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On May 30 2019 15:22 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2019 15:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:
And what did i do that was bad? You have a very different set of values as to what is important as well as what is offensive and what isn't compared to most players on the site. You know that, Joni. It often creates friction where there really is no need. The community is small enough as is and I'd prefer we all try and get along, lest it becomes impossible to have more games. Well then please, you, tell me where i was over the line offensive in this game because i cant see it?
I don't think you've crossed the line this game at least for me. They way you play can definitely ruffle some feathers in that you get tunneled on one thing you think makes someone 100% mafia and you go further on it than almost anyone, but I don't think you stepped out of line at all that I recall. I'm mostly talking about the postgame chat here where there's no need to 'but what about...' at the end when WBG basically had a Rayntunnel on VE all game 
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On May 30 2019 15:20 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2019 15:16 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:12 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 30 2019 15:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Idk where that came from? bugs made the game completely unplayable for VE. Why are you so obsessed with me? If you want to get another rise out of me for whatever it’s probably never going to happen. I just don’t see the point in even playing here if this is what the community is now, like we’re just going to casually all accept that the behaviour you displayed this game toward multiple players, regardless of their actual in-game alignments, is remotely good for the future of TL mafia. This is a big reason why I took a long break. You were even in one of my last two games. They were wins, I was happy with my play, but sad at the direction of the forum. And I will admit I was pretty much just full of rage and burnout. Now i’m Just happier staying away knowing I don’t have to try to cooperate with people like you just to try to enjoy a game I used to really love. Just come play voice with us this weekend! Voice is much more fun than Forum games and people don't get this tryhard. It's fantastic really. I’d love to play but I’m in an awkward time zone compared to everyone now and I am usually asleep or busy when others are active I think. Thank you for the invite though Come join my game if I can post it sometime in the next week. It’ll be a good break for me since I enjoy hosting quite a lot and I promise the setup will be interesting! It’s a new type of setup I’m trying, since I used to be obsessed with mini normals and now I wanna try putting some spice into the roles
I'm not playing a forum game for a while, and if I do it'll have to be a post restricted game. I seriously could not keep up with this game and would not have kept up with it even if I was Town. I think I would've been suspected as either alignment past D1 when the game blew up simply cause I wasn't in the flow of things. When that happens I fall off regardless.
I did do a bunch of things that made me scum for sure though. Would have never afked on D3 as town if I'm lined up to die. My tone was also all kinds of wrong, and I don't think I would've forgotten disfo in any list post as town :D I did it intentionally as 'scum would never forget their teammates on a list post' in the hopes of that being used later if I flipped.
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My biggest issue this game was actually getting people to agree with my reads.
For whatever reason early on everyone just discounted literally everything I said and has me as just as suspicious as my preferred lynch targets that basically you wouldn't ever die -_-
Oh well. Still glad I'm not fully pants on head retardbad
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The Grackaroni Post Game Awards Show![[image loading]](https://media.giphy.com/media/zfuOq2rFBE7Kg/giphy.gif)
Best reads goes to:
+ Show Spoiler +Mr BloodyC0bbler! + Show Spoiler +On May 25 2019 20:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
1. To BC: do you agree with the case on iGrok?
I see some merit in it, but I also feel like its somewhat fabricated. Everything of Igrok I see comes off as townish for the most part. My biggest issue is that Koshi is hard town reading him.
2. To both of you: can you again provide a list of all your reads?
Town
BC
Bugs
VE(i know right)
Null to lean town
HF
Rayn
Igrok
Jock
Null to Lean Mafia
Koshi
Conversion
Mafia
Artanis
Calix
Disinformation
Post with the most potential for solving the game goes to:
+ Show Spoiler +Ms. Calix! + Show Spoiler +On May 27 2019 17:07 Calix wrote:As for D2, I still think his Artanis switch from this: Show nested quote +On May 24 2019 03:20 Conversion wrote:artanis is giving me great conflict. generally his entire filter looked good to me. the only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive, except to Artanis himself. so I don't quite get this "BC was super duper aggressive, but then chilled out" as a switch reason. + Show Spoiler +On May 23 2019 20:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:First, why I'm not as sold on BC anymore. He's significantly dialed down his aggression in general when there's no real reason to and is giving opinions on a lot of things. It's this sequence of posts: Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:20 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I r back now and fuck, sorry guys. The way Ruxxar was playing I thought the read was right =\ Even if my voted wasn't on him, my read still played a huge part in his death.
As for the newest events of the last 20 pages or so.
No Bugs, after al that has been said and done, I wont be agreeing to kill VE. I voted for him (briefly) for the same reasons I started to lose my read of HF in the last game. Having time to sit back, think, and reflect I just can't kill him atm.
Looking at the thread trying to be impartial again to avoid the tunnel mentality and the adversity from contrary reads VE looks good. and his reasonings for the slight changes between games makes sense. Can't kill him as of yet.
Looking at the thread now, especially during the night phase. I would say this.
Rayn, HF, VE, Koshi (i hate saying this), all look decent and should be where any protective roles we have be sitting.
As much I know that I am on that list because I know that I am 100% town, given that basically no one else thinks so, leave me to potential bullets. Bugs, and I personally would say Jock, basically lives in the same zone that I am.
That leaves everyone else.
There is enough consensus now on Artanis that although the way I got my initial read on him was completely stupid, he has continued to post in a way that I still think is mafia. Plus the people who seem to be playing better than me agree on it so I feel a bit more sure.
the other 2 I feel are scattered between Callix, Igrok, Conversion and Disinformation. Im trying to avoid tunneling like I have been, because I can see that I have been now.
I need to reread Calix and Igrok as through tunneling artanis, ruxxar and disinformation I more or less left them by the wayside.
Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:28 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Bugs. I will fully agree that my first major read on Artanis was after he tunnel dove me and said shit I know is wrong. Your reason for why i was super pissed is right though. I gave him a pass, got shat on by him for giving him that pass, had my filter misinterpreted and shit made up. So I will fully admit I got pissed and tunneled on him.
Now. Do I still think hes mafia? yes, but hes currently the only read I had that I am committed to.
That is also concentrating mainly on the last 24ish hours as well. The content is partially important, but more so is the tone. As mafia there'd be no reason to do anything but keep the focus on me with thread sentiment on his side. He also seems to be working with people to actively try and get a read on them. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 20:31 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I have already stated when I scum read you and when I upgraded my read. Those are clearly already in thread. So go filter dive me if you want to read them. Even you have to put through the extra work if we are going to solve the game. The tone is just so different from earlier and there was no pressure on him to change, really. All the people accusing him were considered null at best. As for why WBG: Same tone thing, but very differently. When HF accused me of something that was wrong, this was how he replied: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 04:20 Holyflare wrote:On May 22 2019 04:16 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
And HF, explain your read progression on me. You disliked me, read my filter, gave a begrudging townread and now you're scumreading me for something that is wholly false. Eh, yeah, you're pretty correct actually I don't know. I think it's because you're just not around that you kind of fall by the wayside and I'm like "oh, I haven't scum read that guy in a while and nobody else fits, let's call him mafia." Extremely transparent, acknowledges his reasons for reading me were inaccurate and.. that's it. He doesn't arrive at a conclusion immedately because it's not necessary. Contrast that with Bugs regarding me accusing BC: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 23:48 wherebugsgo wrote:
why did people say BC OMGUSed artanis when BC scumread artanis first
or at least I feel like I remember that sentiment was thrown around
ok w/e. Too much thinking.
Makes an incorrect statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE.
I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him.
I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me insteadLastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. Expands on statement, showcases its importance regarding reading me and disfo. Did not check the validity of said statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 07:20 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE. I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him. I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me instead Lastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. I didn't know May 21 2019 21:08 was before May 20 2019 22:22 in your calendar, WBG. Did you scumread BC before you voted him? Because if you did then I honestly just didn’t remember that, all I remember is that I ignored you for a while since your vote was on me and you were mostly AFK so why would I bother reading you. If you did indeed scumread him before then my apologies, I’m wrong and BC OMGUSed you. Not sure that makes him scum or that his assessment of the situation from his perspective is scummy given that I agreed with it. "Oh I was wrong, but it doesn't change my BC read!" The focus is much more defensive and closed. Then the most recent post made above feels to me like he's trying to stay 'above' the discussion. Get people to guess at his little game to get free townreads.. it doesn't feel like he's critically trying to think of the game, but just filling up space whilst sitting on the sidelines. ##Vote wherebugsgo the second thing is his bugs read, but that's mostly because I townread bugs and I don't think his argument was a good one. mmmmmmmh he's definitely looks less towny than BC to me right now "definitely looks less towny than BC...generally his entire filter looked good...only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive" to having Artanis as "probably scum" and: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 00:18 Conversion wrote:
man how are there 23+ pages since I last left!
and why are people off scum again! did Artanis prove himself town somehow? Where did this confidence in mafia!Artanis come from? This post would suggest he wasn't aware of anything Artanis had posted in the meantime. Then Conversion talks a bunch about iGrok and how bad he looks. But still wants Artanis dead more. Not entirely clear whether he thinks both could be mafia or whatnot. This post stood out to me as scummy because of how inconclusive it is: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 01:07 Conversion wrote:
is that mafia!iGrok flailing since he knows Artanis is his scumbuddy, and trying to force a lynch onto someone else? but why would mafia!Grok try to lynch someone he deems is unlynchable by his own words, and is attempting to distance himself from his scumbuddy Artanis? He proposes some explanations for why mafia!iGrok is doing what he is doing. Seems to think both Artanis/ iGrok are mafia. But his second question poses an idea that seems to dent the mafia iGrok/ Artanis idea. Yet Conversion never really goes anywhere with this. @Conversion, would you mind giving me the lowdown of your thought process at EOD1 and why you became more certain that Artanis is mafia, please?
(I have read your filter but I am still asking anyway so don't blow me off)
As a side note, Conversion was very skeptical of a mafia Artanis/ BC team because of their weird double OMGUS/ bussing thing. My two pence on that matter is that a lot of the BC/ Artanis stuff happened when neither of them were under much pressure and their double OMGUS/ scum-read stuff is weird AF. BC's overreaction to Artanis' scum read especially. But I think the best argument against BC/ Artanis is Artanis popping into the thread at EOD1 with a huge case on BC. This was at a time when sentiment was against BC so he could have actually died there. That would be pretty weird for a mafia to do to another mafia when you could've just settled for a ML, lol.
Town MVP goes to:
+ Show Spoiler +
Mafia MVP goes to:
+ Show Spoiler +Mr. Holyflare! + Show Spoiler +
Conversion
05-24-2019
09:11 AM ET (US)
wowza! that iGrok momentum. thanks HF!
Case I most agreed with goes to:
+ Show Spoiler +Mr. Jock! + Show Spoiler +On May 26 2019 06:08 Jockmcplop wrote:
Conversion he's either doing the BC scumpost thing because he hasn't given us an obvious enough scumtell yet or trying to get a reaction.
It looks ridiculous if you read it though lol.
WHY IS EVERYONE POSTING SO MUCH AND WHY ARE THE PEOPLE WHO AREN'T POSTING NOT POSTING AND WHY IS EVERYONE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHO MIGHT BE MAFIA ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH
Biggest tilt goes to:
+ Show Spoiler +Mr. VE! + Show Spoiler + On May 25 2019 04:22 VisceraEyes wrote:
The things Bugs is accusing me of do not make me mafia.
Post that aged the worst goes to:
+ Show Spoiler +Mr. Bugs! + Show Spoiler + On May 26 2019 09:35 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2019 09:34 iGrok wrote:
I already switched to Artanis, obviously Hf isn’t happening well you aren't fucking reading Artanis either so you can die. I think you have to die and see this in postgame to understand how colossally anti-town you're being here.
Congratulations to the mafia team. GG thanks for playing.
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On May 30 2019 15:28 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2019 15:20 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 30 2019 15:16 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:12 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 30 2019 15:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Idk where that came from? bugs made the game completely unplayable for VE. Why are you so obsessed with me? If you want to get another rise out of me for whatever it’s probably never going to happen. I just don’t see the point in even playing here if this is what the community is now, like we’re just going to casually all accept that the behaviour you displayed this game toward multiple players, regardless of their actual in-game alignments, is remotely good for the future of TL mafia. This is a big reason why I took a long break. You were even in one of my last two games. They were wins, I was happy with my play, but sad at the direction of the forum. And I will admit I was pretty much just full of rage and burnout. Now i’m Just happier staying away knowing I don’t have to try to cooperate with people like you just to try to enjoy a game I used to really love. Just come play voice with us this weekend! Voice is much more fun than Forum games and people don't get this tryhard. It's fantastic really. I’d love to play but I’m in an awkward time zone compared to everyone now and I am usually asleep or busy when others are active I think. Thank you for the invite though Come join my game if I can post it sometime in the next week. It’ll be a good break for me since I enjoy hosting quite a lot and I promise the setup will be interesting! It’s a new type of setup I’m trying, since I used to be obsessed with mini normals and now I wanna try putting some spice into the roles I'm not playing a forum game for a while, and if I do it'll have to be a post restricted game. I seriously could not keep up with this game and would not have kept up with it even if I was Town. I think I would've been suspected as either alignment past D1 when the game blew up simply cause I wasn't in the flow of things. When that happens I fall off regardless. I did do a bunch of things that made me scum for sure though. Would have never afked on D3 as town if I'm lined up to die. My tone was also all kinds of wrong, and I don't think I would've forgotten disfo in any list post as town :D I did it intentionally as 'scum would never forget their teammates on a list post' in the hopes of that being used later if I flipped.
The game I am hosting will be very different from this one on basic mechanics. Normal cycle lengths, silent night (so no reason to troll at night to avoid roleblocks or whatever dumb traps and reasons I came up with for doing antitown things this game at night)
I intend to 100% ban multi-posting (double posting okay in selected circumstances) and I intend to give lots of reminders as well as provide a ranking of players by post count and post rate compared to baseline metrics (like say targetting 30-40 pages per cycle) so that players can hopefully moderate themselves.
Also let me just say that the roles are gonna be a lot more powerful hahahaha
I wanna sit back and watch some of the fireworks
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Canada11355 Posts
I'd just like to say that this game I had a hard time opening up TL.net when I woke up because I knew I'd have 2+ PMs and a bunch of posts in my host qt. At one point I had 6 unread PMs during the whole modkill fiasco.
RE: jockmcplop, I personally don't think someone should just be able to replace out because they are flustered or overwhelmed or whatever. If you play and post all game phase and place a vote but replace out it's not fair to the opposing team or anyone really to have to read 2 people in 1 slot in 1 day. If there's an emergency, of course I'll replace you if I can no questions asked. Take a step back, take a break from playing. Nobody is forcing you to post and nobody is forcing you to play. If you don't meet ingame requirements you will be modkilled/replaced but there's no banlist so if you don't want to play anymore, don't talk about it in game. Maybe let the host know you plan on quitting so they can prepare ahead of time if you feel nice.
RE: host questions, I get that people have questions about mechanics and sometimes these things aren't covered in the OP. However, this game especially, I received multiple questions from multiple people whom will not be named that were either answered directly in the game rules or at least answered in the FAQ. Asking me a bunch different questions about how a roleblocker interacts with a certain role when you are neither role yourself is going to come off as angle shooting whether I answer or not. I prefer to answer every question I'm asked and maybe that's part of my problem but honestly this game made me rethink my policy on answering player questions. Seeing how many things that were talked about in PM used to formulate reads or otherwise used to 'solve' the game was disheartening.
I said this maybe in obs but certainly privately to my cohosts: When people sign up for my games, I expect them to want to play mafia by interacting with other players within the context of the game. I don't expect them to try and game the hosts or use role PMs to find mafia... I was talking to my friend with whom I've played IRL mafia/werewolf with before and he likened it to playing real life werewolf with a deck of standard playing cards, realizing the host only picked red cards for the ones that represent villagers, and trying to find mafia based on that. It goes against the spirit of the game and while I realize nobody has disagreed with me on this, I feel the need to reiterate that fact.
/endrant
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On May 30 2019 15:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2019 15:22 raynpelikoneet wrote:On May 30 2019 15:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:
And what did i do that was bad? You have a very different set of values as to what is important as well as what is offensive and what isn't compared to most players on the site. You know that, Joni. It often creates friction where there really is no need. The community is small enough as is and I'd prefer we all try and get along, lest it becomes impossible to have more games. Well then please, you, tell me where i was over the line offensive in this game because i cant see it? I don't think you've crossed the line this game at least for me. They way you play can definitely ruffle some feathers in that you get tunneled on one thing you think makes someone 100% mafia and you go further on it than almost anyone, but I don't think you stepped out of line at all that I recall. I'm mostly talking about the postgame chat here where there's no need to 'but what about...' at the end when WBG basically had a Rayntunnel on VE all game
Which is exactly why i said it's not his fault. Like i understand i was probably at least the part of reason why Calix got disinterested in the game (my honest opinion is that Jock never should have in the first place), but at least i didn't comment on basically everything she said and shit on it. Every time VE tried to do something (i remember best the time when i talked with him about Conversion) bugs came in with some good 50 posts to tilt him again, and VE always bites. What gives?
I don't really care if someone gets tunneled or is wrong, that's part of the game, but i also don't really like being called something i didn't do, especially when he himself and definitely HF (on D2) were far far "worse" in said same activity.
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Canada11355 Posts
On May 30 2019 15:33 Grackaroni wrote:The Grackaroni Post Game Awards Show
Best reads goes to:+ Show Spoiler +Mr BloodyC0bbler! + Show Spoiler +On May 25 2019 20:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
1. To BC: do you agree with the case on iGrok?
I see some merit in it, but I also feel like its somewhat fabricated. Everything of Igrok I see comes off as townish for the most part. My biggest issue is that Koshi is hard town reading him.
2. To both of you: can you again provide a list of all your reads?
Town
BC
Bugs
VE(i know right)
Null to lean town
HF
Rayn
Igrok
Jock
Null to Lean Mafia
Koshi
Conversion
Mafia
Artanis
Calix
Disinformation
Ms. Calix! + Show Spoiler +On May 27 2019 17:07 Calix wrote:As for D2, I still think his Artanis switch from this: Show nested quote +On May 24 2019 03:20 Conversion wrote:artanis is giving me great conflict. generally his entire filter looked good to me. the only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive, except to Artanis himself. so I don't quite get this "BC was super duper aggressive, but then chilled out" as a switch reason. + Show Spoiler +On May 23 2019 20:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:First, why I'm not as sold on BC anymore. He's significantly dialed down his aggression in general when there's no real reason to and is giving opinions on a lot of things. It's this sequence of posts: Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:20 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I r back now and fuck, sorry guys. The way Ruxxar was playing I thought the read was right =\ Even if my voted wasn't on him, my read still played a huge part in his death.
As for the newest events of the last 20 pages or so.
No Bugs, after al that has been said and done, I wont be agreeing to kill VE. I voted for him (briefly) for the same reasons I started to lose my read of HF in the last game. Having time to sit back, think, and reflect I just can't kill him atm.
Looking at the thread trying to be impartial again to avoid the tunnel mentality and the adversity from contrary reads VE looks good. and his reasonings for the slight changes between games makes sense. Can't kill him as of yet.
Looking at the thread now, especially during the night phase. I would say this.
Rayn, HF, VE, Koshi (i hate saying this), all look decent and should be where any protective roles we have be sitting.
As much I know that I am on that list because I know that I am 100% town, given that basically no one else thinks so, leave me to potential bullets. Bugs, and I personally would say Jock, basically lives in the same zone that I am.
That leaves everyone else.
There is enough consensus now on Artanis that although the way I got my initial read on him was completely stupid, he has continued to post in a way that I still think is mafia. Plus the people who seem to be playing better than me agree on it so I feel a bit more sure.
the other 2 I feel are scattered between Callix, Igrok, Conversion and Disinformation. Im trying to avoid tunneling like I have been, because I can see that I have been now.
I need to reread Calix and Igrok as through tunneling artanis, ruxxar and disinformation I more or less left them by the wayside.
Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:28 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Bugs. I will fully agree that my first major read on Artanis was after he tunnel dove me and said shit I know is wrong. Your reason for why i was super pissed is right though. I gave him a pass, got shat on by him for giving him that pass, had my filter misinterpreted and shit made up. So I will fully admit I got pissed and tunneled on him.
Now. Do I still think hes mafia? yes, but hes currently the only read I had that I am committed to.
That is also concentrating mainly on the last 24ish hours as well. The content is partially important, but more so is the tone. As mafia there'd be no reason to do anything but keep the focus on me with thread sentiment on his side. He also seems to be working with people to actively try and get a read on them. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 20:31 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I have already stated when I scum read you and when I upgraded my read. Those are clearly already in thread. So go filter dive me if you want to read them. Even you have to put through the extra work if we are going to solve the game. The tone is just so different from earlier and there was no pressure on him to change, really. All the people accusing him were considered null at best. As for why WBG: Same tone thing, but very differently. When HF accused me of something that was wrong, this was how he replied: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 04:20 Holyflare wrote:On May 22 2019 04:16 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
And HF, explain your read progression on me. You disliked me, read my filter, gave a begrudging townread and now you're scumreading me for something that is wholly false. Eh, yeah, you're pretty correct actually I don't know. I think it's because you're just not around that you kind of fall by the wayside and I'm like "oh, I haven't scum read that guy in a while and nobody else fits, let's call him mafia." Extremely transparent, acknowledges his reasons for reading me were inaccurate and.. that's it. He doesn't arrive at a conclusion immedately because it's not necessary. Contrast that with Bugs regarding me accusing BC: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 23:48 wherebugsgo wrote:
why did people say BC OMGUSed artanis when BC scumread artanis first
or at least I feel like I remember that sentiment was thrown around
ok w/e. Too much thinking.
Makes an incorrect statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE.
I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him.
I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me insteadLastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. Expands on statement, showcases its importance regarding reading me and disfo. Did not check the validity of said statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 07:20 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE. I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him. I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me instead Lastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. I didn't know May 21 2019 21:08 was before May 20 2019 22:22 in your calendar, WBG. Did you scumread BC before you voted him? Because if you did then I honestly just didn’t remember that, all I remember is that I ignored you for a while since your vote was on me and you were mostly AFK so why would I bother reading you. If you did indeed scumread him before then my apologies, I’m wrong and BC OMGUSed you. Not sure that makes him scum or that his assessment of the situation from his perspective is scummy given that I agreed with it. "Oh I was wrong, but it doesn't change my BC read!" The focus is much more defensive and closed. Then the most recent post made above feels to me like he's trying to stay 'above' the discussion. Get people to guess at his little game to get free townreads.. it doesn't feel like he's critically trying to think of the game, but just filling up space whilst sitting on the sidelines. ##Vote wherebugsgo the second thing is his bugs read, but that's mostly because I townread bugs and I don't think his argument was a good one. mmmmmmmh he's definitely looks less towny than BC to me right now "definitely looks less towny than BC...generally his entire filter looked good...only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive" to having Artanis as "probably scum" and: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 00:18 Conversion wrote:
man how are there 23+ pages since I last left!
and why are people off scum again! did Artanis prove himself town somehow? Where did this confidence in mafia!Artanis come from? This post would suggest he wasn't aware of anything Artanis had posted in the meantime. Then Conversion talks a bunch about iGrok and how bad he looks. But still wants Artanis dead more. Not entirely clear whether he thinks both could be mafia or whatnot. This post stood out to me as scummy because of how inconclusive it is: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 01:07 Conversion wrote:
is that mafia!iGrok flailing since he knows Artanis is his scumbuddy, and trying to force a lynch onto someone else? but why would mafia!Grok try to lynch someone he deems is unlynchable by his own words, and is attempting to distance himself from his scumbuddy Artanis? He proposes some explanations for why mafia!iGrok is doing what he is doing. Seems to think both Artanis/ iGrok are mafia. But his second question poses an idea that seems to dent the mafia iGrok/ Artanis idea. Yet Conversion never really goes anywhere with this. @Conversion, would you mind giving me the lowdown of your thought process at EOD1 and why you became more certain that Artanis is mafia, please?
(I have read your filter but I am still asking anyway so don't blow me off)
As a side note, Conversion was very skeptical of a mafia Artanis/ BC team because of their weird double OMGUS/ bussing thing. My two pence on that matter is that a lot of the BC/ Artanis stuff happened when neither of them were under much pressure and their double OMGUS/ scum-read stuff is weird AF. BC's overreaction to Artanis' scum read especially. But I think the best argument against BC/ Artanis is Artanis popping into the thread at EOD1 with a huge case on BC. This was at a time when sentiment was against BC so he could have actually died there. That would be pretty weird for a mafia to do to another mafia when you could've just settled for a ML, lol. Mr. Holyflare! + Show Spoiler +
Conversion
05-24-2019
09:11 AM ET (US)
wowza! that iGrok momentum. thanks HF!
Mr. Jock! + Show Spoiler +On May 26 2019 06:08 Jockmcplop wrote:
Conversion he's either doing the BC scumpost thing because he hasn't given us an obvious enough scumtell yet or trying to get a reaction.
It looks ridiculous if you read it though lol.
WHY IS EVERYONE POSTING SO MUCH AND WHY ARE THE PEOPLE WHO AREN'T POSTING NOT POSTING AND WHY IS EVERYONE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHO MIGHT BE MAFIA ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH Mr. VE! + Show Spoiler + On May 25 2019 04:22 VisceraEyes wrote:
The things Bugs is accusing me of do not make me mafia.
Mr. Bugs! + Show Spoiler + On May 26 2019 09:35 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2019 09:34 iGrok wrote:
I already switched to Artanis, obviously Hf isn’t happening well you aren't fucking reading Artanis either so you can die. I think you have to die and see this in postgame to understand how colossally anti-town you're being here.
Honestly this guy is a top tier cohost and I personally recommend him to anyone who needs someone reliable, reasonable, and friendly.
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On May 30 2019 15:33 Grackaroni wrote:The Grackaroni Post Game Awards Show
Best reads goes to:+ Show Spoiler +Mr BloodyC0bbler! + Show Spoiler +On May 25 2019 20:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
1. To BC: do you agree with the case on iGrok?
I see some merit in it, but I also feel like its somewhat fabricated. Everything of Igrok I see comes off as townish for the most part. My biggest issue is that Koshi is hard town reading him.
2. To both of you: can you again provide a list of all your reads?
Town
BC
Bugs
VE(i know right)
Null to lean town
HF
Rayn
Igrok
Jock
Null to Lean Mafia
Koshi
Conversion
Mafia
Artanis
Calix
Disinformation
Ms. Calix! + Show Spoiler +On May 27 2019 17:07 Calix wrote:As for D2, I still think his Artanis switch from this: Show nested quote +On May 24 2019 03:20 Conversion wrote:artanis is giving me great conflict. generally his entire filter looked good to me. the only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive, except to Artanis himself. so I don't quite get this "BC was super duper aggressive, but then chilled out" as a switch reason. + Show Spoiler +On May 23 2019 20:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:First, why I'm not as sold on BC anymore. He's significantly dialed down his aggression in general when there's no real reason to and is giving opinions on a lot of things. It's this sequence of posts: Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:20 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I r back now and fuck, sorry guys. The way Ruxxar was playing I thought the read was right =\ Even if my voted wasn't on him, my read still played a huge part in his death.
As for the newest events of the last 20 pages or so.
No Bugs, after al that has been said and done, I wont be agreeing to kill VE. I voted for him (briefly) for the same reasons I started to lose my read of HF in the last game. Having time to sit back, think, and reflect I just can't kill him atm.
Looking at the thread trying to be impartial again to avoid the tunnel mentality and the adversity from contrary reads VE looks good. and his reasonings for the slight changes between games makes sense. Can't kill him as of yet.
Looking at the thread now, especially during the night phase. I would say this.
Rayn, HF, VE, Koshi (i hate saying this), all look decent and should be where any protective roles we have be sitting.
As much I know that I am on that list because I know that I am 100% town, given that basically no one else thinks so, leave me to potential bullets. Bugs, and I personally would say Jock, basically lives in the same zone that I am.
That leaves everyone else.
There is enough consensus now on Artanis that although the way I got my initial read on him was completely stupid, he has continued to post in a way that I still think is mafia. Plus the people who seem to be playing better than me agree on it so I feel a bit more sure.
the other 2 I feel are scattered between Callix, Igrok, Conversion and Disinformation. Im trying to avoid tunneling like I have been, because I can see that I have been now.
I need to reread Calix and Igrok as through tunneling artanis, ruxxar and disinformation I more or less left them by the wayside.
Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:28 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Bugs. I will fully agree that my first major read on Artanis was after he tunnel dove me and said shit I know is wrong. Your reason for why i was super pissed is right though. I gave him a pass, got shat on by him for giving him that pass, had my filter misinterpreted and shit made up. So I will fully admit I got pissed and tunneled on him.
Now. Do I still think hes mafia? yes, but hes currently the only read I had that I am committed to.
That is also concentrating mainly on the last 24ish hours as well. The content is partially important, but more so is the tone. As mafia there'd be no reason to do anything but keep the focus on me with thread sentiment on his side. He also seems to be working with people to actively try and get a read on them. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 20:31 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I have already stated when I scum read you and when I upgraded my read. Those are clearly already in thread. So go filter dive me if you want to read them. Even you have to put through the extra work if we are going to solve the game. The tone is just so different from earlier and there was no pressure on him to change, really. All the people accusing him were considered null at best. As for why WBG: Same tone thing, but very differently. When HF accused me of something that was wrong, this was how he replied: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 04:20 Holyflare wrote:On May 22 2019 04:16 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
And HF, explain your read progression on me. You disliked me, read my filter, gave a begrudging townread and now you're scumreading me for something that is wholly false. Eh, yeah, you're pretty correct actually I don't know. I think it's because you're just not around that you kind of fall by the wayside and I'm like "oh, I haven't scum read that guy in a while and nobody else fits, let's call him mafia." Extremely transparent, acknowledges his reasons for reading me were inaccurate and.. that's it. He doesn't arrive at a conclusion immedately because it's not necessary. Contrast that with Bugs regarding me accusing BC: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 23:48 wherebugsgo wrote:
why did people say BC OMGUSed artanis when BC scumread artanis first
or at least I feel like I remember that sentiment was thrown around
ok w/e. Too much thinking.
Makes an incorrect statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE.
I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him.
I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me insteadLastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. Expands on statement, showcases its importance regarding reading me and disfo. Did not check the validity of said statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 07:20 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE. I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him. I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me instead Lastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. I didn't know May 21 2019 21:08 was before May 20 2019 22:22 in your calendar, WBG. Did you scumread BC before you voted him? Because if you did then I honestly just didn’t remember that, all I remember is that I ignored you for a while since your vote was on me and you were mostly AFK so why would I bother reading you. If you did indeed scumread him before then my apologies, I’m wrong and BC OMGUSed you. Not sure that makes him scum or that his assessment of the situation from his perspective is scummy given that I agreed with it. "Oh I was wrong, but it doesn't change my BC read!" The focus is much more defensive and closed. Then the most recent post made above feels to me like he's trying to stay 'above' the discussion. Get people to guess at his little game to get free townreads.. it doesn't feel like he's critically trying to think of the game, but just filling up space whilst sitting on the sidelines. ##Vote wherebugsgo the second thing is his bugs read, but that's mostly because I townread bugs and I don't think his argument was a good one. mmmmmmmh he's definitely looks less towny than BC to me right now "definitely looks less towny than BC...generally his entire filter looked good...only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive" to having Artanis as "probably scum" and: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 00:18 Conversion wrote:
man how are there 23+ pages since I last left!
and why are people off scum again! did Artanis prove himself town somehow? Where did this confidence in mafia!Artanis come from? This post would suggest he wasn't aware of anything Artanis had posted in the meantime. Then Conversion talks a bunch about iGrok and how bad he looks. But still wants Artanis dead more. Not entirely clear whether he thinks both could be mafia or whatnot. This post stood out to me as scummy because of how inconclusive it is: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 01:07 Conversion wrote:
is that mafia!iGrok flailing since he knows Artanis is his scumbuddy, and trying to force a lynch onto someone else? but why would mafia!Grok try to lynch someone he deems is unlynchable by his own words, and is attempting to distance himself from his scumbuddy Artanis? He proposes some explanations for why mafia!iGrok is doing what he is doing. Seems to think both Artanis/ iGrok are mafia. But his second question poses an idea that seems to dent the mafia iGrok/ Artanis idea. Yet Conversion never really goes anywhere with this. @Conversion, would you mind giving me the lowdown of your thought process at EOD1 and why you became more certain that Artanis is mafia, please?
(I have read your filter but I am still asking anyway so don't blow me off)
As a side note, Conversion was very skeptical of a mafia Artanis/ BC team because of their weird double OMGUS/ bussing thing. My two pence on that matter is that a lot of the BC/ Artanis stuff happened when neither of them were under much pressure and their double OMGUS/ scum-read stuff is weird AF. BC's overreaction to Artanis' scum read especially. But I think the best argument against BC/ Artanis is Artanis popping into the thread at EOD1 with a huge case on BC. This was at a time when sentiment was against BC so he could have actually died there. That would be pretty weird for a mafia to do to another mafia when you could've just settled for a ML, lol. Mr. Holyflare! + Show Spoiler +
Conversion
05-24-2019
09:11 AM ET (US)
wowza! that iGrok momentum. thanks HF!
Mr. Jock! + Show Spoiler +On May 26 2019 06:08 Jockmcplop wrote:
Conversion he's either doing the BC scumpost thing because he hasn't given us an obvious enough scumtell yet or trying to get a reaction.
It looks ridiculous if you read it though lol.
WHY IS EVERYONE POSTING SO MUCH AND WHY ARE THE PEOPLE WHO AREN'T POSTING NOT POSTING AND WHY IS EVERYONE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHO MIGHT BE MAFIA ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH Mr. VE! + Show Spoiler + On May 25 2019 04:22 VisceraEyes wrote:
The things Bugs is accusing me of do not make me mafia.
Mr. Bugs! + Show Spoiler + On May 26 2019 09:35 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2019 09:34 iGrok wrote:
I already switched to Artanis, obviously Hf isn’t happening well you aren't fucking reading Artanis either so you can die. I think you have to die and see this in postgame to understand how colossally anti-town you're being here.
Ahahahaha I knew that one would come back to bite me. I was just trying to get iGrok to stop tunneling HF and they were both my townreads 
Sorry to all 3 of VE, Calix, BC. I should have done more to collaborate with all 3 of you and I failed that pretty hard. I actually couldn’t read enough of the posts to even feel comfortable on any of my reads this game.
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Really well played mafia! You also let town implode upon themselves which was great.
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On May 30 2019 15:36 Fecalfeast wrote:
I'd just like to say that this game I had a hard time opening up TL.net when I woke up because I knew I'd have 2+ PMs and a bunch of posts in my host qt. At one point I had 6 unread PMs during the whole modkill fiasco.
RE: jockmcplop, I personally don't think someone should just be able to replace out because they are flustered or overwhelmed or whatever. If you play and post all game phase and place a vote but replace out it's not fair to the opposing team or anyone really to have to read 2 people in 1 slot in 1 day. If there's an emergency, of course I'll replace you if I can no questions asked. Take a step back, take a break from playing. Nobody is forcing you to post and nobody is forcing you to play. If you don't meet ingame requirements you will be modkilled/replaced but there's no banlist so if you don't want to play anymore, don't talk about it in game. Maybe let the host know you plan on quitting so they can prepare ahead of time if you feel nice.
RE: host questions, I get that people have questions about mechanics and sometimes these things aren't covered in the OP. However, this game especially, I received multiple questions from multiple people whom will not be named that were either answered directly in the game rules or at least answered in the FAQ. Asking me a bunch different questions about how a roleblocker interacts with a certain role when you are neither role yourself is going to come off as angle shooting whether I answer or not. I prefer to answer every question I'm asked and maybe that's part of my problem but honestly this game made me rethink my policy on answering player questions. Seeing how many things that were talked about in PM used to formulate reads or otherwise used to 'solve' the game was disheartening.
I said this maybe in obs but certainly privately to my cohosts: When people sign up for my games, I expect them to want to play mafia by interacting with other players within the context of the game. I don't expect them to try and game the hosts or use role PMs to find mafia... I was talking to my friend with whom I've played IRL mafia/werewolf with before and he likened it to playing real life werewolf with a deck of standard playing cards, realizing the host only picked red cards for the ones that represent villagers, and trying to find mafia based on that. It goes against the spirit of the game and while I realize nobody has disagreed with me on this, I feel the need to reiterate that fact.
/endrant
Hey FF I appreciate the feedback here. I’m actually just gonna be up front and admit I was the one asking about how RBs interact with parity cops in this game because I was trying to figure out 1. Why rayn would claim PC day 1 and 2. If he would know he got RBed based on the mechanics and whether I should be calling him scum on d2 based on it, and if he was alive d3 whether I should try to kill him.
Like, the logic there was basically that you told me I could check my own gun after the night and essentially that would tell me if I was RBed or not. For an investigative, and based on the info in the thread about parity cops, it sounded like there was a difference between:
Receiving no PM at all <—— this is what I thought PC being RBed would look like on n1 n2
Receiving a PM with no result <—— this was stated in the thread. What I thought no RB would look like for PC on n1
Then the problem is that the PC would not know which check was previously successful between n1 and n2 if getting a successful one on n3. So even if we had a PC that scum left alive till d3/d4 I felt we had no way to trust that claim or that it would have any use.
Anyway probably not worth spending more time explaining my logic but I also would have just stopped asking if you had said to me or written in the thread that you weren’t going to answer any questions about roles other than the role of the questioner. Maybe you had said that and I missed it, my apologies regardless.
Thank you for hosting and I’m sorry I got myself modkilled and ruined your game
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Canada11355 Posts
Oh right one final shoutout to LS who did not have Obs chat but sent me a PM with the subject "Ugh"
Original Message From LightningStrike:
Why is town not voting obvious mafia Artanis lmao
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Canada11355 Posts
On May 30 2019 15:47 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2019 15:36 Fecalfeast wrote:
I'd just like to say that this game I had a hard time opening up TL.net when I woke up because I knew I'd have 2+ PMs and a bunch of posts in my host qt. At one point I had 6 unread PMs during the whole modkill fiasco.
RE: jockmcplop, I personally don't think someone should just be able to replace out because they are flustered or overwhelmed or whatever. If you play and post all game phase and place a vote but replace out it's not fair to the opposing team or anyone really to have to read 2 people in 1 slot in 1 day. If there's an emergency, of course I'll replace you if I can no questions asked. Take a step back, take a break from playing. Nobody is forcing you to post and nobody is forcing you to play. If you don't meet ingame requirements you will be modkilled/replaced but there's no banlist so if you don't want to play anymore, don't talk about it in game. Maybe let the host know you plan on quitting so they can prepare ahead of time if you feel nice.
RE: host questions, I get that people have questions about mechanics and sometimes these things aren't covered in the OP. However, this game especially, I received multiple questions from multiple people whom will not be named that were either answered directly in the game rules or at least answered in the FAQ. Asking me a bunch different questions about how a roleblocker interacts with a certain role when you are neither role yourself is going to come off as angle shooting whether I answer or not. I prefer to answer every question I'm asked and maybe that's part of my problem but honestly this game made me rethink my policy on answering player questions. Seeing how many things that were talked about in PM used to formulate reads or otherwise used to 'solve' the game was disheartening.
I said this maybe in obs but certainly privately to my cohosts: When people sign up for my games, I expect them to want to play mafia by interacting with other players within the context of the game. I don't expect them to try and game the hosts or use role PMs to find mafia... I was talking to my friend with whom I've played IRL mafia/werewolf with before and he likened it to playing real life werewolf with a deck of standard playing cards, realizing the host only picked red cards for the ones that represent villagers, and trying to find mafia based on that. It goes against the spirit of the game and while I realize nobody has disagreed with me on this, I feel the need to reiterate that fact.
/endrant Hey FF I appreciate the feedback here. I’m actually just gonna be up front and admit I was the one asking about how RBs interact with parity cops in this game because I was trying to figure out 1. Why rayn would claim PC day 1 and 2. If he would know he got RBed based on the mechanics and whether I should be calling him scum on d2 based on it, and if he was alive d3 whether I should try to kill him. Like, the logic there was basically that you told me I could check my own gun after the night and essentially that would tell me if I was RBed or not. For an investigative, and based on the info in the thread about parity cops, it sounded like there was a difference between: Receiving no PM at all <—— this is what I thought PC being RBed would look like on n1 n2 Receiving a PM with no result <—— this was stated in the thread. What I thought no RB would look like for PC on n1 Then the problem is that the PC would not know which check was previously successful between n1 and n2 if getting a successful one on n3. So even if we had a PC that scum left alive till d3/d4 I felt we had no way to trust that claim or that it would have any use. Anyway probably not worth spending more time explaining my logic but I also would have just stopped asking if you had said to me or written in the thread that you weren’t going to answer any questions about roles other than the role of the questioner. Maybe you had said that and I missed it, my apologies regardless. Thank you for hosting and I’m sorry I got myself modkilled and ruined your game
I totally understand why you were asking but from my perpective it was hard to try and answer without spilling that there is no RB or potentially spilling that there IS one when there isn't.
In the grand scheme of things your questions about RB/PC weren't a big deal but as a part of the whole game it was one of the straws on my back.
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Also playing Mafia without having a roleblocker kinda feels like you have absolutely no control over the thread in case of massclaims which kinda sucks. I understand given the nerfed blue roles it wasn't super bad, but it's still a very meh feeling as maf :D
/whine
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On May 30 2019 15:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also playing Mafia without having a roleblocker kinda feels like you have absolutely no control over the thread in case of massclaims which kinda sucks. I understand given the nerfed blue roles it wasn't super bad, but it's still a very meh feeling as maf :D
/whine
I honestly didn't assume framer because framer is incredibly (too) powerful against parity cop, like one successful frame N1 or N2 can outright lose the game for the town hands down. I agree mafia should always have rb vs 3 town pr.
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+ Show Spoiler +On May 27 2019 17:07 Calix wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 11:24 Conversion wrote:
d'oh.
I just meta-dived ruxxar and he plays really fluid, jokes around a lot as town.
his mafia games are like 4+ years old, though, and not sure if they should really count as much here (couldn't find any more recent games)
but you're right in the fact that nothing about his game here resembles the town games I read meta wise.
in terms of reads, my brain is fried (as evidenced by fucking up a simple logic table up ^^^ there), and I think I'm inclined to believe bugs.. I think disfo is in a pretty non-safe spot going on this ruxxar lynch here as well, so ruxxar flipping mafia doesn't give him too much cred. I don't really buy any of Koshi's reads, and him dodging me and not calling me scum is pretty fuckin' weird cause I'm not really playing any differently than I have in the games we've played together. m
If ruxxar flips mafia though Koshi is never, ever, 100% never ever mafia.
and now I'm sleepy and lost 90 minutes of s tudying for an interview so I'm peacing out. gl hf, see y'all after like 4 PM est for a bit before I fly out Yeah, D1 progression is a bit dodgy. Had ruxxar at null beforehand then says ruxxar's meta points towards him being mafia [as someone who also looked into ruxxar's games, his posting style this game didn't really resemble either town/ mafia ruxxar. Only 'tell' that he might have been mafia on D1 was low activity - he generally has higher activity as town - but that wasn't strong enough for me to think the meta argument was compelling by itself]. Anyway, he then talks about, I presume, why he's voting for ruxxar despite one of his strongest mafia reads also voting for ruxxar. And in retrospect, a lot of this post doesn't say anything because ruxxar was not mafia. As for D2, I still think his Artanis switch from this: Show nested quote +On May 24 2019 03:20 Conversion wrote:artanis is giving me great conflict. generally his entire filter looked good to me. the only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive, except to Artanis himself. so I don't quite get this "BC was super duper aggressive, but then chilled out" as a switch reason. + Show Spoiler +On May 23 2019 20:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:First, why I'm not as sold on BC anymore. He's significantly dialed down his aggression in general when there's no real reason to and is giving opinions on a lot of things. It's this sequence of posts: Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:20 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I r back now and fuck, sorry guys. The way Ruxxar was playing I thought the read was right =\ Even if my voted wasn't on him, my read still played a huge part in his death.
As for the newest events of the last 20 pages or so.
No Bugs, after al that has been said and done, I wont be agreeing to kill VE. I voted for him (briefly) for the same reasons I started to lose my read of HF in the last game. Having time to sit back, think, and reflect I just can't kill him atm.
Looking at the thread trying to be impartial again to avoid the tunnel mentality and the adversity from contrary reads VE looks good. and his reasonings for the slight changes between games makes sense. Can't kill him as of yet.
Looking at the thread now, especially during the night phase. I would say this.
Rayn, HF, VE, Koshi (i hate saying this), all look decent and should be where any protective roles we have be sitting.
As much I know that I am on that list because I know that I am 100% town, given that basically no one else thinks so, leave me to potential bullets. Bugs, and I personally would say Jock, basically lives in the same zone that I am.
That leaves everyone else.
There is enough consensus now on Artanis that although the way I got my initial read on him was completely stupid, he has continued to post in a way that I still think is mafia. Plus the people who seem to be playing better than me agree on it so I feel a bit more sure.
the other 2 I feel are scattered between Callix, Igrok, Conversion and Disinformation. Im trying to avoid tunneling like I have been, because I can see that I have been now.
I need to reread Calix and Igrok as through tunneling artanis, ruxxar and disinformation I more or less left them by the wayside.
Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:28 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Bugs. I will fully agree that my first major read on Artanis was after he tunnel dove me and said shit I know is wrong. Your reason for why i was super pissed is right though. I gave him a pass, got shat on by him for giving him that pass, had my filter misinterpreted and shit made up. So I will fully admit I got pissed and tunneled on him.
Now. Do I still think hes mafia? yes, but hes currently the only read I had that I am committed to.
That is also concentrating mainly on the last 24ish hours as well. The content is partially important, but more so is the tone. As mafia there'd be no reason to do anything but keep the focus on me with thread sentiment on his side. He also seems to be working with people to actively try and get a read on them. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 20:31 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
I have already stated when I scum read you and when I upgraded my read. Those are clearly already in thread. So go filter dive me if you want to read them. Even you have to put through the extra work if we are going to solve the game. The tone is just so different from earlier and there was no pressure on him to change, really. All the people accusing him were considered null at best. As for why WBG: Same tone thing, but very differently. When HF accused me of something that was wrong, this was how he replied: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 04:20 Holyflare wrote:On May 22 2019 04:16 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
And HF, explain your read progression on me. You disliked me, read my filter, gave a begrudging townread and now you're scumreading me for something that is wholly false. Eh, yeah, you're pretty correct actually I don't know. I think it's because you're just not around that you kind of fall by the wayside and I'm like "oh, I haven't scum read that guy in a while and nobody else fits, let's call him mafia." Extremely transparent, acknowledges his reasons for reading me were inaccurate and.. that's it. He doesn't arrive at a conclusion immedately because it's not necessary. Contrast that with Bugs regarding me accusing BC: Show nested quote +On May 22 2019 23:48 wherebugsgo wrote:
why did people say BC OMGUSed artanis when BC scumread artanis first
or at least I feel like I remember that sentiment was thrown around
ok w/e. Too much thinking.
Makes an incorrect statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE.
I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him.
I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me insteadLastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. Expands on statement, showcases its importance regarding reading me and disfo. Did not check the validity of said statement. Show nested quote +On May 23 2019 07:26 wherebugsgo wrote:On May 23 2019 07:20 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 23 2019 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:On BC reading Artanis as scum before Artanis cased him, look: On May 21 2019 21:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Fuck. I need to sleep.
Currently Voting for VE. Although I may be seeing ghosts so I need to think on it a bit / re read his filter.
If hes not who we decide to lynch.
At this point id still be down for
Artanis
Disinformation
Ruxxar.
I will clearly update / reevaluate based on whatever is posted while im gone but those 4 would be my preferred lynch priorities
He literally lists Artanis as the FIRST choice before disfo/ruxxar, after just saying he is confused about VE. I can totally get him reacting very strongly to Artanis then jumping on a vote on him. I’m actually deducting town points from both disformation and Artanis for not correctly reading this and using it as an opportunity to scum me instead Lastly, on the disappearing thing: go ahead and look at the times I’m absent from the thread. It is 7 am here in Japan. I referred to ruxxar disappearing on multiple occasions after myself or other players would direct messages at him shortly after he posted in the thread. These are different types of disappearances, and that both rayn and disformation are trying to scum me for it is highly suspicious. Well, I guess not on rayn’s part because rayn just has a hard-on for calling me stupid and twisting everything I say in that direction. I didn't know May 21 2019 21:08 was before May 20 2019 22:22 in your calendar, WBG. Did you scumread BC before you voted him? Because if you did then I honestly just didn’t remember that, all I remember is that I ignored you for a while since your vote was on me and you were mostly AFK so why would I bother reading you. If you did indeed scumread him before then my apologies, I’m wrong and BC OMGUSed you. Not sure that makes him scum or that his assessment of the situation from his perspective is scummy given that I agreed with it. "Oh I was wrong, but it doesn't change my BC read!" The focus is much more defensive and closed. Then the most recent post made above feels to me like he's trying to stay 'above' the discussion. Get people to guess at his little game to get free townreads.. it doesn't feel like he's critically trying to think of the game, but just filling up space whilst sitting on the sidelines. ##Vote wherebugsgo the second thing is his bugs read, but that's mostly because I townread bugs and I don't think his argument was a good one. mmmmmmmh he's definitely looks less towny than BC to me right now "definitely looks less towny than BC...generally his entire filter looked good...only thing about this is I don't QUITE particularly think BC was being aggressive" to having Artanis as "probably scum" and: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 00:18 Conversion wrote:
man how are there 23+ pages since I last left!
and why are people off scum again! did Artanis prove himself town somehow? Where did this confidence in mafia!Artanis come from? This post would suggest he wasn't aware of anything Artanis had posted in the meantime. Then Conversion talks a bunch about iGrok and how bad he looks. But still wants Artanis dead more. Not entirely clear whether he thinks both could be mafia or whatnot. This post stood out to me as scummy because of how inconclusive it is: Show nested quote +On May 25 2019 01:07 Conversion wrote:
is that mafia!iGrok flailing since he knows Artanis is his scumbuddy, and trying to force a lynch onto someone else? but why would mafia!Grok try to lynch someone he deems is unlynchable by his own words, and is attempting to distance himself from his scumbuddy Artanis? He proposes some explanations for why mafia!iGrok is doing what he is doing. Seems to think both Artanis/ iGrok are mafia. But his second question poses an idea that seems to dent the mafia iGrok/ Artanis idea. Yet Conversion never really goes anywhere with this. @Conversion, would you mind giving me the lowdown of your thought process at EOD1 and why you became more certain that Artanis is mafia, please?
(I have read your filter but I am still asking anyway so don't blow me off)
As a side note, Conversion was very skeptical of a mafia Artanis/ BC team because of their weird double OMGUS/ bussing thing. My two pence on that matter is that a lot of the BC/ Artanis stuff happened when neither of them were under much pressure and their double OMGUS/ scum-read stuff is weird AF. BC's overreaction to Artanis' scum read especially. But I think the best argument against BC/ Artanis is Artanis popping into the thread at EOD1 with a huge case on BC. This was at a time when sentiment was against BC so he could have actually died there. That would be pretty weird for a mafia to do to another mafia when you could've just settled for a ML, lol.
Calix you really should have made this post N2. I am not going to pretend that would have dropped my scumread on you but maybe something like 40% chance i would have tried to convince Koshi to at least lynch Conversion first. Because i said half of that post already and thought he is scum for it, and the rest of it is really good. You don't have to like me or anything, especially inside game, but just know i at least try to be reasonable while at times it definitely doesn't seem like that lol.
Sorry for the tunnel. I believed my version of the reasoning on read on HF. That was wrong. I still have no idea how you considered your two scumreads making scummy thing NAI, it doesn't make any sense to me, since scummy people do scummy things. To me it looked like you wanted to be on both sides of the fence, still call BC and iGrok mafia but look like re-evaluating or something, idk.. it just doesn't make any sense in my world.
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United Kingdom9211 Posts
soz for freaking out FF
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
On May 30 2019 15:37 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2019 15:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:22 raynpelikoneet wrote:On May 30 2019 15:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:
And what did i do that was bad? You have a very different set of values as to what is important as well as what is offensive and what isn't compared to most players on the site. You know that, Joni. It often creates friction where there really is no need. The community is small enough as is and I'd prefer we all try and get along, lest it becomes impossible to have more games. Well then please, you, tell me where i was over the line offensive in this game because i cant see it? I don't think you've crossed the line this game at least for me. They way you play can definitely ruffle some feathers in that you get tunneled on one thing you think makes someone 100% mafia and you go further on it than almost anyone, but I don't think you stepped out of line at all that I recall. I'm mostly talking about the postgame chat here where there's no need to 'but what about...' at the end when WBG basically had a Rayntunnel on VE all game Which is exactly why i said it's not his fault. Like i understand i was probably at least the part of reason why Calix got disinterested in the game (my honest opinion is that Jock never should have in the first place), but at least i didn't comment on basically everything she said and shit on it. Every time VE tried to do something (i remember best the time when i talked with him about Conversion) bugs came in with some good 50 posts to tilt him again, and VE always bites. What gives? I don't really care if someone gets tunneled or is wrong, that's part of the game, but i also don't really like being called something i didn't do, especially when he himself and definitely HF (on D2) were far far "worse" in said same activity.
What?
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On May 30 2019 16:23 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2019 15:37 raynpelikoneet wrote:On May 30 2019 15:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:22 raynpelikoneet wrote:On May 30 2019 15:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On May 30 2019 15:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:
And what did i do that was bad? You have a very different set of values as to what is important as well as what is offensive and what isn't compared to most players on the site. You know that, Joni. It often creates friction where there really is no need. The community is small enough as is and I'd prefer we all try and get along, lest it becomes impossible to have more games. Well then please, you, tell me where i was over the line offensive in this game because i cant see it? I don't think you've crossed the line this game at least for me. They way you play can definitely ruffle some feathers in that you get tunneled on one thing you think makes someone 100% mafia and you go further on it than almost anyone, but I don't think you stepped out of line at all that I recall. I'm mostly talking about the postgame chat here where there's no need to 'but what about...' at the end when WBG basically had a Rayntunnel on VE all game Which is exactly why i said it's not his fault. Like i understand i was probably at least the part of reason why Calix got disinterested in the game (my honest opinion is that Jock never should have in the first place), but at least i didn't comment on basically everything she said and shit on it. Every time VE tried to do something (i remember best the time when i talked with him about Conversion) bugs came in with some good 50 posts to tilt him again, and VE always bites. What gives? I don't really care if someone gets tunneled or is wrong, that's part of the game, but i also don't really like being called something i didn't do, especially when he himself and definitely HF (on D2) were far far "worse" in said same activity. What?
you tunneled iGrok D2.
i mean you shut down basically everything else and tunneled iGrok.
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
I feel burnt out from this game and I didn't even play.
Well done to host and cohosts for managing an undoubtedly stressful game.
My impression is nothing new but the game was overly spammy and hostile. As others have stated, town tore themselves apart and mafia could watch from the sidelines. Two players getting modkilled didn't help.
In my opinion, the community is smaller, we are all a bit older and the mass posting, conversational style that used to work is counter productive. It puts people off reading the thread and playing games in the future, regardless of alignment.
That doesn't mean everyone needs to post a giant case once per cycle, AFK and then pick the best case at EOD to vote.
However it does mean. Not responding to every point made (even those about you) , avoiding shitfights and random conversational bullshit , making your posts succinct.
Sure this isn't the free flowing games older players were used to but 90% of people just don't have the time or will for games like that anymore.
All this is just my opinion . Congrats to mafia.
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EPT
