Close But No Cigar Bogus Excellent non-TvT play, terrible TvT. Has had the misfortune to go against so many ridiculous opponents. Amazing games, but oftentimes can't win when needed.
Jaedong This has been the first time since July of 2007 that Jaedong hasn't been on the Power Rank. And, all favoritism aside, I really wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. Unfortunately, one jaw-dropping game does not an appearance on the Power Rank make.
Last He's shown somewhat that he can play TvP, but his last two TvT games have been bad. It seems that Last is only good when controlling the tempo, and doesn't respond well to pressure. And his TvZ is terrible.
Light Light's plight is kind of like Bogus': lots of tough opponents, one bad matchup, one phenomenal matchup, and because of these factors he's slightly negative.
Shoutouts hOn_sin Quoting mustaju: "He made Bisu cry. Always a good thing to do."
Jaedong will easily get back on if he continues his form as when he was doing donuts around Modesty (my friend that doesn't even know much about pro BW was in amazement at the colony block)
Last and Bogus have a chance of getting up there if they can start getting favourable matchups. Same with Leta, he's CJ's best player at the moment so it's a travesty that he's not being fielded.
i admit jaedong was off form this month but taking him off the pr? seems excessive no? i mean if u put him vs most players on the list i'd say he is favorite
The Flash vs Stork game is the most high level play i have seen in quite a while. Stork played tight as hell, still Flash won. If this game proves anyting it's that Flash truly can't be beaten.
While I'm pained to see JD off the rank, I have to agree...he just wasn't up to par in January. The loss to Flash was baaad. I mean, sure it's Flash, but JD had beaten him four times in a row, and this time it wasn't even close. And of course losing to (shudder) Canata...Thankfully he's 3 for 3 this month, so let's wish him a speedy return to the PR.
Yes, Brave is a Bloody Ridge/Chain Reaction specialist, but he really has two great matchups. His PvT appears to be ridiculously bad, but that's kind of hard to test when you manage to avoid the matchup THIRTY-TWO FRICKING TIMES IN A ROW, including all of 2011. How in the world...?
On February 18 2012 11:26 Elroi wrote: It feels like such a joke that Jaedong is of the ranking after his two last games.
i ts always like that whenever they rank him low he's like a new man thats why i dont care what they rank him should be better once the individuals will start more sample of games and much less time for practicing he peaks in those times
On February 27 2012 05:41 Hinanawi wrote: Flash's music really is suitably epic for him, I get chills whenever I see Flash in the booth with it playing.
P.S. Bring back the PR to the right sidebar, what's the point of even having those joke foreigner Elo ratings there anyway?
I haven't watched many games in ages but having just seen the thread on this I want to post in support of the power rank. May it give us a place to argue endlessly forever!
Also, lol Turn at 7? Much must have changed this season
was the most important match of the night imo. A tide turner and the win that SKT needed to bring the finals home. It was most certainly more important and more impressive than Bisu's last game, considering the map and the fact that Fantasy might just have hit Flash's confidence. Although I'm not too sure about the last part. Surprisingly, neither he nor the rest of the team played like they lost all their confidence after the second set.
1. Fantasy - I'm going with it 2. Flash - a lot of losses recently (esp. to Protoss) but he is still scary as hell. 3. Stork - Consistently solid. Outside of Flash and Fantasy he is the best player. I think that's pretty difficult to dispute. 4. Soulkey - 4/5/6 is pretty interchangeable. I'm going SK. Despite dropping some big games in the final round of PL they were all against rough competition 5. Leta - should have, could have, would have. Was my #4 pick until he dropped in the OSL prelims. Still, his PL kill list looks very impressive with wins over the likes of Fantasy, Soulkey and Jaedong 6. Jaedong - When he's hot he's on fire. When he's not he's reeeeally not. We've seen glimpses of the old Jaedong, but we need more of it before he can break from the 4/5/6 cluster. I am not convinced that he's the best Zerg in the world right now. 7. Hoejja - This is the man who has carried KT through the playoffs. Even last night his win over Best was a big result. 8. Action - The only reason I have Hoejja above Action is that Hoejja's playoff contribution was larger. Action is probably the more solid player and is qualified for OSL, unlike his teammate. 9. Horang2 - This was a big month round for Horang2, between qualifying for OSL and achieving notable wins over the likes of Stats and Flash in PL. 10. Bisu - I'm a bit surprised I find myself putting him back on here. He hardly played in R3 and he lost in the OSL prelims, but last night (along with Fantasy) he carried SKT to victory.
CBNC: Zero - qualified for OSL, turned up his performance in R3, just too little too late Stats - big results in the PL playoffs have launched him into the KeSPA top 5 and almost earned him a rank here, but failure to qualify for OSL + a few key losses here keep him off. Crazy-Hydra - I have my eyes on you.
I'll ask before all the fanboys come in: Why did Bisu fall to 10? Just because of the OSL preliminaries and the way he was beaten?
Hoejja on 7 is very reasonable. Outstanding performance in playoffs, good player apart from that. Makes him the best outside of the (pretty) set ranks 1-6.
On April 09 2012 02:44 Mortality wrote: Let's see...
1. Fantasy - I'm going with it 2. Flash - a lot of losses recently (esp. to Protoss) but he is still scary as hell. 3. Stork - Consistently solid. Outside of Flash and Fantasy he is the best player. I think that's pretty difficult to dispute. 4. Soulkey - 4/5/6 is pretty interchangeable. I'm going SK. Despite dropping some big games in the final round of PL they were all against rough competition 5. Leta - should have, could have, would have. Was my #4 pick until he dropped in the OSL prelims. Still, his PL kill list looks very impressive with wins over the likes of Fantasy, Soulkey and Jaedong 6. Jaedong - When he's hot he's on fire. When he's not he's reeeeally not. We've seen glimpses of the old Jaedong, but we need more of it before he can break from the 4/5/6 cluster. I am not convinced that he's the best Zerg in the world right now. 7. Hoejja - This is the man who has carried KT through the playoffs. Even last night his win over Best was a big result. 8. Action - The only reason I have Hoejja above Action is that Hoejja's playoff contribution was larger. Action is probably the more solid player and is qualified for OSL, unlike his teammate. 9. Horang2 - This was a big month round for Horang2, between qualifying for OSL and achieving notable wins over the likes of Stats and Flash in PL. 10. Bisu - I'm a bit surprised I find myself putting him back on here. He hardly played in R3 and he lost in the OSL prelims, but last night (along with Fantasy) he carried SKT to victory.
CBNC: Zero - qualified for OSL, turned up his performance in R3, just too little too late Stats - big results in the PL playoffs have launched him into the KeSPA top 5 and almost earned him a rank here, but failure to qualify for OSL + a few key losses here keep him off. Crazy-Hydra - I have my eyes on you.
That ranking is pretty good. Fantasy trully deserves that 1st spot imo. I said before that he was slightly behind Flash and since that Flash dropped some games and Fantasy won against him in epic game proving once again that he is immortal in PL finals and he play even better when he have time to prepare and feel presure. Hoejja proved himself again in the final showing that he deserves the spot. I think all 3 KT zergs are equal and its hard to judge who from them should get the spot. But I also think there should be place for Horang2 and Bisu so Im ok with CBNC for crazyhydra. Horang2 was not only one of Godslayers but also won against Stats and qualified to OSL. He looked so strong even in his lost game against Flash. His control was amasing and I thought he could defend against all odds. Bisu deserves spot too. He won two games when it actually mater, and coach Park believed that he could win against either Flash or Stats in ace match. Last year he didnt recieve that much trust and Best was sent. I think its kinda good measure of power even though past results didnt show it.
On April 09 2012 02:54 Spekulatius wrote: I'll ask before all the fanboys come in: Why did Bisu fall to 10? Just because of the OSL preliminaries and the way he was beaten?
Hoejja on 7 is very reasonable. Outstanding performance in playoffs, good player apart from that. Makes him the best outside of the (pretty) set ranks 1-6.
A large part of why Bisu got 6th on the last ranking is that there wasn't as much competition for the 6th place spot. Some of the guys who looked strong out of the starting blocks this season (e.g. Baby, Best, Last) started sucking, Jaedong played some of the worst Starcraft we've seen out of him in years during R2, and some of the guys beneath him who one might expect to deliver results (e.g. Hydra, Zero, Jangbi) decided to suck this season.
Seriously, Turn and Brave weren't even regular features on Khan's line-up, instead being cycled in and out of the line-up by January. Brave was given a more regular spot towards the end of the season, but his results declined along with. And Jaehoon? I think that's enough of an argument for the lack of strength on the PR all by itself.
Flamewheel even said in his ranking that he wasn't happy with ranks 6-10, but that he had to fill them anyway. Since of the contedenders Bisu had a relatively strong record (even though he was playing mediocre competition), that meant he was rank 6.
This time there are more games, meaning more opportunities to succeed or fail. Not only that, but there are games that count for more. Some players like Hoejja and Action walked away as heroes. They deserve the ranks I'm giving them. Leta and Jaedong were also big performers who earned high ranks. Leta was facing stiff competition and walked through it with ease. Jaedong started showing us glimpses of the Tyrant.
And finally, normally I'm one to value offline prelims less than everything else. When Jangbi started returning to form a year ago I was arguing not to be too hasty to put him at the top of the ranking just because he qualified for OSL through the wildcard. I still feel that counting prelim wins as a part of record is cheating because it's much easier to go 6-0 in prelims than in PL or SL, but now that we are down to one league, making it through prelims counts for a hell of a lot more. Bisu's failure to qualify for the prelims after a mediocre R2 and a mediocre R3 was enough to have me question whether he deserved a PR spot.
So the question wasn't whether I was being unfair in lowering his rank, but whether he even deserved a rank.
But I said this before: two big wins against KT in the finals would change my mind. And it did.
I believe that MustacheZerg, PirateZerg and OzSucksBallsWithoutMe have channeled their powers into Hoejja, Action and CH... goddamn did those KT zergs ever play well in the playoffs. Those finals were out of this world.
On April 09 2012 18:47 Hyde wrote: No matter what, Fantasy must be number one.
Agreed. Bisu can be 3 or 4...
Fanta Flash Hoejja Bisu Crazy-Hydra
My fanboi self would like nothing more than to see Bisu at #3 (other than Bisu being at #1/2, obviously).
But yea, before the finals Bisu would have absolutely no argument against those guys that are currently placed higher than him (by Mortality). Depending on how much you value Grand Finals games however, that ll change. Bisu definitely should get a spot in there though, if only through merit of the awesome micro/harass heavy play that he displayed in the GF Ace match.
Slightly off topic, i maintained that Flash played beautifully, but was out-prepared in the Ace match, and really couldn't have done much better. All those people who called him out for poor decision-making (all that Cyber Core -> Zeal hoohah that was in the LR thread) quite simply made an erroneous judgement while watching the game. In any case, his play was so good that i almost want to keep him at number 1, seeing as such powerful play really doesn't warrant a drop in ranking. Though, it is true Flash was 5-5 in his last 10 games. That, and his only competitor actually beat him head-to-head in a straight-up game.
Flash is dangerous as all fucking hell, and I firmly believe that these losses are just bumps in the road. If Fantasy hadn't beaten Flash in head-to-head there would be no talking about ranking Fantasy #1. The difference between this situation and the situation in June of 2010 (where Flash was something like 7-6 during the ranking period and #2 player Jaedong was something like 8-1 -- note that ranking period extended into part of July) is that back then Flash had just come off a 3-0 victory over Jaedong in the MSL finals at the end of May. Even then there was a massive outrage (especially from Jaedong fans) over Flash being ranked #1.
Here it's a different story. Neither Flash nor Fantasy have played a SL match in over 8 months due to the gap between seasons, and although Flash is the best choice for an overall MVP of this PL season, Fantasy is a close second and won a critical head to head match at the highest stage we see right now.
I suspect there would be far less outrage if Flash retained the #1, but that really is a reflection of the fact that Fantasy's fan-base is a miniscule fraction the size of Jaedong's.
Mechanically Flash may be superior to Fantasy, and Fantasy is known for trollololing us worse than pretty much anyone else, so I'm not adverse to saying that Flash is the best in the world, which he probably is, but I think Fantasy may actually be the harder player to prepare to face right now. The danger of Flash is that his game plan seems impenetrable with his phenomenal macro built off calculated risk taking, his ability to pressure his opponent with a push at any point during the midgame, and his masterful cheese play that he uses to stay unpredictable. But although fans like to compare Flash to Oov, in many ways he's really more like a modernized version of NaDa. Fantasy is clearly the player from the Boxer/Oov evolutionary tree.
I'm kind of rambling, but hopefully that kind of makes sense..
On April 10 2012 09:49 Mortality wrote:I suspect there would be far less outrage if Flash retained the #1, but that really is a reflection of the fact that Fantasy's fan-base is a miniscule fraction the size of Jaedong's.
Oh come on.
I actually agree completely with your ranking though, maybe putting Leta higher.
On April 10 2012 09:49 Mortality wrote:I suspect there would be far less outrage if Flash retained the #1, but that really is a reflection of the fact that Fantasy's fan-base is a miniscule fraction the size of Jaedong's.
Oh come on.
I actually agree completely with your ranking though, maybe putting Leta higher.
What? I think so. Jaedong was every Zerg's idol. Moreover he had been #1 in the world prior to Flash's domination. For the most part still is, although recently some of that has shifted towards Zero, Effort, Soulkey, etc. Everybody loves you when you're on top. It's when you're not you see who the real fans are.
Fantasy has always lived in the shadow of Flash and the shadow of Bisu, even though his overall performance has been better than Bisu's for the past 2-3 years and his Starleague results were actually better than Flash's in 2011 (although his overall performance was not). If you look at discussions from this past season, there was a surprising amount of "meh" at Fantasy's performance, with numerous people citing that his opponent list was easy. Admittedly some players he faced like Zero don't seem to be as good this season, but 2x one-sided curb-stomping vs one of the hottest performers in 2011 should get more than a meh.
Fantasy's never really been given his rightful due as a top guy. Even if you consider Flash as the #1 and Fantasy as the #2, the distance between Fantasy and #3 is staggering.
On April 10 2012 09:49 Mortality wrote:I suspect there would be far less outrage if Flash retained the #1, but that really is a reflection of the fact that Fantasy's fan-base is a miniscule fraction the size of Jaedong's.
Oh come on.
I actually agree completely with your ranking though, maybe putting Leta higher.
What? I think so. Jaedong was every Zerg's idol. Moreover he had been #1 in the world prior to Flash's domination. For the most part still is, although recently some of that has shifted towards Zero, Effort, Soulkey, etc. Everybody loves you when you're on top. It's when you're not you see who the real fans are.
Fantasy has always lived in the shadow of Flash and the shadow of Bisu, even though his overall performance has been better than Bisu's for the past 2-3 years and his Starleague results were actually better than Flash's in 2011 (although his overall performance was not). If you look at discussions from this past season, there was a surprising amount of "meh" at Fantasy's performance, with numerous people citing that his opponent list was easy. Admittedly some players he faced like Zero don't seem to be as good this season, but 2x one-sided curb-stomping vs one of the hottest performers in 2011 should get more than a meh.
Fantasy's never really been given his rightful due as a top guy. Even if you consider Flash as the #1 and Fantasy as the #2, the distance between Fantasy and #3 is staggering.
On April 09 2012 18:47 Hyde wrote: No matter what, Fantasy must be number one.
Agreed. Bisu can be 3 or 4...
Fanta Flash Hoejja Bisu Crazy-Hydra
Bisu in top 3 ? Are you that blinded by fanboism or you forgot what happened just a few days ago. By your logic we could have Horang2 and M18M in top 5 more because they beat Flash on a more balanced maps.
I dont think Flash deserves 2nd spot with his current form and games in the last month or so. Going 5-4 in the last 40 days and 0-2 in final in unacceptable for Flash and this is not Kepsa rankings so that we could give points because he dominated everyone in the past 4 months before.
There are way too few games in the last month so my rankings could be subjective/biased but theese would be my rankings :
1. Fantasy ( no contest he outplayed Flash in finals ) 2. Hoejja ( fuckin beast in playoffs ) 3. Stork ( still overall the best protoss ) 4. Flash (sorry too much fail for a god ) 5. Action ( on a similar lvl to Hoejja ) 6. Bisu ( couldnt do better in finals but OSL fail ) 7. Horang2 ( did ok considering he went 1-1 vs Flash and 1-0 vs Stats ) 8. Stats ( not that good in Playoffs and OSL fail ) 9. Crazy-Hydra ( KT zergs.... ) 10. JD ( i dont think he deserves a spot in this month but he got robbed in the last month )
On April 09 2012 18:47 Hyde wrote: No matter what, Fantasy must be number one.
Agreed. Bisu can be 3 or 4...
Fanta Flash Hoejja Bisu Crazy-Hydra
Bisu in top 3 ? Are you that blinded by fanboism or you forgot what happened just a few days ago. By your logic we could have Horang2 and M18M in top 5 more because they beat Flash on a more balanced maps.
I dont think Flash deserves 2nd spot with his current form and games in the last month or so. Going 5-4 in the last 40 days and 0-2 in final in unacceptable for Flash and this is not Kepsa rankings so that we could give points because he dominated everyone in the past 4 months before.
There are way too few games in the last month so my rankings could be subjective/biased but theese would be my rankings :
1. Fantasy ( no contest he outplayed Flash in finals ) 2. Hoejja ( fuckin beast in playoffs ) 3. Stork ( still overall the best protoss ) 4. Flash (sorry too much fail for a god ) 5. Action ( on a similar lvl to Hoejja ) 6. Bisu ( couldnt do better in finals but OSL fail ) 7. Horang2 ( did ok considering he went 1-1 vs Flash and 1-0 vs Stats ) 8. Stats ( not that good in Playoffs and OSL fail ) 9. Crazy-Hydra ( KT zergs.... ) 10. JD ( i dont think he deserves a spot in this month but he got robbed in the last month )
I like your rank but you seem to forgot that Hoejja failed in OSL aswell.
On April 09 2012 18:47 Hyde wrote: No matter what, Fantasy must be number one.
Agreed. Bisu can be 3 or 4...
Fanta Flash Hoejja Bisu Crazy-Hydra
Bisu in top 3 ? Are you that blinded by fanboism or you forgot what happened just a few days ago. By your logic we could have Horang2 and M18M in top 5 more because they beat Flash on a more balanced maps.
I dont think Flash deserves 2nd spot with his current form and games in the last month or so. Going 5-4 in the last 40 days and 0-2 in final in unacceptable for Flash and this is not Kepsa rankings so that we could give points because he dominated everyone in the past 4 months before.
There are way too few games in the last month so my rankings could be subjective/biased but theese would be my rankings :
1. Fantasy ( no contest he outplayed Flash in finals ) 2. Hoejja ( fuckin beast in playoffs ) 3. Stork ( still overall the best protoss ) 4. Flash (sorry too much fail for a god ) 5. Action ( on a similar lvl to Hoejja ) 6. Bisu ( couldnt do better in finals but OSL fail ) 7. Horang2 ( did ok considering he went 1-1 vs Flash and 1-0 vs Stats ) 8. Stats ( not that good in Playoffs and OSL fail ) 9. Crazy-Hydra ( KT zergs.... ) 10. JD ( i dont think he deserves a spot in this month but he got robbed in the last month )
well, I would suggest a few changes to your list. First I think you might want to switch Action and Crazy Hydra, both played pretty well in the playoffs - KT Zerg style - but Action "only" went 6-4 since february while Crazy Hydra went 7-2 and from a purely subjective point of view Action look at lot more shaky during his games - especially in ZvZ.
I would drop Bisu even further, while I agree that he won important matches in the finals, his 4-3 record isn't really convincing (not even including his OSL Prelims fail) and the final game against Flash seemed more like a gigantic blunder by god who managed to lose even after scouting the proxy gate.
I don't really get, why you think JD should be off the rank this month, while saying he got "robbed" last month. In January JD played really poor, while he went 6-1 since February and showed some strong games, especially in ZvZ where he currently seems to be unable not to get the BO loss but still manages to win each time.
Not sure if Stats deserves a spot, there is a really strong field for this Power Rank and Stats has a pretty poor playoff record.
Don't forget that while the Playoffs/finals/OSL prelims are the most fresh in our mind, the next PR will also include all of R3. In which case I don't understand how you could possibly leave Leta off the ranking with good conscience. He could have done better in the playoffs, but his R3 record is nothing to scoff at (6-1) and he showed some really ingenious and dominating games against top players.
well, I would suggest a few changes to your list. First I think you might want to switch Action and Crazy Hydra, both played pretty well in the playoffs - KT Zerg style - but Action "only" went 6-4 since february while Crazy Hydra went 7-2 and from a purely subjective point of view Action look at lot more shaky during his games - especially in ZvZ.
I would drop Bisu even further, while I agree that he won important matches in the finals, his 4-3 record isn't really convincing (not even including his OSL Prelims fail) and the final game against Flash seemed more like a gigantic blunder by god who managed to lose even after scouting the proxy gate.
I don't really get, why you think JD should be off the rank this month, while saying he got "robbed" last month. In January JD played really poor, while he went 6-1 since February and showed some strong games, especially in ZvZ where he currently seems to be unable not to get the BO loss but still manages to win each time.
Not sure if Stats deserves a spot, there is a really strong field for this Power Rank and Stats has a pretty poor playoff record.
I probably made a mistake just counting march and april for my rankings and didnt count ferbruary into this
I think JD was robbed on the last PR because he aint on PR and Bisu on 6th place..... I think e that JD at the very least did the same or even better than Bisu in that period of time.
On April 11 2012 03:25 Kiett wrote: Don't forget that while the Playoffs/finals/OSL prelims are the most fresh in our mind, the next PR will also include all of R3. In which case I don't understand how you could possibly leave Leta off the ranking with good conscience. He could have done better in the playoffs, but his R3 record is nothing to scoff at (6-1) and he showed some really ingenious and dominating games against top players.
As I said i made a mistake counting only march and april so yea Leta deserves spot on PR. Probably gonna update my list with R3 into consideration
On April 09 2012 18:47 Hyde wrote: No matter what, Fantasy must be number one.
Agreed. Bisu can be 3 or 4...
Fanta Flash Hoejja Bisu Crazy-Hydra
Bisu in top 3 ? Are you that blinded by fanboism or you forgot what happened just a few days ago. By your logic we could have Horang2 and M18M in top 5 more because they beat Flash on a more balanced maps.
I dont think Flash deserves 2nd spot with his current form and games in the last month or so. Going 5-4 in the last 40 days and 0-2 in final in unacceptable for Flash and this is not Kepsa rankings so that we could give points because he dominated everyone in the past 4 months before.
There are way too few games in the last month so my rankings could be subjective/biased but theese would be my rankings :
1. Fantasy ( no contest he outplayed Flash in finals ) 2. Hoejja ( fuckin beast in playoffs ) 3. Stork ( still overall the best protoss ) 4. Flash (sorry too much fail for a god ) 5. Action ( on a similar lvl to Hoejja ) 6. Bisu ( couldnt do better in finals but OSL fail ) 7. Horang2 ( did ok considering he went 1-1 vs Flash and 1-0 vs Stats ) 8. Stats ( not that good in Playoffs and OSL fail ) 9. Crazy-Hydra ( KT zergs.... ) 10. JD ( i dont think he deserves a spot in this month but he got robbed in the last month )
well, I would suggest a few changes to your list. First I think you might want to switch Action and Crazy Hydra, both played pretty well in the playoffs - KT Zerg style - but Action "only" went 6-4 since february while Crazy Hydra went 7-2 and from a purely subjective point of view Action look at lot more shaky during his games - especially in ZvZ.
I would drop Bisu even further, while I agree that he won important matches in the finals, his 4-3 record isn't really convincing (not even including his OSL Prelims fail) and the final game against Flash seemed more like a gigantic blunder by god who managed to lose even after scouting the proxy gate.
I don't really get, why you think JD should be off the rank this month, while saying he got "robbed" last month. In January JD played really poor, while he went 6-1 since February and showed some strong games, especially in ZvZ where he currently seems to be unable not to get the BO loss but still manages to win each time.
Not sure if Stats deserves a spot, there is a really strong field for this Power Rank and Stats has a pretty poor playoff record.
Kindly enlighten me as to God's blunder.
I mean, if you could help elaborate on what he did wrong....
On April 09 2012 18:47 Hyde wrote: No matter what, Fantasy must be number one.
Agreed. Bisu can be 3 or 4...
Fanta Flash Hoejja Bisu Crazy-Hydra
Bisu in top 3 ? Are you that blinded by fanboism or you forgot what happened just a few days ago. By your logic we could have Horang2 and M18M in top 5 more because they beat Flash on a more balanced maps.
I dont think Flash deserves 2nd spot with his current form and games in the last month or so. Going 5-4 in the last 40 days and 0-2 in final in unacceptable for Flash and this is not Kepsa rankings so that we could give points because he dominated everyone in the past 4 months before.
There are way too few games in the last month so my rankings could be subjective/biased but theese would be my rankings :
1. Fantasy ( no contest he outplayed Flash in finals ) 2. Hoejja ( fuckin beast in playoffs ) 3. Stork ( still overall the best protoss ) 4. Flash (sorry too much fail for a god ) 5. Action ( on a similar lvl to Hoejja ) 6. Bisu ( couldnt do better in finals but OSL fail ) 7. Horang2 ( did ok considering he went 1-1 vs Flash and 1-0 vs Stats ) 8. Stats ( not that good in Playoffs and OSL fail ) 9. Crazy-Hydra ( KT zergs.... ) 10. JD ( i dont think he deserves a spot in this month but he got robbed in the last month )
well, I would suggest a few changes to your list. First I think you might want to switch Action and Crazy Hydra, both played pretty well in the playoffs - KT Zerg style - but Action "only" went 6-4 since february while Crazy Hydra went 7-2 and from a purely subjective point of view Action look at lot more shaky during his games - especially in ZvZ.
I would drop Bisu even further, while I agree that he won important matches in the finals, his 4-3 record isn't really convincing (not even including his OSL Prelims fail) and the final game against Flash seemed more like a gigantic blunder by god who managed to lose even after scouting the proxy gate.
I don't really get, why you think JD should be off the rank this month, while saying he got "robbed" last month. In January JD played really poor, while he went 6-1 since February and showed some strong games, especially in ZvZ where he currently seems to be unable not to get the BO loss but still manages to win each time.
Not sure if Stats deserves a spot, there is a really strong field for this Power Rank and Stats has a pretty poor playoff record.
Kindly enlighten me as to God's blunder.
I mean, if you could help elaborate on what he did wrong....
biggest one? probably blowing up a cyber core and not expecting zealots and therefore not having a single vulture out or having a wall up. Second one: not dealing with Bisu's probe in the early stages altough he could have, but he choose to run out with all 7 marines to try and destroy the proxy pylon.
The whole game seemed pretty scrappy to me, but hey I always played Zerg myself, I admit not having too much experience with this situation
On April 09 2012 18:47 Hyde wrote: No matter what, Fantasy must be number one.
Agreed. Bisu can be 3 or 4...
Fanta Flash Hoejja Bisu Crazy-Hydra
Bisu in top 3 ? Are you that blinded by fanboism or you forgot what happened just a few days ago. By your logic we could have Horang2 and M18M in top 5 more because they beat Flash on a more balanced maps.
I dont think Flash deserves 2nd spot with his current form and games in the last month or so. Going 5-4 in the last 40 days and 0-2 in final in unacceptable for Flash and this is not Kepsa rankings so that we could give points because he dominated everyone in the past 4 months before.
There are way too few games in the last month so my rankings could be subjective/biased but theese would be my rankings :
1. Fantasy ( no contest he outplayed Flash in finals ) 2. Hoejja ( fuckin beast in playoffs ) 3. Stork ( still overall the best protoss ) 4. Flash (sorry too much fail for a god ) 5. Action ( on a similar lvl to Hoejja ) 6. Bisu ( couldnt do better in finals but OSL fail ) 7. Horang2 ( did ok considering he went 1-1 vs Flash and 1-0 vs Stats ) 8. Stats ( not that good in Playoffs and OSL fail ) 9. Crazy-Hydra ( KT zergs.... ) 10. JD ( i dont think he deserves a spot in this month but he got robbed in the last month )
well, I would suggest a few changes to your list. First I think you might want to switch Action and Crazy Hydra, both played pretty well in the playoffs - KT Zerg style - but Action "only" went 6-4 since february while Crazy Hydra went 7-2 and from a purely subjective point of view Action look at lot more shaky during his games - especially in ZvZ.
I would drop Bisu even further, while I agree that he won important matches in the finals, his 4-3 record isn't really convincing (not even including his OSL Prelims fail) and the final game against Flash seemed more like a gigantic blunder by god who managed to lose even after scouting the proxy gate.
I don't really get, why you think JD should be off the rank this month, while saying he got "robbed" last month. In January JD played really poor, while he went 6-1 since February and showed some strong games, especially in ZvZ where he currently seems to be unable not to get the BO loss but still manages to win each time.
Not sure if Stats deserves a spot, there is a really strong field for this Power Rank and Stats has a pretty poor playoff record.
Kindly enlighten me as to God's blunder.
I mean, if you could help elaborate on what he did wrong....
biggest one? probably blowing up a cyber core and not expecting zealots and therefore not having a single vulture out or having a wall up. Second one: not dealing with Bisu's probe in the early stages altough he could have, but he choose to run out with all 7 marines to try and destroy the proxy pylon.
The whole game seemed pretty scrappy to me, but hey I always played Zerg myself, I admit not having too much experience with this situation
Hmm.. There are pretty detailed discussion in the Live Report thread about this topic. I guess you didn't come back there after the game.
Did it not occur to you that Bisu would have rebuild his Cybernetics Core the moment it got shelled, or even before that when he found out about the attack? Progamers always rebuild their tech, unless that tech is irrelevant to their gameplan. In fact, Bisu rebuilt his Core just a few blocks away from the old one. And it would have affected at most one of his production cycle (on whether he could build Goons), likely none at all. Not to mention, Flash had only 1 tank shelling the Core, Bisu had all the time in the world to rebuild 1, and Flash knows that as well.
Even before Bisu rebuild his Core, even before Flash's attack reached the backdoor, even before the first Citadel warped in, Bisu built another Citadel at his Nat. He really wanted his Legs Upgrade. That attack was clearly intended, and didn't happen because Flash accidentally sniped the Core.
Flash had only ONE production cycle back at his base when Bisu's attack hit (3 Facts unit vs 14 Zeals + 2 Goons). Vultures or otherwise, he wouldn't have held. Not to mention Flash did not have the breathing room to upgrade Vult Speed or Mine all game. Neither could he afford to build Vultures (3 Facts == choose carefully what you build).
When Flash saw the Speed Zeal counter, he did try to wall-in. 1 Barracks was put down at the Natural choke. Too bad he didn't have enough minerals to put down the second one. Not that it would have helped. Bisu had 8 Gates worth of production, and Reaver. Even if the wall would have helped him hold, it wouldn't have lasted long.
Flash didn't make any gigantic blunder. He played well, micro-ed beautifully, and made good informed decisions. The opening set him too far behind though, imho.
Edit: Regarding those early game pushes, Flash had no info whatsoever on Bisu's build. The last time Bisu did early Zeal pressure on him, Bisu expanded behind that pressure. Flash likely believe this to be the case, and aimed to destroy the proxy, hopefully completely stop Bisu's production, and setting himself up for a powerful Marine/SCV push. Of course, Bisu actually slammed down another 2 Gates at home, but Flash didn't know that (we did, but we had maphack). It was a sound decision, given the information he had.
On April 10 2012 09:49 Mortality wrote:I suspect there would be far less outrage if Flash retained the #1, but that really is a reflection of the fact that Fantasy's fan-base is a miniscule fraction the size of Jaedong's.
Oh come on.
I actually agree completely with your ranking though, maybe putting Leta higher.
What? I think so. Jaedong was every Zerg's idol. Moreover he had been #1 in the world prior to Flash's domination. For the most part still is, although recently some of that has shifted towards Zero, Effort, Soulkey, etc. Everybody loves you when you're on top. It's when you're not you see who the real fans are.
Fantasy has always lived in the shadow of Flash and the shadow of Bisu, even though his overall performance has been better than Bisu's for the past 2-3 years and his Starleague results were actually better than Flash's in 2011 (although his overall performance was not). If you look at discussions from this past season, there was a surprising amount of "meh" at Fantasy's performance, with numerous people citing that his opponent list was easy. Admittedly some players he faced like Zero don't seem to be as good this season, but 2x one-sided curb-stomping vs one of the hottest performers in 2011 should get more than a meh.
Fantasy's never really been given his rightful due as a top guy. Even if you consider Flash as the #1 and Fantasy as the #2, the distance between Fantasy and #3 is staggering.
Who is this "#3"?
That's exactly the point, isn't it? :p
But for my money I think Stork is the #3 for both the season and the ranking period. He's been very consistent and very solid against all 3 races this season.
On April 10 2012 09:49 Mortality wrote:I suspect there would be far less outrage if Flash retained the #1, but that really is a reflection of the fact that Fantasy's fan-base is a miniscule fraction the size of Jaedong's.
Oh come on.
I actually agree completely with your ranking though, maybe putting Leta higher.
What? I think so. Jaedong was every Zerg's idol. Moreover he had been #1 in the world prior to Flash's domination. For the most part still is, although recently some of that has shifted towards Zero, Effort, Soulkey, etc. Everybody loves you when you're on top. It's when you're not you see who the real fans are.
Fantasy has always lived in the shadow of Flash and the shadow of Bisu, even though his overall performance has been better than Bisu's for the past 2-3 years and his Starleague results were actually better than Flash's in 2011 (although his overall performance was not). If you look at discussions from this past season, there was a surprising amount of "meh" at Fantasy's performance, with numerous people citing that his opponent list was easy. Admittedly some players he faced like Zero don't seem to be as good this season, but 2x one-sided curb-stomping vs one of the hottest performers in 2011 should get more than a meh.
Fantasy's never really been given his rightful due as a top guy. Even if you consider Flash as the #1 and Fantasy as the #2, the distance between Fantasy and #3 is staggering.
Who is this "#3"?
#3 player overall I think has to be Stork, with Soulkey/Jaedong close behind and then another big gap to the guys who are good but can't make it out of prelims (Leta, Stats, Bisu, ...). That sentence looks really weird, so maybe I'm wrong.
The thing about Jaedong is that he's all over the map right now. Some of his performances have been just awful. Others have just blown me away (see second match vs Modesty this season). And still others have been a bit average. So I find it really hard to rate Jaedong for "the whole season."
Soulkey's highs might not have been quite as high as JD's, but his lows weren't nearly as low, so I'd pick him as my #4 for the season. I guess that makes JD #5 for the season as a whole, although I have him as #6 for this rank, behind Leta, who really stepped it up over the course of the season.
On April 11 2012 03:25 Kiett wrote: Don't forget that while the Playoffs/finals/OSL prelims are the most fresh in our mind, the next PR will also include all of R3. In which case I don't understand how you could possibly leave Leta off the ranking with good conscience. He could have done better in the playoffs, but his R3 record is nothing to scoff at (6-1) and he showed some really ingenious and dominating games against top players.
doesnt matter at all. stats will always be top 5 and above bisu lol.
On April 12 2012 08:28 Taekwon wrote: I can feel the new PR slowly approaching... like an ominous typhoon... o, nvm those are just the prospective fanboiz..
He said it would be out some time today. Originally it was delayed to the PL Finals because nobody knew when OSL would restart and that meant that there would be a month where the only games played were by teams that qualified for the playoffs. PL finals were last weekend. Flamewheel claimed he needed a few more days for whatever reason. Here we are on the alleged day of discovery.
altho he is the one who made the promise, he's doing a great service for us here with absolutely no accolade (other than his rapidash caricature - which leads me to blv he prolly rly sucks at pokemon) its a commitment that requires considerable time investment studying and analyzing games, perusing cases given by countless people, weighing his own opinion, taking a gander at current metagame and map trends, player's history, and probably a myriad of other factors. This for every single possible candidate for the top ten list
considering he's not being paid at all, being the iconic deliveryman of the most objective and important modus operandi of evaluating brood war players in one convenient location...cant really blame flamewheel
remember to always thank the hard working, diligent, and not playing dota2 flamewheel he's a hero, cut him some slack
(and if he is being paid for this, he totally sucks and should immediately be fired)
Uhm, I'm generally supportive of PR writers? Thought you knew that?
But I find this a bit ridiculous. The reason why the PR was delayed until after the PL finals was that we had no clue when OSL would restart so a whole bunch of players wouldn't even be playing if there was a ranking before and a ranking after. Then we got OSL information. A ranking could have been done at that time, but I respect that flamewheel decided to follow his original decision, even if that means that the Power Rank has been delayed by a month.
However, he really should have had a good idea of what the ranking would be already before the PL finals. That was a whole week after the prelims, and a whole month after the regular season ended. It's already been a week since the finals. What exactly is taking so long? I'm not expecting a day to day account of his personal life, but now when we're finally back on the right hand side bar we get stuck in limbo, with OSL roaring up on us before the last Power Rnak that will be covering TWO AND A HALF MONTHS of time is even posted. It's frustrating because it's like being in a car with a defective transmission and as soon as you get that fixed your engine block gets a crack in it.
EPT
Bogus
Jaedong![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/flamewheel/sadsheep.gif)
Thanks.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/YVoXf.png)
