• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:19
CEST 07:19
KST 14:19
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies18Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)5Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview5[ASL21] Ro4 Preview: On Course12
Community News
Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double0Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results2Weekly Cups (May 4-10): Clem, MaxPax, herO win1Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !18Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple0
StarCraft 2
General
herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO4 & Finals Preview Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists
Tourneys
Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 527 Hell Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 526 Rubber and Glue Mutation # 525 Wheel of Misfortune
Brood War
General
vespene.gg — BW replays in browser 25 Years Since Brood War Patch 1.08 (Spoiler) ASL21 Winner's Interview [ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies UA StarCraft: Mawin (T) vs hanniGan (P) Showmatch
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV ZeroSpace Megathread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Trading/Investing Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software)
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Esports Organizations: Raisi…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1314 users

[SC2B] Micro Matters - Page 6

Forum Index > News
106 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 4 5 6 All
XaI)CyRiC
Profile Joined October 2002
United States4471 Posts
March 08 2010 21:35 GMT
#101
On March 08 2010 20:59 Daigomi wrote:Anyway, if you want to continue this discussion, maybe just send a PM since I'm fairly sure we're the only two people in the world who still care about this.


Nope. I'm loving the thoughtful and mature debate going on between you two. I don't have any experience with Chess or Go, but I can understand the analogies with my understanding of SC/BW/SC2. Daigomi's metaphors are masterful

As to my own opinion, I'm going to have to agree with daigomi. I think the most important resource in SC/BW/SC2 is players' attention and focus. APM can be artificially inflated by performing meaningless or inefficient actions, and really is pretty useless by itself. What is really important in SC/BW/SC2, or any good RTS in my opinion, is the number of meaningful/efficient (and correct) actions a player can perform per minute, and that is more than a matter of mechanics or manipulation of a UI, it's a matter of strategic decision-making and tactical execution.

Oversimplifying or overautomating the tasks in a RTS would remove depth from it. The more meaningful (i.e. contribute to winning) actions or decisions that can be made, the more room there is for players to distinguish themselves from each other with their understanding of the game, their ability to react quickly and decisively to what their opponent is doing, and their ability to execute their strategies/tactics. The fact that many of the decisions have a mechanical element requiring the manipulation of a mouse and keyboard doesn't automatically make them non-strategic or not meaningful.

One way to look at it would be to imagine if we had the technology to allow players to connect their brains to their computers that would allow players to play SC/BW/SC2 with their minds instead of their arms/hands (I know the technology is out there, but it's far from the point it needs to be for the purposes of this discussion). Instead of microing with mouse and keyboard, they'd accomplish it by thinking of the action they want performed. Would there really be much of a difference between how the games are played now? The game would still come down to how many meaningful and correct decisions a player could make within the context of a strategy and how quickly and effectively they could execute them, albeit with their minds as opposed to their hands.
Moderator
awol
Profile Joined March 2008
Australia79 Posts
March 09 2010 12:26 GMT
#102
Just wanted to say, awesome that you guys are using ogg vorbis! freedom! Good cast to btw =)
I ain't no superstar.
Loophole
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States867 Posts
March 09 2010 23:46 GMT
#103
Apparently tristens cat is not the only one with autism. You guys are aware that some people listen to podcasts on... iPods... Right? Thanks for ruining my ride home on the metro. I have no way to play this on my iPhone. =[
"Fundamental preparation is always effective. Work on those parts of your game that are fundamentally weak." -Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Daigomi
Profile Blog Joined May 2006
South Africa4316 Posts
March 09 2010 23:49 GMT
#104
On March 08 2010 03:52 Daigomi wrote:
<font size=4>Low quality mp3 podcast for those interested</font>

That should help you!
Moderator
us.insurgency
Profile Joined March 2010
United States330 Posts
March 10 2010 01:58 GMT
#105
If you take out the tactical aspect of SC then you just have two strategies going against each other. You need micro to get yourself out of sticky situations. I want to play a game where I can out think and out control my opponent not just get lucky with a strat i looked up on liquipedia. If you only want your "elaborate pre-planned action" to be the deciding factor then you should play rock paper scissors. You need micro so you can go with a FE and just make enough zerglings to hold off their attack. If you can make less units now and have better control to get an advantage in the mid to late game then more power to you.
ProoM
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Lithuania1741 Posts
March 10 2010 14:05 GMT
#106
awsome, thanks.
IMBA - International Mountain Bicycling Association.
Loophole
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States867 Posts
March 13 2010 15:50 GMT
#107
On March 10 2010 08:49 Daigomi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2010 03:52 Daigomi wrote:
<font size=4>Low quality mp3 podcast for those interested</font>

That should help you!


Thanks very much. I already listened to it at home by the time I saw this but it was cool of you to take the time to convert it. Maybe OP could add this to their post next time so people see it.

So is there no podcast this week? Need my dose of Shawn Plott!
"Fundamental preparation is always effective. Work on those parts of your game that are fundamentally weak." -Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Prev 1 4 5 6 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
00:00
OSC Elite Rising Star #19
Liquipedia
Patches Events
19:30
Patches' Patch Clash #7
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
NeuroSwarm 705
StarCraft: Brood War
HiyA 95
Moletrap 19
Icarus 12
Dota 2
LuMiX1
League of Legends
JimRising 778
Counter-Strike
C9.Mang0270
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox471
Other Games
WinterStarcraft525
Maynarde135
RuFF_SC292
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick813
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta76
• practicex 29
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Diggity8
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
Universe Titan Cup
5h 41m
Rogue vs Percival
Wardi Open
6h 41m
Monday Night Weeklies
10h 41m
Replay Cast
18h 41m
Kung Fu Cup
1d 5h
GSL
2 days
herO vs Classic
Cure vs Clem
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
GSL
3 days
Maru vs SHIN
Zoun vs Rogue
WardiTV Spring Champion…
3 days
SKillous vs Strange
Lambo vs Strange
Ryung vs Strange
Lambo vs Ryung
Ryung vs SKillous
Lambo vs SKillous
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
Maestros of the Game
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
TBD vs SHIN
TBD vs Rogue
IPSL
5 days
ZZZero vs WorsT
Julia vs eOnzErG
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
IPSL
6 days
Dragon vs Artosis
dxtr13 vs Hawk
BSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 21
2026 GSL S1
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

2026 KK StarCraft Pro League
BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
YSL S3
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: King of Kings
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
Bounty Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.