TL Mafia LXXII: Gaiden 2

On August 11 2015 19:00 Blazinghand wrote:
I always perceived the basic problem with majority lynch that people were unwilling to change wagons and that it's hard to get majorities because people fear no-lynch. With an extendable deadline and no fear of that, that solves the problem. What's your perspective?

On August 12 2015 21:15 rsoultin wrote:
also ye rolling majority lynches if i roll scum again will make me want to shoot myself in the face. possibly multiple times. so not a fan

On August 13 2015 17:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
marv join this i wirte you more letters and towncases.

On August 24 2015 19:00 Fidei86 wrote:
What does that make Tina then, the satan of the spampocalypse?

<3

On August 24 2015 21:01 Half the Sky wrote:
She was 40+ in Gaiden.

On August 26 2015 10:36 VisceraEyes wrote:

Why are you posting to say this? Because I find marv posting like Palmar instead of marv to be noteworthy. Just as, I'm assuming, you find me popping on saying only that to be noteworthy.

On August 26 2015 11:41 rsoultin wrote:
now, if marv is town (and scum would know he is) he's not going to be a very happy camper when he wakes up to stupidity and turns on the marv!town charm complete with that lovely ability to get people lynched just because he's marv. so you two are probably town (but idiotic)

On August 26 2015 18:47 Palmar wrote:
so what you're saying that WoS is 100% mafia and we should lynch you if he ever flips town marv? Am I getting this right?

On August 26 2015 19:03 Palmar wrote:
Also what version of marv is naive enough to think I remember/believe/acknowledge my own mistakes and adjust to them in future games?

On August 26 2015 19:15 Palmar wrote:
Like do you disagree? Do you think there's a good chance rsoultin is mafia?

On August 26 2015 20:14 rsoultin wrote:
palmar is town then or is this a aw you're so cutely awful rsoul don't worry your (maybe) pretty head?

On August 26 2015 20:15 rsoultin wrote:


then i don't understand :/

On August 26 2015 20:44 rsoultin wrote:


pssst if you're talking about alpha particles, that sounds a lot "cooler" than it actually is lol ><

-poofs for realsies-

On August 26 2015 21:54 rsoultin wrote:


>> we can quibble but it would be better if you said anything worth saying so i at least feel good about it when i decide you're town and don't do it for just awful reasons like...well...marv was so rude xP

On August 26 2015 21:59 Palmar wrote:

I DON'T EXPLAIN THINGS TO MAFIA

On August 26 2015 22:09 Palmar wrote:

Are you an accomplice?

On August 26 2015 22:09 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
VE is def town because he is withholding information. As odd as that sounds, I'd think mafia would be more self-conscious about coming out early in the day and claiming to have some reads but refuse to give them until an unspecified later time.

On August 26 2015 22:11 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Methinks the JAT is town.

On August 26 2015 22:13 Palmar wrote:

a) I've repeatedly and often bragged about being the one person who lynches you correctly on day 1 (it's true, mind you) so awaiting my opinion on you is to be expected.

b) Even if you find it unreasonable JAT is making it out to be something we should investigate Trfel on, which is complete bullshit. There is no way trfel is mafia because of this. If he is mafia, this is the last reason he is.

On August 26 2015 22:15 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:


Jat is town because he didn't just fall over to Palmar's pressure. He defended his position on the Trfel read and called it the most relevant thing in the thread.

On August 26 2015 22:16 rsoultin wrote:
kinda like cheesecake even though i don't necessarily agree with his reasoning lol...intelligent life

On August 26 2015 22:22 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I didn't actually read why palmar townread rsoultin I just saw that he said "Rsoultin is 2% mafia" and agreed :p

On August 26 2015 22:24 rsoultin wrote:


tis fair

the moosy read is mostly why i liked it cause it was an awful reason (that i happen to agree with for awful reasons) but he knew it was and was like fuck it, i think this shit anyway

in general...i don't necessarily agree with his reasoning or his reads, but the moosy one makes me think town and the willingness to dive right in is tonally more townie as well

i'm not really married to this read, though lol it was just my gut reaction

On August 26 2015 22:24 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:


At the beginning of the game, yes. He gave a read I agreed with, and therefore I assumed he was town making the same assumption on Rsoultin.

On August 26 2015 22:25 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:


The fact that you remember this is awesome. Although my sig kinda gives it away.

On August 26 2015 22:27 MoosyDoosy wrote:

Well according to your post saying Cheesycakes is incoherent as town, I'd say he's pretty much confirmed town at this point.

On August 26 2015 22:31 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Marv is more town than Palmar. Consider my reads switched. Just a feeling, no reasons given.

On August 26 2015 22:33 MoosyDoosy wrote:

who's next on ur pursue list then?

On August 26 2015 22:36 rsoultin wrote:
though the palmarv bromance is lacking ;o; which is interesting to me cause i'm used to the early hard-align from them

On August 26 2015 22:42 Palmar wrote:

This game I'm calling you more town than you me

On August 26 2015 22:47 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Palmar doesn't actually think JAT is mafia. I think he just wants to see who will sheep his flaccid case on the matter, and then call them mafia. For this reason, Palmar is town. Of course now I've ruined Palmar's plan. Soz

On August 26 2015 22:51 Palmar wrote:

Best player na

On August 26 2015 22:50 KelsierSC wrote:


well it was a resounding success

are you really looking at marv here?

On August 26 2015 22:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:

yes because he was meta reading people. And I'm not inclined to just trust people's words on meta and such. I'd much rather prefer a solid case.

On August 26 2015 23:00 MoosyDoosy wrote:
oh ok i found the meta thing about marv that annoyed me. The Cheesecake one and about how he's incoherent as town while he makes sense as mafia.

On August 26 2015 23:04 Palmar wrote:
I kinda agree with rsoultin.

But I know marv gets off of poking things so whatevs

On August 26 2015 23:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:

I dislike meta reads esp in D1. I would understand if there were several days and someone's meta was consistently off during those days, but using meta as a D1 lynch just feels meh to me esp since I've never played with JAT, palmar, or marv.

On August 26 2015 23:13 Palmar wrote:
Wave is a shitty has-been player anyway

On August 26 2015 23:18 MoosyDoosy wrote:

I think this is pretty clear but it goes both ways. I had a town read on him earlier which is why I'm asking for his thoughts, but if he's a Mafia that's just gone afk this is a good chance to call him out.

On August 26 2015 23:28 KelsierSC wrote:
like here is my issue with the whole thing

"palmar caught marv in some games off like 2 posts so im waiting for palmar's thoughts on marv"

for one thing JAT might not have known this was the case, trefl didn't even say this was the reason he wanted to get palmar's thoughts and even if JAT did know this happened he might have forgotten about it.


with this in mind JAT asking trefl to explain his point isn't bad at all.

On August 26 2015 23:32 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
marv out of curiosity what WERE those two posts that palmar got you off of in some game? I assume they were more substantive than this game. Trfel may have just been joking, too.

On August 26 2015 23:35 KelsierSC wrote:


it's a good job that you hate meta reads then

On August 26 2015 23:35 rsoultin wrote:
dude this is so simple

jat's one "remarkable" post was blah

therefore jat has done nothing remarkable

jat may not be the most gung-ho scumhunter or whatever (he's actually more of a peanut gallery type player with sass, and that's possibly putting it nicely) however this is a whole lot more nothing than town jat's usually try to slide by with. he usually values his own opinion way more than this

that is why he's scum

y'all are getting hung up on the question when it's not the question but the LACK of ANYTHING interesting that makes him scum. not really sure how to make this clearer?

On August 26 2015 23:39 justanothertownie wrote:

He shouldn't townread me for that, true.
But please don't try to make it look like you have any real reason to think I am mafia because you really don't.

On August 26 2015 23:40 MoosyDoosy wrote:

lol ok, it's fine to make meta reads but what I'm saying is that you can't just expect me to vote to lynch someone based off of "trusting your meta read" without much else behind it.

On August 26 2015 23:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:
I'm tempted to sheep wave's vote.

On August 26 2015 23:42 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Moosy you never substantiated on your wave!town read

On August 26 2015 23:43 MoosyDoosy wrote:

smh and i'm saying it's fine to make meta reads but just don't expect me to lynch someone based on "trust the meta reads". and i've already said that i made a mistake mixing palmarv up.

tldr learn to read, it makes moosy sad

On August 26 2015 23:44 justanothertownie wrote:

No, she kinda doesn't. I value my own opinion higher than this? What? I am literally saying that I am right and Palmar/rsoultin are wrong and I will keep saying it.

On August 26 2015 23:47 MoosyDoosy wrote:

i thought that you had posted a meta thing about JAT but that was palmar. which is why i said i confused palmar and marv. but then i kept on reading and found ur post about mr cc and didn't like that either. how is this hard to understand??

On August 26 2015 23:50 Palmar wrote:


Why are you poking this so hard? Do you actually think this guy sounds like mafia? I agree he's inconsistent and bad, but mafia? I doubt it.

On August 26 2015 23:51 MoosyDoosy wrote:

ok and...? all this proves is that i dislike using meta reads.

On August 26 2015 23:56 VisceraEyes wrote:
Meh I think JAT is town and Palmar can lick a [redacted] lamppost in wintertime.

On August 26 2015 23:59 Palmar wrote:


Eh.. I think I've played with you before?

You're the guy who ragequit when he couldn't handle the heat right?

On August 27 2015 00:01 VisceraEyes wrote:
No, it's based on what I thought originally PLUS how he's responded to people on his wagon. I think his post to Trfel is in character regardless of his alignment, and I think how he's responded to Palmar's push (maybe not so much rsoultin's, but Palmar's for sure...maybe because rsoultin's point is stronger than Palmar's...) has felt pretty townie. He's capable of this play as mafia, but he's also capable of this play as town imo.

On August 27 2015 00:02 VisceraEyes wrote:

I kinda like the Wave sentiment. FMP, the people hanging in the background not taking a side on the issue are the suspicious ones with regard to the whole JAT thing.

On August 27 2015 00:04 marvellosity wrote:

name names, babe

On August 27 2015 00:10 VisceraEyes wrote:

##Vote: WaveofShadow

Beyond that, Moosy is kinda not taking a side, which I find super strange, and there are several people who have yet to even post.

On August 27 2015 00:13 VisceraEyes wrote:

You're town for your interactions with Palmar + general sexiness. Your visible fence-sitting is townie when compared with Moosy's pushing of an alternative wagon/arguing with marv smokescreen.

On August 27 2015 00:17 VisceraEyes wrote:
My bad Moosy, I'm attributing the Wave counterwagon to you incorrectly.

On August 27 2015 00:41 VisceraEyes wrote:
I didn't like Wave's entrance, worst in the thread besides marv's. Then he disappeared which I find to be extremely out of character for Wave. I'm interested to hear why you think I'm focusing around him so much though, I've spent WAY more posts trying to oppose a JAT lynch and appealing to marv and Palmar.

On August 27 2015 00:55 WaveofShadow wrote:
Which brings me to

Fucking brutal guys.
Is all of that really necessary?

I actually have gained some confidence in my play for once and I refuse to let it be crushed by the likes of you. Unfortunately the fact that I'm not here means if either of the aforementioned are scum I won't have contributed at all to their lynches which is super bleh.

##vote: JAT

On August 27 2015 01:05 Vivax wrote:


Only if marv wants me to be. Otherwise you have no power here.

Also why.

On August 27 2015 01:12 WaveofShadow wrote:
Ah thought marv ninja voted in the thread but it was rsoul.
Well either way I'm still ok with it.

I mean you're welcome to defend/deflect by pushing me JAT.
Bring it.

On August 27 2015 01:16 WaveofShadow wrote:

I mean...I read them and remembered them when I realized I was wrong, but 17 pages is a lot to absorb at once.
And now I've got oatmeal in my keyboard.

On August 27 2015 01:40 justanothertownie wrote:

I already did and if you think my play isn't jatty then you have no idea what jatty is. I don't know why you would think that you can toneread me anyways. You clearly aren't able to do so if you are town.

On August 27 2015 01:44 VisceraEyes wrote:

It's EXACTLY the amount of back and forth that I find disconcerting. Like, they have back and forth every game but it's a LOT in this game and they IMMEDIATELY townread one another (at least it looks that way to me.) In my experience that's a result of one of them being mafia and trying hard to get the other to townread them, saying all the right things, etc. Both Palmar AND Marv are capable of fooling the other, it just takes effort that generally neither of them are willing to put in. Who's to say they aren't willing to put it in this game?

I only mention it because it looks like you're building town/town marv/Palmar as the foundation of your thought process this game and I'm getting bad feels from Palmar.

On August 27 2015 01:48 justanothertownie wrote:

He is wrong. But the general idea is good. You have absolutely fooled Palmar before and even if you are both town it is extremely lazy and bad to use this as a foundation for reads on other people.

On August 27 2015 01:50 VisceraEyes wrote:

It's based on your interactions, it just FEELS like you townread him marv. Hence the parenthetical.

I've BEEN mafia with you before WITH Palmar in the game, and THIS IS HOW YOU DESCRIBED IT TO ME. Maybe I'm high and am misremembering, but this is MY way to read you and Palmar and has been for a while now. If it's mistaken please correct me.

On August 27 2015 01:55 Palmar wrote:
Oh VE thinks I'm mafia.

I guess that takes him back off the do not lynch list.

On August 27 2015 01:53 WaveofShadow wrote:
No wait.
Dumb.
Shadow game.

On August 27 2015 01:56 marvellosity wrote:

apart from being petulant, this doesn't make sense

if VE is mafia and we are both town, VE knows there is 0% chance of getting a lynch on you, and even discrediting you is near-impossible with that alignment configuration

On August 27 2015 01:59 WaveofShadow wrote:

Yeh that was a very good one.
One of the best games I've ever had the pleasure of playing in.

Marv do you not think that VE has similar cohones to me in that he does not fear taking you/Palmar on as scum?
I don't think Palmar's OMGUS has any particular true reason behind it but I don't think VE is ruled out.

On August 27 2015 02:14 Palmar wrote:
moosy seems to get people mixed up easily.

I think that is irrelevant and at best slightly townie (doesn't worry too much about mistakes).

On August 27 2015 02:29 KelsierSC wrote:


fine i'll go read it properly

i get off on cheesecakes posting , it actually makes sense when I read it

On August 27 2015 07:26 WaveofShadow wrote:

Despite his picking invisible nits off of me I think he's more likely town, unless he played like this in the scum game I mentioned earlier that I haven't looked at yet.

On August 27 2015 02:56 rsoultin wrote:
i dunnae people seem to be scumreading moosy for things that i'd expect new players to get scumread for as town :/ i'm really not sold on that

On August 27 2015 07:29 justanothertownie wrote:

If you were able to understand basic logic this would have been obvious the first time. Marv got it.

On August 27 2015 07:32 justanothertownie wrote:

Ehm, ok? I will just pretend I understood whatever you said right there.

On August 27 2015 07:35 marvellosity wrote:
i think you look quite good too, wave, i like how your posts read

On August 27 2015 07:36 WaveofShadow wrote:

I agree with this actually which is I think why I'm getting the jeebies. I know I would specifically act this way as scum after a game like you said to change it up, but that's me.

On August 27 2015 07:37 KelsierSC wrote:
I don't buy the CC looks too good so he must be mafia.

On August 27 2015 07:38 WaveofShadow wrote:

Unfortunately I can't really help you there. I don't think you've ever beaten me when you were town and I was scum :D

On August 27 2015 07:38 rsoultin wrote:


no

looks too good would be the wrong answer from jat

jat's actual answer is that cc was hard-defending him as if he had tmi...too correct

On August 27 2015 07:38 justanothertownie wrote:

That game was awesome. I mean if scum hadn't thrown the game we wouldn't have won it but we still did.

On August 27 2015 07:40 rsoultin wrote:


that's what i just got him to clarify @.@

meh

On August 27 2015 07:40 WaveofShadow wrote:

Oh yeah don't get me wrong you've suspected me/called me scum correctly before but it's never been enough either cause we kill you or waffle.

On August 27 2015 07:41 rsoultin wrote:


^

??? what am i misinterpreting?

On August 27 2015 07:42 WaveofShadow wrote:
Speaking of duo, anyone have anything on him?

On August 27 2015 07:46 Palmar wrote:
or at least give some harder reads.

On August 27 2015 07:51 WaveofShadow wrote:

So you think it's more likely malicious than just dumb?
I think if he harped more on the 'lazy' or 'looking to excuse future town flip' parts of the case it would be worse cause those are terrible, but I think he truly believes the imaginary nits he's picking.

On August 27 2015 07:56 justanothertownie wrote:

It does make sense, don't worry. I feel pretty bad about throwing supicion at CC btw. but sadly being smart/correct does not make someone town.

On August 27 2015 18:38 Palmar wrote:

You're making me really paranoid about you by even entertaining the notion Trfel is mafia.

On August 27 2015 18:38 Palmar wrote:

You're making me really paranoid about you by even entertaining the notion Trfel is mafia.

On August 27 2015 18:39 Palmar wrote:
Like please don't do that if you're town marv. I'm trying to get in the groove of just saying fuck it and hard town reading you if I have no reason to call you mafia, but you're actively trying to create reasons for me to call you mafia.

On August 27 2015 18:41 Palmar wrote:

No, I've provided a ton of reads and opinions that are very valuable for town.

You don't get to call me shit when you've just been fencesitting the whole thing and now you're taking the wrong side.

On August 27 2015 18:59 Palmar wrote:


literally always useful, except when I'm not.

I don't care what his read on rsoultin is. Within his first five posts of the game he tried to solve shit in a manner that makes sense (read his post about VE I think where he's questioning the structure of his post). He was like the first person (maybe aside from rsoultin) who I nodded my head in approval while reading the game yesterday.

Maybe he wants to waffle on rsoultin. It's not like it matters, he's not actively trying to get her lynched. His bottom three look very agreeable to me.

Maybe I'm just mad that he got called out for complete bs by mulitple people and I'm putting too strong of a townread on him because I hate it when people get called out for something they shouldn't be called out for.

Rsoultin is town and he's a moron if he doesn't think so. It doesn't make him mafia.

On August 27 2015 19:03 Palmar wrote:

It's just so early and so tryhard.

I don't think he can do that as mafia.

On August 27 2015 19:02 justanothertownie wrote:

Oh god the irony is killing me.

On August 27 2015 19:07 Palmar wrote:
There is literally no way rsoultin changes her mind. She's best player.

On August 27 2015 19:10 justanothertownie wrote:

I am not going to shout at you.
But I have seriously no idea why 1) you give rsoultin so much credit (I can somewhat see it on her Trfel read but not on myself), 2) you would lynch me even though you do not have a reason to think I am mafia because you know it is an objectively bad play to do this day1 3) why you think I could be mafia in the first place.

On August 27 2015 19:13 justanothertownie wrote:
So, I will be upfront with you right now marv:

If I get mislynched today then I will be angry with rsoultin and Palmar if they are town because they acted retardedly and made me not want to play this game while jerking off about their incorrect and stupid read on me. But if people need to mislynch me once before they realize that this is not the way to figure out my alignment then so be it. I have no motivation to put up with this shit today.

I will not be angry with you because you have been reasonable all game. That you aren't able to read me correctly is just very disappointing.

On August 27 2015 19:21 justanothertownie wrote:

Well, I guess that means I cannot do that as town then.

On August 27 2015 19:23 Palmar wrote:

Btw, if you decide we shouldn't lynch JAT, I'll drop it immediately.

Because that way I can blame you for waffling me out of lynching him if he actually is mafia.

On August 27 2015 20:23 rsoultin wrote:
lol um so basically no he's townreading me but being an asshat by putting me in null to protect his ego lol truffle is pulling a marv. tbf he does always townread me (or claim he won't give a read on me but will instead ignore me, while treating me like town) ever since i've proven i can fool him when i'm scum

it's nothing unusual for a town truffle?

On August 27 2015 20:48 justanothertownie wrote:

What can I say - I just outperform you in any way possible.

On August 27 2015 22:23 VisceraEyes wrote:
lmao I swear to God I'm not trying to pocket you marv. I just read pg 44 and I know it seems that way LOLOL

On August 27 2015 23:23 Palmar wrote:

He's mafia, that's his secret.

On August 27 2015 23:39 justanothertownie wrote:

Based purely on rsoultins toneread or anything concrete?

On August 27 2015 23:38 VisceraEyes wrote:

You and Palmar are only two votes. I think my content on Trfel is better than anything either of you has presented. No offense intended of course.

On August 27 2015 23:42 justanothertownie wrote:

The probability that there is at least 1 or 2 in there is definitely exists.

On August 27 2015 23:57 VisceraEyes wrote:
Add to that the fact that he calls both myself AND JAT mafia and votes for NEITHER of us - which is really odd considering JAT was (and is?) the current vote leader. So he doesn't want to lynch JAT? Why not the other mafias he's reading? Why an inactive that could just be AFK town?

On August 27 2015 23:59 WaveofShadow wrote:

I'm not sure why a scum Trfel does this to be completely honest.

Jesus the waffle on Trfel is super real

Maybe I take a page out of marvs book and lynch him cause waffle

On August 27 2015 23:59 WaveofShadow wrote:
Wowowowow that triple mind meld

On August 28 2015 00:00 VisceraEyes wrote:

Why wouldn't he? He knows I'm town and (I think) JAT is town, and he doesn't want the full force of either of us bearing down on him. So he votes for someone else, hides his "reasoning" in spoilers and crosses his fingers.

Why would he do this as town?

On August 28 2015 00:05 WaveofShadow wrote:

I mean that hasn't been true for a while but you're welcome to it :D

And Tina (no offense to hopeless lol) but he's always utter shit hopeless.

And it takes a lot for someone like me to say that.

On August 28 2015 00:10 WaveofShadow wrote:
But seriously does no one see that?
Ksc calls Trfel hopeless read pretty good, and yet somehow me saying the same on palmar makes me scum.