EPT[Q]PvT ogsMc/voidray opening
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Mada_Jiang
Australia236 Posts
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Sleight
2471 Posts
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Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
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freetgy
1720 Posts
but on short distances you will get rolled, Terran just needs to all in you. 4 marines kill 1 Voidray, not a good trade. | ||
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Hyren
United States817 Posts
Since it is frowned upon to post replays where I win, I am not going to post any replays and simply refer to the games by MC 2 GSLs ago I think that you are mistaken. Posting replays where you win is frowned upon when you are the one asking for help, not when you are discussing a strategy. | ||
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da_head
Canada3350 Posts
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Obelisco
Peru1962 Posts
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monk
United States8477 Posts
I've also seen 3 other oGsMC builds involving voidrays. They are: 3 gate stargate all-in, a different 3 gate stargate all-in, and 2 gate stargate expo. Do not confuse these builds for the same build. They are actually very different and each has a different purpose. All 4 builds differ in the choice of the first gateway units and number of gateways. Once you commit to a certain set of units, you cannot go to a different voidray build. The most impressive aspect of oGsMC's play is his ability to choose the right build based on his very limited scouting information. As for counters to this 5 stalker + voidray build you're probably talking about, 2 rax expand with a reactor first solidly counters this build, as does 3 rax. 1-1-1 builds where terran doesn't get a wall off are good vs this build. Also, if he scouts your stargate and goes viking first on his starport, you will be behind. | ||
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tehemperorer
United States2183 Posts
On February 11 2011 08:31 da_head wrote: are you referrin to three gate star? that's been a pretty common opening for a while.. I've used it since August 2010, either a 2gate or 3gate variant. It will either win the game or force a hard contain + harass that is just unbeatable. There are 3 ways to survive it: 1. you scan and are lucky and find the starport 2. you have played against a player who does this a lot and know it's coming 3. you go pure reactored marines because you planned for a marine/raven/banshee push The good thing is that it is only as all-in as you allow it to go, and if you can't win with it you delay their expansion for so long that you can tech or mass on just 2 bases to destroy the Terran. Follow up is to get bay/facility for colossus to add to gate/VR on 2 bases. Masters league <--- | ||
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Mada_Jiang
Australia236 Posts
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LesPhoques
Canada782 Posts
This thread is pretty useless imo, no discussion whatsoever | ||
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Mada_Jiang
Australia236 Posts
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monk
United States8477 Posts
Vs 2 rax expand on close air distance Ex: vs IMMVP in gisado KOTH on metal 2 gate stargate expand. Gateway units should be more focused on zealot and sentry initially. MC put down a stargate once his probe luckily got up the ramp of the terran and scouted 2 rax. The concept of this build is to get 1 voidray and use it to pin you opponent in his base. This voidray also serves the purposes of forcing more marine heavy than he would like and being a scout. If you're really lucky, you can even force some turrets with just 1 voidray. A very marine heavy army can lose to pure gateway units with good forcefields if he chooses to attack you.. Then, when you finally get collosi, you'll rape his marine heavy army. Vs 1 rax expand: Ex: vs jinro on Shakrus in GSL 3 gate stargate with zealot/sentry heavy early on. At 7:55, all-in with 2 voidray, 3 zealot, 4 stalker, 2 sentry Vs low ground rax/depot: Ex: vs MKP on LT in GSL 3 gate stargate. Puts up a pylon on low ground and uses voidray for vision to warp onto high ground. I wouldn't recommend this build. It's very hard to execute and MC kinda got lucky in this game. I think MC was originally planning to depot bust and this was his backup plan. | ||
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EliteReplay
Dominican Republic913 Posts
On February 11 2011 09:31 4kmonk wrote: Vs a wall off: 2 gate stargate with 1 zealot 5 stalkers, robo at 6:30, hit at 7:00-7:10. I've seen MC do this build every time he scouts a wall off and he's won about 10/10 games with this build. I do a similar version that hits faster, cuts less probes, and hits with 4 stalkers instead. Vs 2 rax expand on close air distance Ex: vs IMMVP in gisado KOTH on metal 2 gate stargate expand. Gateway units should be more focused on zealot and sentry initially. MC put down a stargate once his probe luckily got up the ramp of the terran and scouted 2 rax. The concept of this build is to get 1 voidray and use it to pin you opponent in his base. This voidray also serves the purposes of forcing more marine heavy than he would like and being a scout. If you're really lucky, you can even force some turrets with just 1 voidray. A very marine heavy army can lose to pure gateway units with good forcefields if he chooses to attack you.. Then, when you finally get collosi, you'll rape his marine heavy army. Vs 1 rax expand: Ex: vs jinro on Shakrus in GSL 3 gate stargate with zealot/sentry heavy early on. At 7:55, all-in with 2 voidray, 3 zealot, 4 stalker, 2 sentry Vs low ground rax/depot: Ex: vs MKP on LT in GSL 3 gate stargate. Puts up a pylon on low ground and uses voidray for vision to warp onto high ground. I wouldn't recommend this build. It's very hard to execute and MC kinda got lucky in this game. I think MC was originally planning to depot bust and this was his backup plan. Impresive analisys man, thanks for this, i understand part of the BO mc use but u are really good at understanding why he choose X BO vs T | ||
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Mada_Jiang
Australia236 Posts
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hitman133
United States1425 Posts
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iamke55
United States2806 Posts
If you are looking for a standard blind opening, stick with 2 gate robo. | ||
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Phayze
Canada2029 Posts
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Widar
Sweden261 Posts
So I can write it down. Or perhaps link a thread that has it? | ||
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aegishonoris
United States4 Posts
On February 11 2011 11:32 iamke55 wrote: Wow, this is the perfect example of a player copying a pro's build without understanding the reasoning behind it. Getting a fast void ray is not something you go into the game planning to do. It's a response to scouting the Terran's wall off, which is sometimes seen on maps that are good for proxy gates. In a few Boxer replays I see that he doesn't wall in. Sadly, he lost all of those games! But to you I ask, what do you, as a Protoss, do when 1. there is no wall off 2. there is a bunker defending 3. Terran goes viking? If iamke55 is correct and the Void Ray is truly a response to a wall in, then is the early Void Ray not beneficial in the absence of the early wall-in? Moreover, if you claim one does not go into a game planning to build an early Void Ray, is it because its effectiveness is only found vs. an early wall? As I see it, the early wall allows the Void Ray to charge up, making it deadly to Marines, the only real anti-air that early if Terran forgoes Vikings, hence the value of the early Void Ray. Is the Void Ray really only a response to the wall? | ||
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