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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:01 Amiko wrote: This just reflects why the point is good. If the posts confirmed your suspicions, they should have content in them that leads you to read him as scum. If the posts had content that turned your suspicions into a slam dunk, then you should be using them in your case. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://blogs.citypages.com/food/RIP-500-square.jpg) I have no idea what you're talking about. The posts did not confirm my suspicions. The posts had no content that turned my suspicions into a slam dunk. So... can you get me up to speed? | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
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Palmar
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On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: You misunderstand why I posted bunnies reaction. The post is that your case was not seen as serious, and when you pressed it people responded (as they should) doubting its sincerity. Bunnies' reaction just goes to show how little pressure your case provided. Anyway, you have nothing to lose by making that kind of case as mafia, maybe if you're lucky she OMGUSes you and you use that to try to support the lynch. Yes, this is the logical leap you keep making. You've decided I'm mafia and thus there must be mafia reasons for doing whatever it is I'm doing. I don't know how bunny would react. If I'm right and she's mafia she might overreact to a stupid little case. If she's town she would probably brush it off like she did. There is a reason I posted it, and that reason is a town reason. On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: Part of my case was that slOosh was M_Z, except more scummy. If you thought my case was right, you shouldn't have been on M_Z. If you didn't think that was correct, you didn't agree with me and should have tried to convince me on the merits. Again, stop saying what I "should" have done according to your view of the game. In my opinion townies shouldn't lie but they do it all the time anyway. In my opinion townies shouldn't roleclaim on day 1, and again, they keep doing it. I don't care if you think sloosh was the same as MZ, He did not write the post MZ wrote that made me want to lynch MZ, so by definition they are not the same. But that doesn't mean I didn't think sloosh was mafia and wasn't fine with lynching him early on. I don't know why the idea that someone might actually take a flyer on a good case by a townread is so alien to you. The only reason I ended up actually pushing for MZ instead of sloosh was the lack of resistance to the sloosh lynch (and it was pretty clear, aside from me no one opposed it all that strongly). Put yourself in my shoes for a second. I know I'm town, and no one is questioning this sloosh lynch. There is a reason I was suspicious of it. [QUOTE]On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: [QUOTE]On June 05 2014 23:47 Palmar wrote: I don't waste time when I'm playing mafia. I see no reason to post when town is doing what I want it to be doing. I was okay with Sloosh getting the lynch until later in the day. If I was mafia and planned to defend him I probably would've done it earlier and not just based on wagon speed. But hey, ignore that. ... I'm not this incompetent as mafia dude. When you drop the case I make a decision on what I want to do, and I either bus him for credit or defend him by breaking your case. Your case was good, you KNOW your case was good. If I'm mafia and don't want sloosh to die I would have to dismantle it immediately. Your explanation does not fit. [/quote] I scumhunt even when I think I have caught scum. Anyway, you start pushing for M_Z only after fuba has made a case for people to switch to M_Z. I think you could accurately predict sqrt and Haru could be moved (because I thought they could be moved too). I don't scumhunt when there's one mafia left and I think I know who it is. I don't care if you think I should. I already answered the bolded thing. I can't even remember fuba pushing MZ, in hindsight I was the first person to start person to actively try to change the lynch, and I tried to do it because I felt like there was no resistance to it. [QUOTE]On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: [QUOTE]On June 05 2014 23:47 Palmar wrote: The backtracking strategy you're claiming is actually awful, because if I'm mafia I need two mislynches here, not one. It woul be ok if I needed just one. I can't do the "contemplate my reads" thing twice. [/quote] Why not? You just say "I guess I was wrong, so it must be XYZ" Anyway, for all you know, the cop has no checks. It's possible that the cop checked players who had died. It's possible that you roleblocked the cop on days the cop would check living players. And, you don't know who the cop or medic are. If you are lucky, maybe Slam will flip as one of the blue roles. For all you know, your strategy is a winning strategy because it's possible there will only be one blue (who you could kill tonight). The idea that you didn't make a winning strategy is incorrect because it considers information you did not know. Given the information you did know, your strategy was fine.[/QUOTE] Nope I don't put my money on luck when I'm mafia. But that's subjective. [QUOTE]On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: [QUOTE]On June 05 2014 23:47 Palmar wrote: And you're risking the game on you being cocky.[/QUOTE] If you are town, you certainly risked the game with your play on day 2 and day 3. It doesn't matter. The game is at risk until it's over. That's the nature of the game. (Anyway play has been pretty great, I can't believe you guys didn't roleblock me n2)[/QUOTE] Not sure I would've actually roleblocked you if I'm mafia. I didn't get the feeling you were cop from reading the case on sloosh. It was pretty well disguised. [/b] | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: You misunderstand why I posted bunnies reaction. The post is that your case was not seen as serious, and when you pressed it people responded (as they should) doubting its sincerity. Bunnies' reaction just goes to show how little pressure your case provided. Anyway, you have nothing to lose by making that kind of case as mafia, maybe if you're lucky she OMGUSes you and you use that to try to support the lynch. Yes, this is the logical leap you keep making. You've decided I'm mafia and thus there must be mafia reasons for doing whatever it is I'm doing. I don't know how bunny would react. If I'm right and she's mafia she might overreact to a stupid little case. If she's town she would probably brush it off like she did. There is a reason I posted it, and that reason is a town reason. On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: Part of my case was that slOosh was M_Z, except more scummy. If you thought my case was right, you shouldn't have been on M_Z. If you didn't think that was correct, you didn't agree with me and should have tried to convince me on the merits. Again, stop saying what I "should" have done according to your view of the game. In my opinion townies shouldn't lie but they do it all the time anyway. In my opinion townies shouldn't roleclaim on day 1, and again, they keep doing it. I don't care if you think sloosh was the same as MZ, He did not write the post MZ wrote that made me want to lynch MZ, so by definition they are not the same. But that doesn't mean I didn't think sloosh was mafia and wasn't fine with lynching him early on. I don't know why the idea that someone might actually take a flyer on a good case by a townread is so alien to you. The only reason I ended up actually pushing for MZ instead of sloosh was the lack of resistance to the sloosh lynch (and it was pretty clear, aside from me no one opposed it all that strongly). Put yourself in my shoes for a second. I know I'm town, and no one is questioning this sloosh lynch. There is a reason I was suspicious of it. On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: [/b]I scumhunt even when I think I have caught scum. Anyway, you start pushing for M_Z only after fuba has made a case for people to switch to M_Z. I think you could accurately predict sqrt and Haru could be moved (because I thought they could be moved too). I don't scumhunt when there's one mafia left and I think I know who it is. I don't care if you think I should. I already answered the bolded thing. I can't even remember fuba pushing MZ, in hindsight I was the first person to start person to actively try to change the lynch, and I tried to do it because I felt like there was no resistance to it. On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: Why not? You just say "I guess I was wrong, so it must be XYZ" Anyway, for all you know, the cop has no checks. It's possible that the cop checked players who had died. It's possible that you roleblocked the cop on days the cop would check living players. And, you don't know who the cop or medic are. If you are lucky, maybe Slam will flip as one of the blue roles. For all you know, your strategy is a winning strategy because it's possible there will only be one blue (who you could kill tonight). The idea that you didn't make a winning strategy is incorrect because it considers information you did not know. Given the information you did know, your strategy was fine. Nope I don't put my money on luck when I'm mafia. But that's subjective. On June 06 2014 00:07 Amiko wrote: If you are town, you certainly risked the game with your play on day 2 and day 3. It doesn't matter. The game is at risk until it's over. That's the nature of the game. (Anyway play has been pretty great, I can't believe you guys didn't roleblock me n2) Not sure I would've actually roleblocked you if I'm mafia. I didn't get the feeling you were cop from reading the case on sloosh. It was pretty well disguised. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:35 Amiko wrote: Before I respond, let me get this straight: You suspected M_Z on day 1, but were not sure. You became sure during night 1. You became sure because of M_Z's inactivity. Sort of. Jabber's flip and re-reading MZ's posting also helped. I had become pretty certain when I posted that 95% post, but it was mostly based on earlier evidence. And not inactivity precisely, but rather lack of commitment to solving the game. I don't care how much people post if they post the right things. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:36 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Well, he is playing right now. I don't like being lynched as town. Also I want to post so much proof that I'm not mafia that I can claim in the post game that the people who lynched me did so with absolutely 0 good reasons. I think I'm almost there. Like I would shut up and let you guys lynch me if you signed a form first that says: "I understand that I'm lynching Palmar based on absolutely nothing because I am afraid of words and my brain hurts when I think. I also don't like winning mafia games. I take full responsibility for my idiocy." sig: __________________________ | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:49 Amiko wrote: (I think you probably realized this, and that's why rereading is a new reason) It isn't new, I said "I gradually became convinced over n1" But hey, fit it to your insane story all you like. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:49 Amiko wrote: My point on M_Z is pretty simple. On Day 1, you say that you suspect M_Z. At this time, the case is not a slam dunk. This is your excuse for not pushing M_Z on Day 1 as an alternative for jabber. On Night 1, you become certain that M_Z is scum. This suggests that something between your post Day 1 and your post Night 1 made you feel M_Z was confirmed scum. This is where you're wrong. Nothing needs to happen. Who knows. Maybe I glanced at his filter, maybe I took a walk and it cleared my head, maybe I ate mushrooms and had hallucinations, maybe Jesus told me he was mafia. I did not push MZ as an alternative to jabber because I believed that despite my hesitancy in lynching him we had to lynch him as he could never be kept around in the long run, and would be a very dangerous mislynch target later in the game if the game started going sour. There was plenty of evidence against jabber, but as I pointed out, he was just soooo scummy and sooo wrong that it was almost too much (and it was too much). Like it sounds all fine and dandy in hindsight if I'd convinced myself he was 100% and started pushing an alternative lynch, but I'm not mafia so I wasn't sure. There's always that chance he just fucked up and was mafia. On June 06 2014 01:49 Amiko wrote: In other words, your case against M_Z did not raise the points that you claim convinced you he was mafia The bolded is just wrong. My case raised exactly the points against M_Z that did the most to convince me MZ was mafia. The timing is unimportant really. jabber flipping town was sort of expected but his flip confirmed he was town. MZ flipping on my alignment (he had mentioned me being mafia earlier) helped me become more suspicious of him, MZ not doing anything over the night also added to my suspicion. And the case post is posted when I fully expected to be shot, as I expected MZ to be actuallly mafia, and I wanted it absolutely clear that he was my target of choice. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 01:54 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Well, here's something that I don't get. If you're not mafia, why aren't you pushing people who you think are mafia? If I were you, I'd be trying to get everyone to vote for fuba. I'm not convinced it's fuba. So if you guys could all be dears and start trying to figure out. Just pretend for the next 24 hours that I'm confirmed town, and go scumhunt the other two. Use reasons and stuff. Then you can come back to me and lynch me. But it's hard to scumhunt when people are constantly pushing me as mafia for awful reasons. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
Do you have a point? | ||
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On June 06 2014 01:54 HaruRH wrote: Wait a minute, I dont want you to shut up. Continue on, your overreaction is fun to watch. And why do you think I'm overreacting? Go find a game where I get lynched as mafia (titanic and championship are recent examples). Compare me. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:02 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Here's the thing. It's either you or fuba. I'm lynching both you and fuba. The only question remaining is who to lynch first. I believe that you're a more competent player, and that if you were mafia, it'd be easier for you rather than fuba to wiggle your way out of a lynch. So you're my target today. If you're not mafia, it's fuba. So you're lynching me out of fear? | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:05 Amiko wrote: To me, the quotes posts are you attempting to squirm new reasons into a lynch (inactivity, rereading) that your posts at the time do not reflect. From now on, assume every point I make could possibly be inspired by rethinking, rereading, observation, events, jesus or various other things I don't tell you about. It's 100% super clear what my thought process was. 1. jabber did super scummy things. 2. MZ did some scummy things 3. MZ did super scummy things. he still might contribute later 4. jabber is so scummy he might not be scum 5. we need to lynch him anyway, in case he's just bad mafia 6. can only lynch 1 person today. 8. jabber dies 10. Mz is still not contributing 11. shit day coming up, better post thoughts | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:07 Amiko wrote: Fuba can have his turn, but you are online now and responding. Oh my bad, I'll go afk then so you can actually focus on someone who might be mafia. You understand that you're now enabling two people to skirt by with absolutely no good reason to lynch me. You're not doing a very good job at being the town leader here. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:28 Amiko wrote: Whether you are town or scum, you have an incentive to stay and respond. If you want to go AFK go for it, but I don't think it'll help you. Well I'm not exactly sure what'll help me. I'm doing my best but you've got your head so firmly up your ass nothing I say is getting through. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:32 Amiko wrote: It's so clear you even skipped 7 and 9. (I don't care much about that but it is funny since it reflects you were reordering the 100% clear thoughts) Why would I assume someone has good reasons for their actions if they don't tell me the reasons? That's basically contrary to the game. I'm certainly not going to give you that benefit. lol, 7 was a copy of 10 but I didn't think it needed to be said twice. 9 was "rethinking/rereading/mushrooms/jesus" but again, that's unimportant. | ||
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Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:30 sqrtofneg1 wrote: This attitude isn't gonna help you. Argue all you want, but insulting won't help. I'm not insulting him. maybe his ass is a real nice place. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:32 Amiko wrote: It's so clear you even skipped 7 and 9. (I don't care much about that but it is funny since it reflects you were reordering the 100% clear thoughts) Why would I assume someone has good reasons for their actions if they don't tell me the reasons? That's basically contrary to the game. I'm certainly not going to give you that benefit. No, you're requesting more than reasons. You're requesting inspiration and timeline. Like that has never been a thing in mafia anywhere. You're stuck in your confirmation bias where if I don't have an exact post MZ posted that made me think he's mafia and I responded immediately to that I must be mafia. In that post I was explaining why I thought he was mafia. Yes I gradually became more convinced over time. I probably did some rereading and even more rethinking. I also noticed his activity wasn't keeping up and his content was very lackluster. You're going to have to accept not everyone plays mafia the same way. If you cannot comprehend that I don't think exactly like you, this conversation is pointless. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On June 06 2014 02:52 Amiko wrote: You don't have to play mafia the same way as me. If I see behavior that looks scummy, I want to see an explanation. If the explanation doesn't seem to fit your play at the time, I'm more comfortable disregarding it. Timeline is absolutely a thing in mafia. Haven't you seen MS Paint? Timeline is totally a thing. But only when you timetravel. I didn't timetravel. You don't need to tell me, I've used timeline arguments, but only when they actually apply. My play at the time fits everything I've said perfectly. You're wrong if you say it doesn't. Also, I'm going afk 4srs now because I actually need to do rl stuff for a while. | ||
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