EPToh shii maybe scumteam IS good then, I dun goofed. can't fakeclaim blue any more to try to draw nks
Normal Mini Mafia LVI - Page 3
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
oh shii maybe scumteam IS good then, I dun goofed. can't fakeclaim blue any more to try to draw nks | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
| ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 06:09 VisceraEyes wrote: That was way less than twelve hours scum. brb dinner 10 hours | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 06:19 Lazermonkey wrote: Yo, I'm here for a short while. If there are any questions, just ask. You note that you're only slightly suspicious of me. However, I successfully pushed a mislynch all D1 basically to the exclusion of giving any other reads of substance, and haven't posted anything but fluff since 27nb flipped town. Why aren't you interested in voting me? | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 06:29 Lazermonkey wrote: I didn't read much into your filter the first day TBH. You weren't a contender for the lynch. I do think that what you pointed out makes you look bad and thats why I said I was slightly suspicious of you. But pushing the misslynch of a townie IS something that townies do alot aswell. Right now I'm trying to understand the case on you in order to get a better read on you. I'd consider a case on me to have two main components: 1) I pushed a mislynch D1 2) That comprises the vast majority of my filter. Aside from a couple one-off notes I have not really engaged or given reads on anyone else, not even in the intervening 36 hours since the mislynch happened. Now, if 27nb flipped scum, there would be no suspicion on me basically at all. People would congratulate me for my excellent tunnelling of scum. As luck would have it, 27nb wasn't scum, just profoundly scummy town. And I am a bit tied up eating dinner at the moment so I don't really have time to put together a case on someone, or even write an adequate defense (though honestly the only adequate defense here would be for me to catch scum and then everyone be like "wow look a scum"). People are too lazy and unmotivated to catch scum, so they're just gonna lynch the me. I'm a legendary scum player. I'm so good that most people are naturally suspicious of me no matter what I do. This is acceptable. Ideally though once I'm done with dinner I come back and wow all you guys so hard that you can't even imagine lynching me. I'm the only town leader around here and without me the thread grinds to a halt, it seems. | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 06:40 Lazermonkey wrote: Yhea this is my impression from you aswell. The fact that you haven't done shit since lynch isn't helping you either. You haven't done any scumhuting at all. Its pretty obvious you aren't helping town at this point. But you attitude is suicidal as scum which makes you hard to get a good grip of. I wouldn't be super sad to see you die but I would rather kill VE or Koshi still. Man my attitude is fine, I just legit am eating dinner and can't like read thread, make cases, read etc. Now, you might be wondering, "YKZ, how come you have been eating dinner for over 36 hours now?" to which I can only answer, it's a really good dinner. If I had the ability to give reads I would. Now, if I could just make up reads or something and that would keep me alive, I'd consider it, but I'd rather not lead town astray. Like, sure, maybe I could say "mderg is scum let's lynch him" and we'd lynch him, but I don't actually know whether or not he is scum. I haven't read his filter, and since I'm at dinner, I really can't. All I can say is, I'm done with dinner in about 9 hours, and then I'll wow everyone with a wombo mondo case and people will lynch the guy I want to lynch, whoever that turns out to be. Believe me, if I had the ability to analyze and give accurate reads right now, I'd do it. This is a really good dinner. | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 06:48 Snickers wrote: Yo ykz and chezinu. Care to explain how you are playing to win. I think the only way you are playing to win is if your mafia. You guys must get a high off of being confusing. Given that I'm getting lynched, and nobody wants to get lynched in this setup, your argument falls apart instantly. /dunked Seriously though I'd do more but I'm at dinner, I'll get back in 9 hours and wow you | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 07:00 Snickers wrote: When I look at the thread 4 to 5 hours from now and I continue seeing dumbness. I'm going to make one more post to vote someone then afk till lynch. I already contributed enough , especially compared to some players. ##vote snickers reasons reasons reasons etc etc pretend I wrote something awesome | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
| ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 17:33 Artanis[Xp] wrote: BH, do you believe you're playing towards your win condition? Ok, clearly you don't understand my dinner joke. When I say I'm away at dinner, what I really mean is, "I have IRL reasons for not being at the thread right now." Most of my posting for the past 48 hours has been via phone. Since I am completely and totally willing to lie about being afk as scum, I don't bother explaining why I'm AFK as town. Instead I just say I'm at dinner. If you want me to give details about WHY I have been mostly afk for 48 hours, I'll be glad to provide you with them, but let's be real here: I have lied about reasons for being AFK before as scum. I am 100% willing to say that I got dumped by my gf, or my mom died, or I had a work emergency, or WHATEVER to not get lynched as scum. I've done it before. I've pretended to have mental breakdowns. I've pretended that I don't believe in myself any more. I've pretended that I am busy with work 12 hours a day due to a deadline. So here's what I'll tell you: if I am town, I have had a good reason to be very very low activity for 48 hours. If you want me to share that reason, feel free to ask, but the reason is MEANINGLESS because I am the one player on TL who notoriously ruthlessly lies about IRL things. Hilariously enough, I wish I didn't lie about IRL things when I was scum, because it would make a situation like this easier for me, but I can't not use that move as scum, because not using every tactic available to me would be playing against my win condition when I roll scum. So, Artanis[Xp], not only am I playing towards my wincon, I'm one of the few people who really does. Do you still want my story? I'm busy trying to form reads and catch up seriously on 48 hours of thread. I need to reread how the D1 wagons formed. If I don't solve this problem, I get lynched. So, tell me, do you have a better question for me? | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
| ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 18:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote: That's all I needed to know. You've spent the very little time you've had cracking jokes and making that post rather than trying to do anything useful. ##vote YouKnowZhou I don't understand your reasoning. Please state it more plainly, I don't have time to parse your posts while also rereading the thread. | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 18:05 Artanis[Xp] wrote: A) You've had very little time to spend on the thread, presumably since the end of Day 1 as you did post a decent bit before that. B) You've spent it making promises or arguing about things that are not related to catching mafia or getting reads. C) You claim to not be playing against your win condition. B and C are contradictory if your alignment is in fact town. What promises? Please be specific. A link or a quote would be acceptable. I believe I promised I'd return to the thread around now after dinner and make a case. I'm in the process of doing that. If I made other promises besides that, I hereby rescind those promises as communist lies. | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 18:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Yeah, that counts under making promises. I don't understand why you keep spending time replying to these posts if your time is limited. It's not helping me get a read on you, and I doubt it's helping you get a read on me. Get to your supposedly legendary case. Limiting factor on my case-writing isn't the bandwidth of my fingers, it's my processing power, and honestly when you ask me questions I feel a strong urge to respond. Also, what, do you expect me to NOT respond to your questions? If you want, I can ignore you, but people typically don't like that. | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
YKZ, Artanis, mderg, Chez, Koshi, Sloosh, GK with counterrwagons YKZ with one vote (Release) and mderg with 4 votes (snickers, VE, 27nb, Lazermonkey) GK was shot overnight and generally the thread has died since then. Given the majority with which 27nb was lynched, we can reasonably conclude that even if mderg is in fact scum, scum wouldn't have to all vote for 27nb to save mderg. Still, we should take a look at what happened in the time leading up to the 27nb lynch to get an idea of which votes made sense and which didn't. I'm going to exclude GK from this analysis, since he died, and myself, since I think everyone is pretty clear on my stated motivations for this lynch. In terms of major pivots on the 27nb case, it begins with my KPR case early in the day, and is augmented with a pbp analysis (link) a few hours before the deadline. Before the pbp analysis, the only voter is mderg. He voted in his first post, about halfway through Day 1 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/458796-normal-mini-mafia-lvi?page=12#231(link) that was noteworthy for being generally unfocused. His other statements in that post are YKZ Town, Snickers strange, pre-flip assoc is bad, Release is non-perfect, sloosh is town, artanis case on release makes sense but sloosh case on him also made sense blah blah. He's giving lots of opinions and spends not a huge amount of time on his vote target, bunnies. I'd also like to add some lines from his inital post here, the post in which he votes bunnies. The whole thing with YKZ and bunnies is really strange. It feels like they´re both wrong, bunnies more so thab YKZ, though. I don´t think bunnies case was well substantiated at all, scumslips just almost never happen in forum mafia. I also don´t think the Kenpachi rule is as foolproof as YKZ said. It has some solid reasoning behind it but claiming that it always works seems stupid. They´ve kinda been repeating themselves quite often, so there´s not that much to get from this. ... So I think out of bunnies and YKZ only bunnies can really be scum. It certainly is possible. Especially the heavy focus on YKZ´s "scumslip" seems suspicious. Not calling out YKZ´s scummy posts is not really alignment indicative. Not immediately noticing things that might look scummy to some can happen as both alignments. I also dislike how she agrees with Artanis that Release is scummy but doesn´t think he´s scum because she wants to be right about YKZ and her association read. ... ##vote 27ninjabunnies I'm sure others have pointed this out, but take a look at what's going on in this post. First off, mderg talks a LOT about how 27nb is probably not scum, and neither am I. If you didn't see his vote there at the bottom of the post, and just read the post itself, you would have NO IDEA that he was voting 27nb. Here, try reading his post without the ##vote at the bottom. What does it sounds like to you? + Show Spoiler + On June 17 2014 09:11 mderg wrote: I almost forgot about this due to the world cup  The whole thing with YKZ and bunnies is really strange. It feels like they´re both wrong, bunnies more so thab YKZ, though. I don´t think bunnies case was well substantiated at all, scumslips just almost never happen in forum mafia. I also don´t think the Kenpachi rule is as foolproof as YKZ said. It has some solid reasoning behind it but claiming that it always works seems stupid. They´ve kinda been repeating themselves quite often, so there´s not that much to get from this. I think YKZ is town because of the follow up on bunnies I don´t think scum would so blatantly say that he acted scummy and someone should have pointed it out. This feels like a trap made by town. He´s also claimed vt early on which I find weird but unlikely to be scum play. So I think out of bunnies and YKZ only bunnies can really be scum. It certainly is possible. Especially the heavy focus on YKZ´s "scumslip" seems suspicious. Not calling out YKZ´s scummy posts is not really alignment indicative. Not immediately noticing things that might look scummy to some can happen as both alignments. I also dislike how she agrees with Artanis that Release is scummy but doesn´t think he´s scum because she wants to be right about YKZ and her association read. It also feels like townreading Artanis is some kind of "You´re scumreading me, so I´ll townread you". I think Snickers has been posting strangely. As if he wanted to play the newbie card without stating that he´s new. His general thought process doesn´t show a scum mindset, though. I didn´t really like where he talked about associations between bunnies and VKZ. IMO pre-flip associations are bad most of the time. Release had a not so perfect entrance to this thread. At first glance his case on YKZ seemed good but it basically comes down to the few points bunnies has made on YKZ and that he stuck to the Kenpachi rule for so long. That´s not very much considering the length of his posts. What kinda speaks in his favor is how suddenly several people jumped on him after Artanis made his case on him. Still kinda neutral on him, maybe a bit scummy. I´m having a townread on sloosh right now. Mainly because his posting feels different from Detention where we were scum together. He´s asking questions and seems to be trying to get behind the reasons from the others. I think Artanis´case on Release made sense but slooshs case on him also made sense even though it´s not that strong. The fact that he almost completely ignored the back and forth between YKZ and bunnies is slightly suspicious. But it´s true that the back and forth was repetitive and I don´t think there was anything that´s really scummy in it. I agree with his reason for scumreading bunnies, it´s something I´m also sumreading her for. Slight townread on him. Not much on the others, yet. I´ll hopefully post more tomorrow. Yeah, if you read that, you don't think "I guess he probably votes bunnies at the end there, that makes sense to me". No, you don't think that at all. Not even a LITTLE bit. There's nothign that even remotely a case on bunnies there. And look at his response to people attacking him after this: On June 18 2014 05:38 mderg wrote: I was pretty heavily leaning scum on bunnies, so voting her seems logical, doesn´t it? I was also pretty sure that I´d be here today, just not how much time I could invest. On June 18 2014 06:42 mderg wrote: My vote stays on bunnies today. Nothing today that changed my mind and I need some sleep now. We should definitely look into VE and Snickers, though. He was NOT leaning scum on bunnies. He acted like he thought both me and bunnies were town (which of course scum would know). He never actually writes a case on bunnies. He defends himself a bit sporadically and doesn't elaborate on his case on bunnies, and it's noteworthy that although he claims a townread on me, he doesn't defend me, the vote leader, during D2. His vote on 27nb and general defense afterwards are a pretty low tier D1, and he doesn't justify the vote, or his case on VE today, well at all. I wonder if he was not anticipating me looking so bad today, and now he's in a tough position of wanting to vote a townie on the block, but not being able to, since he "townreads" me. This would explain the lack of defense, and the fact that he has barely posted in the last 36 hours except to townread me then ask if I play like this usually. I'd characterise mderg's play as disinterested and unfocused. An acceptable lynch for these reasons, especially the lack of staking out a solid defense (or even a solid "I changed my mind on this") post on me since, basically any time since his initial townread on em. Take a look at his "case" on bunnies. In his filter, it's clear that the bunnies vote doesn't come from the thoughts he posted in the thread. Probably he was just posting a reads thing to look good as scum, and one of his scumbuddies reminded him he needed to vote. Like shit, man, who forgets to call someone scum or write a case? He even acts like he was leaning scum on bunnies or he had some sort of reason, even after he explicitly calls my case on bunnies unconvincing IN THE POST THAT HE VOTES BUNNIES IN. I don't even need to read the other votes up (though I will, in due time) because if you look at mderg, the way he voted bunnies is in no way related to a town thought process. Take a look at the spoilered quote, his vote post (at the time his only post in the thread) with the ##vote taken out. There's NO WAY the ##vote follows from that post. It's out of place because he doesn't have an actually town scumhunting and thought process to refer to. He's scum. ##unvote ##vote mderg Q: I am lazy and dont' want to read your long post. A: read this spoilered post by mderg, his first post, and his only voting post from D1. I have removed the ##vote from it, and reading it, you have no freaking clue that he's gonna vote 27nb. It looks like he's townreading 27nb. And then he votes her. He is scum. I have boldfaced the parts in which he refers to bunnies as town. + Show Spoiler + On June 17 2014 09:11 mderg wrote: I almost forgot about this due to the world cup The whole thing with YKZ and bunnies is really strange. It feels like they´re both wrong [about each other being scum], bunnies more so thab YKZ, though. I don´t think bunnies case was well substantiated at all, scumslips just almost never happen in forum mafia. I also don´t think the Kenpachi rule is as foolproof as YKZ said. It has some solid reasoning behind it but claiming that it always works seems stupid. They´ve kinda been repeating themselves quite often, so there´s not that much to get from this. I think YKZ is town because of the follow up on bunnies I don´t think scum would so blatantly say that he acted scummy and someone should have pointed it out. This feels like a trap made by town. He´s also claimed vt early on which I find weird but unlikely to be scum play. So I think out of bunnies and YKZ only bunnies can really be scum. It certainly is possible. Especially the heavy focus on YKZ´s "scumslip" seems suspicious. Not calling out YKZ´s scummy posts is not really alignment indicative. Not immediately noticing things that might look scummy to some can happen as both alignments. I also dislike how she agrees with Artanis that Release is scummy but doesn´t think he´s scum because she wants to be right about YKZ and her association read. It also feels like townreading Artanis is some kind of "You´re scumreading me, so I´ll townread you". I think Snickers has been posting strangely. As if he wanted to play the newbie card without stating that he´s new. His general thought process doesn´t show a scum mindset, though. I didn´t really like where he talked about associations between bunnies and VKZ. IMO pre-flip associations are bad most of the time. Release had a not so perfect entrance to this thread. At first glance his case on YKZ seemed good but it basically comes down to the few points bunnies has made on YKZ and that he stuck to the Kenpachi rule for so long. That´s not very much considering the length of his posts. What kinda speaks in his favor is how suddenly several people jumped on him after Artanis made his case on him. Still kinda neutral on him, maybe a bit scummy. I´m having a townread on sloosh right now. Mainly because his posting feels different from Detention where we were scum together. He´s asking questions and seems to be trying to get behind the reasons from the others. I think Artanis´case on Release made sense but slooshs case on him also made sense even though it´s not that strong. The fact that he almost completely ignored the back and forth between YKZ and bunnies is slightly suspicious. But it´s true that the back and forth was repetitive and I don´t think there was anything that´s really scummy in it. I agree with his reason for scumreading bunnies, it´s something I´m also sumreading her for. Slight townread on him. Not much on the others, yet. I´ll hopefully post more tomorrow. ##vote ??? | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
| ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
| ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 18:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote: slOosh, you were scumbuddies with mderg in Detention. Do you feel he's playing similarly in this game? BH, you were the host that game. What do you recall of his play and do you see similarities? What do you think of my case? | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
I note immediately he's making a lot more small posts, which is different. I'm guessing that's a function of the world cup happening now. Other than that I really don't have time to read a freaking filter from a different game. When I host I just make sure my players are 1) not eating each other alive and 2) active. I don't do damn analysis except for on British Empire Mini Mafia II which will TOTALLY HAPPEN I PROMISE | ||
|
YouKnowZhou
United States262 Posts
On June 20 2014 18:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote: It's made me heavily doubt mderg's alignment, but it hasn't convinced me yet, ergo I'm looking for how he usually plays as scum/town for comparison. Yeah, we're gonna have a problem with that then. I generally only use meta when it supports my case, and now that I'm looking at his filter in detention, it looks like the issue here (he forgot that he was townreading 27nb and then voted her for no reason) didn't happen there. I am not making a behavioral analysis on mderg, but it's not exactly a scumslip case either. It's a case based on the fact that his train of thought really does NOT make sense. In Detention Mafia he has some scumtells and some nonsensical things he says, but nothing like this. I do think he's still scum though despite that. I attribute the change in playing style (conversational in Detention, non-conversational here) to World Cup. | ||
| ||
