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[M] (2) Monlyth Memories

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
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1 2 Next All
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-04 18:50:07
August 18 2011 17:22 GMT
#1
Update: as of 9/4
-7/1 bases are now on highground and ramps leading into are smaller.
-Outer ramp by the third is now smaller which should help defending.

Overview
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Im trying to make a blizzard type map not only in design but looks as well.

Notes:
- Watchtowers are in between the two raised circle areas towards the sides of the map, They DO NOT reveal any bases, and the middle pathway is hidden from view.
- Map is roughly 140x140, but plays a little smaller.

IronManSC
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States2119 Posts
August 18 2011 17:50 GMT
#2
So... your 3rd is either a blocked gold on low ground, a small island with 1 geyser, or a normal high-ground expansion right in the center which can easily be attacked from the opponent's 3rd.

I really imagine a lot of 2-base play on this. The 4th on low-ground is also in a really tough spot that is not easily re-inforceable, and it is simply too far away. If it gets attacked, it's gone.

The main bases also look a little small. Would you show analyzer pics at least?
SC2 Mapmaker || twitter: @ironmansc || Ohana & Mech Depot || 3x TLMC finalist || www.twitch.tv/sc2mapstream
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-18 17:58:02
August 18 2011 17:57 GMT
#3
On August 19 2011 02:50 IronManSC wrote:
So... your 3rd is either a blocked gold on low ground, a small island with 1 geyser, or a normal high-ground expansion right in the center which can easily be attacked from the opponent's 3rd.

I really imagine a lot of 2-base play on this. The 4th on low-ground is also in a really tough spot that is not easily re-inforceable, and it is simply too far away. If it gets attacked, it's gone.

The main bases also look a little small. Would you show analyzer pics at least?

the mains are a little small and im going to make them a tad bigger, the thirds i think are actually really defendable since the ramps are towards the natural and your opponent would have to either A go all the way around and be vulnerable to the highground or take the other way which is a pretty straight forward shot. (no different than any other map imo) though i might make a hole or a cliff by the thirds mineral and gas so its more secure.
Oh and its available on NA.
UmiNotsuki
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States633 Posts
August 18 2011 18:52 GMT
#4
Oh god, playing a ZvT on this map looks like a NIGHTMARE! Until I want to expand to my third it would be alright, but for my third:

If I take the gold: I'm extremely vulnerable to siege tank harass and I can't get a good position to attack my opponent's army if it's situated in the corner near the Xel'Naga tower.

If I take the island: No one will take the island, come on. I have to invest into a nydus worm or drops just to get a hatchery and drones there, and if my opponent decides to simply drop harass it I'm not gonna be able to defend it at all.

If I take the central high ground: My opponent will siege up against the cliff and bombard my mineral line and hatchery, while also getting into a very hard to break situation near the watchtower. This also sets my opponent up in a fantastic position to defend the gold base as his third while denying mine, which any Zerg player knows is game ending.
UmiNotsuki.111 (NA), UNTReborn.932 (EU), UmiNotsuki (iCCup) -- You see that text I wrote above this? I'll betcha $5 that you disagree :D
Triscuit
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States722 Posts
August 18 2011 18:55 GMT
#5
I expected more eye stalks.

I agree with IronMan though that the third seems pretty vulnerable. The one on the high ground seems weak to tanks/blink stalkers/infestor play. Specifically I would hate having to play against a terran on this map.
fenX
Profile Joined February 2011
France127 Posts
August 18 2011 19:10 GMT
#6
On August 19 2011 02:22 WniO wrote:
Im trying to make a blizzard type map not only in design but looks as well.

Sooooo many doodads ! Blizzard maps are not allowed to use more than 25 doodads, you fool ! You have at least 30 there !!!
My map thread : http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=195518
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
August 18 2011 19:33 GMT
#7
On August 19 2011 04:10 fenX wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2011 02:22 WniO wrote:
Im trying to make a blizzard type map not only in design but looks as well.

Sooooo many doodads ! Blizzard maps are not allowed to use more than 25 doodads, you fool ! You have at least 30 there !!!

haha i dont know what to make of your post... i have about 600 which is less than the usual blizzard map
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

^^i see like 10 in that screen
@triscuit What are eye stalks?

So yeah ill be making the third a little more attractive to take, but i still want a choice and not herp derp 1234 ez pz bases
iGrok
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5142 Posts
August 18 2011 20:09 GMT
#8
Looks like a Blizzard Map, but with a decent amount of thought put into it.

I like it, though the aesthetics leave something to be desired.

And btw - Even Blizzard nowadays is making Symmetric maps. You should probably do that as well.
MOTM | Stim.tv | TL Mafia | Fantasy Fighting! | SNSD
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
August 18 2011 20:32 GMT
#9
On August 19 2011 05:09 iGrok wrote:
Looks like a Blizzard Map, but with a decent amount of thought put into it.

I like it, though the aesthetics leave something to be desired.

And btw - Even Blizzard nowadays is making Symmetric maps. You should probably do that as well.

yeah the look is something im not happy with, but alot of the areas turned out great. what do you mean by the last comment?
monitor
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2408 Posts
August 18 2011 21:09 GMT
#10
On August 19 2011 05:32 WniO wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2011 05:09 iGrok wrote:
Looks like a Blizzard Map, but with a decent amount of thought put into it.

I like it, though the aesthetics leave something to be desired.

And btw - Even Blizzard nowadays is making Symmetric maps. You should probably do that as well.

yeah the look is something im not happy with, but alot of the areas turned out great. what do you mean by the last comment?


I'm pretty sure he means to make the map symmetrical, using the copy+paste tool, since Blizzard is doing it now too.
https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Monitor
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
August 18 2011 21:23 GMT
#11
On August 19 2011 06:09 monitor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2011 05:32 WniO wrote:
On August 19 2011 05:09 iGrok wrote:
Looks like a Blizzard Map, but with a decent amount of thought put into it.

I like it, though the aesthetics leave something to be desired.

And btw - Even Blizzard nowadays is making Symmetric maps. You should probably do that as well.

yeah the look is something im not happy with, but alot of the areas turned out great. what do you mean by the last comment?


I'm pretty sure he means to make the map symmetrical, using the copy+paste tool, since Blizzard is doing it now too.

i do it the old fashioned way^^ perfect is the opposite of good yo. do you know how boring it would be if metalopolis's mains were the same layout or lost temps sigh... but yeah ill be refining this a lot over the weekend thanks for the feedback.
monitor
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2408 Posts
August 18 2011 21:30 GMT
#12
On August 19 2011 06:23 WniO wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2011 06:09 monitor wrote:
On August 19 2011 05:32 WniO wrote:
On August 19 2011 05:09 iGrok wrote:
Looks like a Blizzard Map, but with a decent amount of thought put into it.

I like it, though the aesthetics leave something to be desired.

And btw - Even Blizzard nowadays is making Symmetric maps. You should probably do that as well.

yeah the look is something im not happy with, but alot of the areas turned out great. what do you mean by the last comment?


I'm pretty sure he means to make the map symmetrical, using the copy+paste tool, since Blizzard is doing it now too.

i do it the old fashioned way^^ perfect is the opposite of good yo. do you know how boring it would be if metalopolis's mains were the same layout or lost temps sigh... but yeah ill be refining this a lot over the weekend thanks for the feedback.


Boring? You mean positionally imbalanced. If you want to make a map non-boring, make a creative and interesting layout. Don't make something "interesting" by making it imbalanced in mirror match ups - it will be never chosen for use at a high level competition (only reason we deal with blizzard is because they're on the ladder- just give it time and they'll all disappear).

That being said, I do find this layout very interesting. I think the third needs to be easier to hold, but very good so far.
https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Monitor
SmashHammer
Profile Joined January 2011
United States148 Posts
August 18 2011 21:54 GMT
#13
I like the layout. Its almost like a reverse desert oasis. Mains on the side and expand into the central base. Not to sure about those islands though. They seem kinda tacked on and probably favor Terran.
TPW Mapping - theplanetaryworkshop.com
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-20 21:26:17
August 20 2011 20:57 GMT
#14
Did some pretty good updates, would be interested to see if they are good changes or if there are major concerns in general. Thanks.
Also, could a mod change the name to [M] (2) Monlyth Memories, Thanks!
+ Show Spoiler +
Oh and there are some small things that arent quite done with regards to textures/cliffareas.
FoxyMayhem
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
624 Posts
August 22 2011 18:24 GMT
#15
About those rocks blocking the ramp to the 4th... I feel like, to be a proper Blizzard map, you need to keep those rocks and put some where the would land, that way terran can't take it earlier than the other races, and you're closer to meeting the destructible rocks quota. You might want to throw one or two in that middle path, and then I think it will be good.

Okay, lulz aside, I like the layout a lot. Why do 2-spawn maps feel more diverse than 4-spawn maps? Probably because you have to have 4 mains and 4 naturals, so that consumes most of the viable expansions. Anyway, I do think you should remove the rocks to the forth, or place them where a CC can't land, unless you think it's required to keep terran competitive on the map, which doesn't seem like that'd be the case. Very well done.
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
August 22 2011 19:18 GMT
#16
On August 23 2011 03:24 FoxyMayhem wrote:
About those rocks blocking the ramp to the 4th... I feel like, to be a proper Blizzard map, you need to keep those rocks and put some where the would land, that way terran can't take it earlier than the other races, and you're closer to meeting the destructible rocks quota. You might want to throw one or two in that middle path, and then I think it will be good.

Okay, lulz aside, I like the layout a lot. Why do 2-spawn maps feel more diverse than 4-spawn maps? Probably because you have to have 4 mains and 4 naturals, so that consumes most of the viable expansions. Anyway, I do think you should remove the rocks to the forth, or place them where a CC can't land, unless you think it's required to keep terran competitive on the map, which doesn't seem like that'd be the case. Very well done.

Thanks for your comment. Layout wise I tried to make a design which hasn't been done before and I think its getting there. The reason those rocks are where they are is to make that expo easier to take since the other two options as a third are more risky.
FoxyMayhem
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
624 Posts
August 22 2011 23:46 GMT
#17
I'm not talking about the long rocks near the center, those are great. I'm talking about the ones on the 12 and 6 o'clock bases. <3
Sea_Food
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Finland1612 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-04 07:14:51
September 04 2011 07:11 GMT
#18
FE so easy for terran and protoss, but 3rd so hard for zerg. To fix the map you must either:
1. Remove the rocks blocking the 6 and 12 bases.
2. raise the 7 and 1 bases from low ground to normal grouund. I would prefer this because it would allow this map to be more unique.

Do either of thoseand you have an awsome map.

EDIT: just noted that the bottom mid base is far more attackable from low ground than the top mid base. Not cool man.
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
September 04 2011 11:00 GMT
#19
On September 04 2011 16:11 Sea_Food wrote:
FE so easy for terran and protoss, but 3rd so hard for zerg. To fix the map you must either:
1. Remove the rocks blocking the 6 and 12 bases.
2. raise the 7 and 1 bases from low ground to normal grouund. I would prefer this because it would allow this map to be more unique.

Do either of thoseand you have an awsome map.

EDIT: just noted that the bottom mid base is far more attackable from low ground than the top mid base. Not cool man.

FE is also "so easy" for zerg so i dont see your point there. the third is not that difficult to hold, youd have to play it, the ramps are facing the defender and attacking into it is cumbersome, i also added some LoS blockers by the naked outside part by the mineral lines, (which is not in the overview.)
your point about the 7/1 base is interesting and i might do something of the sort, but yeah i really dont give a shit about some tiny imbalance over a semi base.
Sea_Food
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Finland1612 Posts
September 04 2011 11:55 GMT
#20
On September 04 2011 20:00 WniO wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 04 2011 16:11 Sea_Food wrote:
FE so easy for terran and protoss, but 3rd so hard for zerg. To fix the map you must either:
1. Remove the rocks blocking the 6 and 12 bases.
2. raise the 7 and 1 bases from low ground to normal grouund. I would prefer this because it would allow this map to be more unique.

Do either of thoseand you have an awsome map.

EDIT: just noted that the bottom mid base is far more attackable from low ground than the top mid base. Not cool man.

FE is also "so easy" for zerg so i dont see your point there. the third is not that difficult to hold, youd have to play it, the ramps are facing the defender and attacking into it is cumbersome, i also added some LoS blockers by the naked outside part by the mineral lines, (which is not in the overview.)
your point about the 7/1 base is interesting and i might do something of the sort, but yeah i really dont give a shit about some tiny imbalance over a semi base.

I have no idea what base you ment with third. I see 3 viable 3rds in this map, one of them only has 1 ramp and with the other 2 both of the ramps most defenitly do not face the defender. Also easy natural but hard 3rd is a very zerg unfavored feature ( see jungle basin).
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