based, this tournament is more about how well these guys are performing in a very short period of time. Doing well in GSL means more to me. Gotta be more consistent to do well. I agree. But we still need to recognize it as a GSL. Because GSL's format has been changing (and will keep on changing). Actually, you could argue all GSL are different. Maybe a new map was introduced which favored a certain race. Or a patch just hit which affected the Ro32/Ro16.
I don't agree. I think a line needs to be drawn somewhere, and the GSL World Championship is it. There is too great a drop from the WC to the Blizzard cup for them to be recognized on the same level.
100k prize pool vs 58k
16 players vs 10
10 days vs 5
The World Championship also occurred at a time when GSL where trying a lot of new things to try and build a fan base and therefore created many big tournaments. By the time the Blizzard Cup rolled around everything was set in place. GSL Code S seasons had structure to them and GOM were no longer needing to experiment. We knew exactly what the toughest tournament in the world was and that was GSL Code S. Blizzard Cup was created as a special end of year celebration tournament. It's not designed to be a GSL or carry the prestige of a GSL. It's has a significantly decreased prize pool and player pool.
It's a great tournament don't get me wrong, but MMA is a 1 time GSL champion and a 1 time Blizz cup champion.
Some people get frustrated at Mvp being called MVP or MvP, some people get angry over the interpretation of what is an 'all in'. This is my big gripe lol.
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On December 17 2012 22:19 bittman wrote:
Leenock didn't get a GSL victory. Leenock also had 2 MLG wins vs DRGs 1.
To be honest, they're very even. I agree with the sentiment that whoever wins will be seen as the best player of 2012.
But Sniper will totally win this so we have no freaking idea haha.
DRG has 2 MLG wins. Leenock only has one right?
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On December 17 2012 22:51 Chill Penguin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:28 vthree wrote:On December 17 2012 22:25 DarkLordOlli wrote:On December 17 2012 22:20 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:18 Dodgin wrote:On December 17 2012 22:17 Shellshock1122 wrote:On December 17 2012 22:15 DrPandaPhD wrote:
If Leenock wins this, compared to DRG:
Both got a MLG victory
Both got a GSL victory
Both got a MLG 2nd place
Leenock got an WEM victory and DRG got an MLG arena victory (both were basically the same difficult, prizepool etc)
Leenock got an IPL victory whereas DRG got a MLG arena 2nd place, OSL 2nd place
Leenock won Ritmix and DRG won FXOIS5
So they are basically on the same page, however Leenocks team got 2 GSTL victories mainly thanks to him and gumiho + as a star in the corner he dethroned HyuN
So I'd say Leenock achieved more than DRG 2012 IF he wins this. However if DRG wins this he is without a doubt the best player 2012 this is probably the best answer imo Blizzard Cup does not = Code S, MMA isn't even officially recognized as a 2 time GSL champion on Liquipedia. He's recognized as a 2 time GSL champion by GOM we should probably fix liquipedia then even still I can't count a 5 day tournament the same as we would a 3 month GSL season. I agree, it's a completely different thing. GSL is so much more preparation based, this tournament is more about how well these guys are performing in a very short period of time. Doing well in GSL means more to me. Gotta be more consistent to do well. I agree. But we still need to recognize it as a GSL. Because GSL's format has been changing (and will keep on changing). Actually, you could argue all GSL are different. Maybe a new map was introduced which favored a certain race. Or a patch just hit which affected the Ro32/Ro16. I don't agree. I think a line needs to be drawn somewhere, and the GSL World Championship is it. There is too great a drop from the WC to the Blizzard cup for them to be recognized on the same level. 100k prize pool vs 58k 16 players vs 10 10 days vs 5 The World Championship also occurred at a time when GSL where trying a lot of new things to try and build a fan base and therefore created many big tournaments. By the time the Blizzard Cup rolled around everything was set in place. GSL Code S seasons had structure to them and GOM were no longer needing to experiment. We knew exactly what the toughest tournament in the world was and that was GSL Code S. Blizzard Cup was created as a special end of year celebration tournament. It's not designed to be a GSL or carry the prestige of a GSL. It's has a significantly decreased prize pool and player pool. It's a great tournament don't get me wrong, but MMA is a 1 time GSL champion and a 1 time Blizz cup champion. Some people get frustrated at Mvp being called MVP or MvP, some people get angry over the interpretation of what is an 'all in'. This is my big gripe lol.
That's the problem, different people will draw their line differently. Using you criteria of prize pool, number of players, duration, WC is actually closer to Blizzard Cup than it is to GSL Code S.
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On December 17 2012 22:56 TommyP wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:19 bittman wrote:
Leenock didn't get a GSL victory. Leenock also had 2 MLG wins vs DRGs 1.
To be honest, they're very even. I agree with the sentiment that whoever wins will be seen as the best player of 2012.
But Sniper will totally win this so we have no freaking idea haha. DRG has 2 MLG wins. Leenock only has one right?
DRG has one. He also has an Arena.
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On December 17 2012 22:57 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On December 17 2012 22:56 TommyP wrote:On December 17 2012 22:19 bittman wrote:
Leenock didn't get a GSL victory. Leenock also had 2 MLG wins vs DRGs 1.
To be honest, they're very even. I agree with the sentiment that whoever wins will be seen as the best player of 2012.
But Sniper will totally win this so we have no freaking idea haha. DRG has 2 MLG wins. Leenock only has one right? DRG has one. He also has an Arena.
Leenock won 1 MLG champ, got 2nd at another MLG champ
DRG had the same + the mini arena (8 player)
We're only counting 2012 results, Leenock won 2 MLG's overall, but 1 was in 2011.
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Player of the year is 100% Leenock or DRG. Nobody other than maybe Mvp comes close an that's a bit of a stretch. If Leenock wins this, it's probably him, if not its DRG
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EPT
