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Who Wants to be a Millionaire Cell Mini Mafia - Page 4
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darthfoley
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On February 26 2016 02:15 nnn_thekushmountains wrote: The ugh at the end indicates frustration right? Why are you frustrated over an easy scum lynch? Yea i'm frustrated. Because I spent half of my cycle wasting my breath defending someone who has turned out to be mega obvious mafia, while getting almost universally wrongly scum read for it. It's great if we successfully used our 50/50 and go up 1:0, but town would be in an amazing decision if we go up 2:0 after my cell and if I can't change people's minds, that won't happen. Can't remember who said it, but I endorse using the audience power for my group too unless there's some obvious reason i'm missing. Going up 2:0 should basically ensure a town win. | ||
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Anyways, what does everyone think about using the audience on my cell after we get the 99% Breshke scum flip? | ||
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 I even rechecked my role PM and I am indeed Town | ||
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Breshke is read scum by people Everyone knows Ritoky will likely use 50/50 on the cell I decide to go super out of my way to reverse buss Breshke while my three other mafia teammates buss him I put a huge target on my back Breshke goes AFK Everyone scum reads me Breshke gets killed, town up 1:0 I get killed, town up 2:0 like this is really unlikely and super super dumb mafia play | ||
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On February 26 2016 07:22 ritoky wrote: btw audience this one or hold it? opinions? esp with breshke currently afk and unsure when/if he is coming back in the next 23 hrs, it means we have an obs QT that has 0 mafia influence or at most 1 in like 15. I think we should use it. This cell is important for town and I want to make sure town has as much info as possible. If we go up 2:0 we'll be in the drivers seat. I hadn't thought of the mafia influence angle, but that's another good reason to use | ||
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On February 26 2016 07:02 sicklucker wrote: darth i wanna hear alot from you today. your in a weird spot because your vs two of my only townreads. But I dont acualy scum read you?. im voting you now but it could change I will filter dive Rels and LS. I'm more than willing to answer people's questions. As you said, i'm in a tough spot because people are meta town reading my cellmates, making me PoE mafia instead of actually having a mafia read on me which is rather annoying. At least that's the vibe i've gotten from everyone not in my cell. Even LS is PoE mafia me! Either way, Rels or LS is aware of their town meta and are exploiting it to great use so far. From what a few players were saying early game, I tend to think Rels is the more likely candidate to be able to emulate town play as scum-- at least that's what someone said early on who had experience with scum!Rels. My biggest defense right now is that if i'm mafia I've played a terribly stupid game. Now that might be believable in a regular mafia game, but there are other 4 mafia members who didn't tell me to cut it out early on. The smart mafia TEAM move is to buss Breshke, win cell 2 and consolidate from there. No way mafia sticks their neck out for a completely AFK Breshke. Think that was proven by Breshke not providing any information in the last 24h for town to decipher. I ask Kush, Shapelog or anyone who saw my scum or town play; does it really feel like i'm playing as mafia right now? Or are you just PoE stratting right now? I've been way more engaged, posted my thoughts-- even if they're unpopular-- and cared more than in my scum game in which I just went with whatever was hip and cool at the time. Anyways I realize this isn't enough, so I will accompany it with cell reads later. I have confidence that we can win this cell and I won't give up until the end of the day | ||
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Pretty sure I was the first person to seriously question the Breshke universal scumread, followed by Kuragari and then Vivax. Maybe i'm forgetting someone. Anyways, my argument never got any traction so good mafia would've still voted or stayed on Breshke imo | ||
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either i'm too scummy to be scum, but I don't even think i've been scummy and most people have me as PoE right now or Rels/LS is exactly like their meta town because they're aware of their meta because they're better and more experienced players than I am | ||
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On February 26 2016 22:30 Rels wrote: DF is scum and you should vote him 1. His townread on Breshke was bad His townread on Breshke was based on two reasons. First: + Show Spoiler + On February 23 2016 16:05 darthfoley wrote: I know Breshke hasn't posted much but I liked this post of his Why would mafia not want an AFK party near the end? Also, didn't particularly like Kush's response While that's true, you're kinda just kicking the can down the road if you want to keep AFK people in longer. Wouldn't town benefit longer from having many active players left in longer? On February 24 2016 10:39 darthfoley wrote: I don't think any of these posts are bad, and they give me a towny vibe from Breshke. You don't have to be running for mayor to care about cell order. This sounds like someone trying to work through the strategy of cell order from town perspective. Breshke posted a few questions at the very beginning of the game. These questions were completely NAI if taken alone, and scum indicative as a whole as it's the only thing Breshke had done N0. DF townreading Breshke for this reason does not make sense: this read is fabricated. Second reason: + Show Spoiler + On February 25 2016 05:33 darthfoley wrote: VA I've never said that i'm set in my scum read of you. But when 8/15 people have already voted for Breshke, and there are 5/15 mafia in the game, I don't like the optics. To switch gears a bit, your post implies that you can't be convinced that LS is mafia, why? Too many people voted Breshke in a row, so Breshke has to be town. Well, first this number is wrong: 6 people voted in a row when DF made this post. This migth mean nothing but it's way less extreme than DF made it out to be. Secondly, he had kinda the same reaction to Palmar being lynched D1 in Star Wars; and Palmar flipped scum. He should have learned that several people piling on a guy doesn't m ean the guy is town. This looks like he used his star wars game town meta to create an excuse to townread Breshke. 2. His reaction to my VA read is not understandable DF is suspicious of me because of my "bad VA town read". But he's saying at the same time VA could be town. Vivax pressured him on that since why would I invent a reason to townread VA just to have an excuse to shit on my partner Breshke. His answer: He dodges the question and says "Rels could be town actually". No explanation as to why he thought my VA read made me scum. Later and even now he continues to be suspicious about me with the vague reason that I "did scummy stuff". Since he agreed I could be town and he just misunderstood my words on VA, I have no idea what "scummy stuff" he is talking about now. 3. He's making the difference between my VA read and ritoky's VA read when it's the same ritoky and I had the same read with different words on VA. It doesn't make sense that he townreads ritoky for it and scurmeads me in the same time. These reads are fabricated. 4. He's spending a lot of time self metaing to prove his townieness He's actually spending more time defending himself than doing anything else, especially lately. Here is a compilation of posts: + Show Spoiler + On February 25 2016 04:53 darthfoley wrote: I find it ironic that i'm playing pretty much EXACTLY how I played Star Wars D1 last game and was universally (correctly) town read for it, but here all of a sudden everyone scum reads me. I was sort of a devil's advocate in Star Wars because I really didn't like the way the Palmar wagon was shaping up. It was basically one wagon with no alternative and everyone was jumping on; I feel similarly regarding Breshke and VA right now. Everyone scum reading the same person, especially in a game with 5!!!! scum, makes me suuuuper uneasy. @Shapelog Meta reading me in Newbie vs. this game is completely different. This is themed, and I'm playing with much better and more experienced players. I am playing a similar game compared to Star Wars: I am willing to sheep people who are better at the game and I have read town, but I am also willing to point out logical inconsistencies and uneasy wagons when I see them. Maybe Breshke is scum who has just gone AFK or whatever and people are trying to jump on him and get town cred, but it makes no sense for scum!darthfoley to be the only one willing to defend/challenge conventional wisdom. On February 25 2016 05:01 darthfoley wrote: Okay, let's accept your premise that breshke is 100% scum. Why does my defense of him make me scum? You literally played with me last game and I did the same thing with Palmar when I was town. Not seeing why you are so attached with this being alignment indicative On February 25 2016 05:26 darthfoley wrote: well i think i've explained why I think things relatively thoroughly so far. Do you want clarification on something? Also @VA, people weren't really scum reading me in a serious way until I started to defend Breshke. From a mafia POV, what's the point of sticking your neck out for a cell that is almost certainly going to get 50/50'd if your scum partner is the heavily scum read person in it? Does this game remind you at all of my scum play in Unoriginal? I'd say it's about as different as you could be. On February 25 2016 17:09 darthfoley wrote: Yea exactly. I'm just gonna stop overthinking things in the future if Breshke is flips obvious mafia kinda like palmar in the Star Wars game lol On February 25 2016 18:30 darthfoley wrote: this is actually so annoying and i'm going to be quite peeved when either of the confirmed town LS or Rels comes back as mafia and we lose the cell. Rels I accidentally looked at the mayor count vote instead of the VA/Breshke vote. My point is still valid and idk why accidentally writing 8 instead of 6 makes me confirmed scum. I later explained my logic after that post Rels. I really don't know why you guys think I would choose my hill to die on D1 defending my completely afk scum teammate when I could just bus him for town points like probably the rest of mafia are doing right now. i t m a k e s n o s e n s e On February 25 2016 18:36 darthfoley wrote: Yes. It is similar to my Star Wars game D1 regarding Palmar/Zyrre. Granted I was wrong in that game, but I really don't like when someone goes AFK and all of a sudden EVERYONE is scum reading that person, ESPECIALLY with the other person (VA) not doing anything imo to warrant the town reads he is getting On February 26 2016 04:40 darthfoley wrote: Yea i'm frustrated. Because I spent half of my cycle wasting my breath defending someone who has turned out to be mega obvious mafia, while getting almost universally wrongly scum read for it. It's great if we successfully used our 50/50 and go up 1:0, but town would be in an amazing decision if we go up 2:0 after my cell and if I can't change people's minds, that won't happen. Can't remember who said it, but I endorse using the audience power for my group too unless there's some obvious reason i'm missing. Going up 2:0 should basically ensure a town win. On February 26 2016 06:56 darthfoley wrote: Just wanna say that the theory that i'm scum is: Breshke is read scum by people Everyone knows Ritoky will likely use 50/50 on the cell I decide to go super out of my way to reverse buss Breshke while my three other mafia teammates buss him I put a huge target on my back Breshke goes AFK Everyone scum reads me Breshke gets killed, town up 1:0 I get killed, town up 2:0 like this is really unlikely and super super dumb mafia play On February 26 2016 09:38 darthfoley wrote: I will filter dive Rels and LS. I'm more than willing to answer people's questions. As you said, i'm in a tough spot because people are meta town reading my cellmates, making me PoE mafia instead of actually having a mafia read on me which is rather annoying. At least that's the vibe i've gotten from everyone not in my cell. Even LS is PoE mafia me! Either way, Rels or LS is aware of their town meta and are exploiting it to great use so far. From what a few players were saying early game, I tend to think Rels is the more likely candidate to be able to emulate town play as scum-- at least that's what someone said early on who had experience with scum!Rels. My biggest defense right now is that if i'm mafia I've played a terribly stupid game. Now that might be believable in a regular mafia game, but there are other 4 mafia members who didn't tell me to cut it out early on. The smart mafia TEAM move is to buss Breshke, win cell 2 and consolidate from there. No way mafia sticks their neck out for a completely AFK Breshke. Think that was proven by Breshke not providing any information in the last 24h for town to decipher. I ask Kush, Shapelog or anyone who saw my scum or town play; does it really feel like i'm playing as mafia right now? Or are you just PoE stratting right now? I've been way more engaged, posted my thoughts-- even if they're unpopular-- and cared more than in my scum game in which I just went with whatever was hip and cool at the time. Anyways I realize this isn't enough, so I will accompany it with cell reads later. I have confidence that we can win this cell and I won't give up until the end of the day On February 26 2016 09:45 darthfoley wrote: That's fair. But no one has yet to "get" me on what my supposed endgame as mafia is from my D1 play. Kuragari and I with a bit of Vivax were the only ones who were skeptical of VA, and they are both in later cells. Why would mafia risk losing 2 cells in a row right at the beginning by trying to save a sunken ship? I might be less experienced than some players, but i'm not that dumb. This seems so obvious to me man. It's clear imo that mafia is in a less than ideal situation, and going down 0:2 is desperation mode. Breshke just takes one for the team and cell 2 becomes almost a must win for mafia. Who seems to be playing in must-win-this-cell mode? 5. His attitude before the 50/50 looked like he was scum with Breshke and waiting to see who the 50/50 ends up being on Here is my post on him at the time: 6. He's STILL undecided on who is scum between LS and I He started by shitting on my reads. Then when I fought back he switched to LS on the "LS scumread me when my reads align with him" thing. Since then he's been undecided. He doesn't know which one of us is scum. Like point 5 where he was undecided between VA and FF, it looks like he's waiting to see who is the easier mislynch between LS and I. Actually here is his last post in the thread: No answer. 7. NOT A REASON: him defending Breshke is NOT town indicative Him defending Breshke is not scum indicative per se (except it is since his reasonning for townreading Breshke is fabricated). But it is NOT town indicative. This is a game where you win when you get to three points. You scum team can have the best scum in the world, he is only going to bring his team 1 point if he's not lynched. He's not going to carry the game. In a standard game this defense of "I wouldn't defend my partner hardcore" would be a little more true. Just a little bit, as scum usually don't push or defend each other hardcore. But in this game, where if VA had been lynched scum team would have gotten 1 point, and DF is going to be out of the game after today anyway, there is NO advantages to bus your teammate, as the end result in the best case scenario is a draw. Conclusion Lynch him, gets free point. Defense against this case which has some serious flaws in it: 1. My read on Breshke was not fabricated. I thought that his point regarding leaving active players in the game longer was town indicative, because that's the most beneficial strategy to town imo. We got an AFK cell out of the way early (to the detriment of Breshke) and we got a point out of it. Idk how that post is scum indicative. Also you calling me confirmed scum because I accidentally cited the mayor VC instead of the D1 VC right below is really dumb. "It's way less extreme than it's made out to be" 6/14 and 8/14 is not an "extreme difference." If I had said 11/14 or something, you'd have a point. 2. You are acting like YOU making a shitty town read on VA and VA being town are mutually exclusive. News flash, scum often town read people for bad or illogical reasoning. My point was this: I think it could've been argued that VA was being more towny than Breshke via meta or something, but I strongly disagreed with your original reason to town read VA: "aggressivly posting his thoughts and scumreads." There was nothing aggressive about his play. I've seen aggressive VA town play against ME, which you can read here and there was nothing in his filter at the time that warranted being called aggressive, him posting a few names with no explanation is not aggressive. He never provided any explanation on any of the things you called "aggressive". Again, this strikes me as a potential fabricated reason to claim a TR on someone while bussing your afk scummate. The reason why I said you could be town is that I have seen multiple times where two towns have tunneled each other because they just simply interpret the same information completely differently, and draw the conclusion that the other MUST be mafia because no one would ever disagree with their godlike reads. 3. Ritoky said VA was doing his "town meta thing" and being a dick. Those are not the same attributes as someone playing aggressively. I'm more likely to believe Ritoky because of the percentages, but his read makes a lot more sense to me than you claiming VA was going after people and being aggressive when he wasn't. 4. I'm not spending time meta'ing myself to "prove" i'm towny. I also find it so fucking annoying that meta'ing myself is considered scummy when people have literally crossed LS, you, or both off the list almost solely imo on meta reads. Like how the fuck can someone not be able to fake rage in all caps. Serrrrrioously? I'm frustrated because one of you is using your meta to your advantage cleverly and i'm getting shit for trying to point out the discrepancies in my town vs. scum play. Also @Kush you say I am not good mafia therefore it's likely that I tried to yolo save Breshke basically by myself. Yet bad mafia are bad because they can't change their meta; which is it? Are you suggesting that I did a complete 180 from my Unoriginal game where I flip flopped on everything and didn't engage with my teammates at all, and now i'm not only defending my scummate, i'm putting myself AND MY TEAM in a terrible situation of going down 0:2 because I was scumread-- oh, and I didn't have anyone in QT telling me not to? If you actually think that, I think I deserve an apology when I flip town. and Rels, who On February 26 2016 19:50 Rels wrote: It does. I am a strong scum, I could have maybe get VA lynched instead of Breshke. Probably not but I would have probably tried, then use that same defense DF is using right now: "hey if I was scum I wouldn't have defended my partner like that!". Even if I didn't try, I would have never pushed my partner like I did, especially before knowing FF was confirmed town. Okay, you contend that you are a strong scum, so you could've defended Breshke and gotten VA lynched. Yet you also seem to suggest that I am NOT strong scum, so I wasn't going to get VA lynched. I guess I just forgot how shitty my scum play was last game, and thought I could Rambo my way through a 50/50 teammate save. You say you probably would've tried; I contend that you wouldn't have, because you're smart scum. - It was pretty clear to most people there was a high chance 50/50 is gonna be used on cell 1 - Last thing you want as mafia cell 2, is to look bad on a cell that's 50/50. Let me explain: even if you win the cell, you will most likely get scum read for it and lose the second cell, so at best you're tied 1:1; at worst, you defend Breshke hardcore, he flips scum, then you die and you're down 0:2. You're smart and realize this, and you can-- on the surface-- incriminate me for my play, so you just decide to do that. - In short, mafia would never choose a 50/50 cell 1 to be their Waterloo when they're in cell 2 and their cell 1 mate has been AFK forever; the chances of going down 0:2 are just too damn high, and Rels is the type of person to be aware of this. Mafia almost certainly loses if they go down 0:2 early. 5. You claim I didn't commit to a read on Breshke's cell before the 50/50 in fear, but I LITERALLY DID. It was basically Breshke town lean, FF null, VA scum lean. That isn't having a null read on everyone and winging it. You even quoted it. Now it's fine to disagree with my reads, but to claim I didn't have reads is misrepresenting me once again 6. My line of questioning against LS regarding his similar reads with me but also scum reading me is probably one of the most towny things I've done all game. To think that you're trying to spin it into some bullshit scum read about being unsure is just that: bullshit. News flash to you, I know one of you two are mafia, but at that time I was unsure. Naturally i'm gonna point out scummy looking things from the two of you. Another bad, bad evidence piece from someone who is normally good at cases... when you're town. 7. You contend that me defending Breshke isn't town indicative; well I suggest that your bus of Breshke is not town indicative either, specifically because of the 50/50 mechanic. You are a much better mafia to be town read than Breshke. You can affect the game more being in for two days, and being town read for two whole cells. Best part is, when you lynch me, town isn't told whether you or LS is mafia, so cell 2 is much more important than cell 1 for a mafia down 0:1, in that sense. One last thing: I think Rels not wanting to use audience is scum indicative. While it would be a bummer to use both powers on two cells, the potential to go up 2:0 as town is CERTAINLY worth it. We should also keep in mind that the audience will probably not be as engaged later in the game per what ritoky said, and right now there is at most like 1/howevermany mafia influence. Compared to 50/50, audience gets exponentially less reliable as the game goes on, so Rels wanting to "save" it for later when more mafia are in the obs qt, and fewer obs people are paying attention, is ideal from mafia pov. Let's remember On February 23 2016 12:35 LightningStrike wrote: Darth corrected himself after remembering Star Wars was played with with our entire cell lol......... It was true I did get townread pretty quickly in that game compared to Onegu so(shrugs). Darth just never had the pleasure of having to deal with scum Rels twice(His scum game was pretty solid). About people's responses to your post: Ritoky does have a decent point about my cell being easier to read as the game goes on. Doesn't help Rels haven't posted yet :\ Few things about LS: read through his filter, and besides the one post I didn't like, there wasn't much from scum pov imo. I also think he was town read as quickly as Star Wars by people who know him better than I do, so I think he's more likely to be town than Rels. TL;DR: I'm not mafia. Who's mafia in my cell? Rels. Way too much cherry picking, misrepresenting and illogical reads from a smart town perspective imo. | ||
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Is that your FINAL answer? | ||
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