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On November 04 2016 09:29 mahrgell wrote:
@calix: Something about your posting confuses me. But I somehow feel you are confusing yourself probably.
You always claim you have too many townreads. But in this game, if you are town you should see 6 town and 2 mafia. So yes... Most people should look townish.
I haven't seen you townread EVERYONE so far... so... I'm sure there are two left.
Which brings me to: Would you care to update me on your current scum->town ranking of the players here?
Yes, I was (and to an extent, still am) having problems with my reads because I was seeing town motivation all over the place. That's kind of why I voted Rels as well because he was/ still is pretty inactive and I figured "well the active players seem townie so I guess the scum are passive/ lurking" and Rels fitted that profile, but I am not so sure now.
This is what I sent when I finally got the chance to jot down a reads list in my notes:
TOWN
Calix
Skynx
Never Unlucky
mahrgell
TT
darthfoley
Foreman
Rels
ExO
MAFIA
I've already changed my mind since this list though. ExO feels genuine (although I'll reread since I got that read when I was feeling sorry for him since everyone and their kittens was pushing him) and it's possible that TT is mafia instead or something. Basically the order of TT, DF, Foreman is interchangeable. I might bump up Foreman a notch, actually.
But anyway, it's kind of where I stand.
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On November 04 2016 09:43 mahrgell wrote:
Thanks @Calix
With that I will now finally go to sleep. As time may be rare tomorrow, who do you suggest to look into first out of TT,DF and Skynx?
I guess you are valueing Skynx highly, so could you maybe give me a summary how you came to this? And then I would start with one of the other two. Probably DF, as TT seems to be tied to skynx. DF seems to be upset with me though and I don't feel like revenge reading ^.^ I doubt anything useful will come from his.
I already stated why I am strongly town-reading Skynx. It's literally just a page back.
As for who you should read - TT. 100% recommend this if you are having doubts on ExO in particular given the TT/ ExO debacle. So if you thought that ExO could be town then how would TT look? Seems like the best choice to me.
But the choice is up to you.
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I second Foreman's response here. If TT 'didn't hate something' then that implies that he thought it could come from town, no?
I don't have a scum-read on TT, but guess what? I have tinfoil!
The main thing which rubs me the wrong way about TT is that he seems more snarky/ prone to insinuations...touchy, even? Not sure there...than I remember him being. For some reason it makes me feel uncomfortable with him. For example, he didn't react well to ExO saying "lol your entrance is scummy" even though that's not something that anyone should really give a fuck about.
And while his responses under pressure are fine, that's all they are. Fine. Acceptable. There's nothing that I think is particularly townie. They just look nice on paper. It's hard to explain but sometimes it feels like he's saying things because he thinks they look good, not because he actually thinks them. Kind of like scum!JAT in CM.
I don't think he's been reconsidering his reads either. His Skynx read progression felt off to me and is muddled. I don't think his reasoning to start null-scum-reading him again or whatever is a valid one. He also seems locked on scum!ExO and when Rels said "he's likely town because of his claim" I didn't get the impression that TT was ACTUALLY taking that post into account with his read because a) he hasn't taken it into consideration since and b) hasn't considered ExO as town at all. It's possible that TT isn't actually thinking critically about the game and is just focusing on minor details so that he doesn't have to fake re-evaluating players or give proper reads on the rest of the game.
tl;dr: I'm paranoid that he's playing a good scum game but don't have much evidence to tell one way or the other.
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Conversely, TT's train is terrible and none of the posts against him have convincing scum explanations for TT's posts. Even I don't.
Furthermore, I think that TT's reaction to ExO has been better than vice versa. He's made it clear why he scum-reads ExO and he's been more aggressive with pursuing ExO, etc. What I didn't like when I saw ExO re-enter the thread is that all he does is sheep Skynx on TT (making it three votes on him + making it the leading wagon) and I had to ask for his reasoning.
It's also undeniable that ExO's early game-play was really awful. He scum-read me based on the dumbest shit, dropped off when the conversation moved away, reappeared to make one more comment at me. After AFKing for some time, he retracts the scum-read of me. (which was in line with thread consensus) Drops off AGAIN before sheeping the TT train. (this isn't quite as bad as he said he didn't like TT's entrance)
But somehow I can't shake off the feeling that ExO is town. Maybe it's his tone. Maybe it's my doubts over how shitty his play has been. Maybe it's my wariness of following a train that everyone is so gung-ho about. Or maybe I'm just overestimating the influence of the mafia team and ExO really is just obvious scum. Whatever, I'm just going to have to call it a gut read at this point.
But I didn't hate his point about TT/ the VT claim even if TT is like "lalala it's a joke guise ladidah"
If DF/ Skynx/ ExO would like to summarise their thoughts on why TT is mafia then I'd like to hear it.
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On November 04 2016 20:10 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 09:01 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 08:59 mahrgell wrote:Exo: 1)my original post about Exo: http://www.liquiddota.com/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=26146963Nothing I said there really changed, even with the newer posts. Honestly while he always calls other ppl to read the tread, his posts don't really strike me as if he had read the thread so far. I guess I have to honorary mention that at least he doesn't ask for summaries all the time. Great upgrade. 2) On November 03 2016 04:46 ExO_ wrote:On November 03 2016 04:44 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:40 mahrgell wrote:On November 03 2016 04:35 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:32 mahrgell wrote:gosh Calix, can we please stop post synced? Also after what I read from you last game I'm afraid of myself, if I share your thoughts... I don't want to be like you  Sorry. It's ironic because you're insinuating that I am a bad player...but I'm pretty sure that you misinterpreted what Foreman said. He was calling me scum, not you. I am aware that he is only going after you. But as I share your concern regarding NU... And would like the same answer to be answered... He refuses to answer me, because he considers you to be scum. I don't agree on the policy of "I don't talk to who I consider scum". I consider this antitown, but I understand interpretations on this may differ. But I really dislike the policy of "I don't talk to you, because a player I consider to be scum shared your concerns". This is for sure antitown. So either he considers me scum too, or he is just antitown. Both conclusions are not really giving him any plus points in my book. It is extremely anti-town to ignore anyone save for red-checked players or the like. It shows that he is not willing to reconsider his reads and will be prone to tunnel-vision. (this is something I am specifically trying to avoid) I remain uncertain on Foreman. I'm inclined to scum-read him purely for his pathetic dismissal of my NU case (aka the most substantial post made this game) but I'm biased there as I think my case is pretty good. Furthermore, some of his posts have minor town-tells in them. (nothing convincing though) Concluding null as it stands. How can you be so hesitant to scum read anyone? All of your reads come built in with "but I might be wrong." You back pedal on everything you've said so far and leave yourself a way out. Almost as if you are afraid to hard scum read somebody because you know you are lying. I'm quite convinced you are scum leaving yourself as many outs as possible. Okay. I can follow this idea. But... How on earth have you not gone after me? So far pretty much everyone in the thread confirms me as the "King of leaving outs". Even I do that. And yet, you haven't once mentioned me? Seriously? I should be your topscum. At this point, if it wasn't about me, I would actually call you out for distancing. In fact i'm surprised nobody did that yet. 3) On November 04 2016 04:30 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 04:18 Calix wrote:
Reasoning? I didn't like his filter and trust skynx Again, are you serious? You come back in the thread, after 13 hours, and all you do to start is an uncommented vote, and when asked this is your reason this is everything? I mean... at least whine about not having time, etc. But all you had to say on those 180 posts that happened in the meantime was that. Stunning! Actually you promised to look into NU and FM first in your last post before the break. You engaged FM later, but all you did was telling him to learn to read. There was no analysis of him whatsoever. Similarly you also tangled with NU, starting with this post: On November 04 2016 06:30 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:27 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:11 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:09 Tictock wrote:On November 04 2016 06:01 Calix wrote:
But how hard is it to just say something like "oh I was joking" or "I wanted to play the game properly" or something? Maybe I'm just assuming that ExO is as amazingly intelligent as I am, but that doesn't seem like a stretch for scum.
His later behaviour is more concerning to me. I don't really like it and the point which I found the most interesting from him is something that you claim was a joke. (I think) Thats actually kinda my point, town!Exo could have said the same things, or started posting gifs to joke around. What did we see? Him getting butthurt that you called him out for not posting Gifs and attacking you for it. Starting a discussion is EXACTLY what town wants to do. And its exactly what I did. Implying that I wouldn't do that is town is at best misleading. What I did drew a lot of attention to me, you really think thats what I would do as scum? Instead of posting a few gifs and joking around a bit? please. Lynch TT its so obvious at this point On October 31 2016 09:24 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Sure. c: One more /in.
This is what is going to happen this game:
1. I will roll town.
2. Game starts; unoriginal players'll say "First confirmed town!"
3. One town will have a weird or even scummy entry.
4. Calix will tunnel said player. NeverUnlucky will have a good read on Calix based on the tunnel.
5. Said town will claim that the intent behind his entry was to stir up conversation.
6. Everyone will mock him and some will town-read him.
7. Active players’ll shitpost, lurkers’ll lurk.
8. One player will case another player who’ll become the main wagon, but the case is weak, thus :
9. People will initiate a CFD at EoD, and a town will die.
1 to 7, check. 8 and 9 to go. Calix hasn't tunneled anyone. You're full of shit Again not what I would call an analysis. You later gave some weak reads on NUs latest posts, but the "I will look into NU" results posts is still to be seen. 4) Your obsession about your VT claim. Your entire defense seems to be "but I claimed VT" I still can't make sense of it. The way you present it here, claiming VT is the ultimative move early day1. Everyone should do it, and nobody doing it should ever be lynched day1 except by scum players. I'm not buying it. And honestly you can't believe that yourself. Either you completely lack the ability to imagine how others may view the game, or this is just some horrible play. And you repeating it again and again doesnt make it better. If you want to convince me... Try another approach. I'm open to arguments, but that VT bullshit is really tiring me and your obsession with it is making you look more scummy in my eyes. I read your town game. You did much better there. If you are town this game, you are awful. I don't think you are awful from what I've seen, but just feel reminded of your rather similar dota2 scum performance. You are wrong. And this is exactly what I think scum will do. Lynch me, and then say "It was his own horrible play". If I die today take a close look at Mahgrell (I'm looking mostly at you calix as you seem the most level-headed person here) This is a scummy reaction to a good case. Buddying Calix and attacking mahrgell directly instead of attacking his arguments;
He sounded stressed out to me so I offered him an out by inviting him to give some reads. From my experience, constantly putting someone on the defense means that you're left with little information if they flip town and it's generally unpleasant for anyone to be put under that much pressure.
I didn't like his posts after that though and I think that's more telling than anything gleaned from him squirming under pressure. He dropped off considerably after the pressure left (this is suspicious because it's a repeated pattern in his behaviour - he did this at the start of the game too) and none of his reads impressed me. (e.g., his activity reads, while NAI, are shallow)
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On November 04 2016 20:41 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 20:31 Calix wrote:On November 04 2016 20:10 Rels wrote:On November 04 2016 09:01 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 08:59 mahrgell wrote:Exo: 1)my original post about Exo: http://www.liquiddota.com/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=26146963Nothing I said there really changed, even with the newer posts. Honestly while he always calls other ppl to read the tread, his posts don't really strike me as if he had read the thread so far. I guess I have to honorary mention that at least he doesn't ask for summaries all the time. Great upgrade. 2) On November 03 2016 04:46 ExO_ wrote:On November 03 2016 04:44 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:40 mahrgell wrote:On November 03 2016 04:35 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:32 mahrgell wrote:gosh Calix, can we please stop post synced? Also after what I read from you last game I'm afraid of myself, if I share your thoughts... I don't want to be like you Sorry. It's ironic because you're insinuating that I am a bad player...but I'm pretty sure that you misinterpreted what Foreman said. He was calling me scum, not you. I am aware that he is only going after you. But as I share your concern regarding NU... And would like the same answer to be answered... He refuses to answer me, because he considers you to be scum. I don't agree on the policy of "I don't talk to who I consider scum". I consider this antitown, but I understand interpretations on this may differ. But I really dislike the policy of "I don't talk to you, because a player I consider to be scum shared your concerns". This is for sure antitown. So either he considers me scum too, or he is just antitown. Both conclusions are not really giving him any plus points in my book. It is extremely anti-town to ignore anyone save for red-checked players or the like. It shows that he is not willing to reconsider his reads and will be prone to tunnel-vision. (this is something I am specifically trying to avoid) I remain uncertain on Foreman. I'm inclined to scum-read him purely for his pathetic dismissal of my NU case (aka the most substantial post made this game) but I'm biased there as I think my case is pretty good. Furthermore, some of his posts have minor town-tells in them. (nothing convincing though) Concluding null as it stands. How can you be so hesitant to scum read anyone? All of your reads come built in with "but I might be wrong." You back pedal on everything you've said so far and leave yourself a way out. Almost as if you are afraid to hard scum read somebody because you know you are lying. I'm quite convinced you are scum leaving yourself as many outs as possible. Okay. I can follow this idea. But... How on earth have you not gone after me? So far pretty much everyone in the thread confirms me as the "King of leaving outs". Even I do that. And yet, you haven't once mentioned me? Seriously? I should be your topscum. At this point, if it wasn't about me, I would actually call you out for distancing. In fact i'm surprised nobody did that yet. 3) On November 04 2016 04:30 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 04:18 Calix wrote:
Reasoning? I didn't like his filter and trust skynx Again, are you serious? You come back in the thread, after 13 hours, and all you do to start is an uncommented vote, and when asked this is your reason this is everything? I mean... at least whine about not having time, etc. But all you had to say on those 180 posts that happened in the meantime was that. Stunning! Actually you promised to look into NU and FM first in your last post before the break. You engaged FM later, but all you did was telling him to learn to read. There was no analysis of him whatsoever. Similarly you also tangled with NU, starting with this post: On November 04 2016 06:30 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:27 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:11 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:09 Tictock wrote:On November 04 2016 06:01 Calix wrote:
But how hard is it to just say something like "oh I was joking" or "I wanted to play the game properly" or something? Maybe I'm just assuming that ExO is as amazingly intelligent as I am, but that doesn't seem like a stretch for scum.
His later behaviour is more concerning to me. I don't really like it and the point which I found the most interesting from him is something that you claim was a joke. (I think) Thats actually kinda my point, town!Exo could have said the same things, or started posting gifs to joke around. What did we see? Him getting butthurt that you called him out for not posting Gifs and attacking you for it. Starting a discussion is EXACTLY what town wants to do. And its exactly what I did. Implying that I wouldn't do that is town is at best misleading. What I did drew a lot of attention to me, you really think thats what I would do as scum? Instead of posting a few gifs and joking around a bit? please. Lynch TT its so obvious at this point On October 31 2016 09:24 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Sure. c: One more /in.
This is what is going to happen this game:
1. I will roll town.
2. Game starts; unoriginal players'll say "First confirmed town!"
3. One town will have a weird or even scummy entry.
4. Calix will tunnel said player. NeverUnlucky will have a good read on Calix based on the tunnel.
5. Said town will claim that the intent behind his entry was to stir up conversation.
6. Everyone will mock him and some will town-read him.
7. Active players’ll shitpost, lurkers’ll lurk.
8. One player will case another player who’ll become the main wagon, but the case is weak, thus :
9. People will initiate a CFD at EoD, and a town will die.
1 to 7, check. 8 and 9 to go. Calix hasn't tunneled anyone. You're full of shit Again not what I would call an analysis. You later gave some weak reads on NUs latest posts, but the "I will look into NU" results posts is still to be seen. 4) Your obsession about your VT claim. Your entire defense seems to be "but I claimed VT" I still can't make sense of it. The way you present it here, claiming VT is the ultimative move early day1. Everyone should do it, and nobody doing it should ever be lynched day1 except by scum players. I'm not buying it. And honestly you can't believe that yourself. Either you completely lack the ability to imagine how others may view the game, or this is just some horrible play. And you repeating it again and again doesnt make it better. If you want to convince me... Try another approach. I'm open to arguments, but that VT bullshit is really tiring me and your obsession with it is making you look more scummy in my eyes. I read your town game. You did much better there. If you are town this game, you are awful. I don't think you are awful from what I've seen, but just feel reminded of your rather similar dota2 scum performance. You are wrong. And this is exactly what I think scum will do. Lynch me, and then say "It was his own horrible play". If I die today take a close look at Mahgrell (I'm looking mostly at you calix as you seem the most level-headed person here) This is a scummy reaction to a good case. Buddying Calix and attacking mahrgell directly instead of attacking his arguments; He sounded stressed out to me so I offered him an out by inviting him to give some reads. From my experience, constantly putting someone on the defense means that you're left with little information if they flip town and it's generally unpleasant for anyone to be put under that much pressure. I didn't like his posts after that though and I think that's more telling than anything gleaned from him squirming under pressure. He dropped off considerably after the pressure left (this is suspicious because it's a repeated pattern in his behaviour - he did this at the start of the game too) and none of his reads impressed me. (e.g., his activity reads, while NAI, are shallow) Yep he has moved in my scumreads. Every post he made yesterday was a defense post, then he just left when he had nothing else to do.
Of the three players that you listed, ExO is by far the most appropriate lynch. The difference can be summed up like this:
TT is proactive and aggressive.
ExO is reactive.
It would take a stretch to think that TT is a better lynch.
I am actually going to unvote you now. I'm curious as to this Rels vs darthfoley scenario that seems to be taking place and I think that it deserves more attention. That's just not going to happen if either of you two die today.
##unvote Rels
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To expand on my Rels vs DF reasoning, I think it's good to foster this because:
A) Neither of you two have been pressured that much so it's a good change in direction.
B) I actually like your thoughts on DF. I found his response to your first post against him to be unsatisfactory so you may be onto something here.
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On November 04 2016 20:54 Rels wrote:Skynx has a real shot at being scum too. A lot of his posts just look like fake to me, faking a "not-caring" tone. To compare with Foreman, it looks like Skynx is trying to appear not caring, while Foreman just doesn't care and wite stuff that he thinks. And I know weaker scums tend to do that after losing scumgames 'cause it's easier to play. And I know Skynx is not a very good scum player. These posts make me think that: + Show Spoiler +On November 03 2016 04:12 Skynx wrote:
Man you guys are way too fun to read On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? On November 03 2016 04:58 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 04:56 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? To generate conversation so that the not-yet-here people have something constructive to add, of course. What is your strategy to find scum if we're doing a poor job of it? Add something constructive when i find opportunity to do so. Like I'm doing now, stopping you guys go overboard with surjective NAI stuff cuz it really means absolutely nothing what you guys accuse each other for in past few pages  On November 03 2016 05:10 Skynx wrote:
I mean I really dunno what to add here, its just NAI guys.
Can we talk about like flowers and butterflies? On November 03 2016 05:15 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2016 05:11 Foreman wrote:On November 03 2016 05:05 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 05:00 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:58 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:56 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:54 Skynx wrote:On November 03 2016 04:53 Calix wrote:On November 03 2016 04:50 Skynx wrote:
None of what happened so far is AI guys please... Then do something that will make AI posts happen. What is the point of sitting around and complaining that people are making early reads exactly? What is the point of spamming bunch of stuff that doesn't have anything to do with anything other than increasing postcount for people that are not here yet? To generate conversation so that the not-yet-here people have something constructive to add, of course. What is your strategy to find scum if we're doing a poor job of it? Add something constructive when i find opportunity to do so. Like I'm doing now, stopping you guys go overboard with surjective NAI stuff cuz it really means absolutely nothing what you guys accuse each other for in past few pages Oh wonderful, that means that you can tell us how my case on NU doesn't show scum-indicative behaviour Do you have any reads at all? I'm skeptical that you have no initial impressions at all. Here is what happened; Calix sr Exo (gif stuff) Exo sr Calix (doesn't like his push) Everyone sr Everyone (because all pushes are very surjective and doesn't mean anything and everyone is aware of that so might aswell sr the others) What you are asking right now makes sense in that regard as me suggesting you guys pushing NAI stuff on eachother means I should also sr you guys but its just not right and this is all really nothing productive in the end. Here is what happened: Skynx entered thread Skynx complained about unproductive content Skynx provided unproductive content What you are doing right now is worse than anything you've complained about, because you should be of the mindset that providing even more unproductive content would only make our situation worse, given your remarks. Well, Calix is the one to make me explain how NAI stuff is NAI you can blame him for that if you really want to. I'm just here to drink milk and fuck bitches. On November 03 2016 22:17 Skynx wrote:
I only like darth so far for making sense with his posts while keeping it short and meaningfull.
I hate TT's reads in p15 or something they are literally the worst. He deserves a vote but I'll touch on this a bit later on.
Exo's reads are quite bad aswell but less bad than TT.
Haven't read Rels yet.
Rest is bad and should feel bad for being able to spam this much and actually say nothing of worth.
I'm gona vote for a stfu lynch on the biggest filter for now before i actually get a time to read in detail cuz this shit is unacceptable. Actually, his only real content were in his 2 huge wall posts. I disagree with pretty much everything he's said in it. A lot of it is just logical mistakes that are not scum tells.
I felt a similar way about darthfoley's case on TT, not Skynx.
Skynx was just lynched as scum in that Dota game, although you seem to know that already. He was relying a lot on fake anger and yelling that XYZ was mafia without pushing for their lynch.
However I am bad at reading emotions. I agree that Foreman's persona seems more authentic but I don't think that means that Skynx is faking it.
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Obligatory useless vote to make sure that I don't get mod-killed.
##vote ExO_
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I'm going to laugh if ExO is mafia and TT/ NU/ mahrgell/ myself are ALL town because that would be the most epic spew.
Call me unrealistically optimistic.
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On November 04 2016 21:36 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 21:23 Calix wrote:
I'm going to laugh if ExO is mafia and TT/ NU/ mahrgell/ myself are ALL town because that would be the most epic spew.
Call me unrealistically optimistic. LOL it might actually be the case
Finished reading Skynx' ISO yet?
As it stands, I'm thinking that we're in an ExO/ darthfoley world. I'm thinking this because:
1. You make good points against him.
2. I remember that he made that poor TT case and I'm going to check now, but if he made that after ExO was starting to get votes or whatever then I'm going to be really suspicious of him. (shameless pre-flip association but hey)
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On November 04 2016 21:44 Calix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 21:36 Rels wrote:On November 04 2016 21:23 Calix wrote:
I'm going to laugh if ExO is mafia and TT/ NU/ mahrgell/ myself are ALL town because that would be the most epic spew.
Call me unrealistically optimistic. LOL it might actually be the case Finished reading Skynx' ISO yet? As it stands, I'm thinking that we're in an ExO/ darthfoley world. I'm thinking this because: 1. You make good points against him. 2. I remember that he made that poor TT case and I'm going to check now, but if he made that after ExO was starting to get votes or whatever then I'm going to be really suspicious of him. (shameless pre-flip association but hey)
Update: Checked his case and the last page before that. darthfoley was getting questioned by Rels/ NU and darthfoley was being critical of ExO. darthfoley later voted for mahrgell although this wagon is not a popular one.
I'm concluding that the evidence is not strong enough to form a pre-flip association.
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He can go in the townpile for now since he's making more sense, so I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. If I'm wrong on one of ExO/ darthfoley then I would revisit him.
Also I thought I had posted my updated list. Well here it is:
MAFIA
ExO (too much scummy behaviour to justify from a town POV at this point)
darthfoley (Rels made another point against him that I agree with)
Rels (has made some decent points for/ against players as of late, can be given the benefit of the doubt for now)
Tictock (goes down a notch for recent tinfoil but if ExO is mafia then he's almost-always town since he was the counter-wagon)
Skynx (depends on what he does next)
Foreman (good tone, content is questionable but he doesn't give a fuck)
mahrgell
NeverUnlucky
Calix
TOWN
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On November 04 2016 22:08 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Also, why did you town-read ExO before?
Because I thought that his actions made more sense from "shit town" than "mafia" since I think his early play is sub-optimal for mafia and I still don't quite get why he would do it as scum. I think I gave him the benefit of the doubt for too long but given that nobody else was, I don't think that's a bad thing.
But that doubt is not strong enough to override the mountain of evidence against him at this point, thus he is probably mafia and a great lynch.
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On November 05 2016 00:14 Tictock wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 06:37 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:36 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:34 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:32 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:30 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:27 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:11 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:09 Tictock wrote:On November 04 2016 06:01 Calix wrote:
But how hard is it to just say something like "oh I was joking" or "I wanted to play the game properly" or something? Maybe I'm just assuming that ExO is as amazingly intelligent as I am, but that doesn't seem like a stretch for scum.
His later behaviour is more concerning to me. I don't really like it and the point which I found the most interesting from him is something that you claim was a joke. (I think) Thats actually kinda my point, town!Exo could have said the same things, or started posting gifs to joke around. What did we see? Him getting butthurt that you called him out for not posting Gifs and attacking you for it. Starting a discussion is EXACTLY what town wants to do. And its exactly what I did. Implying that I wouldn't do that is town is at best misleading. What I did drew a lot of attention to me, you really think thats what I would do as scum? Instead of posting a few gifs and joking around a bit? please. Lynch TT its so obvious at this point On October 31 2016 09:24 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Sure. c: One more /in.
This is what is going to happen this game:
1. I will roll town.
2. Game starts; unoriginal players'll say "First confirmed town!"
3. One town will have a weird or even scummy entry.
4. Calix will tunnel said player. NeverUnlucky will have a good read on Calix based on the tunnel.
5. Said town will claim that the intent behind his entry was to stir up conversation.
6. Everyone will mock him and some will town-read him.
7. Active players’ll shitpost, lurkers’ll lurk.
8. One player will case another player who’ll become the main wagon, but the case is weak, thus :
9. People will initiate a CFD at EoD, and a town will die.
1 to 7, check. 8 and 9 to go. Calix hasn't tunneled anyone. You're full of shit Who's not reading the game now? Are you serious? lol. Show me where Calix is tunneling, and not actively considering all reads and possibilities. Give me a break Pointless argument, dismissed. If you're going to acuse Calix of tunneling, you better be able to back it up. Calix you Town reading NU? because if you're scum reading him I think he might be a decent lynch today I not so subtly hinted at this last night, and coming back to it today I can't help but reach the same conclusion. Doesn't the bolded line look line something meant for a scum QT? Is this a massive slip or am I crazy?
No it doesn't.
Why would scum!ExO make a post meant for the scum QT in the same post that he talks to NU?
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On November 05 2016 00:33 Tictock wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2016 00:23 Calix wrote:On November 05 2016 00:14 Tictock wrote:On November 04 2016 06:37 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:36 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:34 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:32 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:30 ExO_ wrote:On November 04 2016 06:27 NeverUnlucky wrote:On November 04 2016 06:11 ExO_ wrote:
[quote]
Starting a discussion is EXACTLY what town wants to do. And its exactly what I did. Implying that I wouldn't do that is town is at best misleading. What I did drew a lot of attention to me, you really think thats what I would do as scum? Instead of posting a few gifs and joking around a bit?
please.
Lynch TT its so obvious at this point On October 31 2016 09:24 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Sure. c: One more /in.
This is what is going to happen this game:
1. I will roll town.
2. Game starts; unoriginal players'll say "First confirmed town!"
3. One town will have a weird or even scummy entry.
4. Calix will tunnel said player. NeverUnlucky will have a good read on Calix based on the tunnel.
5. Said town will claim that the intent behind his entry was to stir up conversation.
6. Everyone will mock him and some will town-read him.
7. Active players’ll shitpost, lurkers’ll lurk.
8. One player will case another player who’ll become the main wagon, but the case is weak, thus :
9. People will initiate a CFD at EoD, and a town will die.
1 to 7, check. 8 and 9 to go. Calix hasn't tunneled anyone. You're full of shit Who's not reading the game now? Are you serious? lol. Show me where Calix is tunneling, and not actively considering all reads and possibilities. Give me a break Pointless argument, dismissed. If you're going to acuse Calix of tunneling, you better be able to back it up. Calix you Town reading NU? because if you're scum reading him I think he might be a decent lynch today I not so subtly hinted at this last night, and coming back to it today I can't help but reach the same conclusion. Doesn't the bolded line look line something meant for a scum QT? Is this a massive slip or am I crazy? No it doesn't. Why would scum!ExO make a post meant for the scum QT in the same post that he talks to NU? Thats why it's called a slip. I have to admit it's a shitty way to be found out if you are scum kus you've been playing really well. It makes a ton of sense though, kus you've been really weird about your reads on both myself and Exo. You townread Exo forever without ever having reasons to (you even said yourself, you just didn't see the scum modivations but didn't have any reasons to TR him). Most of pages 30-40 you keep talking like you could go either way on me and keep telling people to look at the case on me, never try to come to much of a conclusion yourself. You also made that really paranoid response when I asked you about your townread on Exo. The more I've thought about it the more it makes sense.
No, it ISN'T a slip because it's clearly not a post meant for the scum QT because otherwise the NU comment wouldn't be there.
I wasn't 'going either way on you'. I've been going through most of the game thinking that it's TvT and only took a closer look at you two recently before deciding that ExO is a better lynch than you. Being a black sheep with regards to ExO isn't scummy.
I'm not going to waste anymore time with your dumb tinfoil theory. If you actually think this, you're going to have to case me and maybe then you'll get some sense knocked into you.
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That's a lot of words to say "I think NU has dropped off since his opening posts"
NU did explain his 'historically speaking' post with some weird Kenpachi thing.
I don't understand what half of your reasons even mean. The cow emoticon, why you included NU's post about being 'mod-confirmed', something about his reasoning for voting ExO.
???
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On November 05 2016 01:04 darthfoley wrote:
I'm getting a tad paranoid with the one train lynch ???
Happened in my last scum game too. I am assuming that it's for a similar reason if ExO is mafia - scum are cutting their losses by bussing because he is indefensible.
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Going from my last post, that would incriminate DF, Rels, myself in particular since we were late voters and made a case on ExO before voting even though he was definitely getting lynched at those points.
I can't blame TT for thinking that I'm mafia with ExO. It's not like I had anything to do with getting ExO lynched. Sure, he's going for the obvious target because I was town-reading ExO and thus that looks obviously bad if ExO is scum. I think it's reasonable to suspect me based on that even though there's not much I can say on that front. Too bad that he had to ruin it by going into tunnel-territory with "EXO SCUM-SLIPPED THAT HE'S MAFIA WITH CALIX"
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On November 05 2016 01:21 Skynx wrote:
I mean Exo did some bad stuff guys, as i quoted previous page.
However, can someone please give me some solid arguments that makes him objective scum like TT and NU?
Other than him being defensive all the time which is not even a reason anymore and makes sense as everyone is scumreading him.
How is NU objective scum? I saw nothing of the sort in your case.
I also disagree that TT is 'objective scum'.
I'm also not sure how you missed all of the ExO posts with regards to the early game/ TT's case/ Rels' post before he voted for ExO/ my posts prior to voting for ExO/ darthfoley's post before voting for ExO. I'm not saying that everything in those posts I've flagged up meets your criteria of 'objective scum' but there's definitely a better case for ExO compared to TT/ NU.
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EPT
