Detention Mafia - Page 2

gobbledydook

Australia2603 Posts

May 30 2014 01:24 GMT

#664

wtf fuba stop misquoting my words

I never said you were scum for bandwagoning a mislynch
I said you were scum because of the way you backed the lynch.
Pretty much the only substantial posts you have were against me and that is because I questioned you directly. And I don't think you have answered my question about your stance on sqrtofneg unless I missed it?

gobbledydook

Australia2603 Posts

May 30 2014 01:46 GMT

#667

On May 30 2014 06:36 Amiko wrote:
@gobbledygook:
(1) Fuba raised some points on you D1. Do you think his case is more likely to come from scum or mafia?

(2) One argument you raised re: Fuba was that he joined the JWZ vote without stating reasons. Do you think that criticism is true for any other players?

(3) If you have any thoughts on slOosh/M_Z I'd like to hear them.

1) I think he is scum. He twists my words to make me look bad. He ignores my question and attacks me instead. If he were town I think he would respond to my questions more directly and cut the misrepresentation.

2) Alakaslam flat out voted jwz without saying anything. He hasn't actually posted anything important so far as I recall so I am suspicious of him. We need to pressure him to speak more.

3) sloosh hasn't posted that much of value either. Same as Alakaslam we should ask more questions. MZ I think is town. I think his arguments make more sense than his detractors suggest and while his play may seem a bit off to some, I think he is the victim of Palmar tunnel vision and is town.

gobbledydook

Australia2603 Posts

May 30 2014 12:24 GMT

#698

An analysis of Meapak_Ziphh's posts

By post number:

1)He's agreeing with 27ninjabunnies' accusation of JWZ, and then suggests to find another possible lynch target, his picks being fuba and haru for their defense of JWZ.

2) Follow-up to first post.

3) Quoting a post from Amiko who has a bit there agreeing with his fuba/haru suspicion.

4) Clarifies the reason why he finds fuba/haru suspicious, ie their way of defending JWZ, and compares it to mderg's defense which he finds towny.

5) Criticizes sqrt for lynching for info.

6) Out of nowhere, raises the possibility of a Palmar lynch, but then suggests a JWZ lynch as the clearest option.

7) Criticizes sqrt for being vague. Tells sqrt what to do to contribute more.

8) Explains the reason for his criticism of sqrt, saying that he just wants to help sqrt improve his town play.

9) Reiterates his stance that he didn't threaten sqrt with a scumread, repeats his suspicions of haru/fuba. Then uses meta to classify Palmar's play as scum play.

10) Basically same as 7.

11) Dismisses JWZ's reads list as unconvincing.

12) Quotes 27ninjabunnies' argument to support 11.

13) Now reads sqrt as scum, based on some quotes of sqrt being wishy washy on JWZ's alignment.

14) Attacks Palmar for what he sees as taking a potshot at him, seeing it fail, and trying to back off.

15) Now criticizes people for trying to start a second wagon. You might notice that this contradicts (1).

16) Attacks sqrt for voicing his blue read.

17) Attacks sqrt for now voting JWZ when before, he was defending him.

18) Backs off his Palmar read based on Palmar's contributions after his last read.

19) Responds to sloosh's ??? by saying his views on sqrt changed progressively.

20) Clarifies that he now thinks of sqrt as scum.

21) Now says Palmar is certainly town, and says he likes the case on sloosh.

22) Defending himself from haru's attack. Says that he has already changed his read on Palmar, explained his sqrt scum read already, and gives 'forgetting to vote before' as a reason for voting JWZ late. Dismisses the fact that Palmar didn't die as a WIFOM argument.

Comments: Let's look at some vocal opponents of MZ.

a) Palmar

Palmar says MZ is scum because

1) The choice of words he used to criticize sqrt seemed strange

2 MZ grossly misrepresents Palmar's accusation of him as 'backing off'.

3)"MZ reads Palmar town because Palmar reads MZ scum".

My responses:
1) Assuming that MZ is scum as Palmar believes, why would he go about defending sqrt in such a roundabout way? No one was attacking sqrt. He could have fabricated a bogus accusation on someone else and it would have been less suspicious. The fact that he changed his read from sqrt town to sqrt scum , when there was never any traction for a sqrt wagon, suggests that it had nothing to do with trying to get on a bandwagon. The most likely explanation is that MZ is a town who wants everyone to contribute, so much that he lectures sqrt about his vagueness, and then gets disappointed by sqrt's refusal to improve.

2) I think this is just a case of misunderstanding. Palmar didn't spell out 'I THINK MZ IS MAFIA' in that post, and his annoying habit of referring to sqrtofneg1 as i (it's true, but it is confusing) makes his posts easy to misunderstand on first sight. It took me a couple rereads to get what he was saying.

3) MZ never said he read Palmar town because Palmar was reading him scum, he said he changed his Palmar read to town because Palmar contributed in a way he liked, which ties back to the first point. He wants everyone to contribute, and he is pleased by Palmar's contributions. Problem?

b) haru

Haru's arguments

1) He is lynching according to bandwagons

2) Had more reasons to lynch others such as palmar, but voted for jwz at the last minute.

3) palmar did not die.

my responses:

1) There was only ever one bandwagon in day 1, and that was JWZ's bandwagon. If you say he is lynching according to bandwagons then half the town has lynched according to bandwagon and everyone's guilty? Something doesn't hold here. If you say his Palmar, sqrt, haru, fuba reads were bandwagons, then no? There was never any traction and he never voted for anyone. I don't really think calling reads as bandwagons is legit.

2) Literally his vote had no impact by the time he casted it. He could have casted it on Barack Obama and nothing would have changed; JWZ was a dead man. He's gotta put his vote on someone, and since he cleared Palmar already, and sqrt had no traction, he went with what everyone voted.

3) Yeah, that's really WIFOM. You could argue that mafia didn't kill someone because they were wrong, or they didn't kill someone because they wanted to game that argument, and so on. Using mafia kills to determine whether someone was on the right track doens't get you anywhere.

gobbledydook

Australia2603 Posts

May 30 2014 12:41 GMT

#700

On May 30 2014 21:37 Palmar wrote:
so who is mafia then gobbley?

My strongest read so far is fuba because of the way he's accusing me.
I have skimmed through the sloosh arguments, and I'll come up with a detailed read like this one later.

gobbledydook

Australia2603 Posts

May 30 2014 14:47 GMT

#706

On May 30 2014 22:26 Palmar wrote:

Show nested quote +

Better idea: find me 5 people tho you strongly consider to be town.

Ok, if you want me to do this instead

Amiko is pretty certain to be town, his contributions are excellent and has played a leading role in scumhunting.
27ninjabunnies similarly to Amiko, town.

Those are my 2 strongest town reads, I would be extremely surprised if they flipped mafia.

Other town reads of mine are Palmar, mderg, MZ. You because while I disagree with you on some of your reads, I think you're trying to help, and that's good. MZ I explained pretty fully. mderg's contributions are good too, even though I disagree with him on both the MZ and JWZ reads. He gives good justifications for his reads.

So these are 3 more that I am reasonably sure.